dialup issues

  • Thread starter klem kedidelhopper
  • Start date
On Feb 10, 1:24 am, "Geoffrey S. Mendelson" <g...@mendelson.com>
wrote:
micky wrote:

A few ways later,  my phone continued to work, and the web radio
worked, but newsgroups, email, and web did not.   I was stumped, and
the Verizon DSL guy come over.  He said there is mor e than one level
of the phone line not working, and of DSL not working..   So the fact
that the phone and the web radio worked, didn't mean DSL was fully
working.     He said the wire going out the window was too thin.   (Or
maybe it had to do with too thin considering my aluminmum window
frames (both surrounding the glass and lining the window opening.

That's because DSL is "adaptive". The devices at each end are "smart" and
try the maximum speed they can. If that fails, or they get too many errors,
they try a lower speed until they can connect.

Analog modems do that too.

I can connect to the web browser interface of my DSL routers (which include
"modems") and see the exact speed the line is capable of, the speed it is
running at and the error rates. I can even run a BER (bit error rate) test
without disturbing the line.

In my case it's not very useful, as the DSL portion of my phone service
runs few hundred meters. It goes to a box somewhere near my home which
converts the DSL and analog voice to fiber optics.

That device is even smarter than you would expect, it opens its own
trouble tickets with the phone company and sends me SMSs when it does
or they are resolved.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson,  N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379
Gung Hay Fat Choy! (May the new year be prosperous).
Click to expand...
Quiet line numbers are often like ANI numbers (for identifying the CO
line), which are "top secret" within the phone company. The phone
company will never give them to you, but a cooperative lineman might
after you've established a rap or with him on a job. Some of the older
local exchanges here in New England worked with 200-2222222. Lenny
 
On Mon, 11 Feb 2013 07:16:21 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:

Quiet line numbers are often like ANI numbers (for identifying the CO
line), which are "top secret" within the phone company. The phone
company will never give them to you, but a cooperative lineman might
after you've established a rap or with him on a job. Some of the older
local exchanges here in New England worked with 200-2222222. Lenny
Click to expand...
Ummm... ANAC numbers from Wikipedia:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_number_announcement_circuit>

You should be able to find quiet line numbers with Google.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:10:47 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:29:42 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@bigfoot.com
wrote:

What's the quiet line?

If you hear buzz, clicks, hummmmm, noise, crackly, etc on the phone,
the first step is to determine whether it's a problem at the CO
(central office), on the line, or somewhere in the inside wiring. To
eliminate the inside wiring, simply plug the tester into the NIU
(demarc), thus disconnecting the house wiring. To determine if it's
coming from the switch at the CO, dial a quiet line number. All it
does is terminate the call to a perfect dummy load, that does NOT go
through the switch. If the noise disappears, it's coming from
somewhere inside the CO. If it's still there, it's on the line
somewhere.

Does every phone company have this? Does
Verizon?

Yes, yes, and I don't know the Verizon number.
Click to expand...
Please provide any number that you know. I am willing to bet that it is
industry standard.

?-)
 
On Mon, 11 Feb 2013 07:16:21 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:

On Feb 10, 1:24 am, "Geoffrey S. Mendelson" <g...@mendelson.com
wrote:
micky wrote:

A few ways later,  my phone continued to work, and the web radio
worked, but newsgroups, email, and web did not.   I was stumped, and
the Verizon DSL guy come over.  He said there is mor e than one level
of the phone line not working, and of DSL not working..   So the fact
that the phone and the web radio worked, didn't mean DSL was fully
working.     He said the wire going out the window was too thin.   (Or
maybe it had to do with too thin considering my aluminmum window
frames (both surrounding the glass and lining the window opening.

That's because DSL is "adaptive". The devices at each end are "smart" and
try the maximum speed they can. If that fails, or they get too many errors,
they try a lower speed until they can connect.

Analog modems do that too.

I can connect to the web browser interface of my DSL routers (which include
"modems") and see the exact speed the line is capable of, the speed it is
running at and the error rates. I can even run a BER (bit error rate) test
without disturbing the line.

In my case it's not very useful, as the DSL portion of my phone service
runs few hundred meters. It goes to a box somewhere near my home which
converts the DSL and analog voice to fiber optics.

That device is even smarter than you would expect, it opens its own
trouble tickets with the phone company and sends me SMSs when it does
or they are resolved.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson,  N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379
Gung Hay Fat Choy! (May the new year be prosperous).

Quiet line numbers are often like ANI numbers (for identifying the CO
line), which are "top secret" within the phone company. The phone
company will never give them to you, but a cooperative lineman might
after you've established a rap or with him on a job. Some of the older
local exchanges here in New England worked with 200-2222222. Lenny
Click to expand...
How about that. Many 555-#### numbers are various diagnostic systems.

?-)
 
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:22:31 -0800, josephkk
<joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:10:47 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:29:42 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@bigfoot.com
wrote:

What's the quiet line?

If you hear buzz, clicks, hummmmm, noise, crackly, etc on the phone,
the first step is to determine whether it's a problem at the CO
(central office), on the line, or somewhere in the inside wiring. To
eliminate the inside wiring, simply plug the tester into the NIU
(demarc), thus disconnecting the house wiring. To determine if it's
coming from the switch at the CO, dial a quiet line number. All it
does is terminate the call to a perfect dummy load, that does NOT go
through the switch. If the noise disappears, it's coming from
somewhere inside the CO. If it's still there, it's on the line
somewhere.

Does every phone company have this? Does
Verizon?

Yes, yes, and I don't know the Verizon number.

Please provide any number that you know. I am willing to bet that it is
industry standard.
?-)
Click to expand...
How much would you like to bet? The ANAC, ANI, DAMT, quiet line,
milliwatt tone, etc test numbers vary between locations, CO's, type of
switch, and companies. Same with quiet line numbers, security, test
equipment, procedures, and standards. AT&T is fairly standardized
throughout the system. I don't have a clue what Verizon does as
everything I work with locally uses AT&T.

However, if you want numbers to abuse, this might help.
<http://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=583069>
It's 10 year old, but looks accurate.

Please send my winnings to the address below.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:26:37 -0800, josephkk
<joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

How about that. Many 555-#### numbers are various diagnostic systems.
?-)
Click to expand...
Nope. Except for directory assistance, the 555 prefix is reserved for
"fake" phone numbers, as used in movies and videos.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/555_(telephone_number)>


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 19:11:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:26:37 -0800, josephkk
joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

How about that. Many 555-#### numbers are various diagnostic systems.
?-)

Nope. Except for directory assistance, the 555 prefix is reserved for
"fake" phone numbers, as used in movies and videos.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/555_(telephone_number)
Click to expand...
I hate when they use a 555 number in a movie. For gosh sakes, how
stupid would someone have to be to think the number they give in a
movie is really the number of someone like the character in the movie?
Calling those numbers should seem like calling random numbers. **

I also hate it when they remove t he rear-view mirrors of movie cars.
I've seen a few movies where they leave the rear view mirror and it
looks a lot better. It doesn't distract from the actors. It's a
much bigger distraction when it's not there.


On Law & Order, they always give the address of tte place they are
going. Often it's in the East River or Hudson River, but it still
indicates teh area they have in mind. Other times it would be in a
real block, residential even, but I assume the number they give is
between two real addresses. I have a good friend at W. 85th and
Columbus, and according to Law & Order, a lot goes on within a block
of her apartment.
 
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:22:31 -0800, josephkk
<joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:10:47 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:29:42 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@bigfoot.com
wrote:

What's the quiet line?

If you hear buzz, clicks, hummmmm, noise, crackly, etc on the phone,
the first step is to determine whether it's a problem at the CO
(central office), on the line, or somewhere in the inside wiring. To
eliminate the inside wiring, simply plug the tester into the NIU
(demarc), thus disconnecting the house wiring. To determine if it's
coming from the switch at the CO, dial a quiet line number. All it
does is terminate the call to a perfect dummy load, that does NOT go
through the switch. If the noise disappears, it's coming from
somewhere inside the CO. If it's still there, it's on the line
somewhere.

Does every phone company have this? Does
Verizon?

Yes, yes, and I don't know the Verizon number.

Please provide any number that you know. I am willing to bet that it is
industry standard.

?-)
Click to expand...
In grammar school, the phone guy told me the number to get it to ring
back. 1197 and 1191, but they don't work now where I live now.
Didnt' when I checked 30 years ago. They are very useful if one is
sick in bed and wants to call his mother. who is downstairs.
 
Geoffrey S. Mendelson forklarede:
micky wrote:


In my case it's not very useful, as the DSL portion of my phone service
runs few hundred meters. It goes to a box somewhere near my home which
converts the DSL and analog voice to fiber optics.

That device is even smarter than you would expect, it opens its own
trouble tickets with the phone company and sends me SMSs when it does
or they are resolved.

I assume you mean the box down the road is alerting, not your
Click to expand...
individual dsl boxes in the homes.

the box down the road is monitored from the central office,
where it is decided when an anomaly is turned into a ticket, and when
it is decided the problem is fixed, the sms'es are sent.

I don't think the box down the corner has any "free will" to generate
sms'es.

Of cause I could be wrong...

Leif



--
Husk křrelys bagpĺ, hvis din bilfabrikant har taget den idiotiske
beslutning at undlade det.
 
Den 17/02/2013, skrev micky:
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 19:11:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:26:37 -0800, josephkk
joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

How about that. Many 555-#### numbers are various diagnostic systems.
?-)

Nope. Except for directory assistance, the 555 prefix is reserved for
"fake" phone numbers, as used in movies and videos.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/555_(telephone_number)

I hate when they use a 555 number in a movie. For gosh sakes, how
stupid would someone have to be to think the number they give in a
movie is really the number of someone like the character in the movie?
Calling those numbers should seem like calling random numbers. **

You would be amazed about the stupidity of people.
Click to expand...

And if Dark Knight Rises grossed 1.1billion, average $10 per ticket,
and one in a million will call a number in a movie, that gives 1000
calls.

Would you like to get 1000 calls asking for Batman?

--
Husk křrelys bagpĺ, hvis din bilfabrikant har taget den idiotiske
beslutning at undlade det.
 
micky wrote:
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 19:11:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:26:37 -0800, josephkk
joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

How about that. Many 555-#### numbers are various diagnostic systems.
?-)

Nope. Except for directory assistance, the 555 prefix is reserved for
"fake" phone numbers, as used in movies and videos.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/555_(telephone_number)

I hate when they use a 555 number in a movie. For gosh sakes, how
stupid would someone have to be to think the number they give in a
movie is really the number of someone like the character in the movie?
Calling those numbers should seem like calling random numbers. **
Click to expand...

Some rock band in the mid '80s recorded a song with a real phone
number in it, and idiots all over the country were calling it. Since
they didn't give an area code, there were a lot of people being
harassed, some around the clock. Of course, what could you expect from
the MTV drones?
 
Leif Neland wrote:
I assume you mean the box down the road is alerting, not your
individual dsl boxes in the homes.
Click to expand...
Yes, BUT. The router I have is roughly equivalent to a 2005
computer in terms of processor capability, RAM, offline storage
(ROM), IO (one USB port, 4 ethernet ports, one VDSL modem, one 802.11n
multichannel access point).

It can run three virtual internet sessions for tunneling, two for me,
one for a separate public network.

It can provide a disk server or a print server via the USB.

I expect it can't send SMSs because it has no cellular connection, but it
may well be able to use a channel on the DSL line private to the phone
company for sending trouble tickets, etc.

the box down the road is monitored from the central office,
where it is decided when an anomaly is turned into a ticket, and when
it is decided the problem is fixed, the sms'es are sent.
Click to expand...
Probably.

I don't think the box down the corner has any "free will" to generate
sms'es.
Click to expand...
I don't know. My asterisk system has a cellular modem used as a phone
so I can receive and make calls and SMSs over the cellular network.
It can send me SMS's on its own.

Or to be more accurate, it COULD if I had anything programmed to triger
them. What I do have is set of PERL programs that run on a different
computer and when I run them, ssh into the asterisk system to send SMSs.

The other way, the asterisk system receives the SMS and emails it to me.

Note that some routers have USB ports programmed to connect to the cellular
network with modem sticks. I also have one of those used for emergency
backup.


I assume you could run DD-WRT on them and a stripped down Asterisk system
which could send SMS's based upon pre-programmed conditions (but not
free will, as in "I'm lonely. Please log into me".

Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379
Gung Hay Fat Choy! (May the new year be prosperous).
 
On Mon, 18 Feb 2013 08:58:25 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:

Well I finally dug a path through the snow out to the interface and
plugged my laptop directly into into it using a 6 foot cable and guess
what? A 26.4K connection! So I called the phone company to complain,
and (it was Saturday) but the rep told me that she would run it by the
technician on Tuesday and get back to me, disturbingly adding that she
"wasn't sure if they could do anything about it". Then she further
disturbingly added the usual cover their asses statement that if it is
determined that there was no problem with the telephone company's
lines, "a service charge would apply".
Click to expand...
They are required to inform you that charges may apply, even if they
are unlikely, just in case you want additional work done when they
arrive. That's because someone sued and won claiming that Ma Bell
didn't warn them that they would be charged for on premesis work.
Strictly speaking, if the telephone tech even steps into your house,
you could get a bill. I also know of one local tech that would claim
he did inside work, when the owner never let him in the house or was
away when the tech arrived. The solution is simple... don't let the
tech in the house if you don't want to pay.

Well this really pissed me off, and I told her that as far as I know
if I plugged into their interface and duplicated my problem then the
trouble is NOT premises related, it is THEIR's and therefore I cannot
be charged for a service call which they might make of their own
volition or of my request. Did I imagine that or is that a fact? I
added that if they sent a tech over I could easily demonstrate at the
interface that I can get a 45K connection on one line and only a 26.4K
connection on the other. I would take that service charge if I ever
got one to the PUC if I had to
Click to expand...
Nice try. I don't know how it works in your area, but in the Peoples
Republic of California, the PUC (public utilities commish) has
separated the voice monopoly and data portions of the operation. You
are guaranteed by the monopoly to have acceptable voice service. You
are NOT guaranteed to be able to use the line for data at anything
faster than 2400 baud. AT&T will make an effort to get it working to
V.32 (9600 baud), but no higher. The reason is not crappy wiring.
It's the large number of SLC, pair gain, and remote terminal systems
that have saved AT&T considerable expense by not requiring a metallic
pair back to the CO (central office). These are good for voice, but
will generally limit your modem connection to about 26Kbit/sec because
of the reduced bandwidth. If you want faster dialup, you'll need a
metallic pair. The only way I've found to guess if it's an SLC, Pair
Gain, or metallic pair is the frequency response test from the USR
modem that I previously mentioned.

What actually are my rights here?
Click to expand...
It depends on your state public utilities commission rules. What
state or country are you in? The rules might be available online.

This is a business line. Is the
phone company "required" to provide me with a line that I can get full
dial up bandwidth on?
Click to expand...
Not in California. Business lines actually have less "rights" than
consumer lines, even though you pay more.

Can I legally push this issue with them?
Click to expand...
Are you a lawyer? Do you have a large bank account? If not, I
suspect you may be tilting at windmills.

Or can
they really turn around and say "sorry Charlie but we're providing you
with voice communications and we can't do anything about your dialup
speed issue.
Click to expand...
Yes, they can probably do exactly that. In California, if you
complain to AT&T about data speeds, they will instantly suggest you
buy their new and improved U-Verse data service (ADSL2+) and generally
ignore all modem complaints. This has been an occasional problem with
older credit card machines, that use dialup lines and internal modems.
The result is that the business owner gets burned for a new terminal
that does credit card verifications over the internet instead of
dialup.



--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Feb 17, 12:54 pm, "Geoffrey S. Mendelson" <g...@mendelson.com>
wrote:
Leif Neland wrote:
I assume you mean the box down the road is alerting, not your
individual dsl boxes in the homes.

Yes, BUT. The router I have is roughly equivalent to a 2005
computer in terms of processor capability, RAM, offline storage
(ROM), IO (one USB port, 4 ethernet ports, one VDSL modem, one 802.11n
multichannel access point).

It can run three virtual internet sessions for tunneling, two for me,
one for a separate public network.

It can provide a disk server or a print server via the USB.

I expect it can't send SMSs because it has no cellular connection, but it
may well be able to use a channel on the DSL line private to the phone
company for sending trouble tickets, etc.



the box down the road is monitored from the central office,
where it is decided when an anomaly is turned into a ticket, and when
it is decided the problem is fixed, the sms'es are sent.

Probably.

I don't think the box down the corner has any "free will" to generate
sms'es.

I don't know. My asterisk system has a cellular modem used as a phone
so I can receive and make calls and SMSs over the cellular network.
It can send me SMS's on its own.

Or to be more accurate, it COULD if I had anything programmed to triger
them. What I do have is set of PERL programs that run on a different
computer and when I run them, ssh into the asterisk system to send SMSs.

The other way, the asterisk system receives the SMS and emails it to me.

Note that some routers have USB ports programmed to connect to the cellular
network with modem sticks. I also have one of those used for emergency
backup.

I assume you could run DD-WRT on them and a stripped down Asterisk system
which could send SMS's based upon pre-programmed conditions (but not
free will, as in "I'm lonely. Please log into me".

Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson,  N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379
Gung Hay Fat Choy! (May the new year be prosperous).
Click to expand...
Tommy Two Tone was the group, and that was the 80's song "8675309".
People all over the country had to get their numbers changed because
of that song.

Well I finally dug a path through the snow out to the interface and
plugged my laptop directly into into it using a 6 foot cable and guess
what? A 26.4K connection! So I called the phone company to complain,
and (it was Saturday) but the rep told me that she would run it by the
technician on Tuesday and get back to me, disturbingly adding that she
"wasn't sure if they could do anything about it". Then she further
disturbingly added the usual cover their asses statement that if it is
determined that there was no problem with the telephone company's
lines, "a service charge would apply".

Well this really pissed me off, and I told her that as far as I know
if I plugged into their interface and duplicated my problem then the
trouble is NOT premises related, it is THEIR's and therefore I cannot
be charged for a service call which they might make of their own
volition or of my request. Did I imagine that or is that a fact? I
added that if they sent a tech over I could easily demonstrate at the
interface that I can get a 45K connection on one line and only a 26.4K
connection on the other. I would take that service charge if I ever
got one to the PUC if I had to

What actually are my rights here? This is a business line. Is the
phone company "required" to provide me with a line that I can get full
dial up bandwidth on? Can I legally push this issue with them? Or can
they really turn around and say "sorry Charlie but we're providing you
with voice communications and we can't do anything about your dialup
speed issue. Lenny
 
On Feb 18, 12:26 pm, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Mon, 18 Feb 2013 08:58:25 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper

captainvideo462...@gmail.com> wrote:
Well I finally dug a path through the snow out to the interface and
plugged my laptop directly into into it using a 6 foot cable and guess
what? A 26.4K connection! So I called the phone company to complain,
and (it was Saturday) but the rep told me that she would run it by the
technician on Tuesday and get back to me, disturbingly adding that she
"wasn't sure if they could do anything about it". Then she further
disturbingly added the usual cover their asses statement that if it is
determined that there was no problem with the telephone company's
lines, "a service charge would apply".

They are required to inform you that charges may apply, even if they
are unlikely, just in case you want additional work done when they
arrive.  That's because someone sued and won claiming that Ma Bell
didn't warn them that they would be charged for on premesis work.
Strictly speaking, if the telephone tech even steps into your house,
you could get a bill.  I also know of one local tech that would claim
he did inside work, when the owner never let him in the house or was
away when the tech arrived.  The solution is simple... don't let the
tech in the house if you don't want to pay.

Well this really pissed me off, and I told her that as far as I know
if I plugged into their interface and duplicated my problem then the
trouble is NOT premises related, it is THEIR's and therefore I cannot
be charged for a service call which they might make of their own
volition or of my request. Did I imagine that or is that a fact? I
added that if they sent a tech over I could easily demonstrate at the
interface that I can get a 45K connection on one line and only a 26.4K
connection on the other. I would take that service charge if I ever
got one to the PUC if I had to

Nice try.  I don't know how it works in your area, but in the Peoples
Republic of California, the PUC (public utilities commish) has
separated the voice monopoly and data portions of the operation.  You
are guaranteed by the monopoly to have acceptable voice service.  You
are NOT guaranteed to be able to use the line for data at anything
faster than 2400 baud.  AT&T will make an effort to get it working to
V.32 (9600 baud), but no higher.  The reason is not crappy wiring.
It's the large number of SLC, pair gain, and remote terminal systems
that have saved AT&T considerable expense by not requiring a metallic
pair back to the CO (central office).  These are good for voice, but
will generally limit your modem connection to about 26Kbit/sec because
of the reduced bandwidth.  If you want faster dialup, you'll need a
metallic pair.  The only way I've found to guess if it's an SLC, Pair
Gain, or metallic pair is the frequency response test from the USR
modem that I previously mentioned.

What actually are my rights here?

It depends on your state public utilities commission rules.  What
state or country are you in?  The rules might be available online.

This is a business line. Is the
phone company "required" to provide me with a line that I can get full
dial up bandwidth on?

Not in California.  Business lines actually have less "rights" than
consumer lines, even though you pay more.

Can I legally push this issue with them?

Are you a lawyer?  Do you have a large bank account?  If not, I
suspect you may be tilting at windmills.

Or can
they really turn around and say "sorry Charlie but we're providing you
with voice communications and we  can't do anything about your dialup
speed issue.

Yes, they can probably do exactly that.  In California, if you
complain to AT&T about data speeds, they will instantly suggest you
buy their new and improved U-Verse data service (ADSL2+) and generally
ignore all modem complaints.  This has been an occasional problem with
older credit card machines, that use dialup lines and internal modems.
The result is that the business owner gets burned for a new terminal
that does credit card verifications over the internet instead of
dialup.

--
Jeff Liebermann     je...@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558
Click to expand...
We're in New Hampshire. I don't know what the PUC rules are here
either except that it seems like the utilities, telephone as well as
electric have always seemed to have the PUC in their pockets. I think
that I might have an idea as to how to approach this problem though.
Several months ago I complained to the phone company about a strange
random "Boing Boing" sound on my lines that would come and go during a
conversation with someone. The noise was unpredictable, would usually
last about a minute, was almost deafening at times and could only be
heard by me and never by the person on the other end of the line. They
never could verify my complaint, I'm certain that they never fixed it
and it hasn't happened for awhile now. Perhaps I should remind them of
this "continuing" problem that I've been living with that has
apparently affected my dialup speed as well. Lenny.
 
On Mon, 18 Feb 2013 10:35:08 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:

We're in New Hampshire. I don't know what the PUC rules are here
either except that it seems like the utilities, telephone as well as
electric have always seemed to have the PUC in their pockets.
Click to expand...
Same as in most states. The regulators are now regulated by those
that they were assigned to regulate. The world turned upside down.

Perhaps I should remind them of
this "continuing" problem that I've been living with that has
apparently affected my dialup speed as well.
Click to expand...
When that fails, start here:
<http://www.puc.nh.gov/Consumer/complaint.htm>
I don't see anything on the site for datacomm complaints. This should
be a clue that they don't want to hear those.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 19:09:20 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:22:31 -0800, josephkk
joseph_barrett@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:10:47 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:29:42 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@bigfoot.com
wrote:

What's the quiet line?

If you hear buzz, clicks, hummmmm, noise, crackly, etc on the phone,
the first step is to determine whether it's a problem at the CO
(central office), on the line, or somewhere in the inside wiring. To
eliminate the inside wiring, simply plug the tester into the NIU
(demarc), thus disconnecting the house wiring. To determine if it's
coming from the switch at the CO, dial a quiet line number. All it
does is terminate the call to a perfect dummy load, that does NOT go
through the switch. If the noise disappears, it's coming from
somewhere inside the CO. If it's still there, it's on the line
somewhere.

Does every phone company have this? Does
Verizon?

Yes, yes, and I don't know the Verizon number.

Please provide any number that you know. I am willing to bet that it is
industry standard.
?-)

How much would you like to bet? The ANAC, ANI, DAMT, quiet line,
milliwatt tone, etc test numbers vary between locations, CO's, type of
switch, and companies. Same with quiet line numbers, security, test
equipment, procedures, and standards. AT&T is fairly standardized
throughout the system. I don't have a clue what Verizon does as
everything I work with locally uses AT&T.

However, if you want numbers to abuse, this might help.
http://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=583069
It's 10 year old, but looks accurate.

Please send my winnings to the address below.
Click to expand...
Thanks. You warned me that they vary.

?-)
 
On Feb 19, 1:09 am, josephkk <joseph_barr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 19:09:20 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com
wrote:









On Sat, 16 Feb 2013 18:22:31 -0800, josephkk
joseph_barr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:10:47 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com
wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:29:42 -0500, micky <NONONOmis...@bigfoot.com
wrote:

What's the quiet line?

If you hear buzz, clicks, hummmmm, noise, crackly, etc on the phone,
the first step is to determine whether it's a problem at the CO
(central office), on the line, or somewhere in the inside wiring.  To
eliminate the inside wiring, simply plug the tester into the NIU
(demarc), thus disconnecting the house wiring.  To determine if it's
coming from the switch at the CO, dial a quiet line number.  All it
does is terminate the call to a perfect dummy load, that does NOT go
through the switch.  If the noise disappears, it's coming from
somewhere inside the CO.  If it's still there, it's on the line
somewhere.

Does every phone company have this?  Does
Verizon?

Yes, yes, and I don't know the Verizon number.

Please provide any number that you know.  I am willing to bet that it is
industry standard.
?-)

How much would you like to bet?  The ANAC, ANI, DAMT, quiet line,
milliwatt tone, etc test numbers vary between locations, CO's, type of
switch, and companies.  Same with quiet line numbers, security, test
equipment, procedures, and standards.  AT&T is fairly standardized
throughout the system.  I don't have a clue what Verizon does as
everything I work with locally uses AT&T.

However, if you want numbers to abuse, this might help.
http://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=583069
It's 10 year old, but looks accurate.

Please send my winnings to the address below.

Thanks.  You warned me that they vary.

?-)
Click to expand...
The lady from telephone repair called me back this morning and told me
they will be coming out to my house tomorrow to do "some rewiring". I
asked if they'll need to get into my house to do this, (just to be
sure I knew what she was talking about) and she said no. I then asked
the 64,000 dollar question. "Will there be a charge for this"? And
again it was no. "They will be working on the wires on the road" I was
told. I'm assuming this means a different, (and hopefully better cable
pair). Interestingly she asked if I would be home. She said that
although I didn't have to be, there would be no way that the
technician would be able to tell if my dialup was improved unless we
plugged my laptop into the interface while he was there. I was
surprised that they would have no way to assess dialup capabilities of
a pots line. They must have to do this for DSL don't they? So why
couldn't they assess dialup? Lenny
 
klem kedidelhopper wrote:
The lady from telephone repair called me back this morning and told me
they will be coming out to my house tomorrow to do "some rewiring". I
asked if they'll need to get into my house to do this, (just to be
sure I knew what she was talking about) and she said no. I then asked
the 64,000 dollar question. "Will there be a charge for this"? And
again it was no. "They will be working on the wires on the road" I was
told. I'm assuming this means a different, (and hopefully better cable
pair). Interestingly she asked if I would be home. She said that
although I didn't have to be, there would be no way that the
technician would be able to tell if my dialup was improved unless we
plugged my laptop into the interface while he was there. I was
surprised that they would have no way to assess dialup capabilities of
a pots line. They must have to do this for DSL don't they? So why
couldn't they assess dialup? Lenny
Click to expand...

They use test equipmet made to test phone lines. Usually a TDR, and
maybe a BER testset.
 
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 15:30:59 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:

I was
surprised that they would have no way to assess dialup capabilities of
a pots line. They must have to do this for DSL don't they? So why
couldn't they assess dialup? Lenny
Click to expand...
Locally, the DSL and POTS installers carry an Acterna/JDSU HST-3000
telecom tester. I used to have one (until it was stolen) so I'm
rather familiar with what it can do. Ethernet testing is built into
the base unit. There are plugins for various line types, including
POTS, ADSL, ADSL2+, T1, VoIP, fiber, and V.34 (33.6K) modems. However,
I don't think they have a V.42bis plugin (not sure). Whether the
installer actually knows how to use the tester is another horror
story. I've seen both extremes.
<http://www.jdsu.com/en-us/Test-and-Measurement/Products/a-z-product-list/Pages/hst-3000.aspx?rcode=hst>

Some of the DSL data of my friends and customers from this tester:
<http://dsl.11junk.com>

Sniff.... I miss my tester.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
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