Need to buy a long Phillips no. 1 screwdriver

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 08:29:38 -0700, Smitty Two
<prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:

The problem in many cases is that manufacturers have switched to
posidrive screws, which to a casual observer look like phillips. But a
typical phillips driver doesn't fit a posidrive screw worth a damn.

The Husky screwdriver I purchased was definately a #2 Phillips. It
even said so on the plastic handle.

Pozidriv screw heads have radial marker lines coined into the head at
the 45 degree points.
<http://www.justbrits.com/pozi/pozidriv.html>
Note the flattened tips on BOTH drivers. The problem I keep seeing is
that many screwdrivers have pointed tips while the recesses in common
screw heads are becoming shallower.

The drivers are easy to distinguish:
<http://www.ikeafans.com/forums/assembly-installation/44529-phillips-pozidriv.html>
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Wild_Bill]

I agree that the surfaces for good universal engagement into any particular
size of phillips recesses, aren't easily attained with a file, and
definitely not in any practical sense.

My quality drivers are either ground or cut with round tooling.. properly
dressed abrasive wheels or properly profiled cutters that don't produce
straight lines in the root of the cut.

Filing a #2P to fit a #1P would be little more than an exercise in
frustration. A lot of trial and error would be required even if using a
rotary tool.. die grinder or Dremel.
Then the diameter would likely also need to be reduced to access #1P screws
in recessed holes.

Screw head recesses differ in depth, and a fully filed tip that fits one
screw will likely not fit others as accurately.

In a desperate situation, I'd definitely go for the two-flute/flat driver
that Whit suggests.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


"whit3rd" <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:8914d930-3390-4e97-9ee1-bc8e58d36ab1@g13g2000yqj.googlegroups.com...

If you could really make a #2 into a #1 by filing, you could resharpen
the old #1 easier. The only hand-grind screwdriver tip that fits a
#1 Philips is a flat-blade screwdriver with a V grind and the 'right'
taper and blunted tip. And, that only hits two of the four flutes.

Then you need more practice with a file and the right steel rod.

Not really; I just buy a new screwdriver (except there's some small
sizes
that the hand-grind is required for).

Good Philips tips are mass-producible by grinding, but all my attempts
at hand-filing have been minor to major misfits (I can only, by feel,
get the simpler V-blade shape to a good fit). The handy
instructions at
<http://www.doityourself.com/stry/how-to-file-down-a-stripped-
phillips-head-screwdriver&usg=AFQjCNFT1upaVGIRrHI4QYWvfMxxm-FEgw>

are, IMHO, laughably inadequate. To get it right, you need to
control
eight surfaces, in three dimensions, NONE of those surfaces is
parallel
to (for instance) the visible axis of the shaft.

 

[mm]

On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 20:21:03 -0700, Smitty Two
<prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:

In article <nmekc6lo9sv6jatug8rao0jiilhr6u2j3q@4ax.com>,
mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote:

I need to buy a long Phillips no. 1 screwdriver.

With a shank 8 inches long and a handle 3 or 4 inches long, for a
total of 11 to 12 inches.

I've had one for almost 30 years, and I finally ruined it, taking out
a screw that was in tightly. It was a cheap one, but it worked well
enough until now.

I figured a new one wouldn't be cheap but I can't find one at all, not
at Ace Hardware, HomeDepot, Lowes, or ever Mouser. (Home Depot has a
number 2, but no number 1. )

Where should I look next?

Thanks.

Google sez Amazon's got 'em.

http://www.amazon.com/Klein-P18-Phillips-Tip-Screwdriver-8-Inch-Round-Shank/dp/B0000BYEPU

Thanks. It says it's Profilated. The word isn't in my dictionary.


But Sears is also a good idea. I should think of Sears, but I never
do. I'll be near there today and I'm going to go there.** Okay, I
went, and they have literally 100 different screwdrivers for sale, not
counting sets of them, but not this one.

Michael, I'm not quite ready for brazing or welding. Every time
something breaks I think, a good reason to buy a welder, but so far
it's always so cheap to pay someone.

Dave, I didn't know about Techni-tools. Thanks. The 10 inch one is...

Everyone had a different answer. That's great. Thanks to all of you.


**The Sears webpage has a common defect, however, at least I think
it's a big defect for websites that represent real physical stores
that are nearby. The website is all about selling and not so much
about what I can find at the store***. I asked for Phillips
Screwdriver and got 317 items that are Sears Only and 1124 total. I
thought I would narrow it down by adding #1 but that more than doubled
the number of hits, 677 and 3364. I can't search through all this,
and why should I since I only want to pick out what is at the store.

Even when I find something, it can be very hard to figure out if the
store ever stocks it, let alone if it has one now. For example:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM251527843P?prdNo=8

And Sears isn't the only one like this.

Radio Shack is NOT like this.

***The Best Buy website has the same problem until you tell them what
zipcode you live in and then it shows first (or something like that)
things that are available in the store. But it doesn't explain this.
I had to ask the store manager.

And places that have free shipping to the store note it but I keep
thinking other stores will too, and I waste time looking.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

mm wrote:

On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 20:21:03 -0700, Smitty Two
prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:

In article <nmekc6lo9sv6jatug8rao0jiilhr6u2j3q@4ax.com>,
mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote:

I need to buy a long Phillips no. 1 screwdriver.

With a shank 8 inches long and a handle 3 or 4 inches long, for a
total of 11 to 12 inches.

I've had one for almost 30 years, and I finally ruined it, taking out
a screw that was in tightly. It was a cheap one, but it worked well
enough until now.

I figured a new one wouldn't be cheap but I can't find one at all, not
at Ace Hardware, HomeDepot, Lowes, or ever Mouser. (Home Depot has a
number 2, but no number 1. )

Where should I look next?

Thanks.

Google sez Amazon's got 'em.

http://www.amazon.com/Klein-P18-Phillips-Tip-Screwdriver-8-Inch-Round-Shank/dp/B0000BYEPU

Thanks. It says it's Profilated. The word isn't in my dictionary.


But Sears is also a good idea. I should think of Sears, but I never
do. I'll be near there today and I'm going to go there.** Okay, I
went, and they have literally 100 different screwdrivers for sale, not
counting sets of them, but not this one.

Michael, I'm not quite ready for brazing or welding. Every time
something breaks I think, a good reason to buy a welder, but so far
it's always so cheap to pay someone.

Dave, I didn't know about Techni-tools. Thanks. The 10 inch one is...

Everyone had a different answer. That's great. Thanks to all of you.

**The Sears webpage has a common defect, however, at least I think
it's a big defect for websites that represent real physical stores
that are nearby. The website is all about selling and not so much
about what I can find at the store***. I asked for Phillips
Screwdriver and got 317 items that are Sears Only and 1124 total. I
thought I would narrow it down by adding #1 but that more than doubled
the number of hits, 677 and 3364. I can't search through all this,
and why should I since I only want to pick out what is at the store.

Even when I find something, it can be very hard to figure out if the
store ever stocks it, let alone if it has one now. For example:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM251527843P?prdNo=8

And Sears isn't the only one like this.

Radio Shack is NOT like this.

***The Best Buy website has the same problem until you tell them what
zipcode you live in and then it shows first (or something like that)
things that are available in the store. But it doesn't explain this.
I had to ask the store manager.

And places that have free shipping to the store note it but I keep
thinking other stores will too, and I waste time looking.

Take a look at:

http://www.toolbarn.com/dewalt-dw2061.html


I have similar bits for my cordless drill.
--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

mm wrote:

On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 20:21:03 -0700, Smitty Two
prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:

In article <nmekc6lo9sv6jatug8rao0jiilhr6u2j3q@4ax.com>,
mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote:

I need to buy a long Phillips no. 1 screwdriver.

With a shank 8 inches long and a handle 3 or 4 inches long, for a
total of 11 to 12 inches.

I've had one for almost 30 years, and I finally ruined it, taking out
a screw that was in tightly. It was a cheap one, but it worked well
enough until now.

I figured a new one wouldn't be cheap but I can't find one at all, not
at Ace Hardware, HomeDepot, Lowes, or ever Mouser. (Home Depot has a
number 2, but no number 1. )

Where should I look next?

Thanks.

Google sez Amazon's got 'em.

http://www.amazon.com/Klein-P18-Phillips-Tip-Screwdriver-8-Inch-Round-Shank/dp/B0000BYEPU

Thanks. It says it's Profilated. The word isn't in my dictionary.


But Sears is also a good idea. I should think of Sears, but I never
do. I'll be near there today and I'm going to go there.** Okay, I
went, and they have literally 100 different screwdrivers for sale, not
counting sets of them, but not this one.

Michael, I'm not quite ready for brazing or welding. Every time
something breaks I think, a good reason to buy a welder, but so far
it's always so cheap to pay someone.

Dave, I didn't know about Techni-tools. Thanks. The 10 inch one is...

Everyone had a different answer. That's great. Thanks to all of you.

**The Sears webpage has a common defect, however, at least I think
it's a big defect for websites that represent real physical stores
that are nearby. The website is all about selling and not so much
about what I can find at the store***. I asked for Phillips
Screwdriver and got 317 items that are Sears Only and 1124 total. I
thought I would narrow it down by adding #1 but that more than doubled
the number of hits, 677 and 3364. I can't search through all this,
and why should I since I only want to pick out what is at the store.

Even when I find something, it can be very hard to figure out if the
store ever stocks it, let alone if it has one now. For example:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM251527843P?prdNo=8

And Sears isn't the only one like this.

Radio Shack is NOT like this.

***The Best Buy website has the same problem until you tell them what
zipcode you live in and then it shows first (or something like that)
things that are available in the store. But it doesn't explain this.
I had to ask the store manager.

And places that have free shipping to the store note it but I keep
thinking other stores will too, and I waste time looking.

http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PMPXNO=1659900&PMT4NO=0 is a 10"
blade with a 3.5" handle.


MSC #: 00273854

Stanley
Qty: [Add item to list]
Order Qty of 1 = (1) Piece
Price: $4.82 ea
In stock: 179
Mfr: Stanley
Mfr #: 64-171
Description: Screwdrivers Tool Type: Standard Phillips Screwdriver
Phillips Point Size: #1 Blade Length: 10
Tool Type: Standard Phillips Screwdriver
Phillips Point Size: #1
Blade Length (Inch): 10
Overall Length (Inch): 13-3/4
Shank Type: Round
Handle Style: Ergonomic Molded Plastic Grip


I don't know what shipping costs or minimum order is, (if any) but we
used to buy from them at a previous job.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

 

[mm]

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 22:21:21 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 21:37:47 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov
wrote:
Skycraft Surplus in Orlando has them (new),I just bought one a few weeks
ago.
6 in. OAL. they keep them in a cup at the checkout counter.
IIRC,either $1 or $1.50 each.

I think those are the coffee stirrers, not the screwdrivers.

With a bit of practice, it's possible to use a file to fix a trashed
Phillips screwdriver tip. I'm still using screwdrivers (mostly Sears
Craftsman) that I inherited (or stole) from my father. Most are 30-40
years old and some have been re-filed or re-ground several times.

I bought a "Husky" brand #2 screwdriver, about 10" long, at Home
Depot. Looks nice, but wouldn't work. It stipped out most screws.
Then, I noticed that the tip came to a point. Grinding down the point
somewhat flat, the screwdriver now works normally. I also inspected
my collection of Phillips screwdrivers and found that most of the
older Xcelite screwdrivers were also excessively pointy. The Sears
Craftsman tips were fine. The problem is not really the screwdriver,
but the badly formed cold headed Phillips screws.

Good to know. I'll check my other ones out.

I usually turn ruined Phillips head drivers into awls, but there is a
limit to how mnay of those i need.

I may try to fix this one like suggested, but I'm going to buy another
anyhow. Either Techni-tools (which may have an even longer one for a
dollar more) or Amazon,

http://www.instructables.com/id/Enhance-the-functionality-of-many-screwdrivers./

 

[mm]

On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 08:29:38 -0700, Smitty Two
<prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:

In article <p9upc6d86qv8fm4pf4n7gjlbm73j6bse7v@4ax.com>,
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 21:37:47 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov
wrote:
Skycraft Surplus in Orlando has them (new),I just bought one a few weeks
ago.
6 in. OAL. they keep them in a cup at the checkout counter.
IIRC,either $1 or $1.50 each.

I think those are the coffee stirrers, not the screwdrivers.

With a bit of practice, it's possible to use a file to fix a trashed
Phillips screwdriver tip. I'm still using screwdrivers (mostly Sears
Craftsman) that I inherited (or stole) from my father. Most are 30-40
years old and some have been re-filed or re-ground several times.

I bought a "Husky" brand #2 screwdriver, about 10" long, at Home
Depot. Looks nice, but wouldn't work. It stipped out most screws.
Then, I noticed that the tip came to a point. Grinding down the point
somewhat flat, the screwdriver now works normally. I also inspected
my collection of Phillips screwdrivers and found that most of the
older Xcelite screwdrivers were also excessively pointy. The Sears
Craftsman tips were fine. The problem is not really the screwdriver,
but the badly formed cold headed Phillips screws.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Enhance-the-functionality-of-many-screwdrivers
./

The problem in many cases is that manufacturers have switched to
posidrive screws, which to a casual observer look like phillips. But a
typical phillips driver doesn't fit a posidrive screw worth a damn.

I haven't noticed them yet. Certainly wasn't what ruined my
screwdriver -- that was probably 20 yaars old.

I read that posidrive is good because one size driver fits every size
screw.

 

[whit3rd]

The problem in many cases is that manufacturers have switched to
posidrive screws, which to a casual observer look like phillips.

I read that posidrive is good because one size driver fits every size
screw.

First, it's "Pozidrive", and NO, one size-fits-every-screw is the
selling
point of a (third, obscure) type called Reed and Prince. Reed and
Prince drivers aren't blunted at the point hardly at all, and the
sidewalls
of the flutes are long and flat because they might get buried deep
in a screwhead of large size.

I try to keep good Pozidrive #1 and #2, Philips #0 through #3 in all
my
toolboxes. I only have one or two Reed and Prince bits, though.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 12:33:56 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 22:21:21 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 21:37:47 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov
wrote:
Skycraft Surplus in Orlando has them (new),I just bought one a few weeks
ago.
6 in. OAL. they keep them in a cup at the checkout counter.
IIRC,either $1 or $1.50 each.

I think those are the coffee stirrers, not the screwdrivers.

With a bit of practice, it's possible to use a file to fix a trashed
Phillips screwdriver tip. I'm still using screwdrivers (mostly Sears
Craftsman) that I inherited (or stole) from my father. Most are 30-40
years old and some have been re-filed or re-ground several times.

I bought a "Husky" brand #2 screwdriver, about 10" long, at Home
Depot. Looks nice, but wouldn't work. It stipped out most screws.
Then, I noticed that the tip came to a point. Grinding down the point
somewhat flat, the screwdriver now works normally. I also inspected
my collection of Phillips screwdrivers and found that most of the
older Xcelite screwdrivers were also excessively pointy. The Sears
Craftsman tips were fine. The problem is not really the screwdriver,
but the badly formed cold headed Phillips screws.

Good to know. I'll check my other ones out.

I just found another Husky #2 Philips screwdriver. I compared it with
a similar Craftsman #2 on a typical 6-32 computah screw. The
Craftsman fits perfectly. The Husky doesn't bottom out and is
useless. I had originally thought it was too pointy a tip, but even
after blunting the tip, it seems to be simply a rotten grinding job on
the tapered blades. I'll try to photograph both for a side by side
comparison later (when I get my microscope camera back).

Here's the culprit:
<http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hardware-Hand-Tools-Screwdrivers/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xglZas0k/R-100072202/h_d2/ProductDisplay>
Incidentally, the handle says "Made in USA". The web page says:
"The precision-formed tip provides engagement with fasteners and
limits cam-out..."
Argh.

I usually turn ruined Phillips head drivers into awls, but there is a
limit to how mnay of those i need.

I use a Dremel tool or file to turn them back into Philips (note
spelling) heads. Philips #2 is easy. #1 is not so easy.
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

 

[JW]

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:43:23 -0400 mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote in
Message id: <rk2tc6lgrctnd97u4emvbkm9unub4g3glq@4ax.com>:

[...]

**The Sears webpage has a common defect, however, at least I think
it's a big defect for websites that represent real physical stores
that are nearby. The website is all about selling and not so much
about what I can find at the store***. I asked for Phillips
Screwdriver and got 317 items that are Sears Only and 1124 total. I
thought I would narrow it down by adding #1 but that more than doubled
the number of hits, 677 and 3364. I can't search through all this,
and why should I since I only want to pick out what is at the store.

I think it's because the website search engine ORs the words you put in
the search box. Pretty stupid of them.

Even when I find something, it can be very hard to figure out if the
store ever stocks it, let alone if it has one now. For example:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM251527843P?prdNo=8

And Sears isn't the only one like this.

Radio Shack is NOT like this.

Last time I was there, they did. Perhaps they've corrected this.

 

[Geoffrey S. Mendelson]

Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I use a Dremel tool or file to turn them back into Philips (note
spelling) heads. Philips #2 is easy. #1 is not so easy.

Nope.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_F._Phillips

Philips with one L is the name of the Dutch Company, Koninklijke
Philips Electronics N.V.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson N3OWJ/4X1GM
To help restaurants, as part of the "stimulus package", everyone must order
dessert. As part of the socialized health plan, you are forbidden to eat it.

 

[mm]

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 21:58:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 12:33:56 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 22:21:21 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Oct 2010 21:37:47 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov
wrote:
Skycraft Surplus in Orlando has them (new),I just bought one a few weeks
ago.
6 in. OAL. they keep them in a cup at the checkout counter.
IIRC,either $1 or $1.50 each.

I think those are the coffee stirrers, not the screwdrivers.

With a bit of practice, it's possible to use a file to fix a trashed
Phillips screwdriver tip. I'm still using screwdrivers (mostly Sears
Craftsman) that I inherited (or stole) from my father. Most are 30-40
years old and some have been re-filed or re-ground several times.

I bought a "Husky" brand #2 screwdriver, about 10" long, at Home
Depot. Looks nice, but wouldn't work. It stipped out most screws.
Then, I noticed that the tip came to a point. Grinding down the point
somewhat flat, the screwdriver now works normally. I also inspected
my collection of Phillips screwdrivers and found that most of the
older Xcelite screwdrivers were also excessively pointy. The Sears
Craftsman tips were fine. The problem is not really the screwdriver,
but the badly formed cold headed Phillips screws.

Good to know. I'll check my other ones out.

I just found another Husky #2 Philips screwdriver. I compared it with
a similar Craftsman #2 on a typical 6-32 computah screw. The
Craftsman fits perfectly. The Husky doesn't bottom out and is
useless. I had originally thought it was too pointy a tip, but even
after blunting the tip,

It's husky. It just needs to lose a little weight.

it seems to be simply a rotten grinding job on
the tapered blades. I'll try to photograph both for a side by side
comparison later (when I get my microscope camera back).

Here's the culprit:
http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hardware-Hand-Tools-Screwdrivers/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xglZas0k/R-100072202/h_d2/ProductDisplay
Incidentally, the handle says "Made in USA". The web page says:
"The precision-formed tip provides engagement with fasteners and
limits cam-out..."
Argh.

I usually turn ruined Phillips head drivers into awls, but there is a
limit to how mnay of those i need.

I use a Dremel tool or file to turn them back into Philips (note
spelling) heads. Philips #2 is easy. #1 is not so easy.

Maybe I'll make a flat blade out of it. I have a flat-blade
screwdriver my grandfather sharpened. He made it *too* sharp, but I
like it.

 

[Ron D.]

#1 7.8" shank: http://www.wihatools.com/100seri/153serie.htm

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 2 Nov 2010 09:15:37 +0000 (UTC), "Geoffrey S. Mendelson"
<gsm@mendelson.com> wrote:

Philips with one L is the name of the Dutch Company, Koninklijke
Philips Electronics N.V.
Geoff.

Ooops. Instead of looking it up, I guessed, and lost. Sorry(tm).



--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS