Guy Macon is a self appointed OT cop

[Guy Macon]

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

OK, infectious. If any protein could survive all that crap, and
still be virulent enough to get past the bodie's vast immune system,
and be the instrument of infection, it still is not the Cause.

I have no opinion one way or the other about the distinction
you are making between "instrument" and "cause." What I am saying
is that a prion is inserted into an organism and later there are a
lot more prions in that organism. You can call that whatever you
choose to call it.

Prions, like all other proteins, do survive UV, bleach, etc.
They are also not attacked by the immune system, which is really
good at fighting bacteria and virii but doesn't have any defense
at all against prions.

This raises the obvious question of why there are so few prion
diseases - why don't they just tear through the population? The
answer is that DNA and RNA based life is really, *really* good at
surviving and reproducing and (key concept) eating any proteins it
happens to stumble across - including prions. So prions are really
good at surviving our attempts at disinfecting them but are not
very good at reproducing. We pretty much had to give the prions
a helping hand by taking diseased cow corpses, killing all the DNA
and RNA in them without destroying the proteins, then feeding the
result to cows.

--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Rich Grise wrote:

OK, infectious. If any protein could survive all that crap, and
still be virulent enough to get past the bodie's vast immune system,
and be the instrument of infection, it still is not the Cause.

The research summary clearly states that the gastro-intestinal element
of the immune system *facilitates* the infection. SCID mice are immune-
because they have no immune system. Looks like your best bet for
survival is total body radiation treatment- see your doctor today.

 

[Guy Macon]

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

You create
your own reality, and no amount of logical arguments or scientific
proof can change that one fundamental truth. There ain't anything
you can do to get around it. So, if reality sucks, it's because
you're causing it to be that way because of some higher purpose
that you, yourself, assigned to yourself, and then forgot about
when you incarnated physical.

And, yes, I'm serious, and actually believe this, but luckily,
the part of my brain that says, "Well, don't go out spouting
this crazy shit in front of people who might do nasty things
to you if they think sideways or something" still has a vote.
Sometimes it's a bitch being the only one I know of who's reached
this level of enlightenment - I've gone beyond all the books, and
I can see both sides of almost every issue there is, except, of
course, the parts of Me that I'm still holding out in Not Me
by my own ignorance.

I don't see the "people who might do nasty things to you if they
think sideways or something" as prevailing. Your position as
described above has been extensively analysed by Rene Descartes,
Immanuel Kant, David Hume, Bertrand Russell and James Randi.
While I don't agree with your conclusions about the nature of
reality, They are certaily worth thinking about.




--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Guy Macon wrote:

Prions, like all other proteins, do survive UV, bleach, etc.
They are also not attacked by the immune system, which is really
good at fighting bacteria and virii but doesn't have any defense
at all against prions.

The tutorial explains that the infectious prion PrPc is identical to
"self"- PrPsc in its constituent parts, and that the only distinction is
in the three-dimensional conformational chemistry of their structures-
this is not a well understood area of molecular chemistry. It is the the
3-D lie of the molecule that determines how it reacts with other
proteins- that much is known. This is an imperfect process however, and
it is just now being established that certain infectious agents such as
bacteria do stimulate an immune response that does accidentally destroy
"self" cells- a link to heart valve disease has already been
established. Full blown "self" destruct is called auto-immune disease-
and this can be induced several ways. The original anthrax vaccine and
its link to Gulf War disease, used the squalene adjuvant, known to
cause auto-immune response in laboratory animals. Then there is the
well-known lupus.

 

[Guy Macon]

Richard Henry <rphenry@home.com> says...

If you eat prion-infected beef, the cause of your (eventual
demise will be your own stupidity.

Really? Even if you had no idea that it was prion-infected?

You create
your own reality, and no amount of logical arguments or scientific
proof can change that one fundamental truth. There ain't anything
you can do to get around it. So, if reality sucks, it's because
you're causing it to be that way because of some higher purpose
that you, yourself, assigned to yourself, and then forgot about
when you incarnated physical.

Have you seen "The Matrix" yet?

*Excellent* question!

--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Guy Macon]

Fred Bloggs <nospam@nospam.com> says...

The research summary clearly states that the gastro-intestinal element
of the immune system *facilitates* the infection. SCID mice are immune-
because they have no immune system. Looks like your best bet for
survival is total body radiation treatment- see your doctor today.

Transmissible spongiform encephalopathies depend on the presence of
follicular dendritic cells, and SCID mice produce no follicular
dendritic cells. I am unsure as to whether radiation-induced
immune system degradation involves lack of follicular dendritic
cells or some other mechanism.

--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Guy Macon wrote:

Fred Bloggs <nospam@nospam.com> says...


The research summary clearly states that the gastro-intestinal
element of the immune system *facilitates* the infection. SCID mice
are immune- because they have no immune system. Looks like your
best bet for survival is total body radiation treatment- see your
doctor today.


Transmissible spongiform encephalopathies depend on the presence of
follicular dendritic cells, and SCID mice produce no follicular
dendritic cells. I am unsure as to whether radiation-induced immune
system degradation involves lack of follicular dendritic cells or
some other mechanism.

FDCs are merely a means for taking up the prion, they are not
responsible for reproduction. He will be low on lymphoid phagocytes
after his radiation treatment- and a lot of other immune system activity.


"Ingested prions may be absorbed across the gut wall at Peyers patches.
These are a part of the MALT, or mucosal associated lymphoid tissue. It
is thought that the MALT presents microorganisms to the immune system in
a contained and ideal fashion, facilitating a protective immune
response. Prions could be taken up in the same way. Lymphoid cells then
phagocytose the particle and travel to other lymphoid sites such as
nodes, the spleen and tonsils. The prion can replicate at these sites.
Many of these sites are innervated and eventually the prion gains access
to a nerve and then propagates back up the axon to the spinal cord and
eventually the brain."

Also:
* SCID mice are resistant to a prion challenge, confirming the
importance of the lymphoid system.
* PrP null mice ie those in which both alleles have been disrupted,
PrP o/o, cannot be infected.
* PrPo/omice carrying a PrP +/+ brain graft can develop pathology
following an intracerebral injection but only in the graft.
* PrPo/o mice + graft + a reconstituted PrP+/+ lymphoreticular system
are resistant to a prion challenge.

 

[Rich Grise]

"Richard Henry" <rphenry@home.com> wrote in message news:h4ouc.32954

I have assigned myself a reality with a private jet, a ski house in Lake
Tahoe, and a few million in the bank. It seems to be missing. Have you
seen it?

No, of course not. So far, it only exists in your mind. To have it manifest
in reality, you have to understand the mechanism. Mostly, know the essence
of what you want, and let the form in which it presents itself be the
best for the occasion, whatever that form may be. Try it! It works for me!

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote in message
news:jeSdndRU-rFbgSfdRVn-hA@speakeasy.net...

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

You create
your own reality, and no amount of logical arguments or scientific
proof can change that one fundamental truth. There ain't anything
you can do to get around it. So, if reality sucks, it's because
you're causing it to be that way because of some higher purpose
that you, yourself, assigned to yourself, and then forgot about
when you incarnated physical.

And, yes, I'm serious, and actually believe this, but luckily,
the part of my brain that says, "Well, don't go out spouting
this crazy shit in front of people who might do nasty things
to you if they think sideways or something" still has a vote.
Sometimes it's a bitch being the only one I know of who's reached
this level of enlightenment - I've gone beyond all the books, and
I can see both sides of almost every issue there is, except, of
course, the parts of Me that I'm still holding out in Not Me
by my own ignorance.

I don't see the "people who might do nasty things to you if they
think sideways or something" as prevailing. Your position as
described above has been extensively analysed by Rene Descartes,
Immanuel Kant, David Hume, Bertrand Russell and James Randi.
While I don't agree with your conclusions about the nature of
reality, They are certaily worth thinking about.

Well, they all are perfectly accurate as far as they go, but they're
all missing the one thing that brings it all together, which is, of
course, Everything Else. ;-)

James Randi will never see a real demonstration of telepathy or
telekinesis because those things don't have permission to exist
in his reality. So what he believes comes true. For him. And it's
the same with everybody else. If you believe something's impossible,
at the imprint level, then it literally is. For you. And it can
actually prevent people from performing tricks in front of you.

Look at the paradise the antismokerists are creating for themselves!

It's easy to blame something else for your circumstances, "accident,"
"chance," "Your Mother-in-Law," whatever. Great! You're off the hook!
It's not your fault that reality sucks! How nice. But reality still
sucks. And you've got to get _them_, those people who are out to get
you in the first place, to fix it!

It's a much better feeling that if anything goes wrong, it's my
own fault. And then, armed with that knowledge, I can go find the
problem, and fix it. (actually, it's more like "heal" it.)

And incidentally, I know it works because I now have everything
in the world I've ever wanted and some stuff I'd have never thought
of if I'd had to make it all up myself, attended by a heretofore
unimagined sense of Inner Peace.

The only one standing in your way is you.

Good Luck!
Rich

 

[Guy Macon]

Fred Bloggs <nospam@nospam.com> says...

FDCs are merely a means for taking up the prion, they are not
responsible for reproduction. He will be low on lymphoid phagocytes
after his radiation treatment- and a lot of other immune system activity.

"Ingested prions may be absorbed across the gut wall at Peyers patches.
These are a part of the MALT, or mucosal associated lymphoid tissue. It
is thought that the MALT presents microorganisms to the immune system in
a contained and ideal fashion, facilitating a protective immune
response. Prions could be taken up in the same way. Lymphoid cells then
phagocytose the particle and travel to other lymphoid sites such as
nodes, the spleen and tonsils. The prion can replicate at these sites.
Many of these sites are innervated and eventually the prion gains access
to a nerve and then propagates back up the axon to the spinal cord and
eventually the brain."

Also:
* SCID mice are resistant to a prion challenge, confirming the
importance of the lymphoid system.
* PrP null mice ie those in which both alleles have been disrupted,
PrP o/o, cannot be infected.
* PrPo/omice carrying a PrP +/+ brain graft can develop pathology
following an intracerebral injection but only in the graft.
* PrPo/o mice + graft + a reconstituted PrP+/+ lymphoreticular system
are resistant to a prion challenge.

Thanks! I wasn't aware of the above. Which shows what happens when an
EE dabbles in biology...


--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Guy Macon]

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

James Randi will never see a real demonstration of telepathy or
telekinesis because those things don't have permission to exist
in his reality. So what he believes comes true. For him. And it's
the same with everybody else. If you believe something's impossible,
at the imprint level, then it literally is. For you. And it can
actually prevent people from performing tricks in front of you.

Counterargument: When those who firmly believe in telepathy or
telekinesis do experiments with proper scientific controls, they
also fail to see any demonstration of telepathy or telekinesis.
This leads to the conclusion that it is something other than the
presence of a skeptic which prevents the telepathy or telekinesis
from happening.

--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[Rich Grise]

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote in message
news:Ne2dnQkRqNyH7ifd4p2dnA@speakeasy.net...

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

James Randi will never see a real demonstration of telepathy or
telekinesis because those things don't have permission to exist
in his reality. So what he believes comes true. For him. And it's
the same with everybody else. If you believe something's impossible,
at the imprint level, then it literally is. For you. And it can
actually prevent people from performing tricks in front of you.

Counterargument: When those who firmly believe in telepathy or
telekinesis do experiments with proper scientific controls, they
also fail to see any demonstration of telepathy or telekinesis.
This leads to the conclusion that it is something other than the
presence of a skeptic which prevents the telepathy or telekinesis
from happening.

Not at all. One way to look at it is like an "energy dampening

field" - actually, I hate that expression, and think star trek was
taken over by ignorami to let that one out - it's "Damping."

And "proper scientific controls" contribute - it's an effect that
can't be observed with current instruments, because it's internal
to the human. Everyone is telepathic, receiving everybody else's
thoughts all the time. The average is noise. So you learn to tune
out all the noise so you can hear your own thoughts, and learning
how to narrow the bandpass on your receiver is somewhat of a
challenge. You turn the gain up, and you hear EVERYTHING!. And in
a case like that, the debunkers running the "scientific" instruments
will be broadcasting "FAIL! FAIL! FAIL! FAIL!" orders of magnitude
louder than your partner can think the picture on the card. I.e.,
jamming. And they not only don't know it, but would pooh-pooh the
very idea.

At some point it gets kind like counting angels on the head of a
pin.

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Guy Macon]

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote...

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

James Randi will never see a real demonstration of telepathy or
telekinesis because those things don't have permission to exist
in his reality. So what he believes comes true. For him. And it's
the same with everybody else. If you believe something's impossible,
at the imprint level, then it literally is. For you. And it can
actually prevent people from performing tricks in front of you.

Counterargument: When those who firmly believe in telepathy or
telekinesis do experiments with proper scientific controls, they
also fail to see any demonstration of telepathy or telekinesis.
This leads to the conclusion that it is something other than the
presence of a skeptic which prevents the telepathy or telekinesis
from happening.

Not at all. One way to look at it is like an "energy dampening
field" - actually, I hate that expression, and think star trek was
taken over by ignorami to let that one out - it's "Damping."

And "proper scientific controls" contribute - it's an effect that
can't be observed with current instruments, because it's internal
to the human. Everyone is telepathic, receiving everybody else's
thoughts all the time. The average is noise. So you learn to tune
out all the noise so you can hear your own thoughts, and learning
how to narrow the bandpass on your receiver is somewhat of a
challenge. You turn the gain up, and you hear EVERYTHING!. And in
a case like that, the debunkers running the "scientific" instruments
will be broadcasting "FAIL! FAIL! FAIL! FAIL!" orders of magnitude
louder than your partner can think the picture on the card. I.e.,
jamming. And they not only don't know it, but would pooh-pooh the
very idea.

In the experiments I am talking about, there were no debunkers or
instruments. There were just true believers who got the results by
simple counting of right/wrong predictions, and proper scientific
controls that they got from reading about how to do controlled
experiments. Because the true believers also believed that non-
believers could dampen the phenomena, they were careful to not
tell any non-believer about the experiments.

At some point it gets kind like counting angels on the head of a
pin.

Firstly, the question was "How many angels can dance on the point
(not the head) of a pin?" The great medieval theological debate
on this issue was whether angels were constrained by the "no two
objects can occupy the same space at the same time" constraint,
or whether the laws of physics did not apply to angels and other
spiritual beings. Far from being pointless and silly as is implied
in your statement, it was and is an important theological issue
for them.

BTW, could you please start putting "[OT]" in the title of the
"war on humanity" thread as a personal favor to me?


--
Guy Macon, Electronics Engineer & Project Manager for hire.
Remember Doc Brown from the _Back to the Future_ movies? Do you
have an "impossible" engineering project that only someone like
Doc Brown can solve? My resume is at http://www.guymacon.com/

 

[KR Williams]

In article <c2vuc.15486$g15.9884@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>,
null@example.net says...

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote in message
news:Ne2dnQkRqNyH7ifd4p2dnA@speakeasy.net...
Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

James Randi will never see a real demonstration of telepathy or
telekinesis because those things don't have permission to exist
in his reality. So what he believes comes true. For him. And it's
the same with everybody else. If you believe something's impossible,
at the imprint level, then it literally is. For you. And it can
actually prevent people from performing tricks in front of you.

Counterargument: When those who firmly believe in telepathy or
telekinesis do experiments with proper scientific controls, they
also fail to see any demonstration of telepathy or telekinesis.
This leads to the conclusion that it is something other than the
presence of a skeptic which prevents the telepathy or telekinesis
from happening.

Not at all. One way to look at it is like an "energy dampening
field" - actually, I hate that expression, and think star trek was
taken over by ignorami to let that one out - it's "Damping."

Have you ever been to Niagra Falls? That is one damp energy
field! 'twas damp enough that it made us all misty.

Wouldn't an energy "damping" field be more like a lossy medium?

And "proper scientific controls" contribute - it's an effect that
can't be observed with current instruments, because it's internal
to the human. Everyone is telepathic, receiving everybody else's
thoughts all the time. The average is noise. So you learn to tune
out all the noise so you can hear your own thoughts, and learning
how to narrow the bandpass on your receiver is somewhat of a
challenge. You turn the gain up, and you hear EVERYTHING!. And in
a case like that, the debunkers running the "scientific" instruments
will be broadcasting "FAIL! FAIL! FAIL! FAIL!" orders of magnitude
louder than your partner can think the picture on the card. I.e.,
jamming. And they not only don't know it, but would pooh-pooh the
very idea.

Yep! The medium loses.

At some point it gets kind like counting angels on the head of a
pin.

Oh, I had an aunt that did that sort of thing with the priest in
the church adjacent to her house (she is S. Babtist, btw).

--
Keith

 

[Rich Grise]

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote in message
newsJWdnXdtQMGNESfdRVn-

In the experiments I am talking about, there were no debunkers or
instruments. There were just true believers who got the results by
simple counting of right/wrong predictions, and proper scientific
controls that they got from reading about how to do controlled
experiments. Because the true believers also believed that non-
believers could dampen the phenomena, they were careful to not
tell any non-believer about the experiments.

At some point it gets kind like counting angels on the head of a
pin.

Firstly, the question was "How many angels can dance on the point
(not the head) of a pin?" The great medieval theological debate
on this issue was whether angels were constrained by the "no two
objects can occupy the same space at the same time" constraint,
or whether the laws of physics did not apply to angels and other
spiritual beings. Far from being pointless and silly as is implied
in your statement, it was and is an important theological issue
for them.

This is a very interesting point. In one way of looking at it, everything
is all one huge point that everything occupies at the same time.
You know, one is all, all is one, all that sort of thing.

Or it could be that because of the way reality's been working,
angels can't get to this side any more. ;-)

Maybe the angels-on-a-pin question would be more like, "how many
signals can be going through a node simultaneously?" At least that
one has referents!

" in the title of the
"war on humanity" thread as a personal favor to me?

Sure.

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Guy Macon]

Rich Grise <null@example.net> says...

"Guy Macon" <http://www.guymacon.com> wrote

Firstly, the question was "How many angels can dance on the point
(not the head) of a pin?" The great medieval theological debate
on this issue was whether angels were constrained by the "no two
objects can occupy the same space at the same time" constraint,
or whether the laws of physics did not apply to angels and other
spiritual beings. Far from being pointless and silly as is implied
in your statement, it was and is an important theological issue
for them.

This is a very interesting point. In one way of looking at it,
everything is all one huge point that everything occupies at
the same time. You know, one is all, all is one, all that sort
of thing.

An interesting (cough) point! Have you ever read René Descartes
(1596-1650) _Meditations on First Philosophy_? You seem to share
many of his ideas.

 

[Terry Given]

"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:2g2hb05gj5r7ecvi233rmrkp1erc90o0db@4ax.com...

On Fri, 28 May 2004 12:19:48 -0700, Jim Thompson
thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On 28 May 2004 12:12:46 -0700, jeffm_@email.com (JeffM) wrote:

We need to start taking religion into account.
If a guy is going to kill himself in the process of attacking you,
what can you do to convince him it's a bad idea?
Wrap his corpse in pigskin before you bury it.
The word I get is that it worked on the Moros.

Moors?

I'm interested in your theory because I've suggested something similar
in the past, except I then wanted to run the combination thru a meat
grinder, and shown on Al Jezeera TV ;-)

---
I don't think doing anything to the _corpse_ will matter, since its
owner will no longer be alive and responsibility for what happens to
his body will no longer be his . However, I think that the
_voluntary_ admission of pork into the body while still alive is
unforgivable, so how about pork spray? We let it be known that if
hostilities don't stop immediately, an aerosol of pork fat will be
sprayed over selected portions of the population at a rate of one
square mile per hostile incident or something like that.

http://www.skepticfiles.org/atheist/pork-bul.htm

???
John Fields

Nice. And doesnt require wholesale slaughter (except of pigs). Probably a
brilliant crowd control measure.

Cheers
Terry

 

[Terry Given]

"Anthony Fremont" <spam@anywhere.com> wrote in message
news:r3Ttc.24728$lY2.19161@fe1.texas.rr.com...

"Terry Given" <the_domes@xtra.co.nz> wrote

Nah, I reckon its an abbreviation, of coprophile.

On second thought you're probably right. ;-)

No shit.....

Cheers
Terry

 

[Terry Given]

"Jim Thompson" <thegreatone@example.com> wrote in message
news:a8hhb09d9qnjph3s14gf9p56rni9i02l1j@4ax.com...

On Sat, 29 May 2004 16:50:34 GMT, Spehro Pefhany
speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote:

On 29 May 2004 14:45:47 GMT, the renowned dbowey@aol.com (Dbowey)
wrote:
[snip]
There is a Pub in Buffalo that has the best wings I've eaten. They
advertise
the Pub is the origin of Buffalo wings. Went there several times and
always
enjoyed it. The beer was almost as good as Portland, Or. beer.

That's the Anchor bar. http://www.anchorbar.com/origins.asp

I'm don't know that they are the best, but they are pretty good, and
there are worse places to be in Buffalo.

That's a polite way of putting it ;-) 'Bout like being on Washington
Street in downtown Boston.

Right where I used to live, Worcester Square - about -0.5 blocks from
Roxbury, just by the intersection of Mass & Washington. Where I used to
drink in a pub, and go to Karate

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany


...Jim Thompson

Yes I can cook. No I cant cook buffalo wings.

Cheers
Terry

 

[Rich Grise]

"Terry Given" <the_domes@xtra.co.nz> wrote in message news:BBQuc.12769

"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message

I don't think doing anything to the _corpse_ will matter, since its
owner will no longer be alive and responsibility for what happens to
his body will no longer be his . However, I think that the
_voluntary_ admission of pork into the body while still alive is
unforgivable, so how about pork spray? We let it be known that if
hostilities don't stop immediately, an aerosol of pork fat will be
sprayed over selected portions of the population at a rate of one
square mile per hostile incident or something like that.

http://www.skepticfiles.org/atheist/pork-bul.htm

???
John Fields

Nice. And doesnt require wholesale slaughter (except of pigs). Probably a
brilliant crowd control measure.

Cheers
Terry

So, take away the M-16s or whatever from US troops, and give them

splatball guns with the splatballs full of lard.

Cheers!
Rich