eer

[Sir Charles W. Shults III]

Yes, a few months back, I gave a fairly in-depth look at capacitors,
batteries, flywheels, superconductors, etc. as energy storage devices. I gave
mass/volume/power numbers and so on, but to no avail.

Cheers!

Chip Shults
My robotics, space and CGI web page - http://home.cfl.rr.com/aichip

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 22:51:21 GMT, "Sir Charles W. Shults III"
<aichipREM@OVEcfl.THISrr.com> wrote:

Yes, a few months back, I gave a fairly in-depth look at capacitors,
batteries, flywheels, superconductors, etc. as energy storage devices. I gave
mass/volume/power numbers and so on, but to no avail.
Chip Shults

I missed your posting as I just added sci.electronics.misc to my
subscription list. (I needed a change). I'll excavate it with
Google.

I take it you didn't offer any help on perpetual motion, free energy
systems, vacuum energy, gravity shield motors, zero point energy,
relativistic drive motors, static electricity motors, monopolar
devices, 300 mpg carburetors, themonuclear home water heaters,
capillary powered motors, dipping duck motors, water powered vehicles,
passive amplification, noble gas engines, and cold fusion. Stuff that
actually works takes understanding and labour. Stuff that doesn't
work requires much more effort to fabricate. I guess understanding is
optional.


--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831.336.2558 voice http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
# jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
# 831.421.6491 digital_pager jeffl@cruzio.com AE6KS

 

[FEerguy9]

On 08 Oct 2003 09:11:27 GMT, feerguy9@cs.com (FEerguy9) wrote:

I have concluded that those prototypes are just large vehicles with large
capacitor plates. Nothing new.

You might wanna read up on how cazapitors work. It's not the "size"
of the plates that store the charge.

Isn't charge directly proportional to the area of the matching plates?

The charge is in the dielectric.
For a given dielectric thickness and voltage, if you double the plate
size, you double the stored energy (joules). However, if you double
the voltage, you get 4 times the stored energy. Therefore, there is a
substantial benifit to working with high voltages instead of growing
the plate size.

Okay

In most cazapitors, there are no real plates. The plates are simply a metal
plating (or sputtering) on the surface of
the dielectric.

Hmmmm Didn't know that.

You give me too much credit.

You're right. Give me back my credits.

Not 'till you learn how to spell capacitor.


Frank

 

[Bob Myers]

"FEerguy9" <feerguy9@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20031010115749.05767.00000445@mb-m10.news.cs.com...

On 08 Oct 2003 09:11:27 GMT, feerguy9@cs.com (FEerguy9) wrote:

I have concluded that those prototypes are just large vehicles with
large
capacitor plates. Nothing new.

You might wanna read up on how cazapitors work. It's not the "size"
of the plates that store the charge.

Isn't charge directly proportional to the area of the matching plates?

Bzzzzzzzzt! Sorry, thanks for playing, and next time read what
you're being told a bit more carefully.

Yes, the amount of charge stored is DIRECTLY proportional
to the area of the plates. That does not say where the *energy* is
actually stored. The dielectric is MUCH more involved in
determining how much energy is stored in the cap, both via the
way dielectrics work in the first place and through the fact that
energy storage varies as the square of the voltage. And the
limitation on the voltage that can be stored comes through the
thickness and characteristics of the dielectric.

In short, as you've already been told countless times, your silly
"inner space" notion focuses on the wrong problem (besides the
minor difficulty of not really increasing the energy density in the
first place.

Hmmmm Didn't know that.

The list of things about capacitors that you do not know or
understand seems to grow without limit...


Bob M.

 

[FEerguy9]

"FEerguy9" <feerguy9@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20031010115749.05767.00000445@mb-m10.news.cs.com...
On 08 Oct 2003 09:11:27 GMT, feerguy9@cs.com (FEerguy9) wrote:

I have concluded that those prototypes are just large vehicles with
large
capacitor plates. Nothing new.

You might wanna read up on how cazapitors work. It's not the "size"
of the plates that store the charge.

Isn't charge directly proportional to the area of the matching plates?

Bzzzzzzzzt! Sorry, thanks for playing, and next time read what
you're being told a bit more carefully.

?

Yes, the amount of charge stored is DIRECTLY proportional
to the area of the plates.

All *I* was saying!

How would one achieve such large plate area?

*I* suggest innerspace.

That does not say where the *energy* is
actually stored. The dielectric is MUCH more involved in determining how much
energy is stored in the cap, both via the
way dielectrics work in the first place and through the fact that energy
storage varies as the square of the voltage. And the
limitation on the voltage that can be stored comes through the
thickness and characteristics of the dielectric.

But, if a balance could be found, we might have something.

In short, as you've already been told countless times, your silly
"inner space" notion focuses on the wrong problem

<---not convinced that innerspace is so silly.

(besides the minor difficulty of not really increasing the energy density in
the
first place.



Hmmmm Didn't know that.


The list of things about capacitors that you do not know or
understand seems to grow without limit...

I know.


Frank