OT: Bank Failure

[Cursitor Doom]

Any of our contributors here with savings in Deutsche Bank might do well
to get out while they still can:-

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-16/bank-run-deutsche-bank-clients-
are-pulling-1-billion-day

Better safe than sorry!



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[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 00:45:45 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qglr3p$lv9$7@dont-email.me>:

Any of our contributors here with savings in Deutsche Bank might do well
to get out while they still can:-

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-16/bank-run-deutsche-bank-clients-
are-pulling-1-billion-day

Better safe than sorry!

Na, only thing world should be worried about is the ever bigger US deficit,
once trade breaks down due to ever more silly trump actions
the US currency will be switched for Renminbi and Euros, and Gold.

Dollar will be worth a few cents, not accepted anywhere.
it will make competition easier for the US,
but as it will be radioactive and full of zombies
there will be no more industrial output except foe a small company in SF of course.

Fort Knox is empty all it holds is promissory notes.

To be payed by the next generation,
those zobies,
but those will have noting.

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 07:31:56 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

> Dollar will be worth a few cents, not accepted anywhere.

I see you've become a Zero-Hedge reader, Jan.

Fort Knox is empty all it holds is promissory notes.

Well it does seem very odd that Germany only got a fraction of their gold
back that was being stored in supposed safe custody in the US. Not quite
so safe as they'd thought, it seems; the mice have been at it!



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[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 13:55:10 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgn9bu$459$1@dont-email.me>:

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 07:31:56 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Dollar will be worth a few cents, not accepted anywhere.

I see you've become a Zero-Hedge reader, Jan.


Fort Knox is empty all it holds is promissory notes.

Well it does seem very odd that Germany only got a fraction of their gold
back that was being stored in supposed safe custody in the US. Not quite
so safe as they'd thought, it seems; the mice have been at it!

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Everybody is storing up on it.
https://markets.businessinsider.com/commodities/gold-price

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 14:53:13 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Don't forget GATA. If that class action succeeds you'll wish you'd kept
all your purchase & sale receipts going back 20+ years ago.

> Everybody is storing up on it.

Can you blame them? The fact that Russia and China alone are buying
literally *tons* of the physical stuff per month and have been since 2017
is fuelling the belief that they're preparing to introduce a new gold-
backed currency to rival the dollar for international trade. That would
spell the end of fiat reserve currencies for certain.



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[Rick C]

Why did God create economists? To make weather forecasters look good.

--

Rick C.

- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 14:53:13 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Don't forget GATA. If that class action succeeds you'll wish you'd kept
all your purchase & sale receipts going back 20+ years ago.

http://gata.org

Seems a sales website to me
Biased too?

Everybody is storing up on it.

Can you blame them? The fact that Russia and China alone are buying
literally *tons* of the physical stuff per month and have been since 2017
is fuelling the belief that they're preparing to introduce a new gold-
backed currency to rival the dollar for international trade. That would
spell the end of fiat reserve currencies for certain.

Indeed.
Give or take some nuculear war (an Iran Pakistan alliance comes to mind),
resulting in among other things the destruction of Israel,
what can possibly go wrong???
It is all a reality show now is it not?
At least trump seems to think so.

I expect the electronics based payment systems to completely collapse in such a war scenario
currencies will lose their value, gold may perhaps still buy you food or your escape route,
in a [golden??] bathtub across the oceans to a place with less radiation.

Oh well


Funny beings those humming-beans.

SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
so you can go there and watch things on earth unfold through your binoculars,
start a new life there, like once the Spanish started a new life in 'merrica.
I think this is important for the continuation of species.
For the rest it is, and likely always will be, one ant any heap against the other,
it is part of evolution.
But as our weapons get so powerful we can destroy the galaxy, I see a no zero probability
of the species being terminated by an upset technician, or a technician that dropped his pliers
in the black hole bomb.
Somebody told me the story that dropping of pliers in an atomic bomb while servicing it
happened not far from here, and the poor guy never understood why it did not go off.
FWIIW.

 

[Robert Baer]

Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 14:53:13 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Don't forget GATA. If that class action succeeds you'll wish you'd kept
all your purchase & sale receipts going back 20+ years ago.

http://gata.org

Seems a sales website to me
Biased too?


Everybody is storing up on it.

Can you blame them? The fact that Russia and China alone are buying
literally *tons* of the physical stuff per month and have been since 2017
is fuelling the belief that they're preparing to introduce a new gold-
backed currency to rival the dollar for international trade. That would
spell the end of fiat reserve currencies for certain.

Indeed.
Give or take some nuculear war (an Iran Pakistan alliance comes to mind),
resulting in among other things the destruction of Israel,
what can possibly go wrong???
It is all a reality show now is it not?
At least trump seems to think so.

I expect the electronics based payment systems to completely collapse in such a war scenario
currencies will lose their value, gold may perhaps still buy you food or your escape route,
in a [golden??] bathtub across the oceans to a place with less radiation.

Oh well


Funny beings those humming-beans.

SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
so you can go there and watch things on earth unfold through your binoculars,
start a new life there, like once the Spanish started a new life in 'merrica.
I think this is important for the continuation of species.
For the rest it is, and likely always will be, one ant any heap against the other,
it is part of evolution.
But as our weapons get so powerful we can destroy the galaxy, I see a no zero probability
of the species being terminated by an upset technician, or a technician that dropped his pliers
in the black hole bomb.
Somebody told me the story that dropping of pliers in an atomic bomb while servicing it
happened not far from here, and the poor guy never understood why it did not go off.
FWIIW.


....and what about the atmosphere, what little of it exists?

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Fri, 19 Jul 2019 01:15:06 -0800) it happened Robert Baer
<robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in <3_eYE.20206$eB6.12488@fx30.iad>:

Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 14:53:13 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Don't forget GATA. If that class action succeeds you'll wish you'd kept
all your purchase & sale receipts going back 20+ years ago.

http://gata.org

Seems a sales website to me
Biased too?


Everybody is storing up on it.

Can you blame them? The fact that Russia and China alone are buying
literally *tons* of the physical stuff per month and have been since 2017
is fuelling the belief that they're preparing to introduce a new gold-
backed currency to rival the dollar for international trade. That would
spell the end of fiat reserve currencies for certain.

Indeed.
Give or take some nuculear war (an Iran Pakistan alliance comes to mind),
resulting in among other things the destruction of Israel,
what can possibly go wrong???
It is all a reality show now is it not?
At least trump seems to think so.

I expect the electronics based payment systems to completely collapse in such a war scenario
currencies will lose their value, gold may perhaps still buy you food or your escape route,
in a [golden??] bathtub across the oceans to a place with less radiation.

Oh well


Funny beings those humming-beans.

SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
so you can go there and watch things on earth unfold through your binoculars,
start a new life there, like once the Spanish started a new life in 'merrica.
I think this is important for the continuation of species.
For the rest it is, and likely always will be, one ant any heap against the other,
it is part of evolution.
But as our weapons get so powerful we can destroy the galaxy, I see a no zero probability
of the species being terminated by an upset technician, or a technician that dropped his pliers
in the black hole bomb.
Somebody told me the story that dropping of pliers in an atomic bomb while servicing it
happened not far from here, and the poor guy never understood why it did not go off.
FWIIW.


...and what about the atmosphere, what little of it exists?

Mostly an engineering problem.
When we use nuclear power, and given there is water on mars, it can be split into H2 and O.
gives oxygen and is usable for rocket fuel.
Heating, cooling all electricity based.
Is there any Uranium on mars? Likely.
There are so many other ideas, you need shielding from cosmic radiation for sure,
maybe electromagnetic fields can be used for that, there are so many ideas..
This I did read a short while ago:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190715114256.htm

Resveratrol to prevent muscles losing strength during the trip and later:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190718085319.htm

There is more on mars than US gov wants people to know.
First the Viking experiment was positive for life,
I heard that announcement in the news back then, only to be withdrawn by a dull voice
hours later 'no it is no sign of life'
Hey, NSA tested that experiment for month before the it went on that spacecraft ;-)

There is about half ? of US that is religiously indoctrinated to believe the earth is 4000 years old (or something)
Pi is 4, and what have you, and Pope has a private connection to God.
So and they believe life originated on earth, Adam and Eve and the snake story,
and so no life should be found anywhere else in the universe.

In noticed that any time NASA's budget is up for discussion in the government
all of the sudden they find signs of some creatures in meteorites from mars,
you can test that, wait until they put that news out again, and see what's up in congress.

So for that reason alone I expect China to land there in some way and find life,
they do not have that censorship.
And then there is this:
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/space/mars/lake2color.jpg
a true color image from ESA.
is a link from my site:
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/space/mars/index.html
Also read Dr Levin on that Viking experiment:
http://gillevin.com/mars.htm

So, why do we not go to space, or better why does the US drive around the block all the time in the ISS?
Fear of a religious collapse as life is out there waiting to be confirmed.

The technology to go has been around since the Apollo days, Von Braun had a mars plan.
These days if anybody says 'nuclear' then a whole lot of greenish fanatics jump on that person...
Fear, clueless and fear go hand in hand.
A Voyager spacecraft is still going and uses an RTG, plutonium.
It is all so simple.
Maybe competition will help with Chinese restaurants on mars, then Mc Doughnuts or whatever may want to go there 2.
Who knows.

Or, looking at it from the dark side, maybe those leaders that play the war games may want to make sure they have a cottage there
like some Germans moved to S. America at the end of WW2,
rumor goes Al Gore has a cottage there where he will go when the climate crap bubble he brainwashed the children with, bursts.

 

[Robert Baer]

Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Fri, 19 Jul 2019 01:15:06 -0800) it happened Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in <3_eYE.20206$eB6.12488@fx30.iad>:

Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:

On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 14:53:13 +0000, Jan Panteltje wrote:

Just got into a legal fight about some gold delivery.
Cost me an hour of typing at least.

Don't forget GATA. If that class action succeeds you'll wish you'd kept
all your purchase & sale receipts going back 20+ years ago.

http://gata.org

Seems a sales website to me
Biased too?


Everybody is storing up on it.

Can you blame them? The fact that Russia and China alone are buying
literally *tons* of the physical stuff per month and have been since 2017
is fuelling the belief that they're preparing to introduce a new gold-
backed currency to rival the dollar for international trade. That would
spell the end of fiat reserve currencies for certain.

Indeed.
Give or take some nuculear war (an Iran Pakistan alliance comes to mind),
resulting in among other things the destruction of Israel,
what can possibly go wrong???
It is all a reality show now is it not?
At least trump seems to think so.

I expect the electronics based payment systems to completely collapse in such a war scenario
currencies will lose their value, gold may perhaps still buy you food or your escape route,
in a [golden??] bathtub across the oceans to a place with less radiation.

Oh well


Funny beings those humming-beans.

SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
so you can go there and watch things on earth unfold through your binoculars,
start a new life there, like once the Spanish started a new life in 'merrica.
I think this is important for the continuation of species.
For the rest it is, and likely always will be, one ant any heap against the other,
it is part of evolution.
But as our weapons get so powerful we can destroy the galaxy, I see a no zero probability
of the species being terminated by an upset technician, or a technician that dropped his pliers
in the black hole bomb.
Somebody told me the story that dropping of pliers in an atomic bomb while servicing it
happened not far from here, and the poor guy never understood why it did not go off.
FWIIW.


...and what about the atmosphere, what little of it exists?

Mostly an engineering problem.
When we use nuclear power, and given there is water on mars, it can be split into H2 and O.
gives oxygen and is usable for rocket fuel.
Heating, cooling all electricity based.
Is there any Uranium on mars? Likely.
There are so many other ideas, you need shielding from cosmic radiation for sure,
maybe electromagnetic fields can be used for that, there are so many ideas..
This I did read a short while ago:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190715114256.htm

Resveratrol to prevent muscles losing strength during the trip and later:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190718085319.htm

There is more on mars than US gov wants people to know.
First the Viking experiment was positive for life,
I heard that announcement in the news back then, only to be withdrawn by a dull voice
hours later 'no it is no sign of life'
Hey, NSA tested that experiment for month before the it went on that spacecraft ;-)

There is about half ? of US that is religiously indoctrinated to believe the earth is 4000 years old (or something)

* By counting X years per generation listed (i think ) in Genesis,
starting from Creation.
Problem is, how can there be a day before day and nite was created?
And,,,how long was a "day" then? A billion or so of present years?

Pi is 4, and what have you, and Pope has a private connection to God.
* Wrong! Pi is three. Re-read the source.

So and they believe life originated on earth, Adam and Eve and the snake story,
and so no life should be found anywhere else in the universe.
* Obviously! WE are unique.

In noticed that any time NASA's budget is up for discussion in the government
all of the sudden they find signs of some creatures in meteorites from mars,
you can test that, wait until they put that news out again, and see what's up in congress.

So for that reason alone I expect China to land there in some way and find life,
they do not have that censorship.
And then there is this:
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/space/mars/lake2color.jpg
a true color image from ESA.
is a link from my site:
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/space/mars/index.html
Also read Dr Levin on that Viking experiment:
http://gillevin.com/mars.htm

So, why do we not go to space, or better why does the US drive around the block all the time in the ISS?
Fear of a religious collapse as life is out there waiting to be confirmed.

The technology to go has been around since the Apollo days, Von Braun had a mars plan.
These days if anybody says 'nuclear' then a whole lot of greenish fanatics jump on that person...
Fear, clueless and fear go hand in hand.
A Voyager spacecraft is still going and uses an RTG, plutonium.
It is all so simple.
Maybe competition will help with Chinese restaurants on mars, then Mc Doughnuts or whatever may want to go there 2.
Who knows.

Or, looking at it from the dark side, maybe those leaders that play the war games may want to make sure they have a cottage there
like some Germans moved to S. America at the end of WW2,
rumor goes Al Gore has a cottage there where he will go when the climate crap bubble he brainwashed the children with, bursts.

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Fri, 19 Jul 2019 21:49:11 -0800) it happened Robert Baer
<robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in <%2xYE.53711$XI3.6447@fx39.iad>:

Jan Panteltje wrote:
There is about half ? of US that is religiously indoctrinated to believe the earth is 4000 years old (or something)
* By counting X years per generation listed (i think ) in Genesis,
starting from Creation.
Problem is, how can there be a day before day and nite was created?
And,,,how long was a "day" then? A billion or so of present years?

I often wonder, we now are into the dark energy and dark force babble in cosmology.
There seems to be black holes much earlier than was possible in the current big bang theory.
My view would be (is) that if some super dense 'thing' exploded, then pieces of it would fly away,
and those would be black holes,
Logic?
I do not see any logic in current theories.
Le Sage theory of gravity holds, if Le Sage particles originate in stars or those super dense blobs,
then you have your dark force and the universe is ever faster expanding.

Those people are stuck in their own math, and theories.
With some luck and without war maker trump, maybe in a few thousand of the current size years we have a simple theory
that makes sense,

Pi is 4, and what have you, and Pope has a private connection to God.
* Wrong! Pi is three. Re-read the source.

OK, whatever, I was referring to this bill:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_Pi_Bill

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 21:49:11 -0800, Robert Baer wrote:

There is about half ? of US that is religiously indoctrinated to
believe the earth is 4000 years old (or something)
* By counting X years per generation listed (i think ) in Genesis,
starting from Creation.
Problem is, how can there be a day before day and nite was created?
And,,,how long was a "day" then? A billion or so of present years?

Pi is 4, and what have you, and Pope has a private connection to God.
* Wrong! Pi is three. Re-read the source.

So and they believe life originated on earth, Adam and Eve and the
snake story,
and so no life should be found anywhere else in the universe.
* Obviously! WE are unique.

The Old Testament should be regarded in the same light and taken about as
seriously as ancient Greek mythology and all the other ancient folk tales
of the world's other cultures. The OT is just Jewish folk fables and it's
bizarre why so many people of Jewish and Christian faith actually place
any store by it and believe such blatant nonsense.




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On Saturday, 20 July 2019 14:30:58 UTC+1, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 21:49:11 -0800, Robert Baer wrote:

There is about half ? of US that is religiously indoctrinated to
believe the earth is 4000 years old (or something)
* By counting X years per generation listed (i think ) in Genesis,
starting from Creation.
Problem is, how can there be a day before day and nite was created?
And,,,how long was a "day" then? A billion or so of present years?

Pi is 4, and what have you, and Pope has a private connection to God.
* Wrong! Pi is three. Re-read the source.

So and they believe life originated on earth, Adam and Eve and the
snake story,
and so no life should be found anywhere else in the universe.
* Obviously! WE are unique.

The Old Testament should be regarded in the same light and taken about as
seriously as ancient Greek mythology and all the other ancient folk tales
of the world's other cultures. The OT is just Jewish folk fables and it's
bizarre why so many people of Jewish and Christian faith actually place
any store by it and believe such blatant nonsense.

They say it's true yet it's fundamentally & massively at odds with the new testament.

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 09:21:38 -0700, tabbypurr wrote:

They say it's true yet it's fundamentally & massively at odds with the
new testament.

It's also fundamentally and massively at odds with common sense and the
last four centuries of scientific discovery.



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[Piotr Wyderski]

Jan Panteltje wrote:

> Dollar will be worth a few cents, not accepted anywhere.

After Bretton Woods dollar is no longer backed up by gold.
They switched to a plutonium backup. That makes it sufficiently
acceptable everywhere, lest the imminent rapid currency exchange.

Best regards, Piotr

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Mon, 22 Jul 2019 09:49:42 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

The Earth's magnetic field is what keeps our remaining atmosphere being
blown away by the solar wind. Mars has almost no remaining atmosphere
(if it had one) because it has no magnetosphere.

It seems to be beginning to undergo one of its periodic reversals,
according to those who keep track of such things. Certainly I believe
magnetic north's wandering about is picking up pace. Anyone know if
there's a null in the magnetism as the 'pole' crosses the equator and if
so, how long it persists?
Some sources are claiming it's going to be catastrophic. Could be even
worse than the Y2K bug. ;->



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[Clifford Heath]

On 20/7/19 1:05 am, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Fri, 19 Jul 2019 01:15:06 -0800) it happened Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in <3_eYE.20206$eB6.12488@fx30.iad>:

Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:
SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
...and what about the atmosphere, what little of it exists?

Mostly an engineering problem.
When we use nuclear power, and given there is water on mars, it can be split into H2 and O.
gives oxygen and is usable for rocket fuel.
Heating, cooling all electricity based.
Is there any Uranium on mars? Likely.
There are so many other ideas, you need shielding from cosmic radiation for sure,
maybe electromagnetic fields can be used for that, there are so many ideas..

Never mind the cosmic radiation...

The Earth's magnetic field is what keeps our remaining atmosphere being
blown away by the solar wind. Mars has almost no remaining atmosphere
(if it had one) because it has no magnetosphere.

Good luck manufacturing an atmosphere in those conditions.

Clifford Heath

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Mon, 22 Jul 2019 09:49:42 +1000) it happened Clifford Heath
<no.spam@please.net> wrote in <tS6ZE.52946$ej3.7348@fx36.iad>:

On 20/7/19 1:05 am, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 19 Jul 2019 01:15:06 -0800) it happened Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in <3_eYE.20206$eB6.12488@fx30.iad>:

Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Wed, 17 Jul 2019 22:03:28 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Cursitor
Doom <curd@notformail.com> wrote in <qgo5vg$9eu$2@dont-email.me>:
SpaceX should really get that Mars colony going,
...and what about the atmosphere, what little of it exists?

Mostly an engineering problem.
When we use nuclear power, and given there is water on mars, it can be split into H2 and O.
gives oxygen and is usable for rocket fuel.
Heating, cooling all electricity based.
Is there any Uranium on mars? Likely.
There are so many other ideas, you need shielding from cosmic radiation for sure,
maybe electromagnetic fields can be used for that, there are so many ideas..

Never mind the cosmic radiation...

The Earth's magnetic field is what keeps our remaining atmosphere being
blown away by the solar wind. Mars has almost no remaining atmosphere
(if it had one) because it has no magnetosphere.

Good luck manufacturing an atmosphere in those conditions.

Clifford Heath

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

 

On Monday, 22 July 2019 04:37:09 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

It's not just an eng problem. Any extraterrestrial colinisation is hugely expensive and results in very poor levels of access to things we value & take for granted here.


NT

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Monday, July 22, 2019 at 4:24:39 PM UTC+10, tabb...@gmail.com wrote:

On Monday, 22 July 2019 04:37:09 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

It's not just an eng problem. Any extraterrestrial colonisation is hugely expensive and results in very poor levels of access to things we value & take for granted here.

But might offer better access to things we might value and would love to take for granted.

The British empire colonised a lot of places to exploit specific local products, even though they killed off a lot of the colonists.

Jan Panteltje's claim that we've already solved the problems of setting up self-sustaining closed environments may be a bit premature, but there's no theoretical reason to imagine that we can't manage it eventually.

My guess is that we might get more out of colonising the asteroids rather than Mars - getting stuff up out of the Martian gravity well would make it very expensive - but we have to get to the potential colonisation site before we can start working out the economic costs and benefits.

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Bill Sloman, Sydney