cool power supply

Sergey Kubushyn · Oct 8, 2019

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:

On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************

Oct 8, 2019

On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:49:54 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
<ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

The TDK thing is PFC, but it's not big enough for the required energy
storage. That also has to be added externally: 2x 470 uF 450 volts on
the eval board.

It's roughly half a power supply, or maybe less, for 3x the price of
the complete MeanWell. I don't see the point.

For a pretty big AC-DC power supply, looks like mosfets are about as
good as GaN. GaN looks nice for really tiny medium-power automotive or
cell phone DC-DC regs or something, but AC/PFC still needs a bunch of
energy storage, namely big caps and big inductors in the front end.

--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

lunatic fringe electronics

Sergey Kubushyn · Oct 8, 2019

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:49:54 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

The TDK thing is PFC, but it's not big enough for the required energy
storage. That also has to be added externally: 2x 470 uF 450 volts on
the eval board.

Maybe, I didn't check thoroughly, just noticed those 2 caps on Vbus that are
definitely input bulk capacitors, be it straight bulk or PFC storage...

It's roughly half a power supply, or maybe less, for 3x the price of
the complete MeanWell. I don't see the point.

Yup. That MeanWell looks very nice indeed, just ordered one 24V for testing.
They are $91.26 or so everywhere. Thank you pointing to this one, looks like
a little jewel...

For a pretty big AC-DC power supply, looks like mosfets are about as
good as GaN. GaN looks nice for really tiny medium-power automotive or
cell phone DC-DC regs or something, but AC/PFC still needs a bunch of
energy storage, namely big caps and big inductors in the front end.

Yup.

---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************

Oct 8, 2019

On Tue, 8 Oct 2019 04:05:53 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
<ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:49:54 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

The TDK thing is PFC, but it's not big enough for the required energy
storage. That also has to be added externally: 2x 470 uF 450 volts on
the eval board.

Maybe, I didn't check thoroughly, just noticed those 2 caps on Vbus that are
definitely input bulk capacitors, be it straight bulk or PFC storage...

It's roughly half a power supply, or maybe less, for 3x the price of
the complete MeanWell. I don't see the point.

Yup. That MeanWell looks very nice indeed, just ordered one 24V for testing.
They are $91.26 or so everywhere. Thank you pointing to this one, looks like
a little jewel...

I'm going to, maybe today, connect one to my Kikusui load box and see
how hot it gets at full load.

Las Vegas? If I ever decide to bail on California, I'd move to Nevada.
Probably east shore of Tahoe, which is very nice. Funny when you drive
from Calif to Nevada: the taxes drop a lot, and so do the potholes.

For a pretty big AC-DC power supply, looks like mosfets are about as
good as GaN. GaN looks nice for really tiny medium-power automotive or
cell phone DC-DC regs or something, but AC/PFC still needs a bunch of
energy storage, namely big caps and big inductors in the front end.

Yup.

---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************

--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

lunatic fringe electronics

Sergey Kubushyn · Oct 8, 2019

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Tue, 8 Oct 2019 04:05:53 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:49:54 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

The TDK thing is PFC, but it's not big enough for the required energy
storage. That also has to be added externally: 2x 470 uF 450 volts on
the eval board.

Maybe, I didn't check thoroughly, just noticed those 2 caps on Vbus that are
definitely input bulk capacitors, be it straight bulk or PFC storage...

It's roughly half a power supply, or maybe less, for 3x the price of
the complete MeanWell. I don't see the point.

Yup. That MeanWell looks very nice indeed, just ordered one 24V for testing.
They are $91.26 or so everywhere. Thank you pointing to this one, looks like
a little jewel...

I'm going to, maybe today, connect one to my Kikusui load box and see
how hot it gets at full load.

It would've been interesting, please let us know what you found. I would've
done it myself but my load only goes up to 450W and I don't have that supply
on hand yet, it is enroute to me...

Las Vegas? If I ever decide to bail on California, I'd move to Nevada.
Probably east shore of Tahoe, which is very nice. Funny when you drive
from Calif to Nevada: the taxes drop a lot, and so do the potholes.

Yep, that's a nice place. And way less socialism than in, sorry for an
obscene word, California

---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************

John Larkin · Oct 8, 2019

On Tue, 8 Oct 2019 17:25:48 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
<ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Tue, 8 Oct 2019 04:05:53 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:49:54 -0000 (UTC), Sergey Kubushyn
ksi@koi8.net> wrote:

whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:40:27 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

So, 500W in 231 x 81 x 31mm,
and a TDK model (PFH500H is 500W in
101.6 x 61 x 13.3mm

which I make to be an impressive volume ratio of 1: 0.14
meaning the Meanwell comes in at seven times bigger.

Right, but it makes no sense comparing apples and oranges...

MeanWell is a _COMPLETE_ power supply. PFH500F (can't find 500H anywhere) is
just a _MODULE_ that requires external EMI Filter, output capacitors, Y2
capacitors to earth ground on output, inrush control element, and input
capacitors.

TDK merchants aren't bragging about price, though. Digikey wants
nearly three times the MeanWell price.

Multiply it by two for a complete power supply made from that TDK module.
Fitting everything into volume smaller that that MeanWell is left as
exercize for a reader. And I won't even start on making it convection
cooled or adding PFC somehow...

The TDK thing is PFC, but it's not big enough for the required energy
storage. That also has to be added externally: 2x 470 uF 450 volts on
the eval board.

Maybe, I didn't check thoroughly, just noticed those 2 caps on Vbus that are
definitely input bulk capacitors, be it straight bulk or PFC storage...

It's roughly half a power supply, or maybe less, for 3x the price of
the complete MeanWell. I don't see the point.

Yup. That MeanWell looks very nice indeed, just ordered one 24V for testing.
They are $91.26 or so everywhere. Thank you pointing to this one, looks like
a little jewel...

I'm going to, maybe today, connect one to my Kikusui load box and see
how hot it gets at full load.

It would've been interesting, please let us know what you found. I would've
done it myself but my load only goes up to 450W and I don't have that supply
on hand yet, it is enroute to me...

Las Vegas? If I ever decide to bail on California, I'd move to Nevada.
Probably east shore of Tahoe, which is very nice. Funny when you drive
from Calif to Nevada: the taxes drop a lot, and so do the potholes.

Yep, that's a nice place. And way less socialism than in, sorry for an
obscene word, California

One reason I stay near the west coast is allergies. The wind is
usually from the west and the closest source of pollen is Hawaii.

John Larkin · Oct 11, 2019

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is impressive. It's running with no cooling at all; the fans are
blowing on the resistors but not the supply.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ol0a4nsztjdcayp/MW_UHP-500_bench.JPG?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/susfjgdhfk8bgwa/MW_UHP-500_data.JPG?raw=1

Bolted to the side of my rack, it would have maybe 1/2 the theta.

Loading doesn't seem to change the output voltage at all.

legg · Oct 12, 2019

On Fri, 11 Oct 2019 12:59:10 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is impressive. It's running with no cooling at all; the fans are
blowing on the resistors but not the supply.

Moving air is moving air. Removing that influence from bench
measurements is not simple - but you can easily see why shoving a fan
in somewhere is awfully tempting.

You should also observe end-use physical orientation of the chassis,
if you're looking at a specific application - this can double/halve
free air results.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ol0a4nsztjdcayp/MW_UHP-500_bench.JPG?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/susfjgdhfk8bgwa/MW_UHP-500_data.JPG?raw=1

Bolted to the side of my rack, it would have maybe 1/2 the theta.

Loading doesn't seem to change the output voltage at all.

Thermocouples should be on isolation magnetics, which have the lowest
spot temperature limit, in most evaluation situations.

John Larkin · Oct 15, 2019

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is really tiny:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/murata-power-solutions-inc/PQU650-48/811-PQU650-48-ND/10493741

the only downside is the price, and that you can't get any.

legg · Oct 16, 2019

On Mon, 14 Oct 2019 16:30:14 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is really tiny:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/murata-power-solutions-inc/PQU650-48/811-PQU650-48-ND/10493741

the only downside is the price, and that you can't get any.

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/281/pqu650-1658794.pdf

George Herold · Oct 16, 2019

On Friday, October 11, 2019 at 3:59:20 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is impressive. It's running with no cooling at all; the fans are
blowing on the resistors but not the supply.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ol0a4nsztjdcayp/MW_UHP-500_bench.JPG?raw=1
Wow, that supply is a lot smaller than I thought!

George H.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/susfjgdhfk8bgwa/MW_UHP-500_data.JPG?raw=1

Bolted to the side of my rack, it would have maybe 1/2 the theta.

Loading doesn't seem to change the output voltage at all.

John Larkin · Oct 16, 2019

On Wed, 16 Oct 2019 12:41:47 -0400, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:

On Mon, 14 Oct 2019 16:30:14 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

On Fri, 04 Oct 2019 10:40:17 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/29nrzcned50nde5/AADt7PbPBUWt2nYM8hzqe95za?dl=0

$94 from Amazon, free shipping.

This is really tiny:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/murata-power-solutions-inc/PQU650-48/811-PQU650-48-ND/10493741

the only downside is the price, and that you can't get any.

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/281/pqu650-1658794.pdf

10 on order, no stock.

I'll stick with Mean Well.

cool power supply

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