10 amp lead in a 15 amp socket

[Jaybee]

Hi all,
I need some expert advice on the new relocatable premises standard.


1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

Any help would be really appreciated.

 

[jdm]

Jaybee,

In NZ it is legal to plug a 10 amp extension board into a 15a socket as long
as it has a 15a plug on it ( I am not sure if a 15a plug to 10a socket is
legal )

A 10a plug to 15a socket is 100% illegal.

You might like to check with you local power authority but in my experience
they are as useless as tit's on a bull.

Regards

John


"Jaybee" <johnlbennetts@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:1145348640.602124.191550@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...

Hi all,
I need some expert advice on the new relocatable premises standard.


1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

Any help would be really appreciated.

 

[Mitchell]

As much as I know, (Not much)
You can't fit a 15amp plug in a 10amp socket as the earth 'prong'
is too fat. knowing that I would not push a 10Amp plug in a
15amp Socket as the earth 'prong' would not make contact so
there would be some safety issues.

So I would think carefully about what you are doing from the safety
point of view. Put a current sensing circuit breaker inline. So at least
there is some protection afforded. (RCD type.)

Mitchell..

 

[Ross Herbert]

On 18 Apr 2006 01:24:00 -0700, "Jaybee" <johnlbennetts@bigpond.com>
wrote:

Hi all,
I need some expert advice on the new relocatable premises standard.


1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.

There is no restriction on inserting a 10A plug into a 15A socket. The
socket is made to accept either a 10A plug or a 15A one.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

As long as the extension cordage meets the minimum requirements for
use with a 10A plug and socket then it can safely be used when plugged
into a 15A socket. The fact that your cable is rated for use with a
15A plug and socket means it will well and truly meet the minimum
requirement when used with 10A connectors at either end.

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

Any help would be really appreciated.

 

[Geoff C]

"Jaybee" <johnlbennetts@bigpond.com> wrote in
news:1145348640.602124.191550@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

Hi all,
I need some expert advice on the new relocatable premises standard.


1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

Any help would be really appreciated.

Sounds dodgy to me. This would be a fire hazard in most standards I have
seen because the wire size of 10 amp wire is smaller and may not be
guaranteed to blow a fuse/breaker in the event of a fault. The fact that
the "extension board" has a thermal breaker may not mean much... it may
not be tested by an eccredited body etc. Now, Australias elec product
safety laws are lax and maybe this is not explicitly illegal, I don't
know. But if you have a fire and the insurance inspector sees the setup,
the insurance company may choose to not pay up.

 

[Ross Herbert]

On Wed, 19 Apr 2006 04:03:57 GMT, Ross Herbert
<rherber1@bigpond.net.au> wrote:

On 18 Apr 2006 01:24:00 -0700, "Jaybee" <johnlbennetts@bigpond.com
wrote:

Hi all,
I need some expert advice on the new relocatable premises standard.


1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.


There is no restriction on inserting a 10A plug into a 15A socket. The
socket is made to accept either a 10A plug or a 15A one.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

As long as the extension cordage meets the minimum requirements for
use with a 10A plug and socket then it can safely be used when plugged
into a 15A socket. The fact that your cable is rated for use with a
15A plug and socket means it will well and truly meet the minimum
requirement when used with 10A connectors at either end.

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

Any help would be really appreciated.

Further to my response it dawned on me that the OP referred to
"re-locatable premises". This might imply that he is somehow involved
in building construction or demolition etc. There are more stringent
requirements for industrial circumstances and I would refer him to
some web pages
http://www.dir.qld.gov.au/electricalsafety/business/workers/types/construction/site/
http://www.dir.qld.gov.au/electricalsafety/business/workers/types/construction/cords/

While these are not detailed (you must pay to get the standards)they
point out that you can't use an extension cord longer than 15M for
re-locatable premises.

Also, with regard to extension leads. You can buy off the shelf
industrial leads made with 15A heavy duty cordage fitted with 10A plug
and socket in 20, 30 and 35M lengths. This means that point no. 2 is
answered by saying it is definitely legal, at least for general public
usage. It may not be legal where re-locatable premises are involved
due to the 15M limit on extension cords.

 

[Jasen Betts]

On 2006-04-18, Mitchell <mmoules@bigpond.net.au> wrote:

As much as I know, (Not much)
You can't fit a 15amp plug in a 10amp socket as the earth 'prong'
is too fat. knowing that I would not push a 10Amp plug in a
15amp Socket as the earth 'prong' would not make contact so
there would be some safety issues.

So I would think carefully about what you are doing from the safety
point of view. Put a current sensing circuit breaker inline. So at least
there is some protection afforded. (RCD type.)

AIUI the 15A plug had a wider (but not thicker) earth prong.

plugging a 10A plug into a 15A socket is harmless as the earth contacts in the
socket wil make sufficient contact with the flats of the pin

If it was risky they'd have made it so that it didn't fit.

going the other way is risky,


Bye.
Jasen

 

[Dave]

John,

The legality will depend on the State you use the device, and legality
aside, if the device became unsafe and caused a fire or injury it could
become an issue of negligence. My opinions are based on "is it wise to
do...." rather than "is it legal..."

1. Is it legal (and safe) to plug a 10 amp extension board containing a
10 amp thermal breaker into a 15 amp socket.

Yes, in normal circumstances it is safe to do so.

2. Is it then legal to plug a 15 amp lead with a 10 amp plug on one end
and a 15 amp socket on the other end and connected it to a caravan.

No, it is not safe to use an under-rated plug/board as a component of the
feed to the caravan unless you know the maximum load drawn by the van. If
you know the load and it is always less than 10A RMS then it should be
protected by the over-load device in the power board. This assumes the lead
lengths are the same as supplied out-of-the-package and you haven't extended
them.

Unless you have only low consumption appliances then stick to 15A throughout
just to be sure. A domestic kettle, heater, large toaster, etc. can
individually draw up to 2000W (thats over 8A). So running any two (ignoring
other loads) could give problems.

A note about power boards. Be aware that many brands/types of thermal
breakers fitted to power boards will not operate until the load is greater
than 130% of the rating of the breaker, At up to 160% of the rating the
operating time can be quite long. If the breaker doesn't trip it does NOT
mean the load is OK - measure it. I have seen many power boards that are
very marginal with regard to their ability to withstand over-loads that are
within the uncertain part of the breakers trip-time curve. So running 13A
out of a 10A power board may be possible but definitely not safe (even
though it is supposed to be).

The extension board would be fully contained within an approved weather
proof distrubution box with a RCD and 15 amp breaker.

I guess you mean the point of supply is 15A rated and in a weather and RCD
protected switch board/box - and you are placing your extension board in the
same box.

 

[John G]

"Geoff C" <notinterestedin@spam.com> wrote in message
news:Xns97AA9438E8B76testnospamcom@61.8.0.29...
.. Now, Australias elec product

safety laws are lax and maybe this is not explicitly illegal, I don't
know. But if you have a fire and the insurance inspector sees the
setup,
the insurance company may choose to not pay up.

Geoff,
I guess you live in the United Slack Americas where anyone can do any
thing and the wiring standards are abysmal.

No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.
We can all have 3 phase if we want it and the dodgy neutral problems of
the USA don't exist because domestic installations use one phase and the
neutral and not a funny floating 240 volts with a maybe centre tap like
the antiquated Edison system.
--
John G

Wot's Your Real Problem?

 

[Dave]

No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.

What the OP wanted to do did not require a license as it is not fixed
wiring. There is no license required to buy and assemble your own extension
lead from approved components (plug/socket/cord). Likewise butchering
pre-assembled extension leads is not prohibited, although it may be dum in
some instances.

The rules are far from uniform depending on what you want to do, whereabouts
you want to do it and what state you are in at the time. However I agree it
is better than many places overseas, although it is over-restrictive in some
aspects.

 

[Dave]

plugging a 10A plug into a 15A socket is harmless as the earth contacts in
the
socket wil make sufficient contact with the flats of the pin

If it was risky they'd have made it so that it didn't fit.

It is intended to fit.

going the other way is risky,

Which is why it is intended they do not fit this way around.

 

[John G]

"Dave" <nospam4me@grrrrrrr.com> wrote in message
news:lbo1g.10105$vy1.8283@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia
and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.

What the OP wanted to do did not require a license as it is not fixed
wiring. There is no license required to buy and assemble your own
extension
lead from approved components (plug/socket/cord). Likewise butchering
pre-assembled extension leads is not prohibited, although it may be
dum in
some instances.

The rules are far from uniform depending on what you want to do,
whereabouts
you want to do it and what state you are in at the time. However I
agree it
is better than many places overseas, although it is over-restrictive
in some
aspects.


I think you will find messing with leads is not permitted by the rules

but is often done.

And having a 15 amp socket on a lead with a 10 amp plug as suggested by
the OP is certainly illegal.
--
John G

Wot's Your Real Problem?

 

[Geoff C]

"John G" <Greentest@ozemail.com.au> wrote in news:4446095c$0$16683
$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au:

"Geoff C" <notinterestedin@spam.com> wrote in message
news:Xns97AA9438E8B76testnospamcom@61.8.0.29...
. Now, Australias elec product
safety laws are lax and maybe this is not explicitly illegal, I don't
know. But if you have a fire and the insurance inspector sees the
setup,
the insurance company may choose to not pay up.

Geoff,
I guess you live in the United Slack Americas where anyone can do any
thing and the wiring standards are abysmal.

No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.
We can all have 3 phase if we want it and the dodgy neutral problems of
the USA don't exist because domestic installations use one phase and
the
neutral and not a funny floating 240 volts with a maybe centre tap like
the antiquated Edison system.

No, live in Australia and I made no comment on wiring systems laws, only
PRODUCT safety where we have no real system to speak of such as UL, CSA,
VDE etc.

 

[Virus]

"Dave" <nospam4me@grrrrrrr.com> wrote in message
news:lbo1g.10105$vy1.8283@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.

What the OP wanted to do did not require a license as it is not fixed
wiring. There is no license required to buy and assemble your own
extension
lead from approved components (plug/socket/cord).

Wrong!

To assemble your own extension lead you MUST have at least Restricted
Electrical License.
This is LAW!

 

[Chas]

"Virus" <virus@hatemail.com> wrote in message
news:4446c580$0$7603$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

"Dave" <nospam4me@grrrrrrr.com> wrote in message
news:lbo1g.10105$vy1.8283@news-server.bigpond.net.au...


No electrical work is permitted by unlicensed workers in Australia
and
the rules are very uniform and work very well.

What the OP wanted to do did not require a license as it is not fixed
wiring. There is no license required to buy and assemble your own
extension
lead from approved components (plug/socket/cord).

Wrong!

To assemble your own extension lead you MUST have at least Restricted
Electrical License.
This is LAW!

State laws vary. The above is correct for Qld and Vic, but is not the case

in NSW. I do not know the regulations for the other ststes.
--
Regards,

Chas.

(To email me replace 'xxx' with tango papa golf)