Isola microwave laminate...

[server]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
<peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-series-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

It looks like there are 10 fans on the back of that scope.

2.6 kilowatts power required, weighs 93 pounds.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[server]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 09:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 5:13:12 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
I only needed 3 square inches, but they sampled me a full panel. Good,
I\'ll have some around for fast protos.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

This is much better than FR4, and the board houses say it handles like
FR4.

Impossible to read the scale display on those images. Looks like FR4 and ISOLA 10-90% are the same at ~ 50ps. How sensitive is your design?

Strange. The scope shots look sharp and clear to me, with rise times
shown. The text file states the corrected rise times, which are 53 and
26 ps for the FR4 and the Isola, both 3\", 50-ohm microstrip.

Are you using a phone? That might be hard to see.

My optical transceiver box is clearly suffering from FR4 losses. It\'s
OK for my first customer at 1.2 Gbps, but we may as well make it
better on rev B.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j7r1eyalxfd6t68/K420_1200_Gbps_Eye.jpg?raw=1

The edges should be faster and the flats flatter.

The Rogers laminate will be interesting to try. The copper is shiny,
not like the frosty-finish Isola.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 12:55:02 PM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 09:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 5:13:12 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
I only needed 3 square inches, but they sampled me a full panel. Good,
I\'ll have some around for fast protos.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

This is much better than FR4, and the board houses say it handles like
FR4.

Impossible to read the scale display on those images. Looks like FR4 and ISOLA 10-90% are the same at ~ 50ps. How sensitive is your design?
Strange. The scope shots look sharp and clear to me, with rise times
shown. The text file states the corrected rise times, which are 53 and
26 ps for the FR4 and the Isola, both 3\", 50-ohm microstrip.

3\"? Would never have guessed loss would be significant over that distance.

Are you using a phone? That might be hard to see.

19\" display, but the image won\'t enlarge and the green background overwhelms the numbers.

My optical transceiver box is clearly suffering from FR4 losses. It\'s
OK for my first customer at 1.2 Gbps, but we may as well make it
better on rev B.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j7r1eyalxfd6t68/K420_1200_Gbps_Eye.jpg?raw=1

The edges should be faster and the flats flatter.

The Rogers laminate will be interesting to try. The copper is shiny,
not like the frosty-finish Isola.

Do people use pre-emphasis networks anymore?

--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[Piotr Wyderski]

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

Sure, some outfits are doing heavy-duty electronic design, but I think
there are fewer analog/circuit designers than there were.

That\'s for sure, but IMHO it is just another instance of the
supply-demand template. There are far fewer steam technology experts as
well,
but their role is even more profound that used to be in the distant
past. Quantity and importance are independent variables, methinks.

There is only one NIF and you appear to saturate the niche. What would
your competitors do if there were many of them?

Best regards, Piotr

 

[Steve Wilson]

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One
example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-serie
s-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

I wonder if the 110 GHz version costs a million dollars.

I thought it was 1.3 million. There is a youtube video that disassembles
the unit and describes how it works:

TSP #133 - Keysight UXR 110GHz BW, 256GS/s, 10-bit Real-Time Oscilloscope
Teardown & Experiments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXYje2B04xE

--
Science teaches us to trust. - sw

 

[server]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 19:23:40 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
<peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

Sure, some outfits are doing heavy-duty electronic design, but I think
there are fewer analog/circuit designers than there were.

That\'s for sure, but IMHO it is just another instance of the
supply-demand template. There are far fewer steam technology experts as
well,
but their role is even more profound that used to be in the distant
past. Quantity and importance are independent variables, methinks.

I also suspect that the IC companies are slurping up kids with analog
design talent. The ice in Spice is \"integrated circuit emphasis\".

There is only one NIF and you appear to saturate the niche. What would
your competitors do if there were many of them?

CERN wants to build a bigger machine. Sabine does not approve.

http://backreaction.blogspot.com/2020/10/particle-physicists-continue-to-make.html



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[server]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 10:17:33 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 12:55:02 PM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 09:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 5:13:12 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
I only needed 3 square inches, but they sampled me a full panel. Good,
I\'ll have some around for fast protos.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

This is much better than FR4, and the board houses say it handles like
FR4.

Impossible to read the scale display on those images. Looks like FR4 and ISOLA 10-90% are the same at ~ 50ps. How sensitive is your design?
Strange. The scope shots look sharp and clear to me, with rise times
shown. The text file states the corrected rise times, which are 53 and
26 ps for the FR4 and the Isola, both 3\", 50-ohm microstrip.

3\"? Would never have guessed loss would be significant over that distance.

We did the blue test board to investigate FR4 losses. It\'s hard to go
even 1\" on FR4 without wrecking 40 ps edges.

Are you using a phone? That might be hard to see.

19\" display, but the image won\'t enlarge and the green background overwhelms the numbers.

Sorry. I tweaked the contrast to make the background black. It looks
good to me.

My optical transceiver box is clearly suffering from FR4 losses. It\'s
OK for my first customer at 1.2 Gbps, but we may as well make it
better on rev B.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j7r1eyalxfd6t68/K420_1200_Gbps_Eye.jpg?raw=1

The edges should be faster and the flats flatter.

The Rogers laminate will be interesting to try. The copper is shiny,
not like the frosty-finish Isola.

Do people use pre-emphasis networks anymore?

Radically, for things like PCIe and nth-gen USB and such. And radical
receive equalization. Really fast over-copper signals are
unrecognizable until equalized.

I have done tx side pre-emphasis to dive long CAT5 cables where the
data is not nicely balanced.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[Piotr Wyderski]

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

> CERN wants to build a bigger machine.

We have our own analogue design experts. And the ones from the US as
well, as the effort requires a vast collaboration. But both endeavours
are absolute frontiers and require top-notch skills. Not a good thing
from an individual career perspective. If you somehow manage to enter
that league after many years of heavy training and you lose your job,
there is nowhere to go to utilise your skills fully. It is much wiser to
aim lower from the very beginning, but be able to diversify the client
base in exchange.

> Sabine does not approve.

She has several good points, but then she is nobody in the scientific
community. As far as I can see, she does not even have tenure. Why the
powers that be should care with an opinion of some associate professor,
even if she were right? It is a feudal system.

Best regards, Piotr

 

[server]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 21:45:01 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
<peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

CERN wants to build a bigger machine.

We have our own analogue design experts. And the ones from the US as
well, as the effort requires a vast collaboration. But both endeavours
are absolute frontiers and require top-notch skills. Not a good thing
from an individual career perspective. If you somehow manage to enter
that league after many years of heavy training and you lose your job,
there is nowhere to go to utilise your skills fully. It is much wiser to
aim lower from the very beginning, but be able to diversify the client
base in exchange.

Sabine does not approve.

She has several good points, but then she is nobody in the scientific
community. As far as I can see, she does not even have tenure. Why the
powers that be should care with an opinion of some associate professor,
even if she were right? It is a feudal system.

Best regards, Piotr

She does has a point. Spending a bunch of billions to discover nothing
sounds like it\'s motivated by the spending.

The problem with these big-science projects, from a business or from a
career standpoint, is that they get built in one big shot, and then
they are done. You can hope that there will be another big project to
jump to, but that\'s risky.

SLAC, Fermi, Brookhaven, CEBAF, CERN, NIF, ISS get built in a burst of
effort, may learn something or not, and then don\'t have much purpose
in life.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

 

[Piotr Wyderski]

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

She does has a point. Spending a bunch of billions to discover nothing
sounds like it\'s motivated by the spending.

Sure, but the problem is not whether she has a point, but if she is
going to be listened to. I don\'t really think so. So the final decision
will not be based on what she says. You and I can enjoy that, but that\'s
about all her impact factor.

Best regards, Piotr

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christensen]

lørdag den 24. oktober 2020 kl. 17.49.23 UTC+2 skrev jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com:

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-series-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

I wonder if the 110 GHz version costs a million dollars.

$1.3M https://youtu.be/DXYje2B04xE

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 6:12:17 AM UTC+11, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 19:23:40 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
pete...@neverland.mil> wrote:

jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

Sure, some outfits are doing heavy-duty electronic design, but I think
there are fewer analog/circuit designers than there were.

That\'s for sure, but IMHO it is just another instance of the
supply-demand template. There are far fewer steam technology experts as
well,
but their role is even more profound that used to be in the distant
past. Quantity and importance are independent variables, methinks.
I also suspect that the IC companies are slurping up kids with analog
design talent. The ice in Spice is \"integrated circuit emphasis\".

There is only one NIF and you appear to saturate the niche. What would
your competitors do if there were many of them?

CERN wants to build a bigger machine. Sabine does not approve.

CERN has it\'s own stable of physicists who really can do electronic design. I worked with one of them back in 1980\'s, and Nijmegen had a small team who did stuff for CERN. Jerome Bellman is on-site there now.

John Larkin\'s involvement with NIF seems to have been part of a deliberate attempt on the NIF\'s part to get more sub-contractors.

> http://backreaction.blogspot.com/2020/10/particle-physicists-continue-to-make.html

Physicists will keep on wanting to build bigger machines, and the people who fund them will get progressively less enthusiastic - the US super-collider never got built.

Other physicists will find other machines to build - LIGO comes to mind - and other ways of finding out about ever-morefundamental particles.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 14:13:00 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

I only needed 3 square inches, but they sampled me a full panel. Good,
I\'ll have some around for fast protos.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

This is much better than FR4, and the board houses say it handles like
FR4.

I tested the Rogers equivalent laminate. It\'s about the same.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

Shinier copper, a bit harder to peel. I had to Dremel it off.

I did taper that trace a bit, which could have cost a bit of risetime.
Sorry.

Both lams would probably be faster on a properly etched PCB. My hacks
are a bit ragged.

I have a real board coming up soon, with a TDR test trace.

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 17:29:42 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
<langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote:

lørdag den 24. oktober 2020 kl. 17.49.23 UTC+2 skrev jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-series-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

I wonder if the 110 GHz version costs a million dollars.


$1.3M https://youtu.be/DXYje2B04xE

I guess if you are designing a new military radar or 5G cell stuff or
PCIe gen 19, it\'s worth it.

I bet it\'s like a hurricane on your bench. My power strips and maybe
outlets couldn\'t handle it.

 

[John Miles, KE5FX]

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 12:11:03 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

I bet it\'s like a hurricane on your bench. My power strips and maybe
outlets couldn\'t handle it.

I view scopes like this the way I view logic analyzers. If you have to
power it up for any reason, you\'re already having a reeeeeallly bad day.

-- john, KE5FX

 

[Flyguy]

On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 2:49:05 AM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 3:31:15 PM UTC+11, Flyguy wrote:
On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 6:53:24 PM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 9:59:31 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 18:45:21 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 18:09, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 17:51:10 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 17:13, John Larkin wrote:


I only needed 3 square inches, but they sampled me a full panel. Good,
I\'ll have some around for fast protos.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fva424mq477k857/AACy1-4WS7yddHNOKpeg3w4Fa?dl=0

This is much better than FR4, and the board houses say it handles like
FR4.


That is a lot better.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Nice crisp step, no ugly drool.

I\'ll try a 4-layer board for real. My SFP link thing is really
suffering from the FR4 losses.




Simon and I were TDRing a transmission line sample on an FR4 board
today. It\'s a time stretcher for geophysical lidar--24 T/Hs with about
50 ps aperture time, made of SAV-581+ pHEMTs. Each hold cap sits right
on an input of a simultaneous-sampling ADC. The gates are driven by
FIN1002 LVDS receivers via a very small Schottky diode, and are
forward-biased a bit in track mode. One input of each FIN comes from a
DAC output, and the other from a ~10-ns RC ramp. (There are two ramp
generators.)
I can send you a hunk of the Isola. I have a whole panel. It seems to
have a working dielectric constant about 3.5, which makes traces
wider, which is generally good.

The ramp lines are actually the parlour trick--ringing caused by all the
input reflections has to be managed carefully.

(Positively Larkinesque.)
Hang on, I\'m counting how many rules you are breaking.


Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Send me a schematic, just for fun.

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Fast stuff is especially exotic. People quake at the n-word, and
absolutely panic at the p-word. We have f-worded some.

Crossover, using RF/microwave specified parts in time domain, is
special fun. Let\'s not tell anyone that it\'s possible.

I did some of that around 1984, in Cambridge, UK. Word has finally reached California?

Come to think of it

Ghiggino, K.P., Phillips, D., and Sloman, A.W. \"Nanosecond pulse stretcher\",Journal of Physics E: Scientific Instruments, 12, 686-687 (1979).

used a BFT95 5GHz broadband transistor in a simple emitter-coupled monostable. I was working in west London at the time, but it was for a group at the University of
Southampton.

John Larkin is trying to shut the stable door forty years after the horse had bolted.

Hey SL0W MAN, you just can\'t RESIST posting ad-hominem bullshit about John

What makes you think he is human?

Hey SL0W MAN, that is the sort of bullshit that separates you from polite society. You need to crawl out of your hole, turn off your computer and socialize with people.

 

[Flyguy]

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 8:49:23 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-series-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

I wonder if the 110 GHz version costs a million dollars.

Sure, some outfits are doing heavy-duty electronic design, but I think
there are fewer analog/circuit designers than there were. One of my
EEs is a recent grad and he says that his classmates avoided analog
electronics. They all want to type code, as in c or python or verilog.

Just my impression. I don\'t have serious statistics, just some
personal anecdotes.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

No, you are right. I mentored a group of seniors in EE and they could not solder. I asked how do you get thru an EE program w/o learning how to solder. They responded that all of their circuits were simulated. If only you could sell simulated products...

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 at 10:28:06 AM UTC+11, Flyguy wrote:

On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 2:49:05 AM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 3:31:15 PM UTC+11, Flyguy wrote:
On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 6:53:24 PM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 9:59:31 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 18:45:21 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 18:09, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 17:51:10 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 17:13, John Larkin wrote:

<snip>

Crossover, using RF/microwave specified parts in time domain, is
special fun. Let\'s not tell anyone that it\'s possible.

I did some of that around 1984, in Cambridge, UK. Word has finally reached California?

Come to think of it

Ghiggino, K.P., Phillips, D., and Sloman, A.W. \"Nanosecond pulse stretcher\",Journal of Physics E: Scientific Instruments, 12, 686-687 (1979).

used a BFT95 5GHz broadband transistor in a simple emitter-coupled monostable. I was working in west London at the time, but it was for a group at the University of
Southampton.

John Larkin is trying to shut the stable door forty years after the horse had bolted.

Hey SL0W MAN, you just can\'t RESIST posting ad-hominem bullshit about John

What makes you think he is human?

That is the sort of bullshit that separates you from polite society. You need to crawl out of your hole, turn off your computer and socialize with people.

John Larkin admits that he can\'t do the regular social interactions that distinguish humans from other anthropoid apes. He doesn\'t fit into polite society.

Neither does Flyguy. I rest my case.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 at 12:39:40 PM UTC+11, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 at 10:28:06 AM UTC+11, Flyguy wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 2:49:05 AM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 3:31:15 PM UTC+11, Flyguy wrote:
On Thursday, October 22, 2020 at 6:53:24 PM UTC-7, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, October 23, 2020 at 9:59:31 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 18:45:21 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 18:09, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 17:51:10 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-10-22 17:13, John Larkin wrote:
snip
Crossover, using RF/microwave specified parts in time domain, is
special fun. Let\'s not tell anyone that it\'s possible.

I did some of that around 1984, in Cambridge, UK. Word has finally reached California?

Come to think of it

Ghiggino, K.P., Phillips, D., and Sloman, A.W. \"Nanosecond pulse stretcher\",Journal of Physics E: Scientific Instruments, 12, 686-687 (1979).

used a BFT95 5GHz broadband transistor in a simple emitter-coupled monostable. I was working in west London at the time, but it was for a group at the University of
Southampton.

John Larkin is trying to shut the stable door forty years after the horse had bolted.

Hey SL0W MAN, you just can\'t RESIST posting ad-hominem bullshit about John

What makes you think he is human?

That is the sort of bullshit that separates you from polite society. You need to crawl out of your hole, turn off your computer and socialize with people.

John Larkin admits that he can\'t do the regular social interactions that distinguish humans from other anthropoid apes. He doesn\'t fit into polite society.

Neither does Flyguy. I rest my case.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[server]

On Mon, 26 Oct 2020 16:32:35 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
<soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 8:49:23 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2020 11:37:41 +0200, Piotr Wyderski
peter.pan@neverland.mil> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

I was just talking to Miguel about this: nobody wants to do analog
design any more, and the guys in the big companies who used to do it
have mostly retired. More biz for us, I guess.

Somebody still designs the multi-GHz scopes and remaining gear. One example:

https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2948607-pn-UXR0404A/infiniium-uxr-series-oscilloscope-40-ghz-4-channels?nid=-31885.1251400&cc=PL&lc=eng

Best regards, Piotr

I wonder if the 110 GHz version costs a million dollars.

Sure, some outfits are doing heavy-duty electronic design, but I think
there are fewer analog/circuit designers than there were. One of my
EEs is a recent grad and he says that his classmates avoided analog
electronics. They all want to type code, as in c or python or verilog.

Just my impression. I don\'t have serious statistics, just some
personal anecdotes.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard

No, you are right. I mentored a group of seniors in EE and they could not solder. I asked how do you get thru an EE program w/o learning how to solder. They responded that all of their circuits were simulated. If only you could sell simulated products...

I did a walkthrough of the Cornell EE school. I counted about 35
computer screens and one oscilloscope screen.

Laptops are cheaper than lab benches, especially when the students
have to pay for their own laptops.

What they are not acquiring is instincts.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

Claude Bernard