Which Environment for Xilinx Design?

[Marcus Schaemann]

Hello,

I'm supposed to set up a new VHDL/FPGA lab at our university. But I'm
unsure which operation system and programming solution to use.
Maybe some of you have experience setting up a lab and can answer some
questions.

We already have the Xilinx ISE Software 6.1i for PC/Solaris/Linux and
Synopsys Software for Solaris and Linux through a Europractice license.
We also have an "old" DLC4 and XC4005, but I guess it's not worth trying
to make that work. (As far as I could find out, DLC4 is not supported
anymore even for ISE 4.2.)

So here are my questions:

1. Which operating system supplies the best performance/environment for
Xilinx development?
I read that the supplied ModelSim II XE works only on PCs, not on
Solaris or Linux. So would you prefer a PC, because of the included
simulation environment?

2. If a Solaris/Linux environment is concerned, which simulator is
available/usable? Is Synopsys' scirocco usable?

3. Which Download Cable would you recommend? Does the Parallel Cable
only work with a PC (I read that somewhere)?
Or would you prefer the Multilinx Cable? (If so, why?)

4. Regarding the programming of the FPGA, would you recommend a separate
design/program environment (e.g. Some Solaris Workstations for
design, and one PC just for programming and testing on a FPGA)?

I hope someone can enlighten me a bit!

Regards,

Marcus

 

[Eric Crabill]

Hi,

I set up and maintain a lab at San Jose State University.

1. Which operating system supplies the best performance
environment for Xilinx development? I read that the
supplied ModelSim II XE works only on PCs, not on
Solaris or Linux. So would you prefer a PC, because
of the included simulation environment?

I have a strong preference for Windows 2000. Yes, the
availability of CAD tools is decent but beyond that, your
university probably has a site license for other Microsoft
products, like Word and Powerpoint. If you install these,
the lab is also good for writing reports, etc.

Originally, the department was maintaining the lab, but
every week another machine would get corrupted because
students treat lab equipment like their personal property.
We had all kind of viruses, porn, broken iSE installs.
It got to the point where I had 6 functional machines
out of 16, and it impacted my ability to teach the class.
Also, I felt it left a bad impression on students, I want
their first use of Xilinx FPGAs to be positive.

Over one summer, I configured all 16 machines in the lab
identically (W2K, MS office, Acrobat, Xilinx iSE, etc...)
and then installed DriveShield, which you can read about:
http://www.centuriontech.com

This "restores" the disk to how I left it each time the
power is cycled. The lab has been up and running, bullet
proof, for two years now. The initial setup was some work
but it has really paid off. I highly recommend DriveShield!

3. Which Download Cable would you recommend? Does the
Parallel Cable only work with a PC (I read that somewhere)?
Or would you prefer the Multilinx Cable? (If so, why?)

Don't use any cables. They are easy to break and easy to
steal. Instead, buy prototyping boards that have this
function integrated. You can get boards like this from
Digilent, http://www.digilentinc.com All that is required
is a standard parallel cable (comes with the board).

Eric

 

[PO Laprise]

As a recent student, and having strong preferences toward the *NIX and
open source philosophies, I feel the need to counter-balance some of the
points made:

Eric Crabill wrote:

1. Which operating system supplies the best performance
environment for Xilinx development? I read that the
supplied ModelSim II XE works only on PCs, not on
Solaris or Linux. So would you prefer a PC, because
of the included simulation environment?


I have a strong preference for Windows 2000. Yes, the
availability of CAD tools is decent but beyond that, your
university probably has a site license for other Microsoft
products, like Word and Powerpoint. If you install these,
the lab is also good for writing reports, etc.

The OpenOffice suite is more than good enough for 99% of users, is free,
and is multi-platform. And anyway, everyone in University should be
learning LaTeX . And anyway, you don't need as performant a machine
for writing reports as for synthesis and simulation, so unless you have
computers to spare, it might not be a good idea to encourage people to
write reports on these machines (we have separate labs for general
purpose use).
As to CAD tools, ISE 6.1 is available for Linux, Solaris, and Windows.
I would recommend that you not limit your students to Modelsim XE, but
instead get a site license. Mentor Graphics has a University Program
that will provide you with rebates on these. Using FlexLM, the licenses
will be available from anywhere on the network (independant of the
machine's OS), which allows more flexibility. Using this setup, we have
Modelsim SE running on both Windows 2000 and RedHat boxes. An added
bonus to *NIX boxes is that the programs can be run remotely, meaning
that the computers can be shared by different groups simultaneously. I
also always appreciated not having to physically go to the lab just to
run that one simulation that I had forgotten to run during my lab period...

Originally, the department was maintaining the lab, but
every week another machine would get corrupted because
students treat lab equipment like their personal property.
We had all kind of viruses, porn, broken iSE installs.
It got to the point where I had 6 functional machines
out of 16, and it impacted my ability to teach the class.
Also, I felt it left a bad impression on students, I want
their first use of Xilinx FPGAs to be positive.

It sounds as if users had admin privileges! Most of these problems
would be avoided by students having their own network drive space and
only having write access to "scratch" space on local drives (and of
course, no privilieges whatsoever when it comes to installing and
modifying programs). Admittedly, this can be done as easily with
Windows as *NIX, what's hard is finding a good sysadmin to handle it all.

--
Pierre-Olivier

-- to email me directly, remove all _N0SP4M_ from my address --

 

[Alex Gibson]

"Marcus Schaemann" <Marcus.Schaemann_invalid@mez.rub.de> wrote in message
news:bv5vc2$pvr$1@sunu789.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de...

Hello,

I'm supposed to set up a new VHDL/FPGA lab at our university. But I'm
unsure which operation system and programming solution to use.
Maybe some of you have experience setting up a lab and can answer some
questions.

We already have the Xilinx ISE Software 6.1i for PC/Solaris/Linux and
Synopsys Software for Solaris and Linux through a Europractice license.
We also have an "old" DLC4 and XC4005, but I guess it's not worth trying
to make that work. (As far as I could find out, DLC4 is not supported
anymore even for ISE 4.2.)

So here are my questions:

1. Which operating system supplies the best performance/environment for
Xilinx development?
I read that the supplied ModelSim II XE works only on PCs, not on
Solaris or Linux. So would you prefer a PC, because of the included
simulation environment?

2. If a Solaris/Linux environment is concerned, which simulator is
available/usable? Is Synopsys' scirocco usable?

3. Which Download Cable would you recommend? Does the Parallel Cable
only work with a PC (I read that somewhere)?
Or would you prefer the Multilinx Cable? (If so, why?)

4. Regarding the programming of the FPGA, would you recommend a separate
design/program environment (e.g. Some Solaris Workstations for
design, and one PC just for programming and testing on a FPGA)?

I hope someone can enlighten me a bit!

Regards,

Marcus

I tutor and do some lab support .
We are just upgrading from windows nt4 to windows xp.

What os depends on what hardware you have
and what software is supported and what licenses you get for free.

Also if students can get themselves copies of the software for use on their
own machines.

That is why we use xilinx webpack on windows for students
and full ise version in the labs(xilinx university program).

We are still using version 5 as haven't received 6 yet,
doesn't make much difference as most students
don't use fpgas.
(Xilinx seems rather slow sending things to non-US uni's,
unless its due to the local distributor who is still annoyed at us
for buying cplds direct from xilinx due to them being a good bit cheaper ).

For introductory digital systems we are still using
schematic entry.

For advanced digital systems vhdl.

Linux version of the webpack isn't out
so this isn't an option for the labs yet.

P3 1GHz (256MB ram min) and below windows 2000 or linux
P3 1GHz 256MB ram and above windows 2000, windows xp or linux

Which os depends on the software you can get for that os
and how easy it is for students to use.

Students buy a kit from the uni, then assemble it.
Has experimenter and programmer boards and all components.
Programmer board connects to a pc via parallel port
and programs both cplds and pic microprocessors on the experimenter board.
Using a pic12F675 as a programmable oscillator for the cpld.

This way the uni doesn't need to look after the hardware
and each student has their own.

Gives more chance for hands on debugging.

You can put additional boxed programmer boards in the lab
but we are removing them as they usually get damaged.
(Get some idiot who thinks if the lab programmers or computers don't
work they can get an extension on their assignment, so actively disables the
lab
thats why video surveillance is going in).

Which download cable ?
Which ever you have.Or get one of the students or support staff
to design a programmer and get the pcbs made.

We may possibly switch to altera
as a couple of the lecturers prefer the quartus software
with inbuilt simulation.

Also looks like some time in the next year or so
Advanced digital systems will switch to fpgas.
So we are going to have to come up
with a decent student proof fpga design.

Thinking about using dip modules for fpga and cplds
on the experimenter board, that way we can still have a common
board design for both subjects. Current programmer board can already program
fpgas.
Also want to switch to a usb based programmer due to
the fast disappearing parallel port situation.

Alex Gibson

 

[Kelvin @ SG]

Maybe you need 1024MB RAM if you are doing designs with xc2v6000 and above.
My experience is,
the memory surge to 450MB once P&R started.

Kelvin







Alex Gibson <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:bvg547$rnfhm$2@ID-140944.news.uni-berlin.de...

"Marcus Schaemann" <Marcus.Schaemann_invalid@mez.rub.de> wrote in message
news:bv5vc2$pvr$1@sunu789.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de...
Hello,

I'm supposed to set up a new VHDL/FPGA lab at our university. But I'm
unsure which operation system and programming solution to use.
Maybe some of you have experience setting up a lab and can answer some
questions.

We already have the Xilinx ISE Software 6.1i for PC/Solaris/Linux and
Synopsys Software for Solaris and Linux through a Europractice license.
We also have an "old" DLC4 and XC4005, but I guess it's not worth trying
to make that work. (As far as I could find out, DLC4 is not supported
anymore even for ISE 4.2.)

So here are my questions:

1. Which operating system supplies the best performance/environment for
Xilinx development?
I read that the supplied ModelSim II XE works only on PCs, not on
Solaris or Linux. So would you prefer a PC, because of the included
simulation environment?

2. If a Solaris/Linux environment is concerned, which simulator is
available/usable? Is Synopsys' scirocco usable?

3. Which Download Cable would you recommend? Does the Parallel Cable
only work with a PC (I read that somewhere)?
Or would you prefer the Multilinx Cable? (If so, why?)

4. Regarding the programming of the FPGA, would you recommend a separate
design/program environment (e.g. Some Solaris Workstations for
design, and one PC just for programming and testing on a FPGA)?

I hope someone can enlighten me a bit!

Regards,

Marcus

I tutor and do some lab support .
We are just upgrading from windows nt4 to windows xp.

What os depends on what hardware you have
and what software is supported and what licenses you get for free.

Also if students can get themselves copies of the software for use on
their
own machines.

That is why we use xilinx webpack on windows for students
and full ise version in the labs(xilinx university program).

We are still using version 5 as haven't received 6 yet,
doesn't make much difference as most students
don't use fpgas.
(Xilinx seems rather slow sending things to non-US uni's,
unless its due to the local distributor who is still annoyed at us
for buying cplds direct from xilinx due to them being a good bit
cheaper ).

For introductory digital systems we are still using
schematic entry.

For advanced digital systems vhdl.

Linux version of the webpack isn't out
so this isn't an option for the labs yet.

P3 1GHz (256MB ram min) and below windows 2000 or linux
P3 1GHz 256MB ram and above windows 2000, windows xp or linux

Which os depends on the software you can get for that os
and how easy it is for students to use.

Students buy a kit from the uni, then assemble it.
Has experimenter and programmer boards and all components.
Programmer board connects to a pc via parallel port
and programs both cplds and pic microprocessors on the experimenter board.
Using a pic12F675 as a programmable oscillator for the cpld.

This way the uni doesn't need to look after the hardware
and each student has their own.

Gives more chance for hands on debugging.

You can put additional boxed programmer boards in the lab
but we are removing them as they usually get damaged.
(Get some idiot who thinks if the lab programmers or computers don't
work they can get an extension on their assignment, so actively disables
the
lab
thats why video surveillance is going in).

Which download cable ?
Which ever you have.Or get one of the students or support staff
to design a programmer and get the pcbs made.

We may possibly switch to altera
as a couple of the lecturers prefer the quartus software
with inbuilt simulation.

Also looks like some time in the next year or so
Advanced digital systems will switch to fpgas.
So we are going to have to come up
with a decent student proof fpga design.

Thinking about using dip modules for fpga and cplds
on the experimenter board, that way we can still have a common
board design for both subjects. Current programmer board can already
program
fpgas.
Also want to switch to a usb based programmer due to
the fast disappearing parallel port situation.

Alex Gibson