My own private idaho (self employ)

On Friday, January 31, 2020 at 10:13:28 AM UTC+11, Michael Terrell wrote:
On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 5:43:56 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 4:02:52 AM UTC+11, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 27 Jan 2020 08:47:12 -0800 (PST), George Herold wrote:

On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 3:50:04 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-26 15:42, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 11:16:31 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jan 2020 09:21:58 +0000, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:
The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

And all the other administrivia :( Even if someone
else is doing all that guff, and engineer operates
at full throttle for about 30%-40% of their time.
The rest is "unproductive" meetings etc. Hence in
the absence of better information, multiply your
first estimate by 2.5-3.5 :)

I've seen a couple of startups make one mistake;
I suspect you are too smart, but here it is anyway...

The founder(s) are trapped by the glitz of being
"self-employed CEOs", and spend money on unnecessary
/visible/ trappings, e.g. cars, boardroom furniture,
and the like.

Some people think that the appearance of success (hence buying all
that glitzy expensive stuff) is success. It's the opposite.

One guy that I know of got some investors to join up, and first thing
bought a private jet. Next thing, they fired him.

(One common mistake is to give up too much equity early on, often to
less than savory/competent partners.)


They feel great and "energised", but none of that
gets money in the door.

More successfully...

I've also seen successful R&D consultancies that
only buy the minimum of equipment, i.e. equipment
that is guaranteed to be useful on every project.

General-purpose equipment is good to have around. These days, a suite
of good test equipment isn't very expensive.


Any equipment that doesn't fall into that category
is bought on a project-by-project basis and after
the project it is part of the deliverable to the
client.

NO! Keep all the toys! Well, you can provide custom test sets at large
additional cost. Price them separately; they may find that they want
several.
Yeah, a bad thing about losing my job, was losing most of my toys.
(I've got some power supplies, rigol scope and rigol sig. gen.
and as you say parts are pretty cheap these days.)

George H.



Good luck; all startups need that.

One can certainly be a consultant, and sell the IP and designs and
equipment on a one-time basis. That gets a company started, and some
people can do that forever. But that requires constant selling, and is
often feast-famine stressful. Selling products is a better long-term
force multiplier.
Right, you need a few horses in the stable for sales (at least at the
low volume level I'm contemplating.) to be semi-stable.

The other thing I think about is fun little pcb's and a part's bag/ list.
There's lot's of rather mundane circuits you can think about,
(gain, filtering)
fun ones are rev. biased led spads, and fast edge TDR's

Some standard box for little circuits would be nice.
Phil, what do you pay for your 'stomp' boxes.
(two piece dicast )

They're cheap--five or ten bucks depending on size. BTW once you have a
web site up, you can do pretty good SEO by adding your contact info and
a few keywords to your Usenet posts--SED is widely mirrored. (See below.)
Huh thanks for the SEO tip.
Re: SED mirroring. I do find it weird how many times I'm searching some
electronics thing and I get sent to a few years old SED discussion.
Sometimes that's good, cause it's a discussion I missed or skipped.

George S. Herold
unemployed instrument builder

Sometimes I google a subject and find my own old SED posts.

Want to do some occasional research for us? Email me.

Jim Thompson seems to be dead, so John Larkin will have to find some other right-wing lunatic to to tell just who has just e-mailed him privately.

James Arthur might serve.

I would rather have Jim here and for the Grim reaper to have done his assigned job on you.

Sure you would. Nobody has ever accused you of good judgement.

> You are a cancer on this group.

You don't like me, but that doesn't make me any kind of cancer. John Larkin probably comes closer to that, in tat he posts a lot of stuff and very little of it is useful.

> A lot of good people have left because of your continual attempt to be relevant, which you can only do with your mindless attempts to put others down.

Posting nonsense is what gets me cross. Being rude about that is the very antithesis of a mindless activity. You won't be aware of that, because you swallow a lot of the nonsense that I'm rude about. Since Jim Thompson fitted your idea of a "good person" your anxieties about the "good people" who have left the group can't really be taken seriously.

> If you were the man you want us to think that you are, you wouldn't act like a baby cutting their first tooth.

Your ideas about how people ought to act don't seem to see anything wrong with Jim Thompson's activities. Your judgement isn't to be relied on.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
 
On Thursday, January 30, 2020 at 8:27:14 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, January 31, 2020 at 10:13:28 AM UTC+11, Michael Terrell wrote:
On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 5:43:56 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 4:02:52 AM UTC+11, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 27 Jan 2020 08:47:12 -0800 (PST), George Herold wrote:

On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 3:50:04 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-26 15:42, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 11:16:31 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jan 2020 09:21:58 +0000, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:
The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

And all the other administrivia :( Even if someone
else is doing all that guff, and engineer operates
at full throttle for about 30%-40% of their time.
The rest is "unproductive" meetings etc. Hence in
the absence of better information, multiply your
first estimate by 2.5-3.5 :)

I've seen a couple of startups make one mistake;
I suspect you are too smart, but here it is anyway...

The founder(s) are trapped by the glitz of being
"self-employed CEOs", and spend money on unnecessary
/visible/ trappings, e.g. cars, boardroom furniture,
and the like.

Some people think that the appearance of success (hence buying all
that glitzy expensive stuff) is success. It's the opposite.

One guy that I know of got some investors to join up, and first thing
bought a private jet. Next thing, they fired him.

(One common mistake is to give up too much equity early on, often to
less than savory/competent partners.)


They feel great and "energised", but none of that
gets money in the door.

More successfully...

I've also seen successful R&D consultancies that
only buy the minimum of equipment, i.e. equipment
that is guaranteed to be useful on every project.

General-purpose equipment is good to have around. These days, a suite
of good test equipment isn't very expensive.


Any equipment that doesn't fall into that category
is bought on a project-by-project basis and after
the project it is part of the deliverable to the
client.

NO! Keep all the toys! Well, you can provide custom test sets at large
additional cost. Price them separately; they may find that they want
several.
Yeah, a bad thing about losing my job, was losing most of my toys.
(I've got some power supplies, rigol scope and rigol sig. gen.
and as you say parts are pretty cheap these days.)

George H.



Good luck; all startups need that.

One can certainly be a consultant, and sell the IP and designs and
equipment on a one-time basis. That gets a company started, and some
people can do that forever. But that requires constant selling, and is
often feast-famine stressful. Selling products is a better long-term
force multiplier.
Right, you need a few horses in the stable for sales (at least at the
low volume level I'm contemplating.) to be semi-stable.

The other thing I think about is fun little pcb's and a part's bag/ list.
There's lot's of rather mundane circuits you can think about,
(gain, filtering)
fun ones are rev. biased led spads, and fast edge TDR's

Some standard box for little circuits would be nice.
Phil, what do you pay for your 'stomp' boxes.
(two piece dicast )

They're cheap--five or ten bucks depending on size. BTW once you have a
web site up, you can do pretty good SEO by adding your contact info and
a few keywords to your Usenet posts--SED is widely mirrored. (See below.)
Huh thanks for the SEO tip.
Re: SED mirroring. I do find it weird how many times I'm searching some
electronics thing and I get sent to a few years old SED discussion..
Sometimes that's good, cause it's a discussion I missed or skipped..

George S. Herold
unemployed instrument builder

Sometimes I google a subject and find my own old SED posts.

Want to do some occasional research for us? Email me.

Jim Thompson seems to be dead, so John Larkin will have to find some other right-wing lunatic to to tell just who has just e-mailed him privately.

James Arthur might serve.

I would rather have Jim here and for the Grim reaper to have done his assigned job on you.

Sure you would. Nobody has ever accused you of good judgement.

You are a cancer on this group.

You don't like me, but that doesn't make me any kind of cancer. John Larkin probably comes closer to that, in tat he posts a lot of stuff and very little of it is useful.

A lot of good people have left because of your continual attempt to be relevant, which you can only do with your mindless attempts to put others down.

Posting nonsense is what gets me cross. Being rude about that is the very antithesis of a mindless activity. You won't be aware of that, because you swallow a lot of the nonsense that I'm rude about. Since Jim Thompson fitted your idea of a "good person" your anxieties about the "good people" who have left the group can't really be taken seriously.

If you were the man you want us to think that you are, you wouldn't act like a baby cutting their first tooth.

Your ideas about how people ought to act don't seem to see anything wrong with Jim Thompson's activities. Your judgement isn't to be relied on.

Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.
 
On Saturday, January 25, 2020 at 4:22:22 PM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
So I've been in this kinda dark place... partly due to BS from my PPoE.
(need not be discussed)
But that looks to finally be behind me!

I went down to visit with Phil H. for a day, (wonderful people!),
and when I came back there was all this good news in the mail.
One says that I can use my unemployment insurance benefits
to apply for the Self-employment Assistance Program.
And I'd like to explore that idea here. (starting own company)

First off it seems like a big lift. Spit balling numbers, if
I'm going to take ~$100k in profit (to pay myself and health insurance
and taxes and..) I'm going to need ~$300k in sales.
(most of my ideas involve fun physics teaching stuff, where
price is paramount.) And I don't see any selling enough.

Maybe I need to think about selling to industry too?
I think my number one, this could sell enough, idea
is a LN flow cryostat*. With a bare-bones cryostat for
~$1-2k, (Dewar, minimal probe and pump.) Then people
could make their own probes, and I can sell different probes
(and electronics).
probes could sell for much more money....

The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

I don't mind, and even enjoy some, a little bit of marketing.
but it is what I look at as part of the grunt work.

Thoughts and ideas welcome.

George H.


*typically the variable flow impedance is done with a needle
valve. The needle valve is the expensive, costly to replace bit,
that thumb fingered brutish students can break**.
Part of me thinks.. well let your students learn on this one
(and make it easy to repair) Or some fixed impedance with
variable pressure to change flow.. or something else?
(magneto striction, pwm a solenoid, peizo electric valve?)
** actually I think the latest designs are motor controlled,
with torque sensors or something.

Good luck. It seems to be easier to find a path to making money when it is not so important. Uhg.
 
On Friday, January 31, 2020 at 9:58:21 PM UTC+11, Michael Terrell wrote:
On Thursday, January 30, 2020 at 8:27:14 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, January 31, 2020 at 10:13:28 AM UTC+11, Michael Terrell wrote:
On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 5:43:56 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 4:02:52 AM UTC+11, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 27 Jan 2020 08:47:12 -0800 (PST), George Herold wrote:

On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 3:50:04 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-26 15:42, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 11:16:31 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jan 2020 09:21:58 +0000, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:

Your ideas about how people ought to act don't seem to see anything wrong with Jim Thompson's activities. Your judgement isn't to be relied on.


Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

Michael Terrell seems to think I should strive to make what I post interesting to him. I do aim to include more discerning readers.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
 
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 1:26:03 PM UTC-5, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
tirsdag den 28. januar 2020 kl. 17.04.53 UTC+1 skrev George Herold:
On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 7:42:30 PM UTC-5, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
tirsdag den 28. januar 2020 kl. 00.53.22 UTC+1 skrev Rick C:
I've wanted to make some items that are small and cheap, like Chinese made and sold sort of cheap. But I can't find a way to sell they way they do. There could be lots of competition, but not until the volume gets high enough. I would love to contract out the whole thing, but my understanding is I would never see much money from it because of the way they work.


look at things like arduinos, arduino shields, MCU boards,
usb logic analysers, etc. I don't see how anyone makes any money on those. The minutes it gets any traction you can buy a clone on ebay with free shipping
for half your BOM

You've got places like Spark fun and ada-fruit which seem to be
carving out a niche in this space.

which is a bit surprising since much of what they make can be had for
a tenth on ebay complete with a link to sparkfun/adafruit for documentation
and software

Hmm Well.. either good support from vendor (has value to customer...
I don't mind spending more at DigiK or for beer at Hogan's
down the bottom of my hill, because I don't want either to go away.)
or people are lazy... maybe both.

George H.
 
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 2:35:35 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-26 15:31, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-26 06:06, Piglet wrote:
On 26/01/2020 00:15, George Herold wrote:
Sure with pressure as the pusher.  The one thing I hate about any
magnetic valve ideas.. is that it will f with any magnetic measurements.

George H.

Good luck George.

Getting movement without magnetic fields makes me wonder again about
Nitinol* "muscle wire" - always seemed a great solution looking for a
problem to solve. But possibly not right for your app, as far as I
know it is bang-bang only with no proportional control, slow in the
hundreds of milliseconds, and being thermally driven probably a
complete mismatch for cryo N2 valves!

piglet

*For those unfamiliar a shape memory alloy wire that switches between
two states and corresponding lengths with temperature. Passing a
current to self heat makes a sort of electrical-mechanical transducer.



Nitinol goes much faster if you use a thin gauge and dunk it in oil--you
can get audio rates out of it.  I have a couple of Blue Sky 'Collimeter'
units, which are shear-plate collimation testers dithered by a bit of
Nitinol wire driving a flexure pivot.

It'll give you nice smooth bidirectional motion if you have some sort of
feedback.  There's a resistance change associated with the phase
transition, but I don't know how repeatable that is.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


It might be interesting to mount a Nitinol coil spring coaxially with a
steel one to make rotary motion. The spring rate would let you limit
the torque on the valve, and running the current down one spring and
back up the other would cancel out the magnetic field pretty well. The
parlour trick would be the encoder.

Alternatively a model airplane servo would work--you can turn it off
between motions to get rid of the field.

Or you could put a breakaway shaft extension on the valve, so that Mr
Gorilla just has it come away in his hand without anything breaking
permanently. Something in a nice low-density polystyrene, maybe.

I was thinking about some cheap torque slippy thing like
goes on the end of electric drills.. I took one apart a few
weeks ago.. not sure the right name, torque clutch, slip?)

Some RC servo motor thing might work. It'd be cool if people
could program the valve... you could set up long temperature sweeps
77-400 K. But it would have to do multiple turns... not sure how that
would work.

But I'm putting this probe idea on the back burner. There are
too many unknowns to get ti up and running quickly.


I've got this HBT idea (which we talked about a little)
I'm going to start a new thread.

George H.
Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com
 
On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 10:43:22 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 08:04:47 -0800 (PST), George Herold
ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 7:42:30 PM UTC-5, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
tirsdag den 28. januar 2020 kl. 00.53.22 UTC+1 skrev Rick C:
I've wanted to make some items that are small and cheap, like Chinese made and sold sort of cheap. But I can't find a way to sell they way they do. There could be lots of competition, but not until the volume gets high enough. I would love to contract out the whole thing, but my understanding is I would never see much money from it because of the way they work.


look at things like arduinos, arduino shields, MCU boards,
usb logic analysers, etc. I don't see how anyone makes any money on those. The minutes it gets any traction you can buy a clone on ebay with free shipping
for half your BOM

You've got places like Spark fun and ada-fruit which seem to be
carving out a niche in this space.

George H.

Maybe do something exotic and physics-related. Cryo sensor adapters?
Mag field sensors? You know that business.
Yeah, I've got to start a HBT thread.
(The blue jay gang has invaded the bird feeder, scaring the cardinals
chickadees, juncos and woodpeckery birds into the nearby trees.
White snow, dark trees, the green on the spruce is the same shade as
maple bark.. The blue jays and red cardinals pop, color-wise. )

George h.
--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
"Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"
 
On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 9:58:45 AM UTC-5, Michael Kellett wrote:
On 26/01/2020 19:25, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 4:22:03 AM UTC-5, Tom Gardner wrote:
On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:
The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

And all the other administrivia :( Even if someone
else is doing all that guff, and engineer operates
at full throttle for about 30%-40% of their time.
The rest is "unproductive" meetings etc. Hence in
the absence of better information, multiply your
first estimate by 2.5-3.5 :)

I've seen a couple of startups make one mistake;
I suspect you are too smart, but here it is anyway...

The founder(s) are trapped by the glitz of being
"self-employed CEOs", and spend money on unnecessary
/visible/ trappings, e.g. cars, boardroom furniture,
and the like.

They feel great and "energised", but none of that
gets money in the door.

More successfully...

I've also seen successful R&D consultancies that
only buy the minimum of equipment, i.e. equipment
that is guaranteed to be useful on every project.

Any equipment that doesn't fall into that category
is bought on a project-by-project basis and after
the project it is part of the deliverable to the
client.

Good luck; all startups need that.

Huh, no I won't be purposely buy un-needed stuff.
If I was to do this LN2 thing, the first thing I'd need is
a leak detector. (Or an RGA and pumping station.)

I think I'm mostly trying to talk myself out of this idea.
If I could work 1/2 time for someone else and 1/2+ for myself
that might work.
George h.

Some ideas that may be useful:

I quit a family business 20 years ago to work on my own and it's been
good. I'm not rich but doing OK.
No one bosses me about, I go out with the dog during the day when it
suits me and work when it's raining or dark.

I've done 100% work for other people and while I've had zillions of
ideas I don't make my own products. Still thinking about it but doubt
I'll ever do it - I'm good at what I do but a lot less good at all the
stuff you need to be into to sell stuff and produce it.

Yeah, Marketing.. I haven't thought much about that.
Trade shows, workshops, website, word of mouth, all work.
I design things, write software, make prototypes and one off test gear
and do some product testing. It pays for loads of fun gear and a pretty
good time.
Sound a bit like Phil H's gig.

I don't get hung up about other people making money from my ideas -
there's always another idea coming along during the next dog walk !

(for me there are just a whole bunch of ideas festering in the back
of my brain... you do what you can. :^)
I do buy test gear - I quote jobs on a fixed price - its up to the
client to decide if likes the price or not - he doesn't need to know it
covers loads of labour or a new scope.
OK do you get a lot of repeat work? That would help.

In the end you have to discover what works for you, but it might be good
to try for a couple of freelance type jobs from existing contacts while
they are still fresh. Nothing builds your confidence like sending out an
invoice.

Yeah I don't have any free lance jobs from existing contacts.
(Oh dear, you remind me I once mentioned wanting to make a Cavendish
balance but with a big wall (with some holes) as the fixed mass
and maybe cylinder shapes for the moving masses. That would get like
two or so times the torque (I did the numbers once, riff on the
problem of falling through the earth) And some guy contacted me
and wanted me to build him one... for 50-100k or something.)

Thanks very much for your advice/ story.

George H.
 
On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 8:12:27 PM UTC-5, speff wrote:
On Tuesday, 28 January 2020 11:00:41 UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 5:41:44 PM UTC-5, Clifford Heath wrote:
On 28/1/20 7:16 am, George Herold wrote:
Hey here is sorta a crazy idea I had emailing with Clifford H.
How about designing/ building (as kits?) analog front and back
ends for the labjack?
https://labjack.com/

It's a bad idea(*) for a startup to be completely dependent on the
existence of any other single product or company. The Labjack looks like
a packaged version of the plentiful AD8706 modules, with some software.
Why wouldn't you just make those too, so you aren't dependent?

Search AliExpress for AD8706 and you'll see modules with parallel
interface for around $40, with USB for $60-ish. That gets you 8 channels
of 16-bit data at reasonable speed, which should be enough for many of
the lab projects you have in mind.

(*) The problem is that as soon as you become successful at some add-on
product, the company can easily duplicate your work and undercut you.
That's almost instant death when you're relying on their installed base.

Clifford Heath

Hi Clifford. Well first building something like the labjack is not my forte.
So better to let someone else do it. Much of the lab/interface/ hardware
and software space is taken up by national instruments and lab-view.
I find their hardware over priced and hate the software. So pushing an alternative seems like it might not only be good for me.. but also for the
physiics lab community.

I guess I wouldn't worry much about labjack coping me... small market.
If I head dwon this road I would try and contact labjack early on...
see if there are other vendors like me re-selling their stuff.

Anyway it is interesting to think about. at my PPoE I would often get
requests from customers to provide some sort of an experiment where students
could learn instrument/ computer interfacing. Going to physics lab
workshops the way people are doing this these days is either with
Arduino's, maybe a few Rasbery Pi's and labveiw.

One huge problem with this idea, is I'd have to become a labjack expert
and at the moment I'm a novice.

George H.

Hi, George:-

I guess the important thing is to know the customers and what they're
comfortable with- software they get free or already have and know how
to use, and hardware that they think is good for their application. The
younger guys I have been dealing with like MATLAB/Simulink, for example (despite
free alternatives), and I have yet to find anyone who likes Labview much, but some use it. As an aside, I've been playing around with it, because I ended up
with a little NI data acquisition system that runs off a PXI Windows XP card and
a couple NI USB-powered data acquisition modules. Nice for gathering data in
simple experiments.
Yeah the few, NI instruments I used I had no complaint with the
quality. (just the price.)
For the university/ college lab teaching market the customer base
is varied, from idiots to masters... mind you any given customer
can be an idiot about something and master at another.
As far as instrument interfacing, I'm much more an idiot than master.
(so maybe not the best thing to start a company doing that. :^)

I do get the feeling that those teaching uni labs are aware of
what type of skills/ techniques are getting their graduates jobs,
and trying to tailor labs for that. (My feeling is this is
much more so for BS physics majors.)

This is just an impression but I get the impression it's not that uncommon for
university purchases to go either top end (they have specific funding and are
going to spend it on really nice equipment) or bottom scraping (they've
got very little budget), which doesn't leave much room in the middle. That's
not the educational market though, which I'm not that familiar with. I've
seen a few products like Mr. SQUID, for example, but no idea of that market.
I know Mr. Squid...it's been sold around to a few different vendors.
I think the latest has gotten the bugs out of the 'repeated contacts to
stuff at LN2 temperatures.' (Mostly I don't hear complaints about it
anymore.)

But I think what you say (lotsa money, or shoe strings) is true of
teaching lab funding too. Just much less money than research labs.
So if I do something like this, I'd be selling to the fully funded
people. And then you sell bits and pieces of your stuff to the shoe
string guys, not making much, but bread on the water.

Hey Speff, I was thinking of trying to contact you via linked in...
but. Send me an email... ggherold at gmail
Maybe I can buy you lunch.

George H.

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
 
On Thursday, January 30, 2020 at 6:06:05 PM UTC-5, Michael Terrell wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 3:42:40 PM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 11:16:31 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jan 2020 09:21:58 +0000, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:
The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

And all the other administrivia :( Even if someone
else is doing all that guff, and engineer operates
at full throttle for about 30%-40% of their time.
The rest is "unproductive" meetings etc. Hence in
the absence of better information, multiply your
first estimate by 2.5-3.5 :)

I've seen a couple of startups make one mistake;
I suspect you are too smart, but here it is anyway...

The founder(s) are trapped by the glitz of being
"self-employed CEOs", and spend money on unnecessary
/visible/ trappings, e.g. cars, boardroom furniture,
and the like.

Some people think that the appearance of success (hence buying all
that glitzy expensive stuff) is success. It's the opposite.

One guy that I know of got some investors to join up, and first thing
bought a private jet. Next thing, they fired him.

(One common mistake is to give up too much equity early on, often to
less than savory/competent partners.)


They feel great and "energised", but none of that
gets money in the door.

More successfully...

I've also seen successful R&D consultancies that
only buy the minimum of equipment, i.e. equipment
that is guaranteed to be useful on every project.

General-purpose equipment is good to have around. These days, a suite
of good test equipment isn't very expensive.


Any equipment that doesn't fall into that category
is bought on a project-by-project basis and after
the project it is part of the deliverable to the
client.

NO! Keep all the toys! Well, you can provide custom test sets at large
additional cost. Price them separately; they may find that they want
several.
Yeah, a bad thing about losing my job, was losing most of my toys.
(I've got some power supplies, rigol scope and rigol sig. gen.
and as you say parts are pretty cheap these days.)

George H.



Good luck; all startups need that.

One can certainly be a consultant, and sell the IP and designs and
equipment on a one-time basis. That gets a company started, and some
people can do that forever. But that requires constant selling, and is
often feast-famine stressful. Selling products is a better long-term
force multiplier.
Right, you need a few horses in the stable for sales (at least at the
low volume level I'm contemplating.) to be semi-stable.

The other thing I think about is fun little pcb's and a part's bag/ list.
There's lot's of rather mundane circuits you can think about,
(gain, filtering)
fun ones are rev. biased led spads, and fast edge TDR's

Some standard box for little circuits would be nice.
Phil, what do you pay for your 'stomp' boxes.
(two piece diecast )

If you need a piece of test equipment, ask. A lot of us have an item or two that we wouldn't miss, and at a better price than the used equipment dealers or untested on Ebay. For my use, I bought mostly damaged or 'for parts' items and repaired the best of a model. Sometimes it was a working but damaged item, and one that looked brand new but wasn't worth repairing. Like a Fluke 8920 True RMS (up to 20MHz) like it had either been used in a High Voltage circuit, or it had been hit by lightning. It did yield a nice case. ;-)

There are a lot of diecast and extruded cases on Ebay for prototypes. There are some nice knockoffs of Hammond diecast with a brushed finish.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=1590BB+120x95x35mm+Aluminum+Box&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=0&_odkw=111599975005

I found some two piece 25mm extrusions that you can use with 'large flange' BNC,N and other connectors with a 1" square flange.I use them to build RF modules and test fixtures. These come in several colors and lengths.

A little blurry, taken with my cell phone

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vb8ezxigea6an1u/2020-01-30%2013.39.39.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q9734ehl1g4vpwj/2020-01-30%2013.39.49.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q3vu08mggnjcci4/2020-01-30%2013.39.57.jpg?dl=0

Hi Michael. Thanks! I'm not really sure where I'm going. So I
don't know what I'll need yet. :^) But I do appreciate the support.

George H.
 
On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 1:35:22 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-29 09:58, Michael Kellett wrote:
On 26/01/2020 19:25, George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, January 26, 2020 at 4:22:03 AM UTC-5, Tom Gardner wrote:
On 25/01/20 21:22, George Herold wrote:
The other bad thing about selling stuff is you've got to
spend ~1/2 your time on marketing... maybe more early on.

And all the other administrivia :( Even if someone
else is doing all that guff, and engineer operates
at full throttle for about 30%-40% of their time.
The rest is "unproductive" meetings etc. Hence in
the absence of better information, multiply your
first estimate by 2.5-3.5 :)

I've seen a couple of startups make one mistake;
I suspect you are too smart, but here it is anyway...

The founder(s) are trapped by the glitz of being
"self-employed CEOs", and spend money on unnecessary
/visible/ trappings, e.g. cars, boardroom furniture,
and the like.

They feel great and "energised", but none of that
gets money in the door.

More successfully...

I've also seen successful R&D consultancies that
only buy the minimum of equipment, i.e. equipment
that is guaranteed to be useful on every project.

Any equipment that doesn't fall into that category
is bought on a project-by-project basis and after
the project it is part of the deliverable to the
client.

Good luck; all startups need that.

Huh, no I won't be purposely buy un-needed stuff.
If I was to do this LN2 thing, the first thing I'd need is
a leak detector.  (Or an RGA and pumping station.)

I think I'm mostly trying to talk myself out of this idea.
If I could work 1/2 time for someone else and 1/2+ for myself
that might work.
George h.

Some ideas that may be useful:

I quit a family business 20 years ago to work on my own and it's been
good. I'm not rich but doing OK.
No one bosses me about, I go out with the dog during the day when it
suits me and work when it's raining or dark.

 I've done 100% work for other people and while I've had zillions of
ideas I don't make my own products. Still thinking about it but doubt
I'll ever do it - I'm good at what I do but a lot less good at all the
stuff you need to be into to sell stuff and produce it.

I design things, write software, make prototypes and one off test gear
and do some product testing. It pays for loads of fun gear and a pretty
good time.

I don't get hung up about other people making money from my ideas -
there's always another idea coming along during the next dog walk !

I do buy test gear - I quote jobs on a fixed price - its up to the
client to decide if likes the price or not - he doesn't need to know it
covers loads of labour or a new scope.

In the end you have to discover what works for you, but it might be good
to try for a couple of freelance type jobs from existing contacts while
they are still fresh. Nothing builds your confidence like sending out an
invoice.

MK

We've recently been moving from a straight NRE basis into know-how
licensing plus NRE for customization. If you have enough recurring
themes in your designs, you can do your own based on stuff you've
learned on other jobs.

Many of our projects, especially for new customers, include a photon
budget and proof-of-concept (POC) demo as the first two milestones.

These days our POC systems usually consist largely of a collection of
our existing boards (often modded) plus fairly small amounts of
hand-wired custom circuitry and fairly simple optics and mechanics as
required.

There's this very nice synergy of putting together parts
in different ways. I bunch of the stuff I made was just
one or two analog IC's (quad opamp = 1 IC) with power, connections
and switches. I was alwyas using some bit for something else.
Here's the POC from the cathodoluminescence system that I posted a few
months back:
https://electrooptical.net/www/sed/MPPCphotonCounting.mpg>. It goes
from photon counting up to bright room lights with a twist of a knob,
which we think is pretty slick.

We find that when they see our stuff doing what they wanted, better than
they hoped, cheaper than they expected, the licensing conversation
usually goes pretty smoothly. It helps that our royalty expectations
are fairly modest--we'd way rather do lots of deals that put smiles on
everybody's faces than screw the last dime out of only a few.

YMMV, but a bit of recurring revenue is very comforting.

Thinking of flapping off by myself is a bit scary!

George H.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com
 
On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 09:29:17 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 10:43:22 AM UTC-5, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 08:04:47 -0800 (PST), George Herold
ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, January 27, 2020 at 7:42:30 PM UTC-5, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
tirsdag den 28. januar 2020 kl. 00.53.22 UTC+1 skrev Rick C:
I've wanted to make some items that are small and cheap, like Chinese made and sold sort of cheap. But I can't find a way to sell they way they do. There could be lots of competition, but not until the volume gets high enough. I would love to contract out the whole thing, but my understanding is I would never see much money from it because of the way they work.


look at things like arduinos, arduino shields, MCU boards,
usb logic analysers, etc. I don't see how anyone makes any money on those. The minutes it gets any traction you can buy a clone on ebay with free shipping
for half your BOM

You've got places like Spark fun and ada-fruit which seem to be
carving out a niche in this space.

George H.

Maybe do something exotic and physics-related. Cryo sensor adapters?
Mag field sensors? You know that business.

Yeah, I've got to start a HBT thread.
(The blue jay gang has invaded the bird feeder, scaring the cardinals
chickadees, juncos and woodpeckery birds into the nearby trees.
White snow, dark trees, the green on the spruce is the same shade as
maple bark.. The blue jays and red cardinals pop, color-wise. )

George h.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
"Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

We had a mountain lion near the Safeway on Diamond Heights Blvd. About
a zillion animal control people took it away.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/d75t8nid5u2z3n8/ML2.jpg?raw=1

And lots of coyotes. Now we seem to have at least one big cat but not
as big as the one in the pic, some sort of lynx maybe.

Coyotes have been seen commuting across the Golden Gate Bridge.

I wonder if it would be worth making a little cryo-diode adapter for
an arduino or a Lab Jack or something. Then it would be a small step
to making a cryo temperature controller.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com
 

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