Chinese solder on ebay

[Clocky]

On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:

Clocky wrote:
On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

Consolidated Alloys (http://www.cagroup.com.au/) are an Australian
manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.


I'm still using a roll of Digitor branded .56mm solder that I bought
years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
stuff.

Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label).

The label on my roll is peeled and I can only read the Digitor brand and
size and it's old catalog number N2615 so that could well be. I quite
like it in any case.

I'm not familiar with

Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.

Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.

Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
higher Sn content.

Does your Chinese roll have a decipherable brand or do you have a link
to the stuff? I'll give it a shot.
TIA.

 

[Clocky]

On 13/05/2015 11:39 AM, John_H wrote:

John_H wrote:

You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
(mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
but there are others....
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422

This one might be even better, as well cheaper....
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Yihua-Soldering-Station-YH936C-50W-Lead-Free-Solder-ESD-SAFE-CE-Sydney-1Year-WRT-/271514158500?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3f378145a4

It's from a GST registered Australian based company who're very good
to deal with and send stuff promptly. They also stock Hakko tips (and
other parts) which I've bought from them previously.

Might also be worth googling Yihua 936 as it's a very popular clone.

Yep, the Yihua 936 is what I currently use and it makes sense to get
another. They work well enough for mine.

Thanks John.

 

[Computer Nerd Kev]

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:

Clocky wrote:
On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

Consolidated Alloys (http://www.cagroup.com.au/) are an Australian
manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.


I'm still using a roll of Digitor branded .56mm solder that I bought
years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
stuff.

Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.

Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
higher Sn content.

I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
know where it was purchased.
Same as this:
http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.

I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
logo.

I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.

Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#

 

[Computer Nerd Kev]

Clocky <notgonna@happen.com> wrote:

On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
Clocky wrote:
On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.

The popular 2000 series Dick Smith soldering stations have all actually
been made by Xytronic:
http://www.xytronic-usa.com/shop/category.aspx?catid=8

The 2000 series model they currently sell has been through a lot of
price changes over the years.

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#

 

[John_H]

Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:

Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
know where it was purchased.
Same as this:
http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.

FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
advertised item.

I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
logo.

The two remnant rolls I've got both have Multicore on the label though
DSE could well have used more than one supplier.

I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.

Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
IMHO.

Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.

Probably deservedly so since many Chinese manufactured devices have
featured some pretty rough soldering in the past, but I'm still happy
to judge it as I find it and the aforementioned solder is both nice to
use and makes good looking joints. Whether the quality is consistent
between batches remains to be seen although many of the once
run-of-the mill Chinese manufacturers seem to be improving rapidly in
that regard.

Interesting comment on 63/37 as well, which I hadn't previously used.
So far I'm impressed and can't see any problem with the lack of a
molten temperature range. It's the reverse I find a PITA.

Similar with the comment on 350° being too high for lead solders. I'd
seriously doubt if any experienced tech would agree, with the object
being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without
compromising quality.

--
John H

 

[Clocky]

On 14/05/2015 7:28 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:
Clocky wrote:
On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

Consolidated Alloys (http://www.cagroup.com.au/) are an Australian
manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.


I'm still using a roll of Digitor branded .56mm solder that I bought
years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
stuff.

Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.

Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
higher Sn content.

I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
know where it was purchased.
Same as this:
http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.

I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
logo.

I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.

Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.

I just peeled the remnant label off my roll of Digitor DSE branded stuff
250gm 60/40 .56mm resin cored solder and it has CAPALLOY on the spool.

I quite like it but that is not to say that there isn't better stuff out
there.

 

[Computer Nerd Kev]

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:

Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:

Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.

I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
know where it was purchased.
Same as this:
http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.

FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
advertised item.

Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive
description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems
they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit
products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.

I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
logo.

The two remnant rolls I've got both have Multicore on the label though
DSE could well have used more than one supplier.

I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.

Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
IMHO.

Thing is that if I do a test I tend to want it to be objective. I
think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide
to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer
comes my way.

Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.

Probably deservedly so since many Chinese manufactured devices have
featured some pretty rough soldering in the past, but I'm still happy
to judge it as I find it and the aforementioned solder is both nice to
use and makes good looking joints. Whether the quality is consistent
between batches remains to be seen although many of the once
run-of-the mill Chinese manufacturers seem to be improving rapidly in
that regard.

Probably the best of solders couldn't save some of the dodgy solderers
who have haunted the assembly lines up in Asia.

Interesting comment on 63/37 as well, which I hadn't previously used.
So far I'm impressed and can't see any problem with the lack of a
molten temperature range. It's the reverse I find a PITA.

Similar with the comment on 350? being too high for lead solders. I'd
seriously doubt if any experienced tech would agree, with the object
being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without
compromising quality.

And without having to keep the heat on components too long waiting for
the solder to melt. I think I've seen 350C recommended in a few places
and its certainly around what I use.

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#

 

[John_H]

Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:

FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
advertised item.

Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive
description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems
they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit
products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.

AFAIK this is the only one Multicore call Savbit....
http://au.rs-online.com/web/p/solders/0554939/

Noting that the melting point is 215, with a molten range of 215 -
183, whereas 63/37 has a melting point of 183 with no molten range.

Multicore is now part of Henkel... a German company that also owns
Loctite. Not absolutely certain but I think the Ersin part only
refers to the flux.

Savbit goes back to the days when soldering irons had unplated copper
bits. Nowadays its main use is for soldering thin copper wires, which
are rapidly dissolved by conventional Sn/Pb solders. It's also
available in small quantities (20g or so) which is the convenient way
to buy it for occasional use.

--
John H

 

[John_H]

Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

John_H <john4721@inbox.com> wrote:
Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.

Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
IMHO.

Thing is that if I do a test I tend to want it to be objective. I
think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide
to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer
comes my way.

All you need is an accurate soldering tip thermometer, since the
initial melting point and molten range are what you need to know.
Apart from the flux quality (which is always going to be a subjective
assessment).

For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.

Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
free, all of which have a matte finish.

The Yong Chang Long also has an ROHS sticker on it. No idea who put
it there but it's probably meant to fool the Euros into thinking it's
lead free (RoHS) when sold in that market, which it definitely isn't.
Nor is the composition stated on the label even though it's being sold
on Ebay au as 63/37, and probably is.

--
John H

 

[Phil Allison]

John_H wrote:

For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.

Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
free, all of which have a matte finish.

** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?

I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.

The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet and set very dull.

Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.

OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.

IME (over 40 years) this is how Savbit always performs, soldering tin and nickel plated metals instantly when other solders just dribble off.


.... Phil

The Yong Chang Long also has an ROHS sticker on it. No idea who put
it there but it's probably meant to fool the Euros into thinking it's
lead free (RoHS) when sold in that market, which it definitely isn't.
Nor is the composition stated on the label even though it's being sold
on Ebay au as 63/37, and probably is.

--
John H

 

[John_H]

Phil Allison wrote:

John_H wrote:


For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.

Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
free, all of which have a matte finish.


** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?

One that looks like this.... http://tinyurl.com/mn39597
The hidden part of the label says "SAVBIT ALLOY".

I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.

The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet and set very dull.

Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.

OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.

Is it definitely labled Savbit?
Multicore 60/40 certainly performs as you describe and at least one
vendor seems to have confused 60/40 with Savbit (see Kev's earlier
cite).

>IME (over 40 years) this is how Savbit always performs, soldering tin and nickel plated metals instantly when other solders just dribble off.

It's been about that long since I last had a 1 lb roll (back in the
days of plain copper bits) and I honestly don't remember how it
performed but from the stated composition and melting points
(50/48.5/1.5, 183-215) I wouldn't have expected it to be any different
to what I've currently got.

--
John H

 

[Phil Allison]

John_H wrote:

** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?

One that looks like this.... http://tinyurl.com/mn39597
The hidden part of the label says "SAVBIT ALLOY".

I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil
removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.

The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet
and set very dull.

Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were
a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.

OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.


Is it definitely labled Savbit?

** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager, when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box. For a long time it was just about the only solder on offer for electronic work. Got mine from Radio Despatch Service, then DSE and finally Farnell / Element14.

http://au.element14.com/multicore-loctite/ds18-500g-reel/solder-wire-savbit-1-22mm-500g/dp/419450?ost=419450



..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

Phil Allison wrote:

** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager,
when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box.

** See pic:

http://blog-imgs-45.fc2.com/o/c/4/oc44/ersin02.jpg



.... Phil

 

[~misfit~]

Once upon a time on usenet John_H wrote:

pedro wrote:

WES were largely a supplier to the servicing trade (although the
balance *may* have shifted a littlle towards consumer lines) so I'd
expect it to be decent.

They still are, even though the service trade probably no longer
represents the bulk of their business... Wagner is the retail outlet.
They also sell a considerable amount of junk (which may or may not
include their solder).

I get my supplies of SnPb from a local
electronics specialist who has the trade as 90% of his business.

Nearest thing to a specialist supplier within 500km of me is a Jaycar
outlet which stocks even worse crap (I happen to live in a relatively
remote area). I've previously bought solder from RS Components but
last time around they sent Multicore HMP instead of 60/40 (which
happens to have a very similar looking label). By the time I got
around to using it, and noticed the mistake, it it was too late to
send it back and I don't particularly feel like giving them another
opportunity to stuff up.

I've had great results using RS Components. The only dissapointment I've had
was when recently buying a "1 litre tin of IPA". I can always use IPA
(although I normally buy it in smaller quantities) and I have a brother in
law who collects tins. However despite the picture on their site and the
description on the invoice I was annoyed to discover my IPA came in a one
litre plastic bottle. :-/
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long, way when religious belief has a
cozy little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)