Good, relatively low cost PCB layout SW?

Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2005-11-13, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:


I do not mind paying som reasonable amount for the prog.
But at "104 megs zipped" it is totally impossible to obtain via POTS.


how so? I have dowloaded over half of Debian woody (8 CDroms so far) call it
5Gigs, over POTS.

104 megs will only take all night to download, something like "get right"
will help with resuming aborted downloads if you're running windows
(handy if your ISP has a time limit etc...)

Bye.
Jasen
"104 megs will only take all night to download" ??
Click to expand...
You are nuts!
 
Joel Kolstad wrote:

One significant feature that Pulsonix/EasyPC lack is the ability to
automatically have nets connect by copying/pasting (or duplicating) a bunch of
components and their associated nets "on top of " some other nets. I was
really surprised to find this -- ORCAD, PCAD, and most other packages I've
tried in the past 5 years all do this! It has been mentioned to me that
allowing this behavior is potentially "risky," so I can see some checkbox for
whether or not it should be allowed, but for someone used to working in this
style of design entry it's a real producitivity killer.

Similarly, drawing a line past a bunch of pins (say all your power pins
sticking out of the side of a larger symbol) doesn't connect the net to those
pins -- something that can make what could be a "two click" operations a
"twenty click" operation if you have 10 pins you wanted connected to the same
net. (Although, in all fairness, just like other programs you can pre-assign
a net to a bunch of pins and not show them on the schematic, but personally
I've preferred to show all power pins ever since the likelihood that
"diagonally opposite pins = +5V and Gnd" went the way of the dodo about a
decade ago. Hiding lots of information like power pins numbers certainly
makes the schematic look a little nicer, but for me this benefit is outweighed
by the utility of being able to know, from a paper schematic, where one ought
to find power -- and what the voltage should be -- during troubleshooting.)

In general, Pulsonix/EasyPC are well-written programs that are fast and
'clean,' -- they're still lacking some of the features that the big boys have,
but I haven't regretted spending the money on Pulsonix yet.

---Joel


I really appreciate the mention of copying groups; i have one very
Click to expand...
busy board with 40 items that interconnect to each other exactly the
same way.
So i layout four, and "step and repeat" to get 8, then dup the set
for 16 etc until have 32 then dup a group of 8 for that total of 40.
So i know exactly what you mean.
The bad thing was that Ivex winBoard would not allow any SM on the
back side - otherwise i could theoretically have dupped the 40 and
flipped for the back side.
Being an electronic tech for over 40 years, i agree that
documentation should be complete - even if the schematic looks "messy".
One never knows when troubleshooting is needed, and pin functions
have always been vital since the days of 4-pin, 5-pin, etc tubes and
with plate and grid caps.
The added info (eg: Tektronix) of voltages and waveforms at notable
or useful test points adds to the useability of a schematic for the test
tech.
 
Richard Kanarek wrote:

How about the badly named but (I think???) otherwise well done "Rimu
PCB" and (if you please) "Rimu Schematic" from www.hutson.co.nz ?


Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

NOT affiliated with Hutson Systems in any way.
Am open to all; will look into it and compare with the others.
Click to expand...
Thanks.
 
Rimu happens to be a beautiful hardwood tree very popular among furniture
manufacturers. It also looks far better in a forest.

Simon


"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3XBef.2392$c27.70@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Richard Kanarek wrote:

How about the badly named but (I think???) otherwise well done "Rimu
PCB" and (if you please) "Rimu Schematic" from www.hutson.co.nz ?


Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

NOT affiliated with Hutson Systems in any way.
Am open to all; will look into it and compare with the others.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
 
Leon ...

Do you have a legit copy of an obsolete Windows version of Easy-PC you'd be
willing to sell? I used Easy-PC DOS about fifteen years ago and it was a
bitch kitty when trying to make new parts. It was also DOS-Version specific
so when Microlimp came out with a new version of MSDOS, Easy-PC choked on
it. I couldn't mess around with what was then hobby-level software with
buggy parts.

I've heard you all rave over the newer versions, but I'm not all that
thrilled with the demo I downloaded a couple of years ago. Perhaps the
cripple code made it less than I expected.

I've also got about ten years of CircuitMaker/TraxMaker PCB files that I
will have to port over to whatever new program I decide upon. CM can export
in Protel, Tango, Orcad, and a few more, and TM can export in Gerber or
ProtelText format. Do you happen to know if EZPC can accept any of these
formats?

Thanks,

Jim




"Leon" <leon_heller@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1131804480.685625.48500@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
EasyPC:

http://www.numberone.com

I used it for years.

Leon
Click to expand...
 
"Simon Peacock" <simon$actrix.co.nz> wrote in message
news:437af251@news2.actrix.gen.nz...
Rimu happens to be a beautiful hardwood tree very popular among furniture
manufacturers. It also looks far better in a forest.
Click to expand...
In New Zealand they're no longer allowed to cut down new rimu, so there's now
a thriving market in recycling old rimu furniture into new pieces. Having to
leave in some of the holes, cuts, etc. that are already there from the
original piece sometimes makes the new piece quite artistic...
 
RST Engineering (jw) wrote:
I used Easy-PC DOS about fifteen years ago and it was a
bitch kitty when trying to make new parts.
Click to expand...
It REALLY is easy now.

I'm not all that
thrilled with the demo I downloaded a couple of years ago. Perhaps the
cripple code made it less than I expected.
Click to expand...
They are making a big mistake in not letting you create a very limited
design as Eagle does. Though I think Eagle might have to limit a little
more in the future. 80x100 is now one of my larger PCBs!

Paul Burke
 
JeffM wrote:
I think Eagle might have to limit a little more in the future.
80x100 is now one of my larger PCBs!
Paul Burke


2 layers?
Click to expand...
I don't know how good Eagle's copper pour is (EasyPC's is excellent),
but I've had very good EMC results using a poured groundplane with
plenty of vias stitching the two sides together. Though most PCBs tend
to be 4 layer these days.

Paul Burke
 
On 2005-11-16, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2005-11-13, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:


I do not mind paying som reasonable amount for the prog.
But at "104 megs zipped" it is totally impossible to obtain via POTS.


how so? I have dowloaded over half of Debian woody (8 CDroms so far) call it
5Gigs, over POTS.

104 megs will only take all night to download, something like "get right"
will help with resuming aborted downloads if you're running windows
(handy if your ISP has a time limit etc...)

Bye.
Jasen
"104 megs will only take all night to download" ??
You are nuts!
Click to expand...

I don't pay by the minute for dialup internet (or for local calls),
and neither want nor expect any phone calls while I sleep.
I say let the computer work while I sleep.

why am I nuts?

Bye.
Jasen
 
Hi everyone,

My name is Todd Clifton, I am the product manager for PCB123.

I admit I am biased, but PCB123 is an excellent tool, PCB123 has had
over 200,000+ downloads and thousands of downloads of our manuals with
no issues. We are even willing to mail, at our cost printed user
manuals to all that ask.

We know that our schematic tool is weak and it is slated to be replaced
in 2006. I challenge anyone to try out our technical support, call us
free of charge, you will not be disappointed. The number is
1-800-228-8198 and we love constructive criticism, it is the only way
we can truly understand what is working and what is not working. Our
tool it totally customer driven and not bogged down with isosteric
features. If you need the software mailed on CD let us know at
support@pcb123.com and we will gladly send you a copy at no cost.
Please see what other customers have had to say:
http://www.pcb123.com/pcb123customers.php

Please keep the feedback and constructive criticism coming our way.

Todd


Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2005-11-16, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2005-11-13, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:


I do not mind paying som reasonable amount for the prog.
But at "104 megs zipped" it is totally impossible to obtain via POTS.


how so? I have dowloaded over half of Debian woody (8 CDroms so far) call it
5Gigs, over POTS.

104 megs will only take all night to download, something like "get right"
will help with resuming aborted downloads if you're running windows
(handy if your ISP has a time limit etc...)

Bye.
Jasen
"104 megs will only take all night to download" ??
You are nuts!


I don't pay by the minute for dialup internet (or for local calls),
and neither want nor expect any phone calls while I sleep.
I say let the computer work while I sleep.

why am I nuts?

Bye.
Jasen
Click to expand...
 
toober02@gmail.com wrote:

Hi everyone,

My name is Todd Clifton, I am the product manager for PCB123.

I admit I am biased, but PCB123 is an excellent tool, PCB123 has had
over 200,000+ downloads and thousands of downloads of our manuals with
no issues. We are even willing to mail, at our cost printed user
manuals to all that ask.
Click to expand...
Except its serious disadvantage is it can only be used to make PCBs in your
factory.

Ian
 
Ian Bell <ruffrecords@yahoo.com> writes:
Except its serious disadvantage is it can only be used to make PCBs
in your factory.
Click to expand...
gEDA/PCB produces industry standard gerbers (RS-274X) but I've seen at
least one fab that charged extra if you didn't send them a
cad-package-specific all-in-one file. I.e. a gerber surcharge.
 
DJ Delorie wrote:

Ian Bell <ruffrecords@yahoo.com> writes:
Except its serious disadvantage is it can only be used to make PCBs
in your factory.

gEDA/PCB produces industry standard gerbers (RS-274X) but I've seen at
least one fab that charged extra if you didn't send them a
cad-package-specific all-in-one file. I.e. a gerber surcharge.
Click to expand...
Not sure about your point but I was not referring to gEDA.

Ian
 
Except, you idiot, you have written software that can only be used to make
boards at your facility.

BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

Go AWAY. How's THAT for constructive criticism?

Jim


<toober02@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1134776111.608445.5000@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Hi everyone,

My name is Todd Clifton, I am the product manager for PCB123.

I admit I am biased, but PCB123 is an excellent tool, PCB123 has had
over 200,000+ downloads and thousands of downloads of our manuals with
no issues. We are even willing to mail, at our cost printed user
manuals to all that ask.

We know that our schematic tool is weak and it is slated to be replaced
in 2006. I challenge anyone to try out our technical support, call us
free of charge, you will not be disappointed. The number is
1-800-228-8198 and we love constructive criticism, it is the only way
we can truly understand what is working and what is not working. Our
tool it totally customer driven and not bogged down with isosteric
features. If you need the software mailed on CD let us know at
support@pcb123.com and we will gladly send you a copy at no cost.
Please see what other customers have had to say:
http://www.pcb123.com/pcb123customers.php

Please keep the feedback and constructive criticism coming our way.

Todd


Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2005-11-16, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2005-11-13, Robert Baer <robertbaer@earthlink.net> wrote:


I do not mind paying som reasonable amount for the prog.
But at "104 megs zipped" it is totally impossible to obtain via
POTS.


how so? I have dowloaded over half of Debian woody (8 CDroms so far)
call it
5Gigs, over POTS.

104 megs will only take all night to download, something like "get
right"
will help with resuming aborted downloads if you're running windows
(handy if your ISP has a time limit etc...)

Bye.
Jasen
"104 megs will only take all night to download" ??
You are nuts!


I don't pay by the minute for dialup internet (or for local calls),
and neither want nor expect any phone calls while I sleep.
I say let the computer work while I sleep.

why am I nuts?

Bye.
Jasen
Click to expand...
 
Ian Bell <ruffrecords@yahoo.com> writes:
gEDA/PCB produces industry standard gerbers (RS-274X) but I've seen at
least one fab that charged extra if you didn't send them a
cad-package-specific all-in-one file. I.e. a gerber surcharge.

Not sure about your point but I was not referring to gEDA.
Click to expand...
I know, I was offering a contrast. Plus pointing out that it's not
just the software vendors that penalize standards.
 
On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 20:34:59 -0800, "RST Engineering \(jw\)"
<jim@rstengineering.com> wrote:

Except, you idiot, you have written software that can only be used to make
boards at your facility.
Click to expand...
Be nice. Top-posters should generally refrain from imprecations and
calumny.

BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

Go AWAY. How's THAT for constructive criticism?
Click to expand...
Standard Gerber files are indeed, well, standard. However, for the
onesie-twosie user, a proprietary format isn't that big a deal --
especially if the overall project cost is acceptable. It's not like
their target customer is intending to go out for multiple bids on 100K
lots, is it?

I'm personally happy with the gEDA toolchain but I can see where the
PCB123 guys could have a useful market niche.

--
Rich Webb Norfolk, VA
 
PCB-Pool (my favourite PCB supplier) charges extra for Gerbers, but
they accept GC-Prevue GWK files, so one doesn't have to use one of
their supported packages.

Leon
 
DJ Delorie wrote:

Ian Bell <ruffrecords@yahoo.com> writes:
gEDA/PCB produces industry standard gerbers (RS-274X) but I've seen at
least one fab that charged extra if you didn't send them a
cad-package-specific all-in-one file. I.e. a gerber surcharge.

Not sure about your point but I was not referring to gEDA.

I know, I was offering a contrast. Plus pointing out that it's not
just the software vendors that penalize standards.
Click to expand...
Got you.

Ian
 
"Leon" <leon_heller@hotmail.com> writes:
PCB-Pool (my favourite PCB supplier) charges extra for Gerbers, but
they accept GC-Prevue GWK files, so one doesn't have to use one of
their supported packages.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's the one I was thinking about. I was also thinking about
adding GWK support to PCB but with such an easy workaround... except
for the windows dependency.
 
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