Has Google changed it's format?

[Rick C]

On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 12:08:20 PM UTC-4, Bob Engelhardt wrote:

On 8/12/2019 10:45 AM, Rick C wrote:
On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 10:32:16 AM UTC-4, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
On 8/12/2019 7:02 AM, tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:
Point 1: I put DC24 in quotes, and thus expect only results that contain that string. If a search engine can't even manage that anymore it's a waste of time.
...

I agree - a major frustration. However, Startpage does it to. When
Google wasn't giving me what I wanted I tried Startpage, using a quoted
term and I got pages without that term. I.e., no better than Google.

I don't follow the complaint. I search for DC24 and I don't see a single hit on the first two pages that don't contain the term "DC24". These pages are virtually all about the Dyson motor. Is that not what is desired?

Well ... I wasn't searching for DC24, why would I? I was searching for
steroid eye drops and I kept getting hits about systemic steroids, so I
quoted "eye". Got pages without "eye"

I was responding to the "complaint" by the OP I guess. But when I searched for "steroid eye drops" without the quotes every hit I get has "eye" or "eyes" in it.

Can you provide a link to your search?

--

Rick C.

+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Bob Engelhardt]

On 8/12/2019 10:45 AM, Rick C wrote:

On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 10:32:16 AM UTC-4, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
On 8/12/2019 7:02 AM, tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:
Point 1: I put DC24 in quotes, and thus expect only results that contain that string. If a search engine can't even manage that anymore it's a waste of time.
...

I agree - a major frustration. However, Startpage does it to. When
Google wasn't giving me what I wanted I tried Startpage, using a quoted
term and I got pages without that term. I.e., no better than Google.

I don't follow the complaint. I search for DC24 and I don't see a single hit on the first two pages that don't contain the term "DC24". These pages are virtually all about the Dyson motor. Is that not what is desired?

Well ... I wasn't searching for DC24, why would I? I was searching for
steroid eye drops and I kept getting hits about systemic steroids, so I
quoted "eye". Got pages without "eye"
>

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 04:02:37 -0700 (PDT), tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:

>Point 1: I put DC24 in quotes, and thus expect only results that contain that string. If a search engine can't even manage that anymore it's a waste of time.

Google has a different interpretation for the use of double quote
marks:
<http://www.googleguide.com/quote_operator.html>
If you wrap something in double quote marks, Google search interprets
that as "must include" in the results.

>Point 2: I was specifically looking to avoid distributors, parts companies etc. I was seeking a part pulled from a machine by someone in their kitchen. 'Dyson parts' or similar would generally weed those out.

Put a minus sign in front of anything you do NOT want to see. For
example:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=DC24+-catalog+-distributor+-parts+-review>

>Point 3: Startpage worked as intended, with suitable results right at the top 1st time, ie ones that contained the string "DC24". Why ever would I waste further time on google?

When I tried:
<https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=DC24>
It produced advertisements for Dyson, Amazon, and eBay at the top, and
nothing that indicated a source of scrap parts.

>Point 4: Adding 'dyson' returns results for the main motor, not what was wanted.

Reading between your lines, my guess(tm) is that you're looking for a
"used Dyson DC24 brush bar motor" as in:
<https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor>
Comparing with hits returned by Google, they look very much the same:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor>

Google used to be THE search engine. Now its results are too often a waste of time. It's hugely outperformed by startpage, whoever they are.
NT

This might help determining who they are:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com>
It's a proxy filter that forwards its querys to Google search and
returns results without recording your IP address.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com#Search_mechanism_and_interface>
"...Startpage exclusively uses results from Google, which
the company pays Google for."
It's often cheaper (and easier) to simply repackage search results
from Google, Yahoo, Bing, Ask, or others. Here's a list of where some
popular web piles get their search results:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_search_engines#Based_on>

Suggestion: When I ask for an example, a URL or list of search terms
would be helpful.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Bob Engelhardt]

On 8/12/2019 12:28 PM, Rick C wrote:

I was responding to the "complaint" by the OP I guess. But when I searched for "steroid eye drops" without the quotes every hit I get has "eye" or "eyes" in it.

Can you provide a link to your search?

My post was a long story short & now that Jeff has shown that Startpage
is just an overlay of Google, it's all moot. Thanks Jeff.

 

[John Robertson]

On 2019/08/12 12:31 p.m., Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 04:02:37 -0700 (PDT), tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:

Point 1: I put DC24 in quotes, and thus expect only results that contain that string. If a search engine can't even manage that anymore it's a waste of time.

Google has a different interpretation for the use of double quote
marks:
http://www.googleguide.com/quote_operator.html
If you wrap something in double quote marks, Google search interprets
that as "must include" in the results.

Point 2: I was specifically looking to avoid distributors, parts companies etc. I was seeking a part pulled from a machine by someone in their kitchen. 'Dyson parts' or similar would generally weed those out.

Put a minus sign in front of anything you do NOT want to see. For
example:
https://www.google.com/search?q=DC24+-catalog+-distributor+-parts+-review

Point 3: Startpage worked as intended, with suitable results right at the top 1st time, ie ones that contained the string "DC24". Why ever would I waste further time on google?

When I tried:
https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=DC24
It produced advertisements for Dyson, Amazon, and eBay at the top, and
nothing that indicated a source of scrap parts.

Point 4: Adding 'dyson' returns results for the main motor, not what was wanted.

Reading between your lines, my guess(tm) is that you're looking for a
"used Dyson DC24 brush bar motor" as in:
https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor
Comparing with hits returned by Google, they look very much the same:
https://www.google.com/search?q=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor

Google used to be THE search engine. Now its results are too often a waste of time. It's hugely outperformed by startpage, whoever they are.
NT

This might help determining who they are:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com
It's a proxy filter that forwards its querys to Google search and
returns results without recording your IP address.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com#Search_mechanism_and_interface
"...Startpage exclusively uses results from Google, which
the company pays Google for."
It's often cheaper (and easier) to simply repackage search results
from Google, Yahoo, Bing, Ask, or others. Here's a list of where some
popular web piles get their search results:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_search_engines#Based_on

Suggestion: When I ask for an example, a URL or list of search terms
would be helpful.

Thanks Jeff! I had forgotten about https://duckduckgo.com - which
appears to be truly independent of the bigger engines.

John :-#)#

 

On Monday, 12 August 2019 20:31:11 UTC+1, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 04:02:37 -0700 (PDT), tabbypurr wrote:

Point 1: I put DC24 in quotes, and thus expect only results that contain that string. If a search engine can't even manage that anymore it's a waste of time.

Google has a different interpretation for the use of double quote
marks:
http://www.googleguide.com/quote_operator.html
If you wrap something in double quote marks, Google search interprets
that as "must include" in the results.

that's how google used to work. Now it doesn't. The failure of the quotes system has rendered it fairly useless

Point 2: I was specifically looking to avoid distributors, parts companies etc. I was seeking a part pulled from a machine by someone in their kitchen. 'Dyson parts' or similar would generally weed those out.

Put a minus sign in front of anything you do NOT want to see. For
example:
https://www.google.com/search?q=DC24+-catalog+-distributor+-parts+-review

there's a reason I didn't do that. Think about it.

Point 3: Startpage worked as intended, with suitable results right at the top 1st time, ie ones that contained the string "DC24". Why ever would I waste further time on google?

When I tried:
https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=DC24
It produced advertisements for Dyson, Amazon, and eBay at the top, and
nothing that indicated a source of scrap parts.

umm... ebay is the biggest source of used parts on the web

Point 4: Adding 'dyson' returns results for the main motor, not what was wanted.

Reading between your lines, my guess(tm) is that you're looking for a
"used Dyson DC24 brush bar motor" as in:
https://www.startpage.com/do/search?query=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor

yes

Comparing with hits returned by Google, they look very much the same:
https://www.google.com/search?q=used+Dyson+DC24+brush+bar+motor

Google used to be THE search engine. Now its results are too often a waste of time. It's hugely outperformed by startpage, whoever they are.
NT

This might help determining who they are:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com
It's a proxy filter that forwards its querys to Google search and
returns results without recording your IP address.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startpage.com#Search_mechanism_and_interface
"...Startpage exclusively uses results from Google, which
the company pays Google for."
It's often cheaper (and easier) to simply repackage search results
from Google, Yahoo, Bing, Ask, or others. Here's a list of where some
popular web piles get their search results:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_search_engines#Based_on

Curious, as I keep getting rather different results

Suggestion: When I ask for an example, a URL or list of search terms
would be helpful.

I didn't note them down for you.


NT