Jihad needs scientists

[Kurt Ullman]

In article <eg3f0u$j7l$8@leto.cc.emory.edu>,
lparker@emory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

First, we don't know that. Secondly, when did the 4th amendment get repealed
for an American citizen calling, say, France?

Didn't. If the American is CALLING France, warrants are still needed,
even under the Bush statement. When calls originate OUTSIDE the country
and just come, then Bush says they don't need warrants. This is backed
up by current law, more or less. If there is a legal tap on Goomba 1,
then if Goomba 2 calls G1, anything G2 says is usable against G2,
because the tap was legal.
In this case, when calls originate outside the US, there are no
requirements for warrant. Thus, if Terrorist 1 calls Terrorist 2 in
Pakistan it is legal. If T1 calls T3 in Newark it is also legal.
If one phone is legally tapped any calls to or from that phone are
fair game.

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 05:15:37 GMT, "Homer J Simpson"
<nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
news:t1v8i21l8kal7h6td3j4nr6gir8t5b26mu@4ax.com...

Sounds strange to me. The people I know have traveled a lot, and many
have lived in other countries. Americans are often fans and admirers
of other countries and languages. As for not being very introspective,
that is true of many Americans, and it's generally a virtue: jobs,
hobbies, interests, causes, and family are a lot more interesting than
narcissistic, neurotic self-absorption. Maybe you are mistaking
politeness and open-mindedness for being gullible: they are different.

Of course America is big, with beaches, glaciers, mountains, rivers,
an enormous variety of geography and cultures. Not all Americans elect
to fly overseas when we have 50 different states of our own to
explore. Your thinking seems to be undisturbed by actual knowledge of
the US.

And what percentage of Americans have ever been further than Canada or
Mexico? Or have even left their own state?

I don't know. But I personally know few people who have not traveled
the world a good deal. I've spent time in, and worked in, England, the
USSR, France, and Japan, and visited a few others. My wife lived in
Germany for a couple of years and traveled extensively. Her sister
spends her vacations in a village in Siberia. And like that.

John

hey, the building just shook. The Blue Angels just made a pass
overhead.

 

[Kurt Ullman]

In article <eg3f49$j7l$9@leto.cc.emory.edu>,
lparker@emory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

They do? I thought that was Dan Blather's (et. al.) name.

How cute. Do you spell it Klinton too?
My personal favorite is Clintoon, but that is probably secondary to

my being force fed Looney Toons as a kid. Now, tell me true, if I was
go looking on Google for the posts of lparker, etc., I wouldn't find
even on tiny reference to The Shrub or similar? Hmmmm?????

If an American in America is involved, there's the 4th amendment.
If the American in America initiates the call. If someone outside

the US initiates the call, that isn't anywhere near as cut and dried...
yet.

 

[Kurt Ullman]

In article <eg3f6l$j7l$10@leto.cc.emory.edu>,
lparker@emory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

One was 16.
Above the age of consent in DC ,but interestingly not in FL.

Was Lewinsky a minor too?

She was 22.

Ugly, sure. Throw the bumb under the next bus, sure. BTW, why is
Barney Frank still in congress?


Being gay in this country doesn't get you drawn and quartered yet, but I'm
sure you right-wingers are working on it.

But running a prostitution ring out of your house is generally
frowned upon outside of certain circles.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Keith" <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote in message
news:MPG.1f8f0660ee17b5be989d9b@News.Individual.NET...

It looked good to you because you are so blind that you will not
see.

So spake the blind man.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Keith" <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote in message
news:MPG.1f8eed7cb4eb544d989d8b@News.Individual.NET...

Where did the current terrorism financing and materials come
from?

From the USA (oil). Unlike most every other conflict, the US is paying
for
both sides in this one.

...and only the USA buys middle east oil? You are as ignorant as
the stuffed donkey.

Right. Sure. If the US wasn't importing oil to feed its ridiculous fleet of
inefficient cars what would happen to world prices and hence the flow of
money to the Middle East?

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-25F347.08023505102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...

And what percentage of Americans have ever been further than Canada or
Mexico? Or have even left their own state?

Ever watch Jay Leno?

Yep that certainly meets my criteria for a well-done population
study....

Jay Leno: "Which two countries border the United States?"

Girl on the Street: "Ummm, errr, ahhh, Europe and ummm, Paris?"

Yep, that's an American all right. Like those who think Alaska is an island.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-996235.13594705102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...

Bill looked for volunteers.

Of course he did. Of course all the "volunteers" from Little Rock
forward were employees of whereever he was working at the time.
Haven't seen anything that indicates rape or perjury, yet.

So? He asked, they said no, he moved on. Did Gennifer Flowers say it was
coercion?

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4524AD4F.E60318D@earthlink.net...

T Wake wrote:

Do Americans have a word for Bullying?


Yes, do you have one for yellow bellied cowards?

Yes. Republicans.

 

[Kurt Ullman]

In article <eg3en0$j7l$1@leto.cc.emory.edu>,
lparker@emory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

It well settled that as long as one phone
is legally tapped, any phone that calls it or is called by it is fair
game. Since there are no restrictions on tapping a phone outside of the
country, it would be legal tap. Thus anyone the phone calls or anyone
who calls the phone could be listened to as noted. Would be a rather
interesting case to make.

No it doesn't. If you're listening to Americans in America, you need a
warrant. The FISA act seems clear as does the 4th amendment. Further,
nobody
has proven the NSA was only eavesdropping on overseas calls.

If so, this would be first time that indicates that. Law has
always been that as long as the tap was legal on one end, persons at the
other couldn't say it was illegal against them.
Nobody has proven and few have suggested, that there weren't.

 

"Lloyd Parker" <lparker@emory.edu> wrote in message
news:eg32m2$5l0$8@leto.cc.emory.edu...

In article <lef8i2prust90bdlna6vmp1r0h9p7a7a95@4ax.com>,
Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:
On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 22:52:37 GMT, Kurt Ullman <kurtullman@yahoo.com
wrote:

In article <peb8i2lf4af0irq171tqukscc9n0lec541@4ax.com>,
Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 21:51:21 GMT, Kurt Ullman <kurtullman@yahoo.com
wrote:

In article <HLVUg.13315$7I1.5654@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net>,
lucasea@sbcglobal.net> wrote:


I don't care. If you're listening to a phone call to which the
phone
in
my
living room is party, then as a citizen of the US, I demand that
your
listening be carried out according to my Constitutional rights.

Probably is. Under a warrant for a phone anything that goes on over
that phone is legally admissable, even if the other person's phone
doesn't have a warrant on it. It well settled that as long as one
phone
is legally tapped, any phone that calls it or is called by it is fair
game. Since there are no restrictions on tapping a phone outside of
the
country, it would be legal tap. Thus anyone the phone calls or anyone
who calls the phone could be listened to as noted. Would be a rather
interesting case to make.

And it varies state-by-state... it is legal in Arizona to record all
calls on your own phone, _without_ notifying the other party.

All I need to do is push a button ;-)

There are two different things going on here. One is what you can
do as private citizen, which in AZ is that all are fair game. But we
were talking about what goverment (be it under the mantel of cop-dom or
spook-dom) can do. Whole 'nother kettle of fish..

Of course. But I can record and then hand over to the government, no
sweat, no warrant, nada.

...Jim Thompson

And it can be thrown out.

Maybe, maybe not, but in any case, the scenario that Jim presented is
immaterial. It is still a private citizen behaving as a private citizen.
Now, if the government were to come to that citizen and say "please tap your
phone when you call X", it would be thrown out in most courts in the US,
since that person would be interpreted as working as an ad hoc agent of the
government. The US Constitution only says what the Federal government can
and cannot do. Period. There is a reason that essentially every single
clause in the Constitution says: "Congress shall", or "The Federal
Government shall". A Constitution is a list of rules what a *government*
can and cannot do to or for its citizens. The fact that a private citizen
can do something in no way means that the Federal government is allowed to
do the same thing.

Oh, and there is also a Federal law that say in any recording of a phone
conversation, at least one of the parties to the conversation must be aware
of the recording. So if Jim calls me, John cannot record the phone call
unless either Jim or I know the recording is taking place. Of course,
Federal laws only apply to interstate calls, but Jim is in Arizona and I'm
in Ohio (or am I?), so there you have it.

Eric Lucas

 

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-C96BDE.11201105102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...

In article <Va9Vg.19654$Ij.16215@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>,
lucasea@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

jmfbahciv@aol.com> wrote in message
news:eg2paa$8qk_011@s829.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com...
In article <PsRUg.57$45.150@news.uchicago.edu>,
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <4523844C.CA22EFDF@hotmail.com>, Eeyore
rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> writes:


mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:

In article <4522F8DE.C46161BD@hotmail.com>, Eeyore writes:
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:

You didn't read carefully. It is not "10% changing". It is that
historical data indicates dramatic changes when about 10% of the
population is *dead*. Does this make it clear?

So, we only need to kill 100 million Muslims or so ?

I didn't say, at the moment, what we need (or need not) to do. I
pointed what empirical data for past conflicts shows. Go argue with
history if you don't like it.

But you still mainatain we'd need to kill that many to have an effect
?

Graham

Not that "we'd need" but that, as a worst case scenario, we may need.

The oddity of this, which I cannot find in past history, is that
the extremists are already doing this to themselves.

Oh, the innumeracy. At the rate that they're doing that, it will take at
least an order of magnitude longer than all of recorded human history to
reach the stated endpoint. In the meantime, how about if we stop giving
them reasons to do so?

So, we just all capitulate and become Muslim states?

And again, I'll ask, is there nothing in your worldview but "nuke 'em all"
and "capitulate". Must really suck to live in such a black-and-white world.

Eric Lucas

 

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
newsk8ai2hv7kigieulq677a9s9mvbq7m7k01@4ax.com...

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 09:56:31 +0100, Eeyore
rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:



John Larkin wrote:

Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:
Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:
Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:

I find the humour too juvenile for my taste. It's like finding
farts funny
and nothing else.

More likely you find it juvenile because you don't get the twists;
some of Brooks' stuff is fairly subtle. But there are a lot of
Americanisms and Jewish humor and Black (as in African, not as in
noire) humor you may not get.

What humor meets your standards?

Not much actually. I find much of it pretty banale. I'm not sure
you'd know the
stuff either. Did you ever see Fawlty Towers ( John Cleese ) for
example ? At
least there's a decent chance of that.

I didn't like FT;

Well it is very British.


it was stupid situation/embarassment comedy like "I
Love Lucy"

In which case it didn't 'translate' well over your side of the pond.


, nowhere near Monte Python level. Wodehouse is my favorite
comedic writer... I laugh out loud when I read his stuff.

I find that dull.


You should laugh more... it might cheer you up.

Don't worry. I laugh a bit. There's not a heck of a lot to laugh about
these days
though ( see thread ).

Beg to differ. The world is wonderful, and with a bit of conscious
effort one can learn to appreciate it. A rational creature could do no
less.

It really doesn't feel very wonderful right now.

From a rational perspective, it should. You and I have more freedom,
better health, better education, live longer, eat better, and have
vastly more choices about our lives and entertainments than 99% of the
people who ever lived. And we are educated enough to understand our
own psychies, certainly enough to be able to seize rational control of
our own destinies and *redesign* ourselves to be happy and productive.
A passing grade in Psychology 101 and a bit of effort is all it takes.

But many in the West are depressed, listless, and angry. And unable to
enjoy life or love. This ain't progress. I can appreciate the Islamic
claim that Western society is Godless and spiritually sterile, because
often it is. And I can see how Muslims might not want their kids to
grow up to be like many of our kids, who live for video games and
drugs and emotionless sex, who want to cheat their way through school
so they can get a job that pays enough for a cool apartment and a
Porsche.

....and your chances of dying in that Porsche or any other vehicle you are in
are at least three orders of magnitude greater than your chances of dying at
the hands of a terrorist. Let's get some perspective here. Oh, I forgot,
perspective makes for really crappy election year soundbites.

Eric Lucas

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
news:7vhai2t6o1b3m44o0qjgoue2s0bpenvd23@4ax.com...

If you want to get snippy, consider this: there are several times more
Native Americans alive now, in the USA, than there were when Columbus
landed in the Americas.

Pure blood?

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-1593BC.14174905102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...

Interesting because all of the FL precincts that had troubles were in
Counties where the Dems had majorities on the election boards. Also,
despite the demonizing of the Secretary of State, they only have
authority to okay machines when used. Which machines and how the ballots
are set-up is entirely in the hands of the locals.

In FL the Republicans removed as many black names as they could from the
voting rolls. They were warned that what they were doing would remove a
large number of people who were fully entitled to vote but went ahead
anyway.

The law which bars felons from voting, which is extremely
anti-constitutional, was trumpeted when introduced as "a way to remove the
darkie factor from the popular vote".

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
news:76jai2t05pucnpnd1mcjtdmcca72ime0rm@4ax.com...

And what percentage of Americans have ever been further than Canada or
Mexico? Or have even left their own state?

I don't know. But I personally know few people who have not traveled
the world a good deal. I've spent time in, and worked in, England, the
USSR, France, and Japan, and visited a few others. My wife lived in
Germany for a couple of years and traveled extensively. Her sister
spends her vacations in a village in Siberia. And like that.

Bush had no passport before being selected as president. After his
inauguration a Canadian TV 'reporter' passed on to him the congratulations
of Prime Minister Tim Horton, which Bush gratefully acknowledged. Tim
Horton's is a well known Canadian coffee and donut shop chain. Jean Chrétien
was PM of Canada at the time.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-778428.14283305102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...

But running a prostitution ring out of your house is generally
frowned upon outside of certain circles.

And yet the prostitutes in charge of the White House act with impunity and
compete scorn for the law.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
news:53jai294otieag150rh0bt9r8re6fm8nsn@4ax.com...

It looked a heck of a lot better to me and least he was an intelligent and
articulate man, something that could never be said of Bush.

Of course he was articulate. Many sociopaths are.

Bush is articulate when he is talking about the death penalty - a subject he
truly enjoys.

 

"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:3f5ai2la827940ak5b0vn7om58sbuoid1v@4ax.com...

Mostly true, I think, except for one branch of Cristianity, Roman
Catholicism, where the buck stops at the pope's desk.

Not even there. There are a large variety of Roman Catholic churches, some
of whom take the Pope's word as the law, and many others that rather
liberally interpret the Pope's word into something that's slightly more
realistic in the modern world.

Eric Lucas

 

[Kurt Ullman]

In article <M9cVg.51603$E67.40698@clgrps13>,
"Homer J Simpson" <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:

"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kurtullman-25F347.08023505102006@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx..
.

And what percentage of Americans have ever been further than Canada or
Mexico? Or have even left their own state?

Ever watch Jay Leno?

Yep that certainly meets my criteria for a well-done population
study....

Jay Leno: "Which two countries border the United States?"

Girl on the Street: "Ummm, errr, ahhh, Europe and ummm, Paris?"

Yep, that's an American all right. Like those who think Alaska is an island.

Yep I am impressed how one girl on the street can then be reliably
used as an exemplar for 300 million or so people. When do you go to
Norway?