Generator Hookup

[Fred Abse]

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:33:53 -0500, Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know. Obviously more than all of you combined. Is there an
engineer in the house? Then find out where I went wrong with this

http://mypeoplepc.com/members/jon8338/math/

WTF has the ability to program geometrical graphics got to do with the
ability to design medium current switchgear?

I didn't go wrong with any of it. Then what makes any of you think I
know nothing about anything?

The 240 volts come from two 120 volt signals phase shifted by half a
period. Am I right? Am I wrong? How many of you know that? Or are you
just pretenders?

WRONG! The two 120 volt supplies come from a single transformer secondary
at 240 volts, center tapped to ground/neutral. That isn't phase shifting,
it's phase splitting. Phase relationships are preserved wherever you put
the tap relative to either end.

With 3-phase service, by what fraction of a period are each of the
phases shifted? ANSWER ME. What is the maximum peak-to-peak voltage?

They are not shifted. They are *generated* with a 120 degree (one third of
a period) relationship.

What do you mean by "maximum peak-to-peak voltage"? That would depend upon
whether the voltage is varying. If the voltage is constant, the maximum
equals the average. Peak to peak voltage is 2 * V(RMS) * sqrt(2).

If you are referring to 3-phase *wye* connected supplies, phase-to-phase
voltage equals phase-to-neutral voltage times sqrt(3). This applies
whether you take RMS, peak, or peak-to-peak.

Evidence of sloppy thinking on your part.

Now tell me how to do wye/delta transformations.

--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[Fred Abse]

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:34:10 +0530, pawihte wrote:

You may be good at math but you know so little about
electrical/electronics engineering that you don't even know how little you
know.

"He who knows, and knows that he knows. He is a wise man, seek him.
He who knows not, and knows that he knows not. He is a child, teach him.
He who knows, and knows not that he knows. He is asleep, wake him.
He who knows not, and knows not that he knows not. He is a fool, shun him."

Old Arabic proverb (IIRC)

--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[Jasen Betts]

On 2010-03-10, Jon <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote:

What? Have you deviants flipped your lid? Knowledge is free. But just try
to get your hands on telephone electronics. It's proprietary information.
There are no books on it at the library.

The info is out there if you keep looking.

All they show is how the keypad makes beeps. The rest is secret.

How do you multiplex 4 dedicated lines through one wire?

These days, VOIP. in the past some sort of FDM.

What's the code? But knowledge is free, and nobody's
going to get electrocuted with phone line voltage.

The lowest voltage fatal electric shock that I am aware of was 42V
telephone on-hook volage is 48V, ring voltage is even highrer.

bye.




--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: news@netfront.net ---

 

[JosephKK]

On Mon, 08 Mar 2010 11:30:20 -0700, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

On Mon, 08 Mar 2010 12:22:12 -0600, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:53:51 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote:

The electric service goes to the house, but I want to run the generator in
the barn. So far I know,

* there are 3 unused #10 wires buried between the house and the barn.
* the electric to the barn comes from the house in 2 buried #000 cables.

Some of the parts I have to work with are

* a 3pst relay with a 120vac coil and contacts rated for 90amps
* the above coil also activates 4 N.O. and 4 N.C. contacts rated for 15amps
* two 3pdt relays with a 120vac coil and contacts rated for 30amps at 300vac
* a spst mercury relay with a 240vac coil and contacts rated for 60amps

Here are the rules:

When the MAIN switch is ON, all generator wires must be disconnected.
When the MAIN is OFF, it is safe to connect all generator wires.

I take it that many of you were irritated with me over my last post. I
don't know how you got it I lived in Virginia, but whatever. This past
weekend I spent fixing up a computer and building a network in my home. I
guess it's nice I accidentally firewalled out my address, but since I did I
don't have to deal with backstabbers like some of you. See if I care if you
find out where I live, but I'm not volunteering the information.

---
Rather a juvenile outburst, but hardly a surprise.
---

If any of you have any smarts you'll solve the puzzle and come up with a
circuit that works and is up to code.

---
Since it's _you_ who can't solve the puzzle, I suggest that the
statement about who has smarts and who doesn't is misdirected.

Also, I think the decision to not help you is a wise one since you've
got an attitude and you seem to think that not allowing your precious
generator to be damaged should be the circuit's primary function.

JF

If someone has a trace on the guy, report him to his local power
company.

Otherwise he's liable to kill someone.

Or tell me and I'll do the deed... I have no problem being the "rat"


I do vaguely remember he's in Virginia somewhere? If so I can send
one of my redneck relatives to "educate" him.

...Jim Thompson

From the headers he might be anywhere on the planet, but most likely in the US

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Path: news.astraweb.com!border5.newsrouter.astraweb.com!news.glorb.com!news2.glorb.com!Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.earthlink.com!news.earthlink.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 07:53:54 -0600
From: "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com>
Newsgroups: alt.electronics,sci.electronics.design
Subject: Generator Hookup
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:53:51 -0500
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18005
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6002.18005
X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 100308-0, 03/08/2010), Outbound message
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
Message-ID: <E5ydnb1ZpMHvnAjWnZ2dnUVZ_h0AAAAA@earthlink.com>
Lines: 28
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: 4.248.249.151
X-Trace: sv3-8o5KFEZf3Slru5+WebvAyKEV+2ssFsDqeVWvHfcaUttrv0MqJijQPIvtOnwO6Txz1390cSk9XhhlpVC!VGMVxFAyeWkHUR+sZFRulwpg4vLTIBKfWVVeJlw1LLhhPKLg5GGvLr0bqPm45Qf2woxGQZ1EVeim!uYaugbZx2VQW4/gmo0W+EFOSBr5xkBsX-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40

 

[JosephKK]

On Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:53:51 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote:

The electric service goes to the house, but I want to run the generator in
the barn. So far I know,

* there are 3 unused #10 wires buried between the house and the barn.
* the electric to the barn comes from the house in 2 buried #000 cables.

Some of the parts I have to work with are

* a 3pst relay with a 120vac coil and contacts rated for 90amps
* the above coil also activates 4 N.O. and 4 N.C. contacts rated for 15amps
* two 3pdt relays with a 120vac coil and contacts rated for 30amps at 300vac
* a spst mercury relay with a 240vac coil and contacts rated for 60amps

Here are the rules:

When the MAIN switch is ON, all generator wires must be disconnected.
When the MAIN is OFF, it is safe to connect all generator wires.

I take it that many of you were irritated with me over my last post. I
don't know how you got it I lived in Virginia, but whatever. This past
weekend I spent fixing up a computer and building a network in my home. I
guess it's nice I accidentally firewalled out my address, but since I did I
don't have to deal with backstabbers like some of you. See if I care if you
find out where I live, but I'm not volunteering the information.

If any of you have any smarts you'll solve the puzzle and come up with a
circuit that works and is up to code.

If you post like some half-crazy backwoods hick with no edjumacation with a big
attitude you will be treated as one.

You were told repeatedly, get a licensed and bonded contractor to install a
proper transfer switch. It will protect your generator far better than any
half-baked, made from non-rated spare parts, system you have posted.

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:10:01 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com>
wrote:

"Glen Walpert" <nospam@null.void> wrote in message
news:4b9586a2$0$15780$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
[snip]

If I were him I would be prepared to show them the inspection report for
the legal installation when they show up. Probably he needs to hire an
electrician to do that; he obviously has not read the NEC.

What? Have you deviants flipped your lid? Knowledge is free. But just try
to get your hands on telephone electronics. It's proprietary information.
There are no books on it at the library. All they show is how the keypad
makes beeps. The rest is secret. How do you multiplex 4 dedicated lines
through one wire? What's the code? But knowledge is free, and nobody's
going to get electrocuted with phone line voltage. So what's the problem
when I'd like to know the information on connecting a generator?

I shouldn't have listened to you guys and just built my own knife switch for
10 bucks. It's impossible to make before break and would have worked fine.

I have a couple of electrician buddies. One of them would probably do the
work for me, but why? Disconnect the service, saw the cable, stick the
transfer switch in between and it's done. Then I also have a service
disconnect for future wiring problems.

I live in Harrisonburg, Virginia. Look me up on 7th Street and I'll have my
brass knuckles to serve you teeth lunch.

So you know where North Mountain is? And Franklin, WV (where my
hillbilly relatives live)? I'll send them over to Harrisonburg and
have them talk to the building inspector.

You done gone and deprived a village of an idiot

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 08:31:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
<To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:10:01 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com
wrote:


"Glen Walpert" <nospam@null.void> wrote in message
news:4b9586a2$0$15780$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
[snip]

If I were him I would be prepared to show them the inspection report for
the legal installation when they show up. Probably he needs to hire an
electrician to do that; he obviously has not read the NEC.

What? Have you deviants flipped your lid? Knowledge is free. But just try
to get your hands on telephone electronics. It's proprietary information.
There are no books on it at the library. All they show is how the keypad
makes beeps. The rest is secret. How do you multiplex 4 dedicated lines
through one wire? What's the code? But knowledge is free, and nobody's
going to get electrocuted with phone line voltage. So what's the problem
when I'd like to know the information on connecting a generator?

I shouldn't have listened to you guys and just built my own knife switch for
10 bucks. It's impossible to make before break and would have worked fine.

I have a couple of electrician buddies. One of them would probably do the
work for me, but why? Disconnect the service, saw the cable, stick the
transfer switch in between and it's done. Then I also have a service
disconnect for future wiring problems.

I live in Harrisonburg, Virginia. Look me up on 7th Street and I'll have my
brass knuckles to serve you teeth lunch.

So you know where North Mountain is? And Franklin, WV (where my
hillbilly relatives live)? I'll send them over to Harrisonburg and
have them talk to the building inspector.

You done gone and deprived a village of an idiot

...Jim Thompson

Elaborating... I mentioned "redneck" relatives before. The relatives
in Franklin, WV, _are_ hillbillys who travel regularly to Harrisonburg
to shop... Franklin is just slightly more than a wide spot in the
road.

The redneck relatives (by marriage) are in Richmond, probably 5 times
further away. He is indeed a redneck, has done hard time for various
felonies, including drug possession. He'd be ideal to have a visit
with the Jon "brass knuckles" idiot

Thanks for the approximate address, nice short street, though I
imagine they can find you exactly from your posting IP. Enjoy!

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy

 

[Jim Thompson]

Problem solved. I decided to mail the whole thread to...

Director Stacy Turner
Dept. of Planning and Community Development
409 South Main St.
Harrisonburg, VA 22801

Feel free to mail additional comments ;-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy

 

[PeterD]

On Tue, 09 Mar 2010 14:02:20 +0000, Tim Watts <tw@dionic.net> wrote:

PeterD <peter2@hipson.net
wibbled on Tuesday 09 March 2010 13:14

On Tue, 09 Mar 2010 06:55:17 +0000, Tim Watts <tw@dionic.net> wrote:

Jon <jon8338@peoplepc.com
wibbled on Tuesday 09 March 2010 06:41

All I need is a dpdt knife switch. If I was cheap I'd get some copper
and make one myself.

I just bought an economical manual dpdt transfer switch rated for 100a
at
240vac. I might have to have the electric company disconnect service so
I can wire it in.

Don't tell me now I did something wrong. What?


Don't you need 3p (two lives and a neutral)?

Never switch neutral.


Have you found out how you need to handle the ground/earth connection?
Here, in the event of a power failure,

See above...

the utility earth cannot be trusted,

You're required to have ground on your premises at the entrypoint.
Typically three ground rods.

so for
a generator hookup, one needs a local earth rod or rods bonded to the
neutral of the generator.

Not just generator, but all service. And that's why you never switch
neutral.

As the earth loop fault impedance is now too high
(typically 100+ Ohms for earth rod impedance) to trip a type B or C
breaker in a timely manner, an RCD (you call them GFCI I think) must also
be employed). What does your code say?

(Comments based on USA rules, may vary in other countries!)

That is interesting. Under the IEE Regs (UK), the neutral is considered a
live (ie dangerous). To distinguish what most people think of as a "live",
the other supply conductor is termed "phase", or more recently "line".

Well, we had a nice day today... I went out and did some scouting to
see how it is *really* wired (vs what the books say) and at each pole
where there is a transformer, there is also a ground rod (or rods)
that ground the neutral conductor at that pole. The neutrals are also
bonded between poles, too, with an overhead ground, so that they are
all connected together (this prevents problems if one pole's neutral
to ground rod or wire is damaged). This is likely quite different from
your setup in the UK, however.

Thus, we are required to switch out the neutral in the OP's scenario, which
is pertinent, as with certain types of supply fault on our 3 phase system,
the neutral can potentially move up to 240V away from earth (and lead to a
local 1 phase outlet experiencing a large voltage between the live and
neutral, eg >300V - a scenario I have witnessed).

In the US, if your neutral ever rises above ground, there is a fault
and that fault must be corrected. Again, a difference in systems.

Code (again USA) specifically says: "do not switch neutral."

>...

 

[Tim Watts]

PeterD <peter2@hipson.net>
wibbled on Wednesday 10 March 2010 19:47

Well, we had a nice day today... I went out and did some scouting to
see how it is *really* wired (vs what the books say) and at each pole
where there is a transformer, there is also a ground rod (or rods)
that ground the neutral conductor at that pole. The neutrals are also
bonded between poles, too, with an overhead ground, so that they are
all connected together (this prevents problems if one pole's neutral
to ground rod or wire is damaged). This is likely quite different from
your setup in the UK, however.

That sounds quite a lot like our TN-C-S system (earth/neutral combined). The
multiple rodding of neutral down to the real ground is referred to as PME
(protective multiple earth) or MEN (multiple earth neutral). The Electicity
Supply regulations I believe state how often this must be done by the
supplier.

Thus, we are required to switch out the neutral in the OP's scenario,
which is pertinent, as with certain types of supply fault on our 3 phase
system, the neutral can potentially move up to 240V away from earth (and
lead to a local 1 phase outlet experiencing a large voltage between the
live and neutral, eg >300V - a scenario I have witnessed).

In the US, if your neutral ever rises above ground, there is a fault
and that fault must be corrected. Again, a difference in systems.

Code (again USA) specifically says: "do not switch neutral."

Very interesting. We always isolate neutral along with the one live/phase at
the breaker panel via a DP switch which is mandatory (also supplies to
things in bathrooms like showers must be DP switched too). However we must
not switch the earth which is separate by the time the consumer sees it.
Neither must we ever cross bond earth and neutral within the installation
even if it is known to be bonded at the main fuse/meter.

It's usually the earthing systems that diverge AFAICS - even the IEE seems
to change its mind on the exact method of dealing with earthing from edition
to edition.

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

 

[Teodor Väänänen]

pawihte wrote On 2010-03-10 10:04:

Jon wrote:
What do I know?

What don't I know. Obviously more than all of you combined.
Is
there an engineer in the house? Then find out where I went
wrong
with this
http://mypeoplepc.com/members/jon8338/math/

I didn't go wrong with any of it. Then what makes any of you
think I
know nothing about anything?

The 240 volts come from two 120 volt signals phase shifted by
half a
period. Am I right? Am I wrong? How many of you know that?
Or are
you just pretenders?

You aren't right, IIRC, electricity to homes in the US is almost always
a balanced feed from a center-tapped secondary of a transformer
(120-0-120, or 240 if you only use the outermost leads), AFAIK 3-phase
is only used in distribution and industry settings.

With 3-phase service, by what fraction of a period are each of
the
phases shifted? ANSWER ME. What is the maximum peak-to-peak
voltage?

120 degrees. I live in the EU, so here the voltages are 235V between
phase and neutral, and 400V between two phases. From this we can deduce
that the peak voltage is 332V phase-neutral and 565V phase-phase and
that the peak-to-peak voltage is twice that (664 and 1131 V,
respectively). Yes, I know the voltages are different in the US, but the
ratios should remain the same, i.e. the ratio of the voltage between
phase-neutral vs. phase-phase is in the ballpark of 1.702.
The peak voltage is the rms voltage times sqrt(2), while the
peak-to-peak voltage is the rms voltage times sqrt(8).

Jon, have you taken these potential high voltages (i.e. ~3x normal) into
account when choosing the relay you use? If Murphy's law is invoked when
the mains come back on line, you might find yourself in a situation
where your genny is 180 deg off wrt to mains.

Also, have you tested your design for all the faults that might occur?
The likelihood of a fault isn't the issue, but how your design behaves
is. The rule you must follow is that any failure must be a right-side
failure (fail-safe, i.e. fails in a manner which renders the circuit
safe), you may under no circumstances allow a wrong-side (i.e. fails in
a manner which renders the circuit unsafe) failure to occur. Your and
others lives, health and safety depend on it.

I've followed your threads but have so far refrained from
posting, but I think it's time someone other than those who have
replied told you where you stand. You were given good advice and
vital cautions time and again. But you not only ignored them, but
kept responding with unwarranted belligerence. Your attitude
obviously kept others from following up with more good, patient
guidance.

You may be good at math but you know so little about
electrical/electronics engineering that you don't even know how
little you know. Those challenge questions of yours are so
elementary that I doubt anyone would dignify them with answers.
It's like asking a group of A+ high school students if they know
to spell 'apple'.

So do yourself a favor. Go over this thread and the previous
ones. Check the replies. If you don't understand or don't agree
with some points, ask specific questions in a civil manner and
read the replies with a receptive attitude.

Well, I tried (see above). Personally, I would leave the design of the
circuit to professionals, because even though I'm educated in
electronics and know my way around digital logic and computers, I know
that the design of the circuit is advanced enough, even by my standards,
to warrant a pro having a looksie at it and utter his approval or GTFO...

/Teo.

--
Teodor Väänänen | Don't meddle in the affairs of wizards,
<teostupiditydor@algonet.se> | for you are good and crunchy with
http://www.algonet.se/~teodor/ | ketchup.
Remove stupidity to reply. |

 

[JosephKK]

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:33:53 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know. Obviously more than all of you combined. Is there an
engineer in the house? Then find out where I went wrong with this

http://mypeoplepc.com/members/jon8338/math/

I didn't go wrong with any of it. Then what makes any of you think I know
nothing about anything?

The 240 volts come from two 120 volt signals phase shifted by half a period.
Am I right? Am I wrong? How many of you know that? Or are you just
pretenders?

Single phase 240 V center tap grounded.

With 3-phase service, by what fraction of a period are each of the phases
shifted? ANSWER ME. What is the maximum peak-to-peak voltage?

Related by 120 degree differences phase to neutral;, 208 V in standard services.

Snip

And I am even less impressed than Fred Abase. You are outside your range of
competence. I am an electrical engineer, but you don't see me pontificating
about optics with attitude and a hard head.

I have done construction inspection also, including smallish services like
120/240 V 3-phase 400 A. I have also reviewed designs up to 10 MVA at 12 kV.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 08:31:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:10:01 -0500, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com
wrote:


"Glen Walpert" <nospam@null.void> wrote in message
news:4b9586a2$0$15780$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
[snip]

If I were him I would be prepared to show them the inspection report for
the legal installation when they show up. Probably he needs to hire an
electrician to do that; he obviously has not read the NEC.

What? Have you deviants flipped your lid? Knowledge is free. But just try
to get your hands on telephone electronics. It's proprietary information.
There are no books on it at the library. All they show is how the keypad
makes beeps. The rest is secret. How do you multiplex 4 dedicated lines
through one wire? What's the code? But knowledge is free, and nobody's
going to get electrocuted with phone line voltage. So what's the problem
when I'd like to know the information on connecting a generator?

I shouldn't have listened to you guys and just built my own knife switch for
10 bucks. It's impossible to make before break and would have worked fine.

I have a couple of electrician buddies. One of them would probably do the
work for me, but why? Disconnect the service, saw the cable, stick the
transfer switch in between and it's done. Then I also have a service
disconnect for future wiring problems.

I live in Harrisonburg, Virginia. Look me up on 7th Street and I'll have my
brass knuckles to serve you teeth lunch.

So you know where North Mountain is? And Franklin, WV (where my
hillbilly relatives live)? I'll send them over to Harrisonburg and
have them talk to the building inspector.

You done gone and deprived a village of an idiot

...Jim Thompson

Elaborating... I mentioned "redneck" relatives before. The relatives
in Franklin, WV, _are_ hillbillys who travel regularly to Harrisonburg
to shop... Franklin is just slightly more than a wide spot in the
road.

The redneck relatives (by marriage) are in Richmond, probably 5 times
further away. He is indeed a redneck, has done hard time for various
felonies, including drug possession. He'd be ideal to have a visit
with the Jon "brass knuckles" idiot

Thanks for the approximate address, nice short street, though I
imagine they can find you exactly from your posting IP. Enjoy!

People PC is owned by Earthlink.


--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.

You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.


--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:25:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.


You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.

Let's see how talkative he is by Monday or Tuesday

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:25:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:


Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.


You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.

Let's see how talkative he is by Monday or Tuesday

Or if he still has electricity and Internet access?


--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:50 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:25:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:


Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.


You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.

Let's see how talkative he is by Monday or Tuesday


Or if he still has electricity and Internet access?

I don't know, I printed out the whole thread, with headers
highlighted, and mailed it to the director. Who knows? Virginia
often votes Democrat, so they may just approve his Rube Goldberg
scheme :-(

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:50 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:


Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:25:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:


Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.


You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.

Let's see how talkative he is by Monday or Tuesday


Or if he still has electricity and Internet access?

I don't know, I printed out the whole thread, with headers
highlighted, and mailed it to the director. Who knows? Virginia
often votes Democrat, so they may just approve his Rube Goldberg
scheme :-(

Email it to the local fire chief, so they know not to respond when
the shit hits the fan.


--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

mpm wrote:

On the bright side, when the shit does hit, at least the fan won't be
spinning!

No, but they might get hurt or killed at a neighbor's house when his
'Rube Goldberg' acts up.


--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'

 

[mpm]

On Mar 11, 12:34 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:50 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terr...@earthlink.net> wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:25:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terr...@earthlink.net> wrote:

Jon wrote:

What do I know?

What don't I know.

  You don't know enough to come in out of the rain.

Let's see how talkative he is by Monday or Tuesday

  Or if he still has electricity and Internet access?

I don't know, I printed out the whole thread, with headers
highlighted, and mailed it to the director.  Who knows?  Virginia
often votes Democrat, so they may just approve his Rube Goldberg
scheme :-(

   Email it to the local fire chief, so they know not to respond when
the shit hits the fan.

--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On the bright side, when the shit does hit, at least the fan won't be
spinning!

-mpm