Cut slot in metal enclosure door for ribbon keypad ?

[mpm]

On Friday, October 18, 2019 at 9:02:54 AM UTC-4, DecadentLinux...@decadence..org wrote:

mpm > If it is a small enclosure you may not even be able to get the die
in there.

Thanks. I wondered about that (whether the enclosure door could be situated properly in a press).
Clearly, I know just enough about mechanical to be dangerous.

The shop guys found a knock-out punch on McMaster-Carr that might work, similar to the D-sub hold punch that Martin mentioned earlier. This one cuts just a thin slot with no D-shape to it. (Thin being defined here as 13mm x 41mm, IIRC?) Bigger than required, but I guess you need that minimum width to accommodate a suitably strong pull bolt.

Several of the reviews for this particular knockout punch, when used on 14-ga steel, said it broke on the first use.

So, I'm concerned about it - but then I have also learned to discount what some reviewers say because maybe they don't know what they're doing. Plus, our application is for 16-ga, not 14. Another concern I have is that the knockout punch might chip the powdercoat on the inside door finish? (which, we could live with, after touch-up). I'll report back on the results.

I'm not sure the approach is viable long term. First, it's labor (though maybe the minimum by-hand?). Second, if the knockout punch approach can only do say.. 10 cabinets before it dulls, or breaks, that's not cost-effective.

And third, the Hammond Mnfg. EJ1084 cabinet says it's 16-ga steel (and I'm sure it is...), but it sure feels heftier than that when you get it in your hands and compare it to a known sample of 16-ga steel.

 

On Saturday, 19 October 2019 15:36:31 UTC+1, mpm wrote:

On Friday, October 18, 2019 at 9:02:54 AM UTC-4, DecadentLinux...@decadence.org wrote:
mpm > If it is a small enclosure you may not even be able to get the die
in there.

Thanks. I wondered about that (whether the enclosure door could be situated properly in a press).
Clearly, I know just enough about mechanical to be dangerous.

The shop guys found a knock-out punch on McMaster-Carr that might work, similar to the D-sub hold punch that Martin mentioned earlier. This one cuts just a thin slot with no D-shape to it. (Thin being defined here as 13mm x 41mm, IIRC?) Bigger than required, but I guess you need that minimum width to accommodate a suitably strong pull bolt.

Several of the reviews for this particular knockout punch, when used on 14-ga steel, said it broke on the first use.

So, I'm concerned about it - but then I have also learned to discount what some reviewers say because maybe they don't know what they're doing. Plus, our application is for 16-ga, not 14. Another concern I have is that the knockout punch might chip the powdercoat on the inside door finish? (which, we could live with, after touch-up). I'll report back on the results.

I'm not sure the approach is viable long term. First, it's labor (though maybe the minimum by-hand?). Second, if the knockout punch approach can only do say.. 10 cabinets before it dulls, or breaks, that's not cost-effective.

And third, the Hammond Mnfg. EJ1084 cabinet says it's 16-ga steel (and I'm sure it is...), but it sure feels heftier than that when you get it in your hands and compare it to a known sample of 16-ga steel.

What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the coating or have other significant issues.


NT

 

[mpm]

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4, tabb...@gmail.com wrote:
> What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't work as well as you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a much neater hole..

 

tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote in
news:af4ea44a-ba55-4ae8-9f31-ed1c7115cc55@googlegroups.com:

What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff
saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube.
Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.

The dremel tool with 1.5 inch cut off wheel is the best, least
damaging option. Done right the chipping (if any) would be less than a
mm. It is abrasive as opposed to a cutting tool, and it plunge cuts
almost to the exact length he needs for a 12 conductor flat cable.

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

lørdag den 19. oktober 2019 kl. 18.03.00 UTC+2 skrev tabb...@gmail.com:

On Saturday, 19 October 2019 15:36:31 UTC+1, mpm wrote:
On Friday, October 18, 2019 at 9:02:54 AM UTC-4, DecadentLinux...@decadence.org wrote:
mpm > If it is a small enclosure you may not even be able to get the die
in there.

Thanks. I wondered about that (whether the enclosure door could be situated properly in a press).
Clearly, I know just enough about mechanical to be dangerous.

The shop guys found a knock-out punch on McMaster-Carr that might work, similar to the D-sub hold punch that Martin mentioned earlier. This one cuts just a thin slot with no D-shape to it. (Thin being defined here as 13mm x 41mm, IIRC?) Bigger than required, but I guess you need that minimum width to accommodate a suitably strong pull bolt.

Several of the reviews for this particular knockout punch, when used on 14-ga steel, said it broke on the first use.

So, I'm concerned about it - but then I have also learned to discount what some reviewers say because maybe they don't know what they're doing. Plus, our application is for 16-ga, not 14. Another concern I have is that the knockout punch might chip the powdercoat on the inside door finish? (which, we could live with, after touch-up). I'll report back on the results..

I'm not sure the approach is viable long term. First, it's labor (though maybe the minimum by-hand?). Second, if the knockout punch approach can only do say.. 10 cabinets before it dulls, or breaks, that's not cost-effective.

And third, the Hammond Mnfg. EJ1084 cabinet says it's 16-ga steel (and I'm sure it is...), but it sure feels heftier than that when you get it in your hands and compare it to a known sample of 16-ga steel.

What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the coating or have other significant issues.

a common sized circular saw blade is a mighty big tool for a 19mm? slot

 

[Rick C]

On Thursday, October 17, 2019 at 8:44:08 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

We need to cut an acceptable-looking slot in the front door of a metal NEMA-4 enclosure, through which, we will route a 12-conductor ribbon cable (membrane keypad).

The enclosure is 16-gauge steel. (Mild steel, I think?, but the data sheet just says steel). It's a Hammond Manufacturing EJ1084 standard cabinet.. with some effort, I believe the door can be removed? TBD.

Anybody got any ideas?
It's already powder-coated from the manufacturer, and I'd rather not damage the finish if it can be helped. The keypad will cover any cosmetic damage on the front, so the concern would be the inside of the door. (And not against repairing the inside finish, so long as it would look OK.)

I'm thinking of using a 10-ton hydraulic press with a rectangular punch and die, and cut the whole thing at once. (Slot perimeter = about 92mm).

I realize SED isn't a metal working forum, but you folks are into all manner of ideas (some wackier than others). So, my advance apologies for posting here, but I'm hoping to get some good advice I can pass along to the folks who will have to do this. We're looking at roughly 50-75 cabinets initially.

If follow-on orders flow in, we'll have Hammond, or whomever, punch them before powder-coating. We just don't have the option to do that this time around.

Thanks!

Why not make a larger, round hole and use a custom piece to fit your cable? I guess that is a bit of work, but you are only doing this for a few units, no?

I think I would just have Hammond do the mods. Talk to them and let them produce the drawings from your needs. They can better figure out how to do it most cost effectively with a good result. You are going to need to do this sooner or later.

--

Rick C.

- Get 2,000 miles of free Supercharging
- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

On Saturday, 19 October 2019 18:11:59 UTC+1, mpm wrote:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4, tabby wrote:

What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't work as well as you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a much neater hole.

It works the same as I expect. I know that because I've used the method. Neater hole is what you want. FWIW you can improve the hole by flipping the sheet over & finishing the cut off from the other side. Whether that gives you enough neatness I couldn't say, it's certainly not perfect.

For a perfect edge you could try water jet cutting - I would be unsurprised if it attacked the powder coat though. There is no ideal option.


NT

 

On Saturday, 19 October 2019 18:06:20 UTC+1, DecadentLinux...@decadence.org wrote:

tabby wrote in
news:af4ea44a-ba55-4ae8-9f31-ed1c7115cc55@googlegroups.com:

What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff
saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube.
Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.



The dremel tool with 1.5 inch cut off wheel is the best, least
damaging option. Done right the chipping (if any) would be less than a
mm. It is abrasive as opposed to a cutting tool, and it plunge cuts
almost to the exact length he needs for a 12 conductor flat cable.

My experience with those has not been too good for that sort of task. Perhaps you've found a way to make them work well. I would never suggest that for production.


NT

 

[Michael Terrell]

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4, tabb...@gmail.com wrote:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff saw or compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't work as well as you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a much neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond, Metal cutting blade for under $20

<https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-saw-blades?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7CMetal&filters=attrs>

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworking

 

Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:6b13c13f-e08a-424b-973c-3e2b70c255a7@googlegroups.com:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:
On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4,
tabb...@gmail.com wro
te:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff
saw or
compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other
options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't work
as well a
s you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a much
neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond, Metal
cutting blade for under $20

https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-saw-bla
des?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7CMetal&
filters=attrs

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking
newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworking

Dremel toothed cutting wheels are NOT made for anything harder than
brass or copper. The diamond thing works but is expensive.

The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels are ideal for
this as they only 'cut' where the user abrades the surface with the
edge of the wheel and the faces do a bit of it as well. In a plunge
cut scenario, they continue to 'cut' on the edge of the wheel, AND
abrade the side walls as well, thereby curtailing any binding. With
proper starter holes at either end, it even makes for perpendicular
ends on the slot.

They are also cheaper. And the final point is that a 12 conductor
ribbon is not anywhere close to 4.5" in length so cutting a slot with
such a large diameter tool, is simply the wrong choice from the get-
go.

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 15.55.24 UTC+2 skrev DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:

Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:6b13c13f-e08a-424b-973c-3e2b70c255a7@googlegroups.com:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:
On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4,
tabb...@gmail.com wro
te:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg cutoff
saw or
compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other
options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't work
as well a
s you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a much
neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond, Metal
cutting blade for under $20

https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-saw-bla
des?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7CMetal&
filters=attrs

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking
newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworking


Dremel toothed cutting wheels are NOT made for anything harder than
brass or copper. The diamond thing works but is expensive.

The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels are ideal for
this as they only 'cut' where the user abrades the surface with the
edge of the wheel and the faces do a bit of it as well. In a plunge
cut scenario, they continue to 'cut' on the edge of the wheel, AND
abrade the side walls as well, thereby curtailing any binding. With
proper starter holes at either end, it even makes for perpendicular
ends on the slot.

you cannot use diamond to cut ferrous metal, they react and burn up the diamond

They are also cheaper. And the final point is that a 12 conductor
ribbon is not anywhere close to 4.5" in length so cutting a slot with
such a large diameter tool, is simply the wrong choice from the get-
go.

agree, and if you managed to cut the tiny slot the edges would be very sharp since the disc would barely go through the sheet

 

Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote in
news:6a8c8da1-792e-4954-af0c-5950c11f4663@googlegroups.com:

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 15.55.24 UTC+2 skrev
DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:
Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:6b13c13f-e08a-424b-973c-3e2b70c255a7@googlegroups.com:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:
On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4,
tabb...@gmail.com wro
te:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg
cutoff saw or
compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other
options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't
work as well a
s you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a
much neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond, Metal
cutting blade for under $20

https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-saw-
bla
des?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7CMet
al& filters=attrs

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking
newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworking


Dremel toothed cutting wheels are NOT made for anything harder
than
brass or copper. The diamond thing works but is expensive.

The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels are ideal
for
this as they only 'cut' where the user abrades the surface with
the edge of the wheel and the faces do a bit of it as well. In a
plunge cut scenario, they continue to 'cut' on the edge of the
wheel, AND abrade the side walls as well, thereby curtailing any
binding. With proper starter holes at either end, it even makes
for perpendicular ends on the slot.

you cannot use diamond to cut ferrous metal, they react and burn
up the diamond

I did not suggest diamond, ya ditz. Respond to the post of the
person that did.

They are also cheaper. And the final point is that a 12
conductor
ribbon is not anywhere close to 4.5" in length so cutting a slot
with such a large diameter tool, is simply the wrong choice from
the get- go.

agree, and if you managed to cut the tiny slot the edges would be
very sharp since the disc would barely go through the sheet

Dressing any sharp edges after the slot is made would be easy.

I have done this stuff before, and I know how to pass a 'plastic'
insulated conductor or conductor array through a sheet metal slot
without cutting into it. Chamfers and rounds and fillets have been
in my mind for decades. Even tiny ones.

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 18.40.27 UTC+2 skrev DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:

Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote in
news:6a8c8da1-792e-4954-af0c-5950c11f4663@googlegroups.com:

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 15.55.24 UTC+2 skrev
DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:
Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:6b13c13f-e08a-424b-973c-3e2b70c255a7@googlegroups.com:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:
On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4,
tabb...@gmail.com wro
te:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg
cutoff saw or
compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube. Other
options have their upsides, but this one is as difficult as
falling off a log. All methods are either going to chip the
coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't
work as well a
s you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a
much neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond, Metal
cutting blade for under $20

https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-saw-
bla
des?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7CMet
al& filters=attrs

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking
newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworking


Dremel toothed cutting wheels are NOT made for anything harder
than
brass or copper. The diamond thing works but is expensive.

The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels are ideal
for
this as they only 'cut' where the user abrades the surface with
the edge of the wheel and the faces do a bit of it as well. In a
plunge cut scenario, they continue to 'cut' on the edge of the
wheel, AND abrade the side walls as well, thereby curtailing any
binding. With proper starter holes at either end, it even makes
for perpendicular ends on the slot.

you cannot use diamond to cut ferrous metal, they react and burn
up the diamond


I did not suggest diamond, ya ditz. Respond to the post of the
person that did.

"The diamond thing works but is expensive."
"The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels"

 

Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote in
news:9f16becb-a3c2-4abc-99a6-cce3aeb8d9e9@googlegroups.com:

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 18.40.27 UTC+2 skrev
DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:
Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote in
news:6a8c8da1-792e-4954-af0c-5950c11f4663@googlegroups.com:

mandag den 21. oktober 2019 kl. 15.55.24 UTC+2 skrev
DecadentLinux...@decadence.org:
Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:6b13c13f-e08a-424b-973c-3e2b70c255a7@googlegroups.com:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm
wrote:
On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 12:03:00 PM UTC-4,
tabb...@gmail.com wro
te:
What's the big problem with using a mounted circ saw, eg
cutoff saw or
compound mitre saw? If it's heat, go slower & use lube.
Other options have their upsides, but this one is as
difficult as falling off a log. All methods are either going
to chip the coating or have other significant issues.

We did the first 10 cabinets this way (chop saw).
The first was horrible, as the blade was dull.
New blade, next (9) results were OK, but it really doesn't
work as well a
s you might expect. The other methods mentioned will make a
much neater hole.

What kind of blade are you using? this is a 4.5" Diamond,
Metal cutting blade for under $20

https://www.grainger.com/category/tools/saw-blades/diamond-s
aw- bla
des?attrs=Blade+Dia.%7C4-1%2F2%22~~Primary+Saw+Application%7C
Met al& filters=attrs

Have you asked for help on the news:rec.crafts.metalworking
newsgroup?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.crafts.metalworki
ng


Dremel toothed cutting wheels are NOT made for anything
harder than
brass or copper. The diamond thing works but is expensive.

The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels are
ideal for
this as they only 'cut' where the user abrades the surface
with the edge of the wheel and the faces do a bit of it as
well. In a plunge cut scenario, they continue to 'cut' on the
edge of the wheel, AND abrade the side walls as well, thereby
curtailing any binding. With proper starter holes at either
end, it even makes for perpendicular ends on the slot.

you cannot use diamond to cut ferrous metal, they react and
burn up the diamond


I did not suggest diamond, ya ditz. Respond to the post of the
person that did.


"The diamond thing works but is expensive."

The diamond thing *HE* suggested.

Damn, you are thick.

> "The tiny 'concrete saw' type abrasive cut-off wheels"

Which is NOT the diamond wheel.

 

> you cannot use diamond to cut ferrous metal, they react and burn up the diamond

you can, but not a good choice.

 

[mpm]

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

I wanted to follow-up with the results using the "CP-6" punch from Omega:
In a word... "barely".
In two words... "not recommended"

Link: https://assets.omega.com/pdf/hardware/tools/punches-and-hole-saws/CP_DPP_RHS_RHP_RS.pdf

We cut (5) cabinets before the threads on the pull bolt got so worn, we worried about bricking the tool.

So, we added (3) dock washers to the bolt end so that we're turning on different threads. That bought us another (5) cabinets cut. And again, we risk bricking the tool.

Five cabinet cuts is about all you can do without implementing workarounds. And at 10 cabinets, you need a new pull bolt. The die itself seems to be OK, and not showing obvious signs of wear. However, you have to make absolutely certain things are perfectly lined-up. Any "slop" and you risk breaking the die by having it try to cut itself in the corners.

I don't know if spare bolts are available. (?)
The pull bolt is special-keyed with a slot and pin, so an ordinary bolt won't substitute.

Also, it takes incredible force to make the cut. You must bolt down the work piece, and use at least an 18"-long (24" better) breaker bar to turn the bolt once it bites, even when it's lubed like crazy. In short, I don't believe this punch is truly rated for 16-ga steel. It may cut it a few times, but tool life is extremely short.

I will say: The rectangular hole left by this punch (even as difficult as it is to accomplish), is at least acceptable. The cabinet door did not deform, as I half-expected it to do. The end result is reasonably flat surface, with a nice rectangular hole in it.

The only good news is that the immediate job is done.
Any future orders and I'll have the cabinet vendor prep the boxes with the hole already cut before powder-coating, and we won't have to mess with it at all.

In retrospect: I am wondering if we should have taken the time in design to cut down on the width of the ribbon cable? For example, if we had multiplexed the LED's and switches on the keypad, we could have reduced the number of conductors needed, and thus the overall width of the ribbon cable. Maybe 20%-25%? Doesn't seem like much until you have to get the breaker bar!

Anyway - if someone from the future stumbles upon this post, in similar need, you have your answers.

 

[whit3rd]

On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 1:14:06 PM UTC-7, mpm wrote:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

I wanted to follow-up with the results using the "CP-6" punch from Omega:
In a word... "barely".
We cut (5) cabinets before the threads on the pull bolt got so worn, we worried about bricking the tool.

Friction on the threads is the problem. It's possible to adapt it to a hydraulic puller
(threads don't turn during the pull, only to attach the pullhead).

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

lørdag den 26. oktober 2019 kl. 22.14.06 UTC+2 skrev mpm:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

I wanted to follow-up with the results using the "CP-6" punch from Omega:
In a word... "barely".
In two words... "not recommended"

Link: https://assets.omega.com/pdf/hardware/tools/punches-and-hole-saws/CP_DPP_RHS_RHP_RS.pdf

We cut (5) cabinets before the threads on the pull bolt got so worn, we worried about bricking the tool.

So, we added (3) dock washers to the bolt end so that we're turning on different threads. That bought us another (5) cabinets cut. And again, we risk bricking the tool.

Five cabinet cuts is about all you can do without implementing workarounds. And at 10 cabinets, you need a new pull bolt. The die itself seems to be OK, and not showing obvious signs of wear. However, you have to make absolutely certain things are perfectly lined-up. Any "slop" and you risk breaking the die by having it try to cut itself in the corners.

I don't know if spare bolts are available. (?)
The pull bolt is special-keyed with a slot and pin, so an ordinary bolt won't substitute.

use the bolt for alignment only and use a press for the heavy work?

 

[mpm]

On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:36:19 PM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:

Friction on the threads is the problem. It's possible to adapt it to a hydraulic puller
(threads don't turn during the pull, only to attach the pullhead).

Agreed, friction is the problem (even when generously lubed).
This punch & die doesn't come with a bearing (which I thought was a little weird that it didn't?)

I also thought about converting it to hydraulic, but the keyed bolt is also what aligns the bottom half of the die. But that said, as long as you can align the two halves, hydraulic should work.

 

[Michael Terrell]

On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 4:14:06 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 1:11:59 PM UTC-4, mpm wrote:

I wanted to follow-up with the results using the "CP-6" punch from Omega:
In a word... "barely".
In two words... "not recommended"

Link: https://assets.omega.com/pdf/hardware/tools/punches-and-hole-saws/CP_DPP_RHS_RHP_RS.pdf

We cut (5) cabinets before the threads on the pull bolt got so worn, we worried about bricking the tool.

So, we added (3) dock washers to the bolt end so that we're turning on different threads. That bought us another (5) cabinets cut. And again, we risk bricking the tool.

Five cabinet cuts is about all you can do without implementing workarounds. And at 10 cabinets, you need a new pull bolt. The die itself seems to be OK, and not showing obvious signs of wear. However, you have to make absolutely certain things are perfectly lined-up. Any "slop" and you risk breaking the die by having it try to cut itself in the corners.

I don't know if spare bolts are available. (?)
The pull bolt is special-keyed with a slot and pin, so an ordinary bolt won't substitute.

Also, it takes incredible force to make the cut. You must bolt down the work piece, and use at least an 18"-long (24" better) breaker bar to turn the bolt once it bites, even when it's lubed like crazy. In short, I don't believe this punch is truly rated for 16-ga steel. It may cut it a few times, but tool life is extremely short.

I will say: The rectangular hole left by this punch (even as difficult as it is to accomplish), is at least acceptable. The cabinet door did not deform, as I half-expected it to do. The end result is reasonably flat surface, with a nice rectangular hole in it.

The only good news is that the immediate job is done.
Any future orders and I'll have the cabinet vendor prep the boxes with the hole already cut before powder-coating, and we won't have to mess with it at all.

In retrospect: I am wondering if we should have taken the time in design to cut down on the width of the ribbon cable? For example, if we had multiplexed the LED's and switches on the keypad, we could have reduced the number of conductors needed, and thus the overall width of the ribbon cable. Maybe 20%-25%? Doesn't seem like much until you have to get the breaker bar!

Anyway - if someone from the future stumbles upon this post, in similar need, you have your answers.

Did you use cutting oil with the punch, and oil the threads to reduce the drive friction??