F
Fred Bloggs
Guest
Radiosrfun wrote:
trick is to visualize their view of the ground/terrain and direct
adjustments to their flight path relative to their orientation, it may
not be a good idea to give away map coordinates of your location at that
time and they don't do much good at that point anyway. There may be
radio security considerations so the transmissions have to be short and
to the point, it also helps to give them a little courtesy brief on
situational security parameters as best you know them. When the pilot is
confident you know what you're doing he will bring that thing in real
fast and right to the spot whether he sees you or not. I love flying in
a Blackhawk especially when they're doing high speed evasive maneuvers
at tree top level, doors open, there's nothing better
I have brought helicopters into a landing on a few occasions and the"Fred Bloggs" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:46D170B4.7010107@nospam.com...
Eeyore wrote:
Fred Bloggs wrote:
When will US airmen ever stop shooting up the Brits, Canadians, and
other allies
?
Why are we even fighting your stupid wars for you ?
" Three British soldiers have been killed in a 'friendly fire' tragedy
in
Afghanistan by an American airman.
A U.S. Air Force jet dropped a 500lb bomb on the soldiers' position as
they
battled Taliban insurgents.
A pair of F-15 warplanes had been called in to help when 60 British
soldiers
were ambushed by Taliban fighters and found themselves fighting for
their lives.
An inquiry was under way last night into what went so disastrously
wrong, and
led to the latest in a string of socalled 'blue-on-blue' incidents
involving
American forces. "
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=477478&in_page_id=1811
Last time it happened, the Pentagon even tried to suppress evidence.
Are you such a moron you think the pilot eyeballs the bomb release?
You mean target by eye ? I believe that's often what they do in fact.
Your lot killed a load of refugees in
Kosovo that way too.
It is obviously a case of the British calling in the wrong coordinates.
They're supposed to call in the enemy position and not their own. If it
was a case of mistaken identity all 60 British troops would have been
cremated.
I don't see there's anything obvious about it at all. In any case, ground
warfare isn't static. The pilot
should visually confirm the target.
Graham
That may not be possible. The Taliban are not stupid, sometimes the ambush
is just a ruse to lure close air support which is their real target, they
have SAMs. The terrain in that place is very bad, it naturally channels
the combat patrols onto fixed routes in many areas, a perfect setup for an
ambush. The only way to avoid them is to reconnoiter the route beforehand
with aircraft, gunships, or RPVs, and then engage the enemy with an air
attack. The incident occurred because of bad planning on the part of the
British, they called in a bad bombing coordinate, and/or they were not
aware of the positions of all their troops. In any case it was most likely
their own fault.
It is obvious - he's clueless about "Ground" issues when dealing from the
air. When a "Medical" Helicopter is called in - we have to give them ALL
pertinent information. Power lines/poles, fences, etc... They can "not" see
them from the air. They circle over to get "their" view of the situation -
but "still" rely on us to guide them in. IF the pilot for "any" reason feels
it is unsafe to land - they will not. One situation about a month ago - it
was foggy. They flew - because where they took off from - it was clear - our
area was foggy. We could see them hovering overhead - gave them the
description of the landing zone. Even with our Engines emergency beacons on
and so on to form a circle for them - the pilot couldn't see "us". He
couldn't see "anything" - was his description on the radio. He aborted. Our
choppers have pre-set LZ settings to fly to - but they do not have any way
to know - if any changes were made since their last trip there and will
"not" place themselves, their crew, ship or anyone else in a situation. We
also have to call them on the radio to let them know we hear/see them - and
at what position to us - (1 o'clock, etc) so they know they do in fact have
the "proper" lz setting - to double check all information. Then too - on an
occasion, they've been called out to "an" LZ - only to have it changed while
hovering over. We keep in constant contact with them once they're in radio
contact range. Otherwise, they go through our 911 system for contact - to be
relayed. These pilots are pretty decent - they can land most anywhere - but
again - won't place themselves or others in danger. I've flown in aircraft,
been trained in chopper landings for "our" needs and a "Flight Nurse" also
runs with our Engine Company - so I have pretty good information on how
"accurate" ground coordinates "must" be. Ground contact and coordinates are
"critical". The pilots can't possibly spot enemy forces <or> "Friendly"
forces on the ground at those altitudes. Somehow - I don't see those
"bombers" swooping low enough to pick out uniforms - which would be
disasterous enough - especially in Mountainous terrain - and given they know
there may be some SAMS waiting for them.
Radio transmissions "could" be garbled too - leading to the errors......
Under stress - information can get crossed - confused. I can't think of too
many stressful situations aside from a war - being fired at. There are many
factors we doing the armchair quarterbacking - aren't aware of - in
particular <there>; but having had / have experiences we do - know what is
is about and how it can work or fail. We don't know the "actual" conditions,
terrain, how they're feeling, thinking, reacting. We don't know - what they
"called" in - as opposed to being "heard". But for someone to "ASSUME" that
an aircraft pilot can make out the difference in people on the ground -
guess again.
trick is to visualize their view of the ground/terrain and direct
adjustments to their flight path relative to their orientation, it may
not be a good idea to give away map coordinates of your location at that
time and they don't do much good at that point anyway. There may be
radio security considerations so the transmissions have to be short and
to the point, it also helps to give them a little courtesy brief on
situational security parameters as best you know them. When the pilot is
confident you know what you're doing he will bring that thing in real
fast and right to the spot whether he sees you or not. I love flying in
a Blackhawk especially when they're doing high speed evasive maneuvers
at tree top level, doors open, there's nothing better