MH370 crash site identified with amateur radio technology...

[Martin Brown]

On 06/09/2023 19:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:

On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 09:49:48 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

The example is topologically equivalent to real* code you merely have to
construct input data that will force execution down each binary choice
in turn at every level. Getting the absolute minimum number of test
vectors for full coverage is a much harder problem but a good enough
solution is possible in most practical cases.

In practice, this is certainly pretty effective, but the proposed
requirement did not allow for such shortcuts, rendering the
requirement intractable - the Sun will blow up first.

Also, in practice we do a combination of random probing and fuzzing.

.<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzzing

One tactic I have adopted for testing numerical code is very similar.
Basically a biassed random number generator which creates test data for
the routines under test and then verifies the answers.

It is extra work to do both a solver and a verifier but not that much
and the verification of such provides a basis for regression testing.

Most software the computation being done may be very difficult but the
inverse is often relatively easy by comparison. Finding all real roots
of a function f(x)=0 to maximum accuracy is quite tricky but given a
supposed root x0 then computing the value of the equation f(x0) and its
derivative f\'(x0) is easy. Then you can use NR to see if the correction
is acceptably small enough, if not rinse and repeat.

I found a new bug in a cubic solver that is as robust as any on the
planet quite recently. It required a very specific near exact
combination of 3 64 bit parameters to create a catastrophic numeric
cancellation down a seldom trodden path where the cubic equation has
three real roots and you want the one that it can\'t compute accurately.

Most of these problems we try very hard to only have one real root...

My initial reaction was that it was tested library code so it must be my
problem - until I traced into it and saw how it failed. It gives 8
instead of 16 sig fig in double precision for these pathological data.

--
Martin Brown

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Thu, 7 Sep 2023 17:31:42 +0100, Martin Brown
<\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

On 06/09/2023 19:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 09:49:48 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

The example is topologically equivalent to real* code you merely have to
construct input data that will force execution down each binary choice
in turn at every level. Getting the absolute minimum number of test
vectors for full coverage is a much harder problem but a good enough
solution is possible in most practical cases.

In practice, this is certainly pretty effective, but the proposed
requirement did not allow for such shortcuts, rendering the
requirement intractable - the Sun will blow up first.

Also, in practice we do a combination of random probing and fuzzing.

.<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzzing

One tactic I have adopted for testing numerical code is very similar.
Basically a biased random number generator which creates test data for
the routines under test and then verifies the answers.

What do you mean by biased?

It is extra work to do both a solver and a verifier but not that much
and the verification of such provides a basis for regression testing.

Most software the computation being done may be very difficult but the
inverse is often relatively easy by comparison. Finding all real roots
of a function f(x)=0 to maximum accuracy is quite tricky but given a
supposed root x0 then computing the value of the equation f(x0) and its
derivative f\'(x0) is easy. Then you can use NR to see if the correction
is acceptably small enough, if not rinse and repeat.

I often do that. Another trick is that many problems can be solved
two different ways, so I solve twice and compare.

One can also check that invariant\'s are respected.

NR = Newton Raphson?

And then there is co-plotting and staring - the Mark I eyeball is a
very good pattern and anomaly detector, especially of concentricity or
linearity.

I found a new bug in a cubic solver that is as robust as any on the
planet quite recently. It required a very specific near exact
combination of 3 64 bit parameters to create a catastrophic numeric
cancellation down a seldom trodden path where the cubic equation has
three real roots and you want the one that it can\'t compute accurately.

Most of these problems we try very hard to only have one real root...

My initial reaction was that it was tested library code so it must be my
problem - until I traced into it and saw how it failed. It gives 8
instead of 16 sig fig in double precision for these pathological data.

That\'s a good one.


A sort-of parallel of my experience was in the late 1990s when looking
for failure patterns in how a network was composed and connected, and
were looking for test cases that could be used to debut the
fault-tolerance algorithm. We used a form of Monte Carlo test, where
we described the network contents and topology using a random number,
and then tried the FT algorithm on it. Only if the algorithm failed
(anything other than graceful behavior) did we record the random
number, and then proceed, looking. Letting the random poking continue
day and night for a few days sufficiently reduced the algorithm
failure rate.

Key to this was to write the algorithm and test harness in plain C
code, not using any commercial statistical test application - these
were large interpreters, and were orders of magnitude too slow. Not
to mention expensive and hard to use. Sometimes, it\'s best to
reinvent the wheel.

Now days, I\'d probably use some kind of genetic programming to
generate test cases. But totally random had the advantage of making
no assumptions, and so caught hazards that nobody could guess or
suspect.

Joe Gwinn

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 3 Sep 2023 17:41:00 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying
<skybuckflying@gmail.com> wrote:

model m101-cbj

the red laser goes from bright to dark.

maybe dark red can\'t see through slighty scratched plastic, but it could also be a power saving bug, it freezes completely except buttons, after passing fingers past lasers it works again.

I tried deactivating usb power savings ? in german... did not hel;
any ideas how to keep the laser on at max brightness/power?
w7

Probably power save. If you can\'t disarm the power save in the mouse
driver, try it using a custom power plan:
<https://www.minitool.com/news/how-to-disable-usb-selective-suspend-settings.html>

Incidentally, I recently purchased at a thrift store a RedDragon
S101-3 gaming mouse, which has a somewhat similar problem:
<https://redragonshop.com/products/redragon-s101-combo>
I has the same sleeping disorder as your Medion (Lenovo) mouse, and a
small collection of other irritations. For example, the default mouse
lighting mode is flashing all the red mouse lights at full brightness
every few seconds. This can be disabled by switching the driver into
one of two available modes, no lights or full bright with no flashing.
Unplug the USB mouse momentarily and the mouse returns to default
flashing red at full brightness and requires a reboot to return to
sanity. It looks almost new but the rubberized paint is well on its
way to de-vulcanizing and becoming a sticky mess. I should have been
suspicious and ask what an almost new mouse is doing in a thrift
store.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Flyguy]

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 5:05:08 AM UTC-7, John Walliker wrote:

On Monday, 4 September 2023 at 10:12:50 UTC+1, gggg gggg wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

The trouble with that theory is that they would be unlikely to be overcome by smoke
when wearing oxygen masks - which they would undoubtedly put on in such a situation.

John

This \"theory\" is COMPLETELY DEBUNKED by the facts of the flight path of MH370 by multiple reconstructions.
GIVE IT UP, ALREADY!!

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 4:45:32 PM UTC+10, Flyguy wrote:

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 5:05:08 AM UTC-7, John Walliker wrote:
On Monday, 4 September 2023 at 10:12:50 UTC+1, gggg gggg wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

The trouble with that theory is that they would be unlikely to be overcome by smoke
when wearing oxygen masks - which they would undoubtedly put on in such a situation.

This \"theory\" is COMPLETELY DEBUNKED by the facts of the flight path of MH370 by multiple reconstructions.
GIVE IT UP, ALREADY!!

Sadly Flyguy is arguing from \"facts\" he doesn\'t provided links to. We know that there isn\'t a \"fact\" that Flyguy can\'t interpret as supporting his notion about what is going on (even when they directly contradict them), so his unsupported assertions are a complete waste of bandwidth.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[gggg gggg]

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 5:05:08 AM UTC-7, John Walliker wrote:

On Monday, 4 September 2023 at 10:12:50 UTC+1, gggg gggg wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

The trouble with that theory is that they would be unlikely to be overcome by smoke
when wearing oxygen masks - which they would undoubtedly put on in such a situation.

John

If you haven\'t already read my theory, it may be of interest:

https://groups.google.com/u/1/g/sci.electronics.design/c/QSwrqfKRUr0

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 5:49:34 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 5:05:08 AM UTC-7, John Walliker wrote:
On Monday, 4 September 2023 at 10:12:50 UTC+1, gggg gggg wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

The trouble with that theory is that they would be unlikely to be overcome by smoke
when wearing oxygen masks - which they would undoubtedly put on in such a situation.

John
If you haven\'t already read my theory, it may be of interest:

https://groups.google.com/u/1/g/sci.electronics.design/c/QSwrqfKRUr0

Theories are interesting when they put together real evidence about things that have actually happened.

Your exposition didn\'t link back to any real data. so it isn\'t remotely interesting.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Martin Brown]

On 07/09/2023 23:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:

On Thu, 7 Sep 2023 17:31:42 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

On 06/09/2023 19:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 09:49:48 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

The example is topologically equivalent to real* code you merely have to
construct input data that will force execution down each binary choice
in turn at every level. Getting the absolute minimum number of test
vectors for full coverage is a much harder problem but a good enough
solution is possible in most practical cases.

In practice, this is certainly pretty effective, but the proposed
requirement did not allow for such shortcuts, rendering the
requirement intractable - the Sun will blow up first.

Also, in practice we do a combination of random probing and fuzzing.

.<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzzing

One tactic I have adopted for testing numerical code is very similar.
Basically a biased random number generator which creates test data for
the routines under test and then verifies the answers.

What do you mean by biased?

Instead of a linear random number on 0-1 it generates numbers that are
focussed on regions that may cause trouble for the algorithm under test.

Usually but not always in the vicinity of zero or very large values. A
few bits of the original seed are used to determine how to convert it.

Typical mappings from x a double precision uniform on 0-1 are
x
x^2
1-x^2
x^4
x^8
x^16

with some scale factor K multiplying it up to beyond the range that the
parameter is supposed to take. Or more generally but a bit sparse:

x/(1+eps-x)
(x-1/2)/(1+eps-x)

(sacrifices 3 bits of the original 64 bit seed)

It is extra work to do both a solver and a verifier but not that much
and the verification of such provides a basis for regression testing.

Most software the computation being done may be very difficult but the
inverse is often relatively easy by comparison. Finding all real roots
of a function f(x)=0 to maximum accuracy is quite tricky but given a
supposed root x0 then computing the value of the equation f(x0) and its
derivative f\'(x0) is easy. Then you can use NR to see if the correction
is acceptably small enough, if not rinse and repeat.

I often do that. Another trick is that many problems can be solved
two different ways, so I solve twice and compare.

One can also check that invariant\'s are respected.

Invariants are invaluable in critical code you get to find out sooner
rather than later if one of your assumptions is invalid, something has
gone wrong or the routine has been fed garbage inputs.

> NR = Newton Raphson?

Yes. Although these days my production code actually uses Halley\'s
method in preference since it is almost the same speed to execute on
modern pipeline CPUs and gives cubic rather than quadratic convergence.

Some practitioners prefer what they call modified NR which is a sort of
hybrid of NR with Halley with slightly better convergence than Halley.
However it involves a sqrt and isn\'t always better.

Equation (4) in this paper (which includes the derivation) - method
originally due to Laguerre but now seeing a revival in some codes.

https://academic.oup.com/mnras/article/467/2/1702/2929272

The gotcha is that although as written with abs() it never actually
fails - a sufficiently bad guess will still give poor answers, but is
much less likely to explode or oscillate in the way that NR does.

I\'m not convinced that it is worth the cost of a sqrt but with CPUs
improving all the time it is now very close. The latest i5-12600 I have
can do a sqrt in about the same time as it takes to do a divide!

And then there is co-plotting and staring - the Mark I eyeball is a
very good pattern and anomaly detector, especially of concentricity or
linearity.

Looking at the plot of residual errors can be very enlightening. So can
looking at the histogram for many test cases of the error distribution
of solve, test and then measure error in the resulting answer.

It is remarkably easy to home in on any weak spots and edge cases. My
normal reporting rule is printout exceptions whenever the worst case
high or low error is exceeded. Verbose mode shows when it is equalled.

I found a new bug in a cubic solver that is as robust as any on the
planet quite recently. It required a very specific near exact
combination of 3 64 bit parameters to create a catastrophic numeric
cancellation down a seldom trodden path where the cubic equation has
three real roots and you want the one that it can\'t compute accurately.

Most of these problems we try very hard to only have one real root...

My initial reaction was that it was tested library code so it must be my
problem - until I traced into it and saw how it failed. It gives 8
instead of 16 sig fig in double precision for these pathological data.

That\'s a good one.

I was a bit surprised. It required an astonishingly exact combination of
factors for it to trigger and one of my real problems hit it square on.

--
Martin Brown

 

[Klaus Kragelund]

On Tuesday, 5 September 2023 at 12:29:31 UTC+2, piglet wrote:

On 04/09/2023 10:59 pm, Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund wrote:
On 03-09-2023 18:05, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Sunday, September 3, 2023 at 10:42:14 AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 3 Sep 2023 05:38:52 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, September 3, 2023 at 4:15:30?AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 2 Sep 2023 11:20:49 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, September 1, 2023 at 4:53:24?PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 1 Sep 2023 12:56:31 -0700 (PDT), Klaus Kragelund
klaus.k...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi

I have a triac control circuit in which I supply gate current
all the time to avoid zero crossing noise.

https://electronicsdesign.dk/tmp/TriacSolution.PNG

Apparently, sometimes the circuit spontaneously turns on the triac.
It\'s probable due to a transient, high dV/dt, turning on via
\"rate of rise of offstate voltage\" limits.

The triac used is BT137S-600:

https://www.mouser.dk/datasheet/2/848/bt137s-600g-1520710.pdf

I am using a snubber to divert energy, and also have a pulldown
of 1kohm to shunt energy transients that capacitively couple
into the gate.

The unit is at the client, so have not measured on it yet, so
trying to guess what I should try to remove the problem.

I could:

Do a more hard snubber
Reduce the shunt resistor
Get a better triac
Add an inductor in series to limit the transient

One thing I though of, since I turn it on all the time, and it
is not very critical that the timing is perfect in terms of
turning it on in the zero crossing, was to add a big capacitor
on the gate in parallel with shunt resistor R543. That will act
as low impedance for high speed transients.

Good idea, or better ideas?

Cheers

Klaus
It\'s a sensitive-gate triac. R542 and 543 look big to me. They could
be smaller and bypassed.

If there are motors in the vicinity, you want to at least use
twisted leads in all feeds of the gate circuit.
I doubt that would make any difference.

Twisted pairs make a HUGE difference.
Sometimes. Probably not here.

I wonder how far from the triac the opto is.


The opto is just next to the Triac, and with a good ground plane, so no
twisting of the gate traces needed,

It drops 1.3V minimum at 10A. It has an R theta-JC of about 2. If the
application is high current, it needs a heat sink, so it may be off
board.

I^2T is only 21, which is kind of weak.

The max rate of rise of turn off commutating is min. 10 V/us, again on
the low side.

But dVd/dt is a minimum of 200 V/us with the gate open, that\'s to
trigger a commutation from the off state, which is pretty good but not
outstanding. It could be that, and if so a standard L shunt C off the
line is all that\'s needed.

Don\'t know how you get sensitive gate with 30mA trigger current.

The kicker is VGT, gate trigger voltage. At 400V across main
terminals, it could be as low as 0.25V @125oC, making for 0.4V at
25oC. Table 6. That kind of number indicates a vulnerability. He
definitely should guard the gate drive.

https://www.mouser.dk/datasheet/2/848/bt137s-600g-1520710.pdf

The combination of the voltage rate of rise and the capacitance from
M1/M2 to the gate is what triggers it, right?

So just adding a capacitor on the gate would be a good way to protect
against noise, right?
Yes, I\'d put a capacitor across R543. At a guess 0.1uF a good first try,
maybe even upto 0.47uF. R543 at 1k is far too high and maybe not even
necessary since a lot of triacs that size have on-die resistors gate-MT1
- you could measure one.

Is there a special reason the triac side supply is negative ground? That
triac is capable of positive gate triggering but is much less sensitive.
I almost always have the logic supply positive ground triac side so the
gate is driven from the -3.3 or -5V.

The changes was implemented, and now the spurious triggering is gone

I still need to be sure that I have sufficient robustness, so it doesn\'t creep up again...

 

[gggg gggg]

On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
> https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 09:33:33 +0100, Martin Brown
<\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

On 07/09/2023 23:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Thu, 7 Sep 2023 17:31:42 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

On 06/09/2023 19:20, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 09:49:48 +0100, Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

The example is topologically equivalent to real* code you merely have to
construct input data that will force execution down each binary choice
in turn at every level. Getting the absolute minimum number of test
vectors for full coverage is a much harder problem but a good enough
solution is possible in most practical cases.

In practice, this is certainly pretty effective, but the proposed
requirement did not allow for such shortcuts, rendering the
requirement intractable - the Sun will blow up first.

Also, in practice we do a combination of random probing and fuzzing.

.<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzzing

One tactic I have adopted for testing numerical code is very similar.
Basically a biased random number generator which creates test data for
the routines under test and then verifies the answers.

What do you mean by biased?

Instead of a linear random number on 0-1 it generates numbers that are
focussed on regions that may cause trouble for the algorithm under test.

Usually but not always in the vicinity of zero or very large values. A
few bits of the original seed are used to determine how to convert it.

Typical mappings from x a double precision uniform on 0-1 are
x
x^2
1-x^2
x^4
x^8
x^16

with some scale factor K multiplying it up to beyond the range that the
parameter is supposed to take. Or more generally but a bit sparse:

This reminds me of how one tests memory hardware.

x/(1+eps-x)
(x-1/2)/(1+eps-x)

I\'d be tempted to fuzz the eps parameter.

(sacrifices 3 bits of the original 64 bit seed)

It is extra work to do both a solver and a verifier but not that much
and the verification of such provides a basis for regression testing.

Most software the computation being done may be very difficult but the
inverse is often relatively easy by comparison. Finding all real roots
of a function f(x)=0 to maximum accuracy is quite tricky but given a
supposed root x0 then computing the value of the equation f(x0) and its
derivative f\'(x0) is easy. Then you can use NR to see if the correction
is acceptably small enough, if not rinse and repeat.

I often do that. Another trick is that many problems can be solved
two different ways, so I solve twice and compare.

One can also check that invariant\'s are respected.

Invariants are invaluable in critical code you get to find out sooner
rather than later if one of your assumptions is invalid, something has
gone wrong or the routine has been fed garbage inputs.

Oh yes. I also code invariants into in-line assertions, for runtime
detection.

NR = Newton Raphson?

Yes. Although these days my production code actually uses Halley\'s
method in preference since it is almost the same speed to execute on
modern pipeline CPUs and gives cubic rather than quadratic convergence.

Interesting. I had not heard of Halley\'s Method, and cubic
convergence is worthwhile.

Some practitioners prefer what they call modified NR which is a sort of
hybrid of NR with Halley with slightly better convergence than Halley.
However it involves a sqrt and isn\'t always better.

Equation (4) in this paper (which includes the derivation) - method
originally due to Laguerre but now seeing a revival in some codes.

https://academic.oup.com/mnras/article/467/2/1702/2929272

The gotcha is that although as written with abs() it never actually
fails - a sufficiently bad guess will still give poor answers, but is
much less likely to explode or oscillate in the way that NR does.

So NR is better because it always warns?

I\'m not convinced that it is worth the cost of a sqrt but with CPUs
improving all the time it is now very close. The latest i5-12600 I have
can do a sqrt in about the same time as it takes to do a divide!

Wonder what algorithm it uses?

And then there is co-plotting and staring - the Mark I eyeball is a
very good pattern and anomaly detector, especially of concentricity or
linearity.

Looking at the plot of residual errors can be very enlightening. So can
looking at the histogram for many test cases of the error distribution
of solve, test and then measure error in the resulting answer.

It is remarkably easy to home in on any weak spots and edge cases. My
normal reporting rule is printout exceptions whenever the worst case
high or low error is exceeded. Verbose mode shows when it is equalled.

Yes. But I always make plots and stare at them.

Although I have found it useful to program a distinctive chord that
sounds if for instance two measurement datafiles are identical, or a
file was not found, so I don\'t have to stare at the screen when the
code is grinding away.

I found a new bug in a cubic solver that is as robust as any on the
planet quite recently. It required a very specific near exact
combination of 3 64 bit parameters to create a catastrophic numeric
cancellation down a seldom trodden path where the cubic equation has
three real roots and you want the one that it can\'t compute accurately.

Most of these problems we try very hard to only have one real root...

My initial reaction was that it was tested library code so it must be my
problem - until I traced into it and saw how it failed. It gives 8
instead of 16 sig fig in double precision for these pathological data.

That\'s a good one.

I was a bit surprised. It required an astonishingly exact combination of
factors for it to trigger and one of my real problems hit it square on.

So biased probing paid off here? Or only for diagnosis?

In the 1980s I hit a similar problem, but it wasn\'t hard to find. In
scaled integer arithmetic (no floating point then), it\'s very common
to multiply two 32-bit integers together, yielding a 64-bit product,
and then divide that by a 64-bit scaling factor, yielding a 32-bit
quotient. In the Fortran of the day, if one just wrote this as
(a*b)/c, the compiler would truncate the product (a*b) to 32 bits
before dividing by c, yielding a wildly wrong answer, without any
warnings or drama. The solution was define a 64-bit intermediate
variable, and do the operation in two lines: p=a*b, result = p/c.

Joe Gwinn

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:

On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571

Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[gggg gggg]

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane..

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[gggg gggg]

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 11:31:35 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html
They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

According to a lady on a yacht:

- I was looking at what appeared to be an elongated plane glowing bright orange, with a trail of black smoke behind it.

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f108/i-think-i-saw-mh370-127132.html

As for the orange glow:

- The senior cabin crew member was summoned. At that point, a hiss was heard before a \"tornado\" of smoke appeared, accompanied by an orange glow....When phones are crushed or deformed, it can cause a lithium battery to become pierced. This, in turn, can cause the phone to ignite. According to the AAIB, a lithium battery is more likely to catch fire during or just after charging. At the time of the incident, the passenger had plugged the phone in.

https://simpleflying.com/british-airways-787-iphone-fire/

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:32:16 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:

On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 11:31:35 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

According to a lady on a yacht:

- I was looking at what appeared to be an elongated plane glowing bright orange, with a trail of black smoke behind it.

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f108/i-think-i-saw-mh370-127132.html

But nobody seems to have taken her seriously. You do get lots of attention-seeking behavior after big news stories.

As for the orange glow:

- The senior cabin crew member was summoned. At that point, a hiss was heard before a \"tornado\" of smoke appeared, accompanied by an orange glow....When phones are crushed or deformed, it can cause a lithium battery to become pierced. This, in turn, can cause the phone to ignite. According to the AAIB, a lithium battery is more likely to catch fire during or just after charging. At the time of the incident, the passenger had plugged the phone in.

https://simpleflying.com/british-airways-787-iphone-fire/

Somebody else\'s minor disaster, with no obvious relevance to this major one..

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[gggg gggg]

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:44:25 AM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:32:16 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 11:31:35 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

According to a lady on a yacht:

- I was looking at what appeared to be an elongated plane glowing bright orange, with a trail of black smoke behind it.

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f108/i-think-i-saw-mh370-127132.html
But nobody seems to have taken her seriously. You do get lots of attention-seeking behavior after big news stories.
As for the orange glow:

- The senior cabin crew member was summoned. At that point, a hiss was heard before a \"tornado\" of smoke appeared, accompanied by an orange glow.....When phones are crushed or deformed, it can cause a lithium battery to become pierced. This, in turn, can cause the phone to ignite. According to the AAIB, a lithium battery is more likely to catch fire during or just after charging. At the time of the incident, the passenger had plugged the phone in.

https://simpleflying.com/british-airways-787-iphone-fire/
Somebody else\'s minor disaster, with no obvious relevance to this major one.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

And what about this witness:

- There was no noise, just black smoke as a result of fires before it crashed into the water. There was a strong smell of acidic fumes in the air before the plane went down, he added.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6597725/Fisherman-claims-SAW-MH370-recorded-EXACT-location-GPS.html

Concerning the \"....strong smell of acidic fumes in he air...\":

- Lithium-ion battery fires generate intense heat and considerable amounts of gas and smoke. Although the emission of toxic gases can be a larger threat than the heat...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5577247/

 

[gggg gggg]

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 10:53:44 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:44:25 AM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:32:16 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 11:31:35 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

According to a lady on a yacht:

- I was looking at what appeared to be an elongated plane glowing bright orange, with a trail of black smoke behind it.

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f108/i-think-i-saw-mh370-127132.html
But nobody seems to have taken her seriously. You do get lots of attention-seeking behavior after big news stories.
As for the orange glow:

- The senior cabin crew member was summoned. At that point, a hiss was heard before a \"tornado\" of smoke appeared, accompanied by an orange glow.....When phones are crushed or deformed, it can cause a lithium battery to become pierced. This, in turn, can cause the phone to ignite. According to the AAIB, a lithium battery is more likely to catch fire during or just after charging. At the time of the incident, the passenger had plugged the phone in.

https://simpleflying.com/british-airways-787-iphone-fire/
Somebody else\'s minor disaster, with no obvious relevance to this major one.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
And what about this witness:

- There was no noise, just black smoke as a result of fires before it crashed into the water. There was a strong smell of acidic fumes in the air before the plane went down, he added.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6597725/Fisherman-claims-SAW-MH370-recorded-EXACT-location-GPS.html

Concerning the \"....strong smell of acidic fumes in he air...\":

- Lithium-ion battery fires generate intense heat and considerable amounts of gas and smoke. Although the emission of toxic gases can be a larger threat than the heat...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5577247/

And this:

- Battery acid smells like rotten eggs or burnt rubber, and it has a strong acidic odor ...

https://www.tycorun.com/blogs/news/how-to-spot-battery-leaking-acid-helpful-guide-to-dispose-a-leaking-battery

 

[John Smiht]

On Thursday, September 7, 2023 at 7:56:31 PM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Sun, 3 Sep 2023 17:41:00 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying
skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

model m101-cbj

the red laser goes from bright to dark.

maybe dark red can\'t see through slighty scratched plastic, but it could also be a power saving bug, it freezes completely except buttons, after passing fingers past lasers it works again.

I tried deactivating usb power savings ? in german... did not hel;
any ideas how to keep the laser on at max brightness/power?
w7
Probably power save. If you can\'t disarm the power save in the mouse
driver, try it using a custom power plan:
https://www.minitool.com/news/how-to-disable-usb-selective-suspend-settings.html

Incidentally, I recently purchased at a thrift store a RedDragon
S101-3 gaming mouse, which has a somewhat similar problem:
https://redragonshop.com/products/redragon-s101-combo
I has the same sleeping disorder as your Medion (Lenovo) mouse, and a
small collection of other irritations. For example, the default mouse
lighting mode is flashing all the red mouse lights at full brightness
every few seconds. This can be disabled by switching the driver into
one of two available modes, no lights or full bright with no flashing.
Unplug the USB mouse momentarily and the mouse returns to default
flashing red at full brightness and requires a reboot to return to
sanity. It looks almost new but the rubberized paint is well on its
way to de-vulcanizing and becoming a sticky mess. I should have been
suspicious and ask what an almost new mouse is doing in a thrift
store.

--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Of course the mouse freezes. It\'s not moving.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 3:53:44 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:

On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:44:25 AM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:32:16 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 11:31:35 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 3:23:05 PM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Friday, September 8, 2023 at 9:51:18 PM UTC-7, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 4:43:02 AM UTC+10, gggg gggg wrote:
On Monday, September 4, 2023 at 2:12:50 AM UTC-7, wrote:
https://www.wired.com/2015/07/still-best-theory-mh370/

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/mh370-lawsuit-suggests-electrical-failures-led-crash-n730571
Ambulance chaser logic. The plane went done, Boeing is worth suing, so it makes sense to allege that there was a defect in the design of the plane.

It\'s not evidence about what did go wrong, merely speculation about what might have gone wrong. The \"best theory\" is still just a theory, and will stay that way until we find enough of the wreckage to learn more. which seems unlikely to happen.

Concerning an electrical fire, what about these 2 photos which show burn/scorch marks?:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/12/asia/mh370-fire-madagascar-blaine-gibson/index.html

They show discolorations. You can use an electron microscope set up to generate X-ray fluorescence from discolored areas to work out what is creating the funny colors.

The report doesn\'t mention the results of any such tests, so nobody seems to be taking the question seriously. I\'m not going to either.

According to a lady on a yacht:

- I was looking at what appeared to be an elongated plane glowing bright orange, with a trail of black smoke behind it.

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f108/i-think-i-saw-mh370-127132.html

But nobody seems to have taken her seriously. You do get lots of attention-seeking behavior after big news stories.

As for the orange glow:

- The senior cabin crew member was summoned. At that point, a hiss was heard before a \"tornado\" of smoke appeared, accompanied by an orange glow.....When phones are crushed or deformed, it can cause a lithium battery to become pierced. This, in turn, can cause the phone to ignite. According to the AAIB, a lithium battery is more likely to catch fire during or just after charging. At the time of the incident, the passenger had plugged the phone in.

https://simpleflying.com/british-airways-787-iphone-fire/

Somebody else\'s minor disaster, with no obvious relevance to this major one.

And what about this witness:

- There was no noise, just black smoke as a result of fires before it crashed into the water. There was a strong smell of acidic fumes in the air before the plane went down, he added.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6597725/Fisherman-claims-SAW-MH370-recorded-EXACT-location-GPS.html

But it\'s the Daily Mail, in 2019. The \"witness\" might have recorded an exact GPS location. but either nobody took him seriously enough to look for wreckage from the plane around there, or they looked and didn\'t find any. The Daily Mail is infamous for the dubious quality of its \"journanlism\".

<snipped more speculation about lithium ion batteries>

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney