XML and spice

[Insane And Lazy]

I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
input instead of the standard netlists?

 

[Stuart Brorson]

Insane And Lazy <insane@and.lazy> wrote:
: I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
: past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
: input instead of the standard netlists?

I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
or eased by using XML?

Stuart

 

[Insane and Lazy]

I was never on the XML bandwagon, but it does allow for a well defined
ASCII file format, and there are lots of parsers out there for it. Also,
I saw a reference on the Parametric Technology website about a public
XML DTD associated with their Pro/ENGINEER Routed Systems Designer, but I
can't find where that public specification is actually available.

From: Stuart Brorson (sdb@cloud9.net)
Subject: Re: XML and spice

Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
Date: 2004-08-29 17:17:40 PST

I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
or eased by using XML?

Stuart

From: Mantra (mymantra@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: XML and spice

Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
Date: 2004-08-29 20:17:37 PST

I know of none, but it wouldn't be hard to write a SAX-based parser
that could translate from some hypothetical, as-yet-undefined
DTD/Schema to a "standard" SPICE netlist.

MM

Insane And Lazy wrote:

I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
input instead of the standard netlists?

 

[Stuart Brorson]

SPICE defines both a program and a netlist file format. The file
format is ASCII, compact, and is well entrenched. Since the file
format is ASCII, SPICE netlists are human readable, which -- besides
the ready availability of parsers -- is the only real advantage to
XML. Currently existing SPICE simulators have parsers built in which
already read and parse the format.

It is true that lots of XML parsers are out there. However, that's
only 1/100th the job performed when reading in a SPICE netlist. The
other 99/100th involves filling out the circuit and simulation data
structures which SPICE uses to do its computations, and then solving
the matrix equations iteratively. That means that just having
an XML parser in hand is barely a beginning to writing a circuit
simulator.

Finallly, there are zillions of SPICE models already out there for
useful components. Unless there is a really something new and
astounding whiich you can do with an XML format, it's unlikely that
people will ever change.

Stuart



Insane and Lazy <insane@and.lazy> wrote:
: I was never on the XML bandwagon, but it does allow for a well defined
: ASCII file format, and there are lots of parsers out there for it. Also,
: I saw a reference on the Parametric Technology website about a public
: XML DTD associated with their Pro/ENGINEER Routed Systems Designer, but I
: can't find where that public specification is actually available.



:> From: Stuart Brorson (sdb@cloud9.net)
:> Subject: Re: XML and spice
:>
:> Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
:> Date: 2004-08-29 17:17:40 PST
:>
:> I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
:> simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
:> or eased by using XML?
:>
:> Stuart
:>



:> From: Mantra (mymantra@yahoo.com)
:> Subject: Re: XML and spice
:>
:> Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
:> Date: 2004-08-29 20:17:37 PST
:>
:> I know of none, but it wouldn't be hard to write a SAX-based parser
:> that could translate from some hypothetical, as-yet-undefined
:> DTD/Schema to a "standard" SPICE netlist.
:>
:> MM
:>
: Insane And Lazy wrote:

:> I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
:> past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
:> input instead of the standard netlists?

 

[Svenn Are Bjerkem]

In article <10j4sfekerthnfb@corp.supernews.com>,
Stuart Brorson <sdb@cloud9.net> wrote:

I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
or eased by using XML?

The use of SPICE-XML as a common place for models, topology and
parameters for analog circuitry. Lack of topology info in SPICE is a
real drawback.

You could theoretically read a circuit definition into a program without
the need of writing a spice parser yourself. There are enough libraries
for XML parsing out there, let it be SAX or DOM.

Another thing that is not so evil with XML is that you are allowed to
insert whatever *additional* information you would like to. XML say that
you have to treat data you don't need well and leave it alone. There are
enough tries to add information in SPICE netlist as secert codes in the
comments.

XML is an extreme overhead on the functionality of SPICE as a hardware
description language, and replacing the structure of SPICE with that of
XML just to make it XML is, in my opinion, not a reason to change.

--
Svenn