Diodes, Inc...

J

John Larkin

Guest
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?
 
John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?
Click to expand...

We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC /
Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
Click to expand...

That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.
 
On 7/19/2023 19:31, Phil Hobbs wrote:
John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.
Click to expand...

I use these only as overvoltage detecting refs for a 1.5V supply so
I have not noticed which are better, in fact I don\'t know which ones
we have been using. Thanks, good to know.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.
Click to expand...

I am eyeing their AP62800, rated at 8A and I need sort of 6.
However their diagrams are only (mostly) at 5 and 3.3V out,
I want to use it at 1V (where the 6A will be, may be elsewhere
as well. Meaning I\'ll have to test it before committing, stability,
(huge) load change response etc. can take me by surprise.

And thanks to John Larkin for mentioning diodes as a source.


Cheers

Phil Hobbs
Click to expand...
 
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.
Click to expand...

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
 
On 7/19/2023 2:15 PM, Eddy Lee wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Click to expand...

Do you have a spare contact on each relay?
 
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 12:20:06 PM UTC-7, John S wrote:
On 7/19/2023 2:15 PM, Eddy Lee wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Do you have a spare contact on each relay?
Click to expand...

No, all used on DPDT.
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 09:07:23 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?
Click to expand...

I hve used Diodes Inc for many many years.

Good stuff as I remember.

boB
 
On 7/19/23 9:07 AM, John Larkin wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.
Click to expand...

They do make good parts and, most of all, at good prices.


Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?
Click to expand...

Yep, one. I designed a specialty circuit around their AP63200. Worked
beautifully until ... the AP63200 became hardcore unobtanium. Many
manufacturers had such supply chain problems though so I am not going to
diss them for that. Heck, for a while you couldn\'t even get toilet paper
around here.

Subsequently I did the usual, designed it back out and made the whole
circuit jelly-bean and discretes so there would no longer be much of a
supply chain risk. Now this client has two designs, a fancy nice one and
a more mundane fallback version if things hit the fan. A good insurance
policy on their part.

Long story, over the last few years I really got weaned off super nice
parts and rather go a more classic route with less supply chain risk.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
<eddy711lee@gmail.com> wrote:

On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Click to expand...

Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 14:02:33 -0700, Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com>
wrote:

On 7/19/23 9:07 AM, John Larkin wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.


They do make good parts and, most of all, at good prices.


Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?


Yep, one. I designed a specialty circuit around their AP63200. Worked
beautifully until ... the AP63200 became hardcore unobtanium. Many
manufacturers had such supply chain problems though so I am not going to
diss them for that. Heck, for a while you couldn\'t even get toilet paper
around here.

Subsequently I did the usual, designed it back out and made the whole
circuit jelly-bean and discretes so there would no longer be much of a
supply chain risk. Now this client has two designs, a fancy nice one and
a more mundane fallback version if things hit the fan. A good insurance
policy on their part.

Long story, over the last few years I really got weaned off super nice
parts and rather go a more classic route with less supply chain risk.
Click to expand...

I could plop a few pcb test points around the part. If I can\'t get it,
I could make a little baby board regulator and stand it off the main
board on a few wires.

The supply situation is less crazy now, and some people have garages
full of toilet paper.
 
torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 01.16.45 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.
Click to expand...

this would save routing, https://www.ti.com/product/TPIC6B595
 
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 4:16:45 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.
Click to expand...

My relays draw 80mA @ 24V, or close to 2W to hold. A 3.7V to 24V booster can only start two of them at the same time. I might need bigger booster, unless I can sequence the starting.
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:48:11 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
<langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 01.16.45 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

this would save routing, https://www.ti.com/product/TPIC6B595
Click to expand...

We use that part in some other places. But it\'s physically big and
they would actually cost a tad more than the fpga+uln drivers. I can
squeeze the ULN2003s on the bottom, between the relay pins.

Diodes Inc does the ULN2003 too.

A single mosfet under each relay would be cool, but I\'d need a catch
diode or an avalanche-rated part.
 
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 17:38:33 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
<eddy711lee@gmail.com> wrote:

On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 4:16:45?PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

My relays draw 80mA @ 24V, or close to 2W to hold. A 3.7V to 24V booster can only start two of them at the same time. I might need bigger booster, unless I can sequence the starting.
Click to expand...

OK, 2 watts per coil, 10x mine. And I have a kilowatt of +48 supply
available.

48v relays would be great, but the 12 volt ones are a lot easier to
get. Automotive stuff.
 
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 6:03:38 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 17:38:33 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 4:16:45?PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

My relays draw 80mA @ 24V, or close to 2W to hold. A 3.7V to 24V booster can only start two of them at the same time. I might need bigger booster, unless I can sequence the starting.
OK, 2 watts per coil, 10x mine. And I have a kilowatt of +48 supply
available.

48v relays would be great, but the 12 volt ones are a lot easier to
get. Automotive stuff.
Click to expand...

24V coil relays are more common, especially for heavy duty one. Mine is 30A DC28V contact.

I am now using a 250W 12V to 24V inverter to activate 4 relays.
 
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 09:02:15 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
<langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 16.44.27 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 02:54:02 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 02.53.23 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:48:11 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 01.16.45 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

this would save routing, https://www.ti.com/product/TPIC6B595
We use that part in some other places. But it\'s physically big and
they would actually cost a tad more than the fpga+uln drivers. I can
squeeze the ULN2003s on the bottom, between the relay pins.

Diodes Inc does the ULN2003 too.

A single mosfet under each relay would be cool, but I\'d need a catch
diode or an avalanche-rated part.

https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Toshiba/SSM3K357RLF?qs=F5EMLAvA7ICLn4Y138U4bA%3D%3D&_gl=1*1l31jut*_ga*MjE3OTg0NTgyLjE2Njg0NDMwOTE.*_ga_15W4STQT4T*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4yOS4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuMC4wLjA.*_ga_1KQLCYKRX3*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4xNy4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuNDUuMC4w
It avalanches but they don\'t specify the voltage!

the drain-gate zener makes it shunt so one would assume it does that at ~60V and avalanche never happens
Click to expand...

Abs max is 60 volts, without a clue what that zener clamps at.

Same as avalanche-rated fets, no hint of the actual clamp voltage.
Grrrr.
 
torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 19.51.24 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 09:02:15 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 16.44.27 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 02:54:02 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 02.53.23 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:48:11 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 01.16.45 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

this would save routing, https://www.ti.com/product/TPIC6B595
We use that part in some other places. But it\'s physically big and
they would actually cost a tad more than the fpga+uln drivers. I can
squeeze the ULN2003s on the bottom, between the relay pins.

Diodes Inc does the ULN2003 too.

A single mosfet under each relay would be cool, but I\'d need a catch
diode or an avalanche-rated part.

https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Toshiba/SSM3K357RLF?qs=F5EMLAvA7ICLn4Y138U4bA%3D%3D&_gl=1*1l31jut*_ga*MjE3OTg0NTgyLjE2Njg0NDMwOTE.*_ga_15W4STQT4T*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4yOS4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuMC4wLjA.*_ga_1KQLCYKRX3*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4xNy4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuNDUuMC4w
It avalanches but they don\'t specify the voltage!

the drain-gate zener makes it shunt so one would assume it does that at ~60V and avalanche never happens
Abs max is 60 volts, without a clue what that zener clamps at.

Same as avalanche-rated fets, no hint of the actual clamp voltage.
Grrrr.
Click to expand...

https://www.diodes.com/assets/Articles/Automotive-MOSFETs.pdf

page 2
 
On 2023-07-20 16:29, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 12:50:23 +0200, jeroen <jeroen@nospam.please
wrote:

On 2023-07-20 02:38, Eddy Lee wrote:
[...]

My relays draw 80mA @ 24V, or close to 2W to hold. A 3.7V to 24V
booster can only start two of them at the same time. I might need
bigger booster, unless I can sequence the starting.


What do you think the current vs. time curve of a relay pulling in
looks like? It\'s probably not what you think.

Jeroen Belleman

Probably weird. Do you have any waveforms?

The flyback voltage should be strange too.
Click to expand...

Aussitôt dit, aussitôt fait.

I measured this on a clunky ERNI REL20 relay from my junk box.
When the armature moves, the coil current actually briefly drops.
See <http://cern.ch/jeroen/tmp/relay.html>.

I also tried one of these tiny Omron G6K relays, but did not see
a momentary current drop there. I may have to take another look,
because the trace was quite noisy.

Jeroen Belleman
 
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 12:01:35 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
<langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 19.51.24 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 09:02:15 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 16.44.27 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Thu, 20 Jul 2023 02:54:02 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 02.53.23 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:48:11 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
lang...@fonz.dk> wrote:

torsdag den 20. juli 2023 kl. 01.16.45 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Eddy Lee
eddy7...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 11:08:24?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 16:31:27 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:

John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:
Diodes is lately a lot more than diodes. A similar case is Onsemi, a
spinoff of Motorola that inherited the cheap gumdrop business but does
a lot more now.

Diodes has some dynamite new switchers, the AP66200 parts, that I\'d
like to use.

Any experience with Diodes, as regards support and especially keeping
parts in production? Any horror stories?



We’ve had good luck with them. Some of their analog parts are odd, both for
good or ill.

Their TLV431 is better than TI’s original, and much much better than the
onsemi version.

Their TLC271 is, like, 30 dB noisier than TI’s.

Haven’t used any of their switcher parts.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
That switcher looks fabulous. I\'m designing a board with maybe 125
12-volt-coil relays and I have to switch +48 down to 12 and have about
no room to do it in. HV-input switchers are rare. I like the old
LM2576HV-ADJ but it, and its inductor and caps, are gigantic.

How many of them are switched on at the same time? How do you deal with the initial surge? I am looking for a way to have a short delay to sequence on 24V relay coils.
Rough guess, maybe 50 max on at once. What surge do you expect?

One trick is to bump up the coil bus voltage to 12 for a while
whenever any relay state is changed, and drop it down to the
guaranteed holding voltage after a short while. But my relays will
only need maybe 200 mW coil power each, under an amp for all 50 on, so
that\'s not worth the hassle here.

I\'m thinking of using an Efinix FPGA and ULN2003s as the coil drivers.

this would save routing, https://www.ti.com/product/TPIC6B595
We use that part in some other places. But it\'s physically big and
they would actually cost a tad more than the fpga+uln drivers. I can
squeeze the ULN2003s on the bottom, between the relay pins.

Diodes Inc does the ULN2003 too.

A single mosfet under each relay would be cool, but I\'d need a catch
diode or an avalanche-rated part.

https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Toshiba/SSM3K357RLF?qs=F5EMLAvA7ICLn4Y138U4bA%3D%3D&_gl=1*1l31jut*_ga*MjE3OTg0NTgyLjE2Njg0NDMwOTE.*_ga_15W4STQT4T*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4yOS4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuMC4wLjA.*_ga_1KQLCYKRX3*MTY4OTg0NjM4MC4xNy4xLjE2ODk4NDYzOTUuNDUuMC4w
It avalanches but they don\'t specify the voltage!

the drain-gate zener makes it shunt so one would assume it does that at ~60V and avalanche never happens
Abs max is 60 volts, without a clue what that zener clamps at.

Same as avalanche-rated fets, no hint of the actual clamp voltage.
Grrrr.

https://www.diodes.com/assets/Articles/Automotive-MOSFETs.pdf

page 2
Click to expand...

Lots of words, no numbers.
 
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