W
William Sommerwerck
Guest
Fascinating.
What's interesting about this patent is that the head moves in a circle,
while the /tape/ moves in a helix. This is "backwards" to the way modern
helical-scan systems work.
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Fascinating.
What's interesting about this patent is that the head moves in a circle,
while the /tape/ moves in a helix. This is "backwards" to the way modern
helical-scan systems work.
S
spamtrap1888
Guest
On Dec 22, 2:55 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net>
wrote:
1950 (2,773,120). A good picture of the alpha wrap is shown in DC
resident Arthur W. Holt's patent 2919314, "Means for recording and/or
reproducing recorded high frequency signals," applied for in 1956. As
usual for that era, the Japanese merely copied and adapted American
inventions.
The earliest date I can find a tape recording patent assigned to
Hitachi is 1969.
wrote:
Helical scan tape recording was invented by RCA's Earl Masterson instratu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bc464648-01dc-483f-ad84-f1fe6a1959af@l24g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 21, 3:34 pm, myfathersson <licensedtoqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
I got my first VCR in 1977, a Sony Betamax personal purchase half off
for only $650. When I tell you VCRs are crap, its because they are
crap They were ALWAYS crap but it was all we had so it was "good".
Picture is poor, media wears out, machine wears out, tapes get
damaged, recording time is finite. Why would anyone want such a thing
when you don't have to use it?
Here we go again...
Yes, it makes a lot more sense to record on a DVR. The consumer VCR is both
technically and practically obsolete. That said...
Unlike VHS, the Betamax represented an excellent compromise between price
and quality. The first time I saw a Betamax recording (playing on Sony's
original 19" console TV/VCR combo), I didn't know whether it was live or
recorded. I used a Betamax for years for time-shifting, and I assure you,
the machine was not "crap", and the picture was in no way "poor".
Also, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi, I think)
was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
1950 (2,773,120). A good picture of the alpha wrap is shown in DC
resident Arthur W. Holt's patent 2919314, "Means for recording and/or
reproducing recorded high frequency signals," applied for in 1956. As
usual for that era, the Japanese merely copied and adapted American
inventions.
The earliest date I can find a tape recording patent assigned to
Hitachi is 1969.
Guest
On Dec 22, 2:55 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net>
wrote:
in the tape path. Take your quad head drum and tip it to almost
perpendicular to the tape path rather than parallel to it, increase
its size and you have a helical machine. Not a very big leap
conceptually. The drum is still phase locked to the video, the drum
generates a pulse recorded longitudinally as control track.
Interestingly Ampex managed to get the AVR-1 quad machine to play with
no control track and even re-generate a new control track for the
machines that required it (all the rest).
G˛
wrote:
Helical scan is simply a re-orientation of the head wheel and a changestratu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bc464648-01dc-483f-ad84-f1fe6a1959af@l24g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 21, 3:34 pm, myfathersson <licensedtoqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
I got my first VCR in 1977, a Sony Betamax personal purchase half off
for only $650. When I tell you VCRs are crap, its because they are
crap They were ALWAYS crap but it was all we had so it was "good".
Picture is poor, media wears out, machine wears out, tapes get
damaged, recording time is finite. Why would anyone want such a thing
when you don't have to use it?
Here we go again...
Yes, it makes a lot more sense to record on a DVR. The consumer VCR is both
technically and practically obsolete. That said...
Unlike VHS, the Betamax represented an excellent compromise between price
and quality. The first time I saw a Betamax recording (playing on Sony's
original 19" console TV/VCR combo), I didn't know whether it was live or
recorded. I used a Betamax for years for time-shifting, and I assure you,
the machine was not "crap", and the picture was in no way "poor".
Also, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi, I think)
was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
in the tape path. Take your quad head drum and tip it to almost
perpendicular to the tape path rather than parallel to it, increase
its size and you have a helical machine. Not a very big leap
conceptually. The drum is still phase locked to the video, the drum
generates a pulse recorded longitudinally as control track.
Interestingly Ampex managed to get the AVR-1 quad machine to play with
no control track and even re-generate a new control track for the
machines that required it (all the rest).
G˛
Guest
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 07:37:05 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:
do not NEED a DVR. However, you DESIRE a means of recording TV
broadcasts. That can be accomplished by three methods - VCR, DVR
(either stand alone or a computer running something like Myth-TV), or
DVD recorder.
It's been over 10 years since I used a VCR for time-shifting. At that
time you set the time it should start and stop recording and tuned it
to the channel. Perhaps things have advanced since then.
Certainly with the switch to digital broadcasts you must either have
a separate converter box, or a recorder that incorporates an ATSC
tuner. Using a recorder (VCR, DVR, or DVD) that records the signal
without any analog conversion is preferable - the data stream is
compressed using the MPEG-4 algorithm.
A quick search for VCRs with ATSC tuners brought up a number of them,
all incorporating a DVD recorder. Typical prices were in the
$250-$300 range; a bit rich for my wallet. It also brought up the
TiVo TCD746320 Premiere DVR at under $80, but that requires a monthly
subscription, something to be viewed with caution. And it brought up
the brite-View BV-980H Digital Antenna HD DVR for $200, no
subscription required. With a 320 Gig hard drive it can hold up to 39
hours of HD programming, or 450 hours of SD programming. That's
equivalent to 75 VHS tapes.
PlainBill
wrote:
without a TV, and claim it has not distorted my personality, thus youOn Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:15:30 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote:
And why PlainBill do I personally need all that stuff, because YOU say
I do? Lenny
Because all you really need is food, shelter, and clothing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_needs
How far you climb out of your cave largely depends on how far above
the subsistence level you feel comfortable. If glorified technical
poverty is your maximum level of achievement, then you probably do not
need a DVR.
http://www.google.com/search?q=minimalist+lifestyle&tbm=isch
If you obtain your entertainment in ways other than TV, then a DVR is
again wasted on your lifestyle[1]. If your philosophical or religious
convictions proscribe watching TV, then a DVR is not required.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_living
However, if you do watch TV, and find that convenience, time shifting,
and fast forward through commercials, are useful additions to your
lifestyle, then a DVR is required.
DVR Penetration Grows to 39.7% of Households, 42.2% of Viewers
http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/03/23/dvr-penetration-grows-to-39-7-of-households-42-2-of-viewers/86819/
[1] I spent about 10 years without owning a TV and survived.
I have to agree with Jeff, I lived the first 18 years of my life
do not NEED a DVR. However, you DESIRE a means of recording TV
broadcasts. That can be accomplished by three methods - VCR, DVR
(either stand alone or a computer running something like Myth-TV), or
DVD recorder.
It's been over 10 years since I used a VCR for time-shifting. At that
time you set the time it should start and stop recording and tuned it
to the channel. Perhaps things have advanced since then.
Certainly with the switch to digital broadcasts you must either have
a separate converter box, or a recorder that incorporates an ATSC
tuner. Using a recorder (VCR, DVR, or DVD) that records the signal
without any analog conversion is preferable - the data stream is
compressed using the MPEG-4 algorithm.
A quick search for VCRs with ATSC tuners brought up a number of them,
all incorporating a DVD recorder. Typical prices were in the
$250-$300 range; a bit rich for my wallet. It also brought up the
TiVo TCD746320 Premiere DVR at under $80, but that requires a monthly
subscription, something to be viewed with caution. And it brought up
the brite-View BV-980H Digital Antenna HD DVR for $200, no
subscription required. With a 320 Gig hard drive it can hold up to 39
hours of HD programming, or 450 hours of SD programming. That's
equivalent to 75 VHS tapes.
PlainBill
C
Charles
Guest
"JW" wrote in message news:und6f7de0egb158ukrrekpkqht30n5uuc1@4ax.com...
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 07:24:53 -0600 "Mark Zacharias"
<mark_zacharias@labolgcbs.net> wrote in Message id:
<4ef32fa6$0$16555$a8266bb1@newsreader.readnews.com>:
my country.
Still the most desired place for lots of folks (emigrants) from other
countries. Still the place to obtain an advanced education in almost all
fields of important and current knowledge. Still the place to offer those
with unique skills the freedom to exploit free markets. Still the place to
practice religious beliefs without undue duress.
Eat your heart out naysayers, but for most of us in the USA, it is USA USA
USA (Olympic cheer).
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 07:24:53 -0600 "Mark Zacharias"
<mark_zacharias@labolgcbs.net> wrote in Message id:
<4ef32fa6$0$16555$a8266bb1@newsreader.readnews.com>:
Yup, it sure was. But deserving. I'm tired of idiots Like Will dumping on"JW" <none@dev.null> wrote in message
news:av76f711s9la6dualrbjmc5l9h5jscqk6j@4ax.com...
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 02:58:06 -0800 "William Sommerjerck"
grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote in Message id:
jcv2g7$45t$1@dont-email.me>:
America is almost certainly the most stupid, parochial, unsophisticated,
and
just-plain-brainless Western society. What else is new?
Hey Will, Go Fuck Yourself with a splintered fence post.
Wow. That was even worse.
my country.
Still the most desired place for lots of folks (emigrants) from other
countries. Still the place to obtain an advanced education in almost all
fields of important and current knowledge. Still the place to offer those
with unique skills the freedom to exploit free markets. Still the place to
practice religious beliefs without undue duress.
Eat your heart out naysayers, but for most of us in the USA, it is USA USA
USA (Olympic cheer).
W
William Sommerwerck
Guest
Not if you disagree with the "moral majority".America is almost certainly the most stupid, parochial,
unsophisticated,
and just-plain-brainless Western society. What else is new?
Hey Will, Go Fuck Yourself with a splintered fence post.
Wow. That was even worse.
Yup, it sure was. But deserving. I'm tired of idiots Like Will dumping
on my country.
Still the most desired place for lots of folks (emigrants) from other
countries. Still the place to obtain an advanced education in almost all
fields of important and current knowledge. Still the place to offer those
with unique skills the freedom to exploit free markets. Still the place to
practice religious beliefs without undue duress.
Still the best place (in the Western world) for economic oppression. StillEat your heart out naysayers, but for most of us in the USA, it is
USA USA USA (Olympic cheer).
the best place for the "religious" to deny others their rights.
There's a simple reason why this country is so "successful". Since the
invention of agriculture and animal husbandry (7000+ years ago), we've lived
in a world dominated by economics. The US provides a relatively unfettered
"playground" for economic development. Because humans view economic success
as the most-important thing in life, they naturally gravitate toward the US.
But, ultimately, economic freedom (more or less) is ALL we have to offer.
Our society is vulgar and spiritually dead.
J
Jeff Liebermann
Guest
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 16:08:21 -0700, PlainBill@yawhoo.com wrote:
anyone, especially me.
1. The price. It was free.
2. I was bribed to proof and edit some training videos on Unix.
3. I felt culturally deprived. Friends would mention movies and
actors. I had no idea what they were talking about.
fan. I've built various no-fan schemes in the past. They worked but
all had their limitations and complications. These days, it's easy
enough with SBC (single board computah). I have a DVR integrated into
my DirecTV receiver, which makes an external DVR a marginal
improvement.
guide using the user interface from hell. When I find what I want,
usually more by luck than by intent, I can command my home DVR to
record the show. DirecTV sends the commands to the DVR via the
satellite. Also works via my iPhone. There are also some built in
algorithms for recording regularly scheduled shows (e.g. Mythbusters)
and automagically discarding ancient recordings to make room. There's
also an ethernet connection and associated PC program, that allows
playing shows on a PC that are stored on the DVR, or copying the show
from the DVR to the PC. DRM is epidemic, but not too horrible for
home use. I have plenty of complaints and improvement suggestions,
but basically, it works and does roughly what I want.
years ago. I've replaced it twice for $100 each time. There's a
$5/month charge for the DVR, which is mostly to pay for the program
guide.
tape. Duz that count?
I have an old Tivo 2 DVR with a lifetime subscription. NTSC video
only and useless for satellite or cable. It's going on eBay when I
have time to make sure it works and it's updated. I also has a
Philips something DVR and DVD burner combo. Plenty of DVR's but
nothing that's better than the one built into the DirecTV receiver.
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS
Something is wrong. This is Usenet and nobody ever agrees withI spent about 10 years without owning a TV and survived.
I have to agree with Jeff,
anyone, especially me.
Nicely done. What convinced me to get a TV was:I lived the first 18 years of my life
without a TV, and claim it has not distorted my personality, thus you
do not NEED a DVR.
1. The price. It was free.
2. I was bribed to proof and edit some training videos on Unix.
3. I felt culturally deprived. Friends would mention movies and
actors. I had no idea what they were talking about.
The limiting factor on home made DVR construction is the noise of theHowever, you DESIRE a means of recording TV
broadcasts. That can be accomplished by three methods - VCR, DVR
(either stand alone or a computer running something like Myth-TV), or
DVD recorder.
fan. I've built various no-fan schemes in the past. They worked but
all had their limitations and complications. These days, it's easy
enough with SBC (single board computah). I have a DVR integrated into
my DirecTV receiver, which makes an external DVR a marginal
improvement.
Yep. I can connect to the DirecTV web pile and search the programIt's been over 10 years since I used a VCR for time-shifting. At that
time you set the time it should start and stop recording and tuned it
to the channel. Perhaps things have advanced since then.
guide using the user interface from hell. When I find what I want,
usually more by luck than by intent, I can command my home DVR to
record the show. DirecTV sends the commands to the DVR via the
satellite. Also works via my iPhone. There are also some built in
algorithms for recording regularly scheduled shows (e.g. Mythbusters)
and automagically discarding ancient recordings to make room. There's
also an ethernet connection and associated PC program, that allows
playing shows on a PC that are stored on the DVR, or copying the show
from the DVR to the PC. DRM is epidemic, but not too horrible for
home use. I have plenty of complaints and improvement suggestions,
but basically, it works and does roughly what I want.
That's how the built in DVR works.Certainly with the switch to digital broadcasts you must either have
a separate converter box, or a recorder that incorporates an ATSC
tuner. Using a recorder (VCR, DVR, or DVD) that records the signal
without any analog conversion is preferable - the data stream is
compressed using the MPEG-4 algorithm.
The DirecTV DVR cost me nearly zero when I first signed up about 5A quick search for VCRs with ATSC tuners brought up a number of them,
all incorporating a DVD recorder. Typical prices were in the
$250-$300 range; a bit rich for my wallet.
years ago. I've replaced it twice for $100 each time. There's a
$5/month charge for the DVR, which is mostly to pay for the program
guide.
I have a VCR that will record 1280 hrs of security camera stuff perIt also brought up the
TiVo TCD746320 Premiere DVR at under $80, but that requires a monthly
subscription, something to be viewed with caution. And it brought up
the brite-View BV-980H Digital Antenna HD DVR for $200, no
subscription required. With a 320 Gig hard drive it can hold up to 39
hours of HD programming, or 450 hours of SD programming. That's
equivalent to 75 VHS tapes.
tape. Duz that count?
I have an old Tivo 2 DVR with a lifetime subscription. NTSC video
only and useless for satellite or cable. It's going on eBay when I
have time to make sure it works and it's updated. I also has a
Philips something DVR and DVD burner combo. Plenty of DVR's but
nothing that's better than the one built into the DirecTV receiver.
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS
J
Jeff Liebermann
Guest
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 08:21:40 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
<grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote:
include getting my science from the TV. I read plenty of non-fiction.
efficient and effective for the good of the governed. Better to let
the governments fight among each other than to direct their attention
at the people.
up. I once had a college professor announce that the college would be
a nice place to work were it not for the students.
published yearly. The books go somewhere besides libraries and
recycling centers.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Books_published_per_country_per_year>
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS
<grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote:
Me, me, me... I believe in "Learn by Destroying" which does notFind an "average" American who reads non-fiction books, * who knows anything
about anything that hasn't been presented to him or her via mass
communication or mass "culture". Find one who'd willing to consider points
of view other than his or her own.
include getting my science from the TV. I read plenty of non-fiction.
Sniff...You won't find many.
Correct. If we had a single world government, it might become tooBy the way, I don't believe in "one-world government". By the time human
beings progress to the point where it would workable without Fascist
coercion, there would be no need for it.
efficient and effective for the good of the governed. Better to let
the governments fight among each other than to direct their attention
at the people.
Right. The planet would be a nice place without people to mess thingsThe problem with the world is people. And I'm not the first to say it.
Tarzan even said it in a movie.
up. I once had a college professor announce that the college would be
a nice place to work were it not for the students.
That's difficult to believe considering the large number of books* I think this is what Howard Beale means when he says "Only 3% of you read
books".
published yearly. The books go somewhere besides libraries and
recycling centers.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Books_published_per_country_per_year>
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS
M
Michael A. Terrell
Guest
William Sommerwerck wrote:
Ampex used both. 'Quad' was used on their 2" machines. Helical scan
was used on their 1" machines.
--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
stratus46@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bc464648-01dc-483f-ad84-f1fe6a1959af@l24g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 21, 3:34 pm, myfathersson <licensedtoqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
I got my first VCR in 1977, a Sony Betamax personal purchase half off
for only $650. When I tell you VCRs are crap, its because they are
crap They were ALWAYS crap but it was all we had so it was "good".
Picture is poor, media wears out, machine wears out, tapes get
damaged, recording time is finite. Why would anyone want such a thing
when you don't have to use it?
Here we go again...
Yes, it makes a lot more sense to record on a DVR. The consumer VCR is both
technically and practically obsolete. That said...
Unlike VHS, the Betamax represented an excellent compromise between price
and quality. The first time I saw a Betamax recording (playing on Sony's
original 19" console TV/VCR combo), I didn't know whether it was live or
recorded. I used a Betamax for years for time-shifting, and I assure you,
the machine was not "crap", and the picture was in no way "poor".
Also, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi, I think)
was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
Ampex used both. 'Quad' was used on their 2" machines. Helical scan
was used on their 1" machines.
--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
M
Michael A. Terrell
Guest
spamtrap1888 wrote:
The Cartrivision system was developed by AVCO, at what later became
the Cincinnati, Electronics plant on Glendale-Milford road. The
prototypes and test fixtures were still on site a few years later, when
I did QA on the PRC-77 for CE. There were two types of cartridges. One
you could record on, and rewind. The other was play once only, then the
cartridge had to be returned to where you rented it so it could be
rewound on a separate machine before it could be rented out again.
--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
The video cassette recording system Cartrivision was introduced at the
Summer Consumer Electronics Show in 1970. Sold at first exclusively by
Sears retail stores, the system was noteworthy for being the first to
rent prerecorded movies -- by mail, making it a predecessor of
Netflix.
The Cartrivision system was developed by AVCO, at what later became
the Cincinnati, Electronics plant on Glendale-Milford road. The
prototypes and test fixtures were still on site a few years later, when
I did QA on the PRC-77 for CE. There were two types of cartridges. One
you could record on, and rewind. The other was play once only, then the
cartridge had to be returned to where you rented it so it could be
rewound on a separate machine before it could be rented out again.
--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
S
spamtrap1888
Guest
On Dec 22, 8:52 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net>
wrote:
covers the "modern helical-scan system" of which you speak.
wrote:
While Masterson's claims are drawn quite narrowly, Holt's first claimAlso, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi,
I think) was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
Helical scan tape recording was invented by RCA's Earl Masterson in
1950 (2,773,120). A good picture of the alpha wrap is shown in DC
resident Arthur W. Holt's patent 2919314, "Means for recording and/or
reproducing recorded high frequency signals," applied for in 1956. As
usual for that era, the Japanese merely copied and adapted American
inventions.
Fascinating.
What's interesting about this patent is that the head moves in a circle,
while the /tape/ moves in a helix. This is "backwards" to the way modern
helical-scan systems work.
covers the "modern helical-scan system" of which you speak.
Guest
On Dec 22, 8:39 am, spamtrap1888 <spamtrap1...@gmail.com> wrote:
issued in 1964 - not 1950.
G˛
I looked up the RCA / Masterson patent. It was submitted in 1959 andOn Dec 22, 2:55 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net
wrote:
stratu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bc464648-01dc-483f-ad84-f1fe6a1959af@l24g2000yqm.googlegroups.com....
On Dec 21, 3:34 pm, myfathersson <licensedtoqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
I got my first VCR in 1977, a Sony Betamax personal purchase half off
for only $650. When I tell you VCRs are crap, its because they are
crap They were ALWAYS crap but it was all we had so it was "good".
Picture is poor, media wears out, machine wears out, tapes get
damaged, recording time is finite. Why would anyone want such a thing
when you don't have to use it?
Here we go again...
Yes, it makes a lot more sense to record on a DVR. The consumer VCR is both
technically and practically obsolete. That said...
Unlike VHS, the Betamax represented an excellent compromise between price
and quality. The first time I saw a Betamax recording (playing on Sony's
original 19" console TV/VCR combo), I didn't know whether it was live or
recorded. I used a Betamax for years for time-shifting, and I assure you,
the machine was not "crap", and the picture was in no way "poor".
Also, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi, I think)
was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
Helical scan tape recording was invented by RCA's Earl Masterson in
1950 (2,773,120). A good picture of the alpha wrap is shown in DC
resident Arthur W. Holt's patent 2919314, "Means for recording and/or
reproducing recorded high frequency signals," applied for in 1956. As
usual for that era, the Japanese merely copied and adapted American
inventions.
The earliest date I can find a tape recording patent assigned to
Hitachi is 1969.
issued in 1964 - not 1950.
G˛
M
Mark Zacharias
Guest
"William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:jd0gmj$fsm$1@dont-email.me...
<snip>
still enjoying the benfits of modern society, on the planet.
(Possible exception - Australia?)
I would agree about "vulgar" (Jerry Springer, anyone?). The price we pay, I
suppose.
Mark Z.
news:jd0gmj$fsm$1@dont-email.me...
<snip>
And happens to be just about the closest thing to a free existence, whileOur society is vulgar and spiritually dead.
still enjoying the benfits of modern society, on the planet.
(Possible exception - Australia?)
I would agree about "vulgar" (Jerry Springer, anyone?). The price we pay, I
suppose.
Mark Z.
J
Jeff Liebermann
Guest
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 16:06:34 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
<grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote:
US didn't bother with the guild system, which was a European
exclusive. Our labor unions were run by organized crime, which was
somewhat of an improvement over being dominated by the government. In
the US, we offer the ability to fail and lose everything, while the
European philosophy seems to be to provide a "cushion" in the event of
failure. We can still open new banks, while in Europe, it's almost
impossible. Basically, you can still get rich (quick) in the US. The
opportunity to do so in Europe was replaced with a socialist failure
cushion. Each system has its benefits and supporters. The jury is
still out to determine which is best.
manipulation, price fixing, conspicuous consumption, junk bonds,
sub-prime loans, and creative finance. Our exploitation of various
foreign countries by plundering their resources is a fairly good
emulation of the British example in England and South Africa.
Opportunities for exploitation, err... investment, are still
available:
<http://news.starbucks.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=234>
Matthew 26:41
Writing a moral code is easy. We started with 10 commandment and
ended up with 613 rules and regulations.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_mitzvot>
Last time I looked at the IRS code, it was monsterous. That which
does not grow, soon dies.
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
<grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote:
Well, I don't feel particularly oppressed. In the distant past, theStill the best place (in the Western world) for economic oppression. Still
the best place for the "religious" to deny others their rights.
US didn't bother with the guild system, which was a European
exclusive. Our labor unions were run by organized crime, which was
somewhat of an improvement over being dominated by the government. In
the US, we offer the ability to fail and lose everything, while the
European philosophy seems to be to provide a "cushion" in the event of
failure. We can still open new banks, while in Europe, it's almost
impossible. Basically, you can still get rich (quick) in the US. The
opportunity to do so in Europe was replaced with a socialist failure
cushion. Each system has its benefits and supporters. The jury is
still out to determine which is best.
Yep. We invented robber barons, buying on margin, stock marketThere's a simple reason why this country is so "successful". Since the
invention of agriculture and animal husbandry (7000+ years ago), we've lived
in a world dominated by economics. The US provides a relatively unfettered
"playground" for economic development. Because humans view economic success
as the most-important thing in life, they naturally gravitate toward the US.
manipulation, price fixing, conspicuous consumption, junk bonds,
sub-prime loans, and creative finance. Our exploitation of various
foreign countries by plundering their resources is a fairly good
emulation of the British example in England and South Africa.
Opportunities for exploitation, err... investment, are still
available:
<http://news.starbucks.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=234>
"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak."But, ultimately, economic freedom (more or less) is ALL we have to offer.
Our society is vulgar and spiritually dead.
Matthew 26:41
Writing a moral code is easy. We started with 10 commandment and
ended up with 613 rules and regulations.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_mitzvot>
Last time I looked at the IRS code, it was monsterous. That which
does not grow, soon dies.
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
S
spamtrap1888
Guest
On Dec 23, 1:02 am, stratu...@yahoo.com wrote:
response. I'm referring to US Patent 2,773,120, applied for in 1950
and issued in 1956.
This is quite clever trolling, as its patent idiocy demands aOn Dec 22, 8:39 am, spamtrap1888 <spamtrap1...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Dec 22, 2:55 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net
wrote:
stratu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bc464648-01dc-483f-ad84-f1fe6a1959af@l24g2000yqm.googlegroups.com....
On Dec 21, 3:34 pm, myfathersson <licensedtoqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
I got my first VCR in 1977, a Sony Betamax personal purchase half off
for only $650. When I tell you VCRs are crap, its because they are
crap They were ALWAYS crap but it was all we had so it was "good".
Picture is poor, media wears out, machine wears out, tapes get
damaged, recording time is finite. Why would anyone want such a thing
when you don't have to use it?
Here we go again...
Yes, it makes a lot more sense to record on a DVR. The consumer VCR is both
technically and practically obsolete. That said...
Unlike VHS, the Betamax represented an excellent compromise between price
and quality. The first time I saw a Betamax recording (playing on Sony's
original 19" console TV/VCR combo), I didn't know whether it was live or
recorded. I used a Betamax for years for time-shifting, and I assure you,
the machine was not "crap", and the picture was in no way "poor".
Also, those Japanese VCR manufacturers all paid licensing fees to
Ampex. They shrunk and repackaged the concept. Does that qualify
as an invention?
Yes, because the Japanese helical-scan system (invented by Hitachi, I think)
was quite different from the Ampex quadruplex [sic] system.
Helical scan tape recording was invented by RCA's Earl Masterson in
1950 (2,773,120). A good picture of the alpha wrap is shown in DC
resident Arthur W. Holt's patent 2919314, "Means for recording and/or
reproducing recorded high frequency signals," applied for in 1956. As
usual for that era, the Japanese merely copied and adapted American
inventions.
The earliest date I can find a tape recording patent assigned to
Hitachi is 1969.
I looked up the RCA / Masterson patent. It was submitted in 1959 and
issued in 1964 - not 1950.
G˛
response. I'm referring to US Patent 2,773,120, applied for in 1950
and issued in 1956.
S
spamtrap1888
Guest
On Dec 23, 8:39 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
hold without formal structured training, passing a test, holding a
certificate, with mandated continuing education to keep it.
Distant past, nothing. There are very few jobs in Germany that one canOn Thu, 22 Dec 2011 16:06:34 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
grizzledgee...@comcast.net> wrote:
Still the best place (in the Western world) for economic oppression. Still
the best place for the "religious" to deny others their rights.
Well, I don't feel particularly oppressed. In the distant past, the
US didn't bother with the guild system, which was a European
exclusive.
hold without formal structured training, passing a test, holding a
certificate, with mandated continuing education to keep it.
M
myfathersson
Guest
On Dec 22, 6:08 pm, PlainB...@yawhoo.com wrote:
professional VCRs being invented in the anywhere, just mass acceptance
of VCRs as consumer items: This is borne out by the existence of
readily available Sony U-Matic machines before the Philips 1500. But
though my next door neighbour had one for consumer use, they were
hardly a consumer item! (and had no consumer features)
I note that no one has answered the question about what on earth those
USB ports on (eg) Motorola cable boxes in the States can be used for?
Are they really disabled?
Thanks for that PlainBill, clearly I was not making any comment aboutOn Thu, 22 Dec 2011 07:37:05 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com
wrote:
On Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:15:30 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
captainvideo462...@gmail.com> wrote:
And why PlainBill do I personally need all that stuff, because YOU say
I do? Lenny
Because all you really need is food, shelter, and clothing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_needs
How far you climb out of your cave largely depends on how far above
the subsistence level you feel comfortable. If glorified technical
poverty is your maximum level of achievement, then you probably do not
need a DVR.
http://www.google.com/search?q=minimalist+lifestyle&tbm=isch
If you obtain your entertainment in ways other than TV, then a DVR is
again wasted on your lifestyle[1]. If your philosophical or religious
convictions proscribe watching TV, then a DVR is not required.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_living
However, if you do watch TV, and find that convenience, time shifting,
and fast forward through commercials, are useful additions to your
lifestyle, then a DVR is required.
DVR Penetration Grows to 39.7% of Households, 42.2% of Viewers
http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/03/23/dvr-penetration-grows-to-....
[1] I spent about 10 years without owning a TV and survived.
I have to agree with Jeff, I lived the first 18 years of my life
without a TV, and claim it has not distorted my personality, thus you
do not NEED a DVR. However, you DESIRE a means of recording TV
broadcasts. That can be accomplished by three methods - VCR, DVR
(either stand alone or a computer running something like Myth-TV), or
DVD recorder.
It's been over 10 years since I used a VCR for time-shifting. At that
time you set the time it should start and stop recording and tuned it
to the channel. Perhaps things have advanced since then.
Certainly with the switch to digital broadcasts you must either have
a separate converter box, or a recorder that incorporates an ATSC
tuner. Using a recorder (VCR, DVR, or DVD) that records the signal
without any analog conversion is preferable - the data stream is
compressed using the MPEG-4 algorithm.
A quick search for VCRs with ATSC tuners brought up a number of them,
all incorporating a DVD recorder. Typical prices were in the
$250-$300 range; a bit rich for my wallet. It also brought up the
TiVo TCD746320 Premiere DVR at under $80, but that requires a monthly
subscription, something to be viewed with caution. And it brought up
the brite-View BV-980H Digital Antenna HD DVR for $200, no
subscription required. With a 320 Gig hard drive it can hold up to 39
hours of HD programming, or 450 hours of SD programming. That's
equivalent to 75 VHS tapes.
PlainBill
professional VCRs being invented in the anywhere, just mass acceptance
of VCRs as consumer items: This is borne out by the existence of
readily available Sony U-Matic machines before the Philips 1500. But
though my next door neighbour had one for consumer use, they were
hardly a consumer item! (and had no consumer features)
I note that no one has answered the question about what on earth those
USB ports on (eg) Motorola cable boxes in the States can be used for?
Are they really disabled?
W
William Sommerwerck
Guest
"spamtrap1888" <spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f9d1fcd9-5c4f-4227-8aac-8d01abb802d5@n13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 23, 8:39 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
fewer unemployed. Such a system would reduce the need for immigration.
news:f9d1fcd9-5c4f-4227-8aac-8d01abb802d5@n13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 23, 8:39 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
We need more of that in this country. There'd probably be less crime andOn Thu, 22 Dec 2011 16:06:34 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
grizzledgee...@comcast.net> wrote:
Still the best place (in the Western world) for economic oppression.
Still
the best place for the "religious" to deny others their rights.
Well, I don't feel particularly oppressed. In the distant past, the
US didn't bother with the guild system, which was a European
exclusive.
Distant past, nothing. There are very few jobs in Germany that one
can hold without formal structured training, passing a test, holding
a certificate, with mandated continuing education to keep it.
fewer unemployed. Such a system would reduce the need for immigration.
Guest
On Fri, 23 Dec 2011 10:34:00 -0800 (PST), myfathersson
<licensedtoquill@gmail.com> wrote:
intelligent guesses, however.
A possible use is it allows the cable company to provide (and charge
for) a 'premium' service that allows recording shows onto an extenal
hard drive.
A less likely one is that it is to allow a firmware upgrade,
diagnostic, or similar function that the cable provider does not want
to perform over the cable.
But most likely the designers said "You know, we could ad a USB port
to this thing for $2.18 per box, marketing could try to sell it as a
feature to the cable companies for $15 a box, and when they balk
marketing will discount the price to $5.00, so we still make a
profit."
PlainBill
<licensedtoquill@gmail.com> wrote:
the last cable box I had didn't have a USB port. I CAN make severalOn Dec 22, 6:08 pm, PlainB...@yawhoo.com wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 07:37:05 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com
wrote:
On Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:15:30 -0800 (PST), klem kedidelhopper
captainvideo462...@gmail.com> wrote:
And why PlainBill do I personally need all that stuff, because YOU say
I do? Lenny
Because all you really need is food, shelter, and clothing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_needs
How far you climb out of your cave largely depends on how far above
the subsistence level you feel comfortable. If glorified technical
poverty is your maximum level of achievement, then you probably do not
need a DVR.
http://www.google.com/search?q=minimalist+lifestyle&tbm=isch
If you obtain your entertainment in ways other than TV, then a DVR is
again wasted on your lifestyle[1]. If your philosophical or religious
convictions proscribe watching TV, then a DVR is not required.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_living
However, if you do watch TV, and find that convenience, time shifting,
and fast forward through commercials, are useful additions to your
lifestyle, then a DVR is required.
DVR Penetration Grows to 39.7% of Households, 42.2% of Viewers
http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/03/23/dvr-penetration-grows-to-...
[1] I spent about 10 years without owning a TV and survived.
I have to agree with Jeff, I lived the first 18 years of my life
without a TV, and claim it has not distorted my personality, thus you
do not NEED a DVR. However, you DESIRE a means of recording TV
broadcasts. That can be accomplished by three methods - VCR, DVR
(either stand alone or a computer running something like Myth-TV), or
DVD recorder.
It's been over 10 years since I used a VCR for time-shifting. At that
time you set the time it should start and stop recording and tuned it
to the channel. Perhaps things have advanced since then.
Certainly with the switch to digital broadcasts you must either have
a separate converter box, or a recorder that incorporates an ATSC
tuner. Using a recorder (VCR, DVR, or DVD) that records the signal
without any analog conversion is preferable - the data stream is
compressed using the MPEG-4 algorithm.
A quick search for VCRs with ATSC tuners brought up a number of them,
all incorporating a DVD recorder. Typical prices were in the
$250-$300 range; a bit rich for my wallet. It also brought up the
TiVo TCD746320 Premiere DVR at under $80, but that requires a monthly
subscription, something to be viewed with caution. And it brought up
the brite-View BV-980H Digital Antenna HD DVR for $200, no
subscription required. With a 320 Gig hard drive it can hold up to 39
hours of HD programming, or 450 hours of SD programming. That's
equivalent to 75 VHS tapes.
PlainBill
Thanks for that PlainBill, clearly I was not making any comment about
professional VCRs being invented in the anywhere, just mass acceptance
of VCRs as consumer items: This is borne out by the existence of
readily available Sony U-Matic machines before the Philips 1500. But
though my next door neighbour had one for consumer use, they were
hardly a consumer item! (and had no consumer features)
I note that no one has answered the question about what on earth those
USB ports on (eg) Motorola cable boxes in the States can be used for?
Are they really disabled?
I really wouldn't know, I've been using DirecTV for over a decade and
intelligent guesses, however.
A possible use is it allows the cable company to provide (and charge
for) a 'premium' service that allows recording shows onto an extenal
hard drive.
A less likely one is that it is to allow a firmware upgrade,
diagnostic, or similar function that the cable provider does not want
to perform over the cable.
But most likely the designers said "You know, we could ad a USB port
to this thing for $2.18 per box, marketing could try to sell it as a
feature to the cable companies for $15 a box, and when they balk
marketing will discount the price to $5.00, so we still make a
profit."
PlainBill
J
Jeff Liebermann
Guest
On Fri, 23 Dec 2011 10:06:01 -0800 (PST), spamtrap1888
<spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote:
generally ineffective mostly because NBC (nobody cares):
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_engineering#United_States_2>
<http://community.nspe.org/blogs/licensing/archive/2010/10/06/the-industrial-exemption-what-states-have-them-and-what-states-do-not.aspx>
Strictly speaking, I can't call myself an engineer in California
because the state does not have an P.E. industrial exemption (unless I
work for an electrical or communications utility). It's never been an
issue except when I've played expert witness in depositions.
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS
<spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote:
Yep. The US has its own version of the guild system. However, it'sOn Dec 23, 8:39 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2011 16:06:34 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
grizzledgee...@comcast.net> wrote:
Still the best place (in the Western world) for economic oppression. Still
the best place for the "religious" to deny others their rights.
Well, I don't feel particularly oppressed. In the distant past, the
US didn't bother with the guild system, which was a European
exclusive.
Distant past, nothing. There are very few jobs in Germany that one can
hold without formal structured training, passing a test, holding a
certificate, with mandated continuing education to keep it.
generally ineffective mostly because NBC (nobody cares):
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_engineering#United_States_2>
<http://community.nspe.org/blogs/licensing/archive/2010/10/06/the-industrial-exemption-what-states-have-them-and-what-states-do-not.aspx>
Strictly speaking, I can't call myself an engineer in California
because the state does not have an P.E. industrial exemption (unless I
work for an electrical or communications utility). It's never been an
issue except when I've played expert witness in depositions.
--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com jeffl@cruzio.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS