Chip with simple program for Toy

Terry Pinnell · Feb 28, 2005

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:02:19 +0000, Terry Pinnell
terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

Pull-up and symmetry fix here:

news:deq121t2u5b754tctmk3f8ov8dm4n4vh4g@4ax.com

John: You used to give a Subject when referencing posts to
alt.binaries.schematics.electronic. I've recently split my news
reading so that all binary groups are in another 'instance' of my
newsreader. (Agent is still incapable of handling multiple servers,
although still my preferred email/news reader). So I can no longer
simply d-click a news: reference to get to your post. It's no big deal
(I can find it pretty quickly), but I'd appreciate your returning to
including the Subject and maybe date please.

---
Sure, no problem.

Thanks.

I don't understand why you can't just click on the URL, though, I'm
also using Agent and it works for me. Version 2.0, though. Maybe
that's it?

It's because alt.binaries.schematics.electronic is not in my list of
newsgroups in *this* instance of Agent. The free server I use for this
instance is News.Individual.Net, which is excellent but doesn't carry
binary groups. When I want to work with binaries (schematics, music,
pictures), I load up another instance of Agent, which uses the Forte
APN server, that does cover all the binaries.

Last time I checked, Agent 2.0 still did not support multiple servers.
Has that changed?

--
Terry Pinnell
Hobbyist, West Sussex, UK

Jim Thompson · Feb 28, 2005

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:31:24 +0000, Terry Pinnell
<terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:02:19 +0000, Terry Pinnell
terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

Pull-up and symmetry fix here:

news:deq121t2u5b754tctmk3f8ov8dm4n4vh4g@4ax.com

John: You used to give a Subject when referencing posts to
alt.binaries.schematics.electronic. I've recently split my news
reading so that all binary groups are in another 'instance' of my
newsreader. (Agent is still incapable of handling multiple servers,
although still my preferred email/news reader).

Agent v3 is supposed to handle multiple servers.

So I can no longer
simply d-click a news: reference to get to your post. It's no big deal
(I can find it pretty quickly), but I'd appreciate your returning to
including the Subject and maybe date please.

---
Sure, no problem.

Thanks.

I don't understand why you can't just click on the URL, though, I'm
also using Agent and it works for me. Version 2.0, though. Maybe
that's it?

It's because alt.binaries.schematics.electronic is not in my list of
newsgroups in *this* instance of Agent. The free server I use for this
instance is News.Individual.Net, which is excellent but doesn't carry
binary groups. When I want to work with binaries (schematics, music,
pictures), I load up another instance of Agent, which uses the Forte
APN server, that does cover all the binaries.

Last time I checked, Agent 2.0 still did not support multiple servers.
Has that changed?

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

John Fields · Feb 28, 2005

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:31:24 +0000, Terry Pinnell
<terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:02:19 +0000, Terry Pinnell
terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

Pull-up and symmetry fix here:

news:deq121t2u5b754tctmk3f8ov8dm4n4vh4g@4ax.com

John: You used to give a Subject when referencing posts to
alt.binaries.schematics.electronic. I've recently split my news
reading so that all binary groups are in another 'instance' of my
newsreader. (Agent is still incapable of handling multiple servers,
although still my preferred email/news reader). So I can no longer
simply d-click a news: reference to get to your post. It's no big deal
(I can find it pretty quickly), but I'd appreciate your returning to
including the Subject and maybe date please.

---
Sure, no problem.

Thanks.

I don't understand why you can't just click on the URL, though, I'm
also using Agent and it works for me. Version 2.0, though. Maybe
that's it?

It's because alt.binaries.schematics.electronic is not in my list of
newsgroups in *this* instance of Agent. The free server I use for this
instance is News.Individual.Net, which is excellent but doesn't carry
binary groups. When I want to work with binaries (schematics, music,
pictures), I load up another instance of Agent, which uses the Forte
APN server, that does cover all the binaries.

Last time I checked, Agent 2.0 still did not support multiple servers.
Has that changed?

---
No, but I'm still at a loss to understand why, if you use your second
instance of Agent to access binaries, it won't decode the link and
send you to the referenced post.

--
John Fields

Terry Pinnell · Feb 28, 2005

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:31:24 +0000, Terry Pinnell
terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:02:19 +0000, Terry Pinnell
terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote:

John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

Pull-up and symmetry fix here:

news:deq121t2u5b754tctmk3f8ov8dm4n4vh4g@4ax.com

John: You used to give a Subject when referencing posts to
alt.binaries.schematics.electronic. I've recently split my news
reading so that all binary groups are in another 'instance' of my
newsreader. (Agent is still incapable of handling multiple servers,
although still my preferred email/news reader). So I can no longer
simply d-click a news: reference to get to your post. It's no big deal
(I can find it pretty quickly), but I'd appreciate your returning to
including the Subject and maybe date please.

---
Sure, no problem.

Thanks.

I don't understand why you can't just click on the URL, though, I'm
also using Agent and it works for me. Version 2.0, though. Maybe
that's it?

It's because alt.binaries.schematics.electronic is not in my list of
newsgroups in *this* instance of Agent. The free server I use for this
instance is News.Individual.Net, which is excellent but doesn't carry
binary groups. When I want to work with binaries (schematics, music,
pictures), I load up another instance of Agent, which uses the Forte
APN server, that does cover all the binaries.

Last time I checked, Agent 2.0 still did not support multiple servers.
Has that changed?

---
No, but I'm still at a loss to understand why, if you use your second
instance of Agent to access binaries, it won't decode the link and
send you to the referenced post.

The link is in the text instance (this one, in which I'm composing
this reply). Your schematic is in alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,
the binaries instance. Even with both running, clicking here in this
instance doesn't find any messages outside.

When I had *all* my groups in one instance, using a server that
handled them all, it was fine. That was before I moved to a broadband
service. I missed the small print which excluded both email and Usenet
access! So had to make different arrangements.

I *could* still have all groups in one instance, and use the APN
server that supports all of them. But that's a limited download
monthly (5 GB), So I want to use the free one for all but binaries.

--
Terry Pinnell
Hobbyist, West Sussex, UK

Robert Monsen · Feb 28, 2005

John Fields wrote:
<good stuff, posting 'news:' links, which, sadly, appear not to work at
all with Thunderbird, the mozilla newsreader>

--
Regards,
Robert Monsen

"Your Highness, I have no need of this hypothesis."
- Pierre Laplace (1749-1827), to Napoleon,
on why his works on celestial mechanics make no mention of God.

Lord Garth · Mar 7, 2005

"Pooh Bear" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:422BE817.F051E6A@hotmail.com...

Harold Ryan wrote:

Checksum is just the addition of each byte of data. At the end of the
file,
another byte or word is added that will total all of the bytes to zero.
If
any of the bytes are corrupt, the total sum of all the bytes will not be
zero. A loose wire or strong magnetic field may cause this problem.
Harold

I'm broadly familiar with this thanks. I'm less familiar with why Eprom
programmers of old seemed to produce different checksums according to
manufacturer.

The OP still hasn't explained *what checksum* he's talking about under
what
conditions.

Can he even validate the file ?

Graham

Maybe a CRC was used rather than a checksum. How old is the code in the
EPROM?

Dummy · Mar 9, 2005

Robert Monsen <rcsurname@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<W8WdnfdK4bC_bLDfRVn-1w@comcast.com>...

Charles Edmondson wrote:

Take a GOOD look at power up and power down sequences. A few years ago,
a vendor of mine was having problems with a similiar situation, where an
EEPROM kept getting programmed to random bits here and there. Seemed
that on start up (this was on a parallel port) there were voltage
glitches that JUST HAPPENED to mimic the programming sequence on the
device, which was not supposed to be field programmable! Since this was
a security dongle, and the bits were sometimes the security ID codes,
this was considered a very bad thing!

Were they actually able to observe this, or was it assumed? Dealing with
hardware/software interfaces, it is quite common for programmers to
blame software bugs on hardware 'glitches'. I've seen this again and
again. It is usually a bug that just seems to come and go, possibly due
to some unrelated change in the software that changes the timing or
place in memory where a random pointer is hitting. I have made a living
out of consulting on these kinds of issues.

So, take a look at what occurs during start up and shut downs, and see
if there are any glitches then that can cause you problems!

Yet another goblin to beware of. Thanks.

Introducing random noise at supply line won't be able to cause any
glitches at EEPROM lines because the noise was riding on the supply.
However, when glitches are introduced to main supply line by creating
a temporary dip of voltage at certain period, glitches can passed
through to EEPROM lines.

Previously, we have been able to see the EEPROM checksum error by
introducing noise to EEPROM directly, bypassing the regulator. So I
reckon that if the glitches get through the regulator, most probably
checksum error will occur. We are checking on that. We thought of
noise, but missed out the glitches.

If that's the root cause, any method to prevent glitches? I guess
regulator is only able to filter the noise that rides on the Vcc. Any
sudden dip in voltage is not recoverable.

Leon Heller · Mar 9, 2005

http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller
"Dummy" <ahkit1021@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:74bb84c0.0503090259.7f2f2d4b@posting.google.com...

I have one radio (330Mhz-400MHz), equipped with antenna and remote
speaker mic.
When the radio is transmitting at 4W over a groundplane with LCD
display facing down, display blank problem could be seen occasionally.
The display was totally blank and not functioning. Of course, radio
was still working well. Turning the radio OFF and ON again would have
the display recovered.

A copper tape that applied at the LCD flex solved the problem. But no
display blank issue was not seen at other bands of radios such as from
100MHz-200MHz and 400MHz-500MHz. All radios are using same LCD, same
circuitry and similar platform design. Even though the problem has
been solved, the behaviour of the display blank problem was not
properly understood, especially when it's frequency dependent, and it
happened when display was facing downwards the big groundplane, and it
didn't happen at other bands of radio. Can somebody shed some light on
this?

One or more of the connections to the LCD was probably acting as an antenna
at that particular frequency or a harmonic of it.

Leon

Robert Baer · Mar 16, 2005

Jamie wrote:

Dummy wrote:
I have a simple setup as below. The ammeter is used to measure the
transmit current of the radio. Power supply has an display of total
current as well.

Power supply (Vin=7.5V)-------ammeter--------- (Vout) radio

When connecting the ammeter, there's a 0.3V voltage drop across the
ammeter before transmitting. During transmit mode, total current as
displayed at ammeter is 1.80A, matched with the power supply current
display. But Vout is measured to be 6.14V only, thus causing the Tx
power to be lower.

Using direct cable connection without ammeter, the current measured is
almost similar, but the Tx power is much more higher. Current is
1.85A. Vout is 7.0V during transmission - a voltage drop of 0.5V.
I guess the ammeter is giving more resistance the the cable.

So I was wondering whether the ammeter should be used to measure any
high current in circuit level if it can cause some voltage drop. The
voltage drop might affect the circuit performance at the subsequent
stage.
if you want to experiment a bit, you could use an OP-Amp inputs with a
shunt ( very low value shunt). the Op-Amp can be an Amp for a simple
meter.
of course there is more that you need to do, this is just an idea for
you to ponder with.

Again, pay attention and use kelvin connections.

Robert Baer · Mar 16, 2005

Ken Taylor wrote:

"Dummy" <ahkit1021@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:74bb84c0.0503142125.60e5255@posting.google.com...
I have a simple setup as below. The ammeter is used to measure the
transmit current of the radio. Power supply has an display of total
current as well.

Power supply (Vin=7.5V)-------ammeter--------- (Vout) radio

When connecting the ammeter, there's a 0.3V voltage drop across the
ammeter before transmitting. During transmit mode, total current as
displayed at ammeter is 1.80A, matched with the power supply current
display. But Vout is measured to be 6.14V only, thus causing the Tx
power to be lower.

Using direct cable connection without ammeter, the current measured is
almost similar, but the Tx power is much more higher. Current is
1.85A. Vout is 7.0V during transmission - a voltage drop of 0.5V.
I guess the ammeter is giving more resistance the the cable.

So I was wondering whether the ammeter should be used to measure any
high current in circuit level if it can cause some voltage drop. The
voltage drop might affect the circuit performance at the subsequent
stage.

You could buy a shunt and use a voltmeter (on a suitably low range) to
measure the drop across it.

Ken

I think i said that, and added a cautionary note to use kelvin
connections.

John Fields · Mar 16, 2005

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 03:37:29 -0800, "Larry Brasfield"
<donotspam_larry_brasfield@hotmail.com> wrote:

"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:jetf31l4prjgl1g4gif72o7mvj3511rko1@4ax.com...
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:42:43 -0800, "Larry Brasfield"
donotspam_larry_brasfield@hotmail.com> wrote:

"Fred Bloggs" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:423796E7.3090905@nospam.com...

Or buy/modify a p.s. with external sense compensation,

Spending money was an obvious option which
I mentioned in several of its many forms.
---
However, you never mentioned external sense compensation (using a
Kelvin connection at the load to supply feedback to the supply in
order to compensate for lead resistance) and had you known such a
thing existed you would surely have mentioned it as an "obvious
option".

There are two silly assumptions you've made. As I have
stated elsewhere, I thought the OP would like a solution
utilizing what he mentioned he had on hand. I threw out
a few spending options without pretending to exhaust
them, merely to let him know he was not stuck with
just what he had. So I was not inclined to spend much
time trying to come up with a list that none of the smart
alecs around here would be able to "improve" upon.
So, assuming that my non-mention reflects ignorance
of remote sense power supplies is fatuous.

---
In light of the fact that his power supply might have been capable of
remote sensing and in view of your statement: "I thought the OP would
like a solution utilizing what he mentioned he had on hand." It seems
to me that your "familiarity" with remote sensing supplies would, at
the very least, brought forth the question of his power supply having
that capability and, if it did, a suggestion to use that capability.
---

The other
laughable assumption is that it should be an obvious
option to anybody who knew of such supplies.

---
Key phrase here is "knew of". If the OP wasn't aware that his supply
had that capability, or how to use it, then that option would hardly
have been obvious. You, though, knowing that such an option might
have been available didn't bring it up either.
---

Why should the OP go spend that kind of money when he
can simply use a shunt or measure the resistance of his
cable and use that and a voltmeter to measure current?

---
He probably shouldn't, but that's not what you advised him to do, you
sent him on some wild goose chase to measure this and that and
calculate this and that, when all you had to tell him was to monitor
the voltage at the input of the radio and crank the supply up to make
that voltage go to 7.5V when he was transmitting, LOL!

You also wrote:

"You could also put a lower shunt resistor across
your ammeter and calibrate the combination."

which is one of the stupidest things I've ever read. Do you know why
or would you like me to explain it to you while typing through fits of
laughter?
---

Now that the cat's out of the bag, though, I suspect you'll soon
become the expert you'd like us to believe you already were.

Here, I'll save you a little time on Google:

On power supplies supplied with external sense compensation there are
two terminals, one usually marked "+ sense" or something like that,
and the other one marked "- sense" or something like that. In use, a
wire is connected from the "+ sense" terminal to the + input of the
load at the same point the supply lead is connected to the load, and
the "- sense" terminal is connected from the "- sense" terminal to the
- input of the load at the same point the supply lead is connected to
the load. That way, voltage variations _at the load_ are sensed and
fed back to the supply where the supply voltage is automatically
adjusted upward to compensate for the voltage dropped across the
supply leads. If sense compensation isn't needed, the sense terminals
are shorted to their respective supply outputs at the supply, and the
supply regulates the voltage at that point.

Thanks, so much John.
You're welcome.

I note that your little description omits mention of the
1k or so resistors that normally obviate the need for
those jumpers when remote sensing is not used.

---
??? Funny... all of the stuff I've got around here _requires_
strapping the sense terminals to the output terminals if remote
sensing isn't used, but hey, that's only HP.
---

Not knowing how old you are, I may be actually wrong
about this, but there is a good chance that the incident
I relate below happened before you had any inkling of
what a circuit is or what 'electronics' means.

Before my job as an engineering tech which preceeded
my career as an electronics design engineer, I held a
job as a factory test tech. One day, in return for a
similar level of prank, I connected an RC network
between the so far unused sense terminals and the
output terminals on the power supply that my "pal"
would be using after lunch to continue troubleshooting
some equipment. (These machines were battery
operated but run off of a DC supply during most test
and troubleshooting.) After enjoying the spectacle of
him trying to figure out what was going on as his bench
supply was oscillating at a low level, I went and told a
few other techs so they could come and "help" (see).

---
So you were into chicanery back then as well?
Old habits die hard, I see.
---

As for the novelty of 4 wire connections for dealing
with cable and connection drops, you could pull up
one of my patents detailing a system that relies on that
very concept in order to operate effectively. (I do
not expect any such effort from you, attached as you
are to the notion of my ignorance. If not for that, it
ought to suffice to plug your "soon become" spew.)

---
Hey, sure, I'll look it up. I always enjoy a good laugh.
What's the Patent Number?

--
John Fields

Fred Bloggs · Mar 16, 2005

Larry Brasfield wrote:

"Fred Bloggs" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:423796E7.3090905@nospam.com...

Larry Brasfield wrote:

Measure the current with ammeter in at the ordinary
supply voltage. Call this Iao. Measure the voltage
at the transmitter with same lashup. Call this Vao.
Measure the drop across the ammeter, Vad.

Reduce the supply voltage by an amount similar
to what the ammeter drops, leaving the ammeter
in place. Measure current and voltage, to be
called Iar and Var respectively.

Calculate Rt = (Vao - Var) / (Iao - Iar)
This is the slope of the voltage versus current
characteristic for the transmitter.

Calculate Ina = Iao + Rt * Vad
This is an approximation of the current the
transmitter draws when you have no ammeter
to reduce the supply voltage it sees.

Yeah? So the F___ what? And since when is resistance x voltage equal a current?- and you don't even have the sign right.

(Finally, a positive contribution.)

That line should have read, of course, thusly:
Calculate Ina = Iao + Vad / Rt
And, contrary to what the esteemed Mr. Boggs
proclaims, the sign is correct. As defined, both
Vad and Rt are positive quantities (at least if
the transmitter draws more power at higher
voltages, which is already in evidence.) Since
Ina (pronounce as: I 'n'o 'a'mmeter) represents
the current predicted when no ammeter is present,
and that is already known to be higher, adding the
positive ratio Vad/Rt to the current measure with
the ammeter present is correct for getting such a
result. I would hope that this is now obvious
even to the most critical observer.

Here's the deal you worthless, pretentious son-of-a-bitch-with-VD, you are a worthless p.o.s.- we are wise to your dumb ass-

I perhaps should engage in some name-calling on
account of the above correction, but, as a low ranking
member of the excrement class, I am not up to it.

go away.

I already said 'No', Fred. Do you think repetition
is going to be effective? (It would appear so.)

You could also put a lower shunt resistor across
your ammeter and calibrate the combination.

Or buy/modify a p.s. with external sense compensation,

Spending money was an obvious option which
I mentioned in several of its many forms. The
OP's questions led me to believe he might be
interested in using the equipment he had. We
have seen no evidence to the contrary.

damned worthless idiot.

Fred, I appreciate your opinion. Honestly.
I tried to tell you that earlier, but I suspect
my meaning escaped your notice.

What a simple-minded little fairy and brainless pussy you are- the OP
already said that he gets 1.85A at 7.0V without the ammeter- so who
needs your crap and pretentious pseudo- engineering formula? You want to
assume linearity for voltage drops less than 10%, then that there tells
you the effective power supply output resistance is 0.5V/1.85A=0.27
ohms. Then because the OP also states the load voltage is 6.14V at 1.80
with the ammeter, you have that 7.5V=1.8*0.27+1.8*Rammeter+6.14V or
Rammeter=0.486 ohms. The OP also states that without transmitting, the
drop due to the ammeter is 0.3V making I= 0.3V/(0.486+0.27)ohm=0.4 amps
at 7.2V load voltage- or a load power of 7.2*0.4=2.9 Watts. The load
power during transmit w/o ammeter is 7*1.85=13W and the load power w/
ammeter is 6.14*1.8=11W. The ammeter deprives the circuit of 2W of load
power,- so that the RF output will fall something like eta*2W where eta
is the transmit efficiency. Say for example eta is 33% more or less over
these power consumption ranges- then he must lose about 0.7W transmit
power- if he has a lot of Class A overhead stuff then eta may only be
10% and the power loss is 0.2W in transmit. Your little sissy model
conveys no usable information, and why would it- you don't what you're
doing- you are a pretentious fraud- you latch onto to same linearity
model for load Rt- you don't have a clue what's important and what's
not- and once again you can't understand what the OP is asking- like
mainly how much transmit power degradation can he expect. Get a clue and
take a hike- you are another "unwanted" NG p.o.s- just leave.

Terry Given · Mar 17, 2005

Larry Brasfield wrote:

"Terry Given" <my_name@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:XM4_d.10432$1S4.1095388@news.xtra.co.nz...

Clearly its pick-on-Larry O'clock, so here's my 2 cents worth:

I dont like your hat

Ouch! You guys sure know how to pile on. That's
very close to the most damaging blow so far. <g

Cheers

Thanks, and likewise.

What can I say, I'm one of the people my parents warned me about

wrt OP, I once had the brilliant idea of incorporating -ve feedback into
a TL431-opto feedback circuit, by placing the LED resistor at the o/p
rail, then taking the o/p voltage feedback from the bottom of that
resistor in order to reduce the maximum gain and stabilise it (Aol is
all over the show for a TL431). OK, fair enough, it ought to work. In
order to test it, I slapped a Fluke87 (in mA mode) in series with the
TL431. The voltage drop across the ammeter was more than enough to screw
up the entire circuit (esp. since it was in the -ve feedback part), and
as I was being particularly thick that day it took several hours for me
to figure out why it didnt work.

Thats not so bad. What really hurt was my tech roaring with laughter
when he found out what I had done, then calling the other guys down for
a laugh. Perhaps it was revenge for the time I kicked him in the ankle
whilst his head was under a shelf - ouch clonk fuck OWTTE ;]

Actually it was probably payback for the time I gave him a dish
containing about 10,000 0603 caps (200 values), and asked him to sort
them out. Half an hour later, there he was painstakingly measuring each
one, until one of the other techs took pity on him and told him the
correct response to such a request was "piss off"

Cheers
Terry

Jim Thompson · Mar 17, 2005

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:25:07 -0600, Rob Gaddi
<rgaddi@bcm.YUMMYSPAMtmc.edu> wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:
On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:46:40 +0000, John Woodgate
jmw@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote:

I read in sci.electronics.design that John Fields <jfields@austininstrum
ents.com> wrote (in <12bj315kqurrphd28bfv8bjg9nn6nb9ppp@4ax.com&gt about
'Newsgroup Nazi', on Thu, 17 Mar 2005:

What do y'all think about that?

He must be French.

"Ippolito"? Sure sounds "French" to me ;-)

Me, I'd send Ippolito a nastygram, copied to whatever state agency
regulates SBC in Texass.

...Jim Thompson
Agency? Regulates? Clearly, son, you don't understand how we do
business here in Texas.

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

BFoelsch · Mar 18, 2005

Personally, I'd take a sip of my martini, and post his response as a test
message.

Then, I'd take another sip of my martini.

"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:12bj315kqurrphd28bfv8bjg9nn6nb9ppp@4ax.com...

I've had a DSL line for a year or so, supplied by SBC Internet
Services, and I'm really pleased with it. I was using another ISP for
outgoing email and news, and yesterday I decided to save a few bucks
by dropping the other ISP and running everything through SWB. No
problem; everything worked fine except the connection to Usenet,
through Prodigy, which was (is) so crappy that I didn't see any new
posts on sed or abse for hours after I hooked up with prodigy's news
server.

So, I thought, maybe something's wrong on my end. In order to check
it out I decided to send some test posts to see if they'd make it
through, and here's what I found in my inbox shortly after that:

QUOTE

FYI,
Please be advised that posting tests to discussion
groups is considered poor netiquette. There are test
groups set aside for posting tests. Please retry your
test to sbcglobal.test, or alt.test. For binary test
posts please use alt.test.binaries.
All unmoderated groups work the same way so if a post
works to a test group it should work in any group. On
the rare occasion where a test must be made to a
discussion group, please post a short on-topic message
as your test. Your test post would have been successful
had it not been filtered out.
If you are having problems with or questions regarding
newsgroups please post your concerns to;

news://sbcglobal.help.tech.newsgroups

or email news-support@sbcglobal.net

Common problems and fixes may be found at;

http://newsgroups.news.prodigy.com

Thank You,

--
Tom Ippolito
Newsgroups System Administrator
SBC Services
ippolitot@prodigy.net

END QUOTE

Notice that Ippolito took it upon _himself_ to stop a legal
transmission which I'm paying good money to supposedly be able to do.

What do y'all think about that?

--
John Fields

Bryan · Mar 18, 2005

"Luhan Monat" <x@y.z> wrote in message
news:yUo_d.6252$uk7.5701@fed1read01...

Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:21:45 -0700, Bryan wrote:

Hello one and all.

I have been looking into building a "very" sensitive EMF detector due to
issues with power lines in the area. I am sorry to say that I have no
REAL
idea on how to do it.
I was also told that there is a way to build a device that would use
Hall
effect sensors to measure the earths magnetic field. It would be much
more
sensitive and would work if adjustable. I have yet to find a circuit
design
that will give a visual as well as audible measurement. An LED bar graph
would be ok.
Any good ideas on what I could build that would do this?

Thanks for your help.

I'd say that if they're too low to detect except with specialized ultra-
high sensitivity equipment, you're blowing smoke up your own ass.

Cheers!
Rich

Try Google: +"smoke detector" +anal

I think I know how I am going to work this now.
Thanks to everyone for their help. Well, almost everyone. For Rich I guess
just a peice of advice.... Rich we all know that liquids conduct
electricity. So, be carfulful next time you are around power supplies, and
don't forget to wipe your chin! He will understand if he really cares.

Cheers!

Rich Grise · Mar 18, 2005

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:29:43 -0700, Bryan wrote:

"Luhan Monat" <x@y.z> wrote in message
Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:21:45 -0700, Bryan wrote:

I have been looking into building a "very" sensitive EMF detector due
to issues with power lines in the area. I am sorry to say that I have
no
REAL
idea on how to do it.
....
I'd say that if they're too low to detect except with specialized
ultra- high sensitivity equipment, you're blowing smoke up your own
ass.

I think I know how I am going to work this now. Thanks to everyone for
their help. Well, almost everyone. For Rich I guess just a peice of
advice.... Rich we all know that liquids conduct electricity. So, be
carfulful next time you are around power supplies, and don't forget to
wipe your chin! He will understand if he really cares.

Well, an aluminum foil hat would be the cheapest solution.

What "issues" do you have with power lines in the area? How sensitive
does this detector have to be? I still say, if you can't detect something
it's probably not worth worrying about very much.

Thanks,
Rich

John Fields · Mar 18, 2005

On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 12:39:13 +0000 (GMT), Tony Williams
<tonyw@ledelec.demon.co.uk> wrote:

In article <12bj315kqurrphd28bfv8bjg9nn6nb9ppp@4ax.com>,
John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

Notice that Ippolito took it upon _himself_ to stop a legal
transmission which I'm paying good money to supposedly be able to
do.

Since many of us saw it he didn't stop the
original propagation, probably issued a later
cancel. Third party cancels are themselves
often regarded as poor netiquette.

You missed something though John. Your post was
entitled 'Short message'. In order for your ISP
to know that it was a test post they must have
examined the *content* of the post.

---
Actually, that was a second post which I sent which I knew wouldn't be
cancelled, because the subject wasn't "test". The first post, which
_did_ have "test" as the subject was the one that was cancelled.
---

This is a dangerous thing for an ISP to do, because
all posts they propagate may reasonably be assumed
to have been seen by them and they are satisfied
that no posts have an illegal content. Therefore
they lay themselves open to prosecution if a post
is subsequently the cause of legal action.

---
Yes, I agree. In this case however, since I've paid to use their
Usenet server(s) and have committed no illegal acts with respect to
that usage, theft of service would seem to me to be the cause for
legal action.
---

My ISP makes a big fuss about never looking at the
content of a post. In this way they maintain their
status as a common carrier (like the post office).

---
A good policy, IMO, and it frees them from the daunting task of having
to read (or machine filter for content followed by a human read) every
post that goes through them.

--
John Fields

John Fields · Mar 18, 2005

On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:20:42 +0000, John Woodgate
<jmw@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote:

I read in sci.electronics.design that John Fields <jfields@austininstrum
ents.com> wrote (in <12bj315kqurrphd28bfv8bjg9nn6nb9ppp@4ax.com&gt about
'Newsgroup Nazi', on Thu, 17 Mar 2005:
Notice that Ippolito took it upon _himself_ to stop a legal
transmission which I'm paying good money to supposedly be able to do.

What do y'all think about that?

Did you check the header to see if there is any evidence that it's a
wind-up?

---
Yes, and I also sent a copy of the message and the headers to "abuse
at prodigy.com", where Ippolito's post originated. (prodigy.com, that
is) No response so far...

--
John Fields

Watson A.Name - \"Watt Su · Mar 18, 2005

"Rich Grise" <richgrise@example.net> wrote in message
news

an.2005.03.18.16.02.04.271952@example.net...

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:21:45 -0700, Bryan wrote:

Hello one and all.

I have been looking into building a "very" sensitive EMF detector
due to
issues with power lines in the area. I am sorry to say that I have
no REAL
idea on how to do it.

You could check with some of the strawberry growers who are using the
whole corridor under the hi-line alongside I-605. They might know
something about the effects of power line induction.

Good Luck!
Rich

GASP! You mean those strawberries we eat have been irradiated?!? Don't
let the organic nuts know!

People don't realize how much of an electrostatic field there is around
those high tension lines. But it rapidly dissipates after a few scores
of feet.

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