ZYNQ temperature

[John Larkin]

Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

[glen herrmannsfeldt]

John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

Well, all chips have a high temperature shutdown, but you mean
one that was designed in, right?

-- glen

 

[Robert Swindells]

On Mon, 11 May 2015 13:10:43 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 May 2015 10:59:38 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:


Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

I did find this:

ds190-Zynq-7000-Overview.pdf

"A user-specified limit (for example, 100°C) can be used to initiate an
automatic power-down."

I wonder what we specified!

There are references in ug585 (the Zynq TRM) to ug480 for the temperature
sensor stuff, it looks to be common to all the 7 series.

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 11 May 2015 18:07:00 +0000 (UTC), glen herrmannsfeldt
<gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote:

John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

Well, all chips have a high temperature shutdown, but you mean
one that was designed in, right?

-- glen

Yeah, something it might recover from. As it seems to do.




--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 11 May 2015 10:59:38 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

I did find this:

ds190-Zynq-7000-Overview.pdf

"A user-specified limit (for example, 100°C) can be used to initiate
an automatic power-down."

I wonder what we specified!


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 11 May 2015 20:53:11 +0000 (UTC), Robert Swindells
<rjs@fdy2.co.uk> wrote:

On Mon, 11 May 2015 13:10:43 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 May 2015 10:59:38 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:


Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

I did find this:

ds190-Zynq-7000-Overview.pdf

"A user-specified limit (for example, 100°C) can be used to initiate an
automatic power-down."

I wonder what we specified!

There are references in ug585 (the Zynq TRM) to ug480 for the temperature
sensor stuff, it looks to be common to all the 7 series.

We epoxied a pin-fin heat sink to the top, and added a fan. That helps
a lot.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Thermal/FPGA_Fan.JPG



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:

Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.

looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to load the PL

30.3.6 Critical Over-temperature Alarm
Note: This feature sends an interrupt status to the PS and causes an automatic shutdown feature for
the PL side of the Zynq-7000 device if enabled. Th e PL shutdown is enabled via the bitstream and the
PL will only come out of power-down if th e over-temperature alarm goes inactive or a
reconfiguration occurs.
The on-chip temperature measurement is used for critical temperature warnings. The default over
temperature threshold is 125°C. This threshold is used when the contents of the OT Upper Alarm
register (listed in UG480) have not been configured. When the die temperature exceeds the
threshold set in the XADC's Control register, the ov er-temperature alarm (OT) becomes active. The OT
signal resets when the die temperature has fallen below set threshold.
The OT alarm can also be used to automatically power down the PL upon activation. The OT alarm can
be disabled by writing a 1 to the OT bit in the XADC's Configuration register.
Note: these registers are in the XADC and are accessible using the DRP.

-Lasse

 

[Rob Gaddi]

On Tue, 12 May 2015 21:08:09 -0400, rickman wrote:

On 5/12/2015 4:57 PM, lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:
Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.


looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to
load the PL

Without me digging into the data sheet myself, can you tell me what the
PL and PS are?

Programmable Logic (FPGA side of things) and Processor System (hard ARM
processor and some peripherals).

--
Rob Gaddi, Highland Technology -- www.highlandtechnology.com
Email address domain is currently out of order. See above to fix.

 

[rickman]

On 5/12/2015 4:57 PM, lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:

Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.


looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to load the PL

30.3.6 Critical Over-temperature Alarm
Note: This feature sends an interrupt status to the PS and causes an automatic shutdown feature for
the PL side of the Zynq-7000 device if enabled. Th e PL shutdown is enabled via the bitstream and the
PL will only come out of power-down if th e over-temperature alarm goes inactive or a
reconfiguration occurs.
The on-chip temperature measurement is used for critical temperature warnings. The default over
temperature threshold is 125°C. This threshold is used when the contents of the OT Upper Alarm
register (listed in UG480) have not been configured. When the die temperature exceeds the
threshold set in the XADC's Control register, the ov er-temperature alarm (OT) becomes active. The OT
signal resets when the die temperature has fallen below set threshold.
The OT alarm can also be used to automatically power down the PL upon activation. The OT alarm can
be disabled by writing a 1 to the OT bit in the XADC's Configuration register.
Note: these registers are in the XADC and are accessible using the DRP.

Without me digging into the data sheet myself, can you tell me what the
PL and PS are?

--

Rick

 

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 12 May 2015 13:57:47 -0700 (PDT),
lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:

Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.


looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to load the PL

30.3.6 Critical Over-temperature Alarm
Note: This feature sends an interrupt status to the PS and causes an automatic shutdown feature for
the PL side of the Zynq-7000 device if enabled. Th e PL shutdown is enabled via the bitstream and the
PL will only come out of power-down if th e over-temperature alarm goes inactive or a
reconfiguration occurs.
The on-chip temperature measurement is used for critical temperature warnings. The default over
temperature threshold is 125°C. This threshold is used when the contents of the OT Upper Alarm
register (listed in UG480) have not been configured. When the die temperature exceeds the
threshold set in the XADC's Control register, the ov er-temperature alarm (OT) becomes active. The OT
signal resets when the die temperature has fallen below set threshold.
The OT alarm can also be used to automatically power down the PL upon activation. The OT alarm can
be disabled by writing a 1 to the OT bit in the XADC's Configuration register.
Note: these registers are in the XADC and are accessible using the DRP.

-Lasse

It's probably shutting down at 125C, without our specifically
programming any temperature.

Extensive searching, by us and by Avnet, finds no fan that matches the
hole spacing on the MicroZed board. So we'll fab a little aluminum
adapter plate and use a standard fan. With a pin-fin heat sink glued
to the 7020 FPGA, and the fan blowing down on that, we can run at 100C
ambient.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

[rickman]

On 5/12/2015 9:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:

It's probably shutting down at 125C, without our specifically
programming any temperature.

Extensive searching, by us and by Avnet, finds no fan that matches the
hole spacing on the MicroZed board. So we'll fab a little aluminum
adapter plate and use a standard fan. With a pin-fin heat sink glued
to the 7020 FPGA, and the fan blowing down on that, we can run at 100C
ambient.

Reminds me of an array processor I worked on in the early 80's. It had
ECL gate arrays in ceramic PGA packages with a heat sink on each chip
and a specially designed plenum which slid over each one to direct air
across the heat sink. This machine was as fast as a CRAY-1 and only a
few years later.

--

Rick

 

[kkoorndyk]

On Tuesday, May 12, 2015 at 9:42:58 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:

On Tue, 12 May 2015 13:57:47 -0700 (PDT),
lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:

Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.


looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to load the PL

30.3.6 Critical Over-temperature Alarm
Note: This feature sends an interrupt status to the PS and causes an automatic shutdown feature for
the PL side of the Zynq-7000 device if enabled. Th e PL shutdown is enabled via the bitstream and the
PL will only come out of power-down if th e over-temperature alarm goes inactive or a
reconfiguration occurs.
The on-chip temperature measurement is used for critical temperature warnings. The default over
temperature threshold is 125°C. This threshold is used when the contents of the OT Upper Alarm
register (listed in UG480) have not been configured. When the die temperature exceeds the
threshold set in the XADC's Control register, the ov er-temperature alarm (OT) becomes active. The OT
signal resets when the die temperature has fallen below set threshold.
The OT alarm can also be used to automatically power down the PL upon activation. The OT alarm can
be disabled by writing a 1 to the OT bit in the XADC's Configuration register.
Note: these registers are in the XADC and are accessible using the DRP.

-Lasse

It's probably shutting down at 125C, without our specifically
programming any temperature.

Extensive searching, by us and by Avnet, finds no fan that matches the
hole spacing on the MicroZed board. So we'll fab a little aluminum
adapter plate and use a standard fan. With a pin-fin heat sink glued
to the 7020 FPGA, and the fan blowing down on that, we can run at 100C
ambient.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

The MicroZed has a -I part on it, right? Those parts are spec'd at a max junction temp of 100 C. You need the Expanded temperature grade parts (Q) to get the 125 C junction temps.

 

[John Larkin]

On Wed, 13 May 2015 05:37:17 -0700 (PDT), kkoorndyk
<kris.koorndyk@gmail.com> wrote:

On Tuesday, May 12, 2015 at 9:42:58 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 12 May 2015 13:57:47 -0700 (PDT),
lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:

Den mandag den 11. maj 2015 kl. 19.59.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
Does anyone know if the ZYNQ chips have an internal high-temperature
shutdown? They are behaving like they do.


looks like you have to enable it (it may be default) and you have to load the PL

30.3.6 Critical Over-temperature Alarm
Note: This feature sends an interrupt status to the PS and causes an automatic shutdown feature for
the PL side of the Zynq-7000 device if enabled. Th e PL shutdown is enabled via the bitstream and the
PL will only come out of power-down if th e over-temperature alarm goes inactive or a
reconfiguration occurs.
The on-chip temperature measurement is used for critical temperature warnings. The default over
temperature threshold is 125°C. This threshold is used when the contents of the OT Upper Alarm
register (listed in UG480) have not been configured. When the die temperature exceeds the
threshold set in the XADC's Control register, the ov er-temperature alarm (OT) becomes active. The OT
signal resets when the die temperature has fallen below set threshold.
The OT alarm can also be used to automatically power down the PL upon activation. The OT alarm can
be disabled by writing a 1 to the OT bit in the XADC's Configuration register.
Note: these registers are in the XADC and are accessible using the DRP.

-Lasse

It's probably shutting down at 125C, without our specifically
programming any temperature.

Extensive searching, by us and by Avnet, finds no fan that matches the
hole spacing on the MicroZed board. So we'll fab a little aluminum
adapter plate and use a standard fan. With a pin-fin heat sink glued
to the 7020 FPGA, and the fan blowing down on that, we can run at 100C
ambient.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

The MicroZed has a -I part on it, right? Those parts are spec'd at a max junction temp of 100 C. You need the Expanded temperature grade parts (Q) to get the 125 C junction temps.

It's 99% likely that all the chips come off the same wafer. The faster
ones may get binned as the high-temp versions.

The real issue is timing margins, and our fastest clock is only 128
MHz.

(We buy two different Altera parts, one with twice the logic cells and
RAM and price and stuff. They are actually identical, run the same
bitstreams compiled for either part.)

Here's the fan, with its adapter plate. The box runs fine at 100C
ambient. Next time we recompile the design, in a couple of months
maybe, we'll bring out the chip temperature sensor to see how hot it
actually is inside there.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Thermal/Uzed_Fan_Top.JPG

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Thermal/Uzed_Fan_Side.JPG

It's really insane that we should have to do this.

I once built and calibrated a ring oscillator to measure FPGA chip
temperature. That's another story.

--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 6:37:19 AM UTC-6, kkoorndyk wrote:
> The MicroZed has a -I part on it, right? Those parts are spec'd at a max junction temp of 100 C. You need the Expanded temperature grade parts (Q) to get the 125 C junction temps.

MicroZed can be purchased off the shelf with either a -C or -I. A -Q is possible through a custom build by contacting customize at avnet dot com

Bryan

 

Den torsdag den 14. maj 2015 kl. 23.53.37 UTC+2 skrev Tomas D.:

I don't have the measurements, but it seems like it's a very common cooler
among motherboards:
http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/msi/k9n4-sli/cooler.jpg


Here it is:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Northbridge-motherboard-graphics-heatsink-6cm-pitch-40-40MM-ultra-quiet-fan/1714057574.html

Maybe fits the size?

Regards
Tomas D.

not even close

the mounting fan holes on the Microzed is 2mm, and the diagonal spacing
is ~31.5mm, that is some where between a 25x25mm and 30x30mm fan

and the heatsink has to fit in a ~17x17mm footprint because there are caps
that are taller than the Zynq right next to it

-Lasse

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 14 May 2015 09:45:11 -0700 (PDT), bryan.at.avnet@gmail.com
wrote:

On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 6:37:19 AM UTC-6, kkoorndyk wrote:
The MicroZed has a -I part on it, right? Those parts are spec'd at a max junction temp of 100 C. You need the Expanded temperature grade parts (Q) to get the 125 C junction temps.

MicroZed can be purchased off the shelf with either a -C or -I. A -Q is possible through a custom build by contacting customize at avnet dot com

Bryan

We are buying AES-Z7MB-7Z020-SOM-G. I'm not sure which version of the
FPGA is on that.

Seems fine at 100C ambient, with our fan. I couldn't persuade the
engineer to crank the temperature any higher. I like to test things to
destruction.

Nobody at Avnet wants to discuss the fan-mount hole spacing, or name a
fan that fits.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

Den fredag den 15. maj 2015 kl. 04.58.36 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:

On Thu, 14 May 2015 16:55:06 -0700 (PDT),
lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com wrote:

Den torsdag den 14. maj 2015 kl. 23.53.37 UTC+2 skrev Tomas D.:
I don't have the measurements, but it seems like it's a very common cooler
among motherboards:
http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/msi/k9n4-sli/cooler.jpg


Here it is:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Northbridge-motherboard-graphics-heatsink-6cm-pitch-40-40MM-ultra-quiet-fan/1714057574.html

Maybe fits the size?

Regards
Tomas D.

not even close

the mounting fan holes on the Microzed is 2mm, and the diagonal spacing
is ~31.5mm, that is some where between a 25x25mm and 30x30mm fan

and the heatsink has to fit in a ~17x17mm footprint because there are caps
that are taller than the Zynq right next to it

The hole spacing may be English units, namely 1.25"

yeh, but they aren't normally spec'ed by the diagnal

I did look at a lot of CPU cooler fans. There are many, many hole
spacings, except that one.

yeh, a 25x25 fan is 20x20 holes, a 30x30 is 24x24mm

the microzed need ~22x22 mm

We'll just order a bucket of those adapter plates and get on with our
lives.

I'd make the plate bigger so it could use the four mounting holes, those
2mm holes are bit small

We're gluing a Cool Innovations pin-fin sink to the top of the FPGA
and blowing air down on that.

Without the forced air, the pin fins are useless. But the base of the
heat sink spreads heat laterally out from the central hot-spot (a flat
metal plate works the same) and cuts junction temp by 5C or so.

we have a fan mounted vertically in our box so it blows air across the
top and bottom of the PCB, even with out a heatsink I think it drops
the temp 20'C

-Lasse

 

Den fredag den 15. maj 2015 kl. 14.38.01 UTC+2 skrev Tomas D.:

Without the forced air, the pin fins are useless. But the base of the
heat sink spreads heat laterally out from the central hot-spot (a flat
metal plate works the same) and cuts junction temp by 5C or so.

It seems like the best solution for you would be your own board. Maybe worth
outsourcing that? You know you're overpaying for that board from Avnet, plus
that heatsink solution... Not technological I'd say.

Tomas D.

Depends on how many you need

The pcb needs blind microvias, 8~10 layers, tracks to DDR RAM need to be
matched to a few millimeters. So before you have made the layout and sourced all the components and have the thing build the microzed might seem like a bargain.


-Lasse

 

[Tomas D.]

Without the forced air, the pin fins are useless. But the base of the
heat sink spreads heat laterally out from the central hot-spot (a flat
metal plate works the same) and cuts junction temp by 5C or so.

It seems like the best solution for you would be your own board. Maybe worth
outsourcing that? You know you're overpaying for that board from Avnet, plus
that heatsink solution... Not technological I'd say.

Tomas D.

 

[John Larkin]

On Fri, 15 May 2015 13:37:58 +0100, "Tomas D." <mailsoc@gmial.com>
wrote:

Without the forced air, the pin fins are useless. But the base of the
heat sink spreads heat laterally out from the central hot-spot (a flat
metal plate works the same) and cuts junction temp by 5C or so.

It seems like the best solution for you would be your own board. Maybe worth
outsourcing that? You know you're overpaying for that board from Avnet, plus
that heatsink solution... Not technological I'd say.

Tomas D.

The uZed makes sense for low-volume, complex, relatively high-priced
products, 10 to maybe 50 units a year. It has the SOC, flash, SDcard,
DRAM, gB Ethernet, USB, power supplies, Linux, all that done and
working. The two boxes that we've done used all of that stuff. The
real downside is the ghastly Xilinx development software and horrible
support.

Future simpler products that have volume potential, we'll probably
switch over from our current habits (separate NXP ARM and Altera
chips) to an Altera SOC, now that they are available.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/PCBs/TEM2_FPGA.jpg

The two-chip thing works, but it wastes a lot of FPGA balls to provide
CPU access, and the FPGA register access is only 16 bits wide,
asynchronous and slow.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com