Velleman DC controlled dimmer (K8003)

P

Peter Vlaciky

Guest
I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Peter
 
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete>

I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart
from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

** How about YOU post a scan of the schematic on
"alt.binaries.schematics.electronic" ???




................ Phil
 
Well, it is available here:
http://www.velleman.be/Downloads/0/Manual_K8003.pdf


"Phil Allison" <philallison@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3fca97a5$0$13682$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete

I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart
from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off
with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.


** How about YOU post a scan of the schematic on
"alt.binaries.schematics.electronic" ???




............... Phil
Click to expand...
 
On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 12:21:16 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@optusnet.com.au> wrote:

"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete

I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart
from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.


** How about YOU post a scan of the schematic on
"alt.binaries.schematics.electronic" ???

............... Phil
Click to expand...
Hello Gents,
this might help
http://www.velleman.be/Downloads/0/Manual_K8003.pdf
the circuit diagram is on page 7.
Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 02:34:18 GMT, "Peter Vlaciky"
<peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote:

Well, it is available here:
http://www.velleman.be/Downloads/0/Manual_K8003.pdf
Click to expand...
Hello Peter,
I found that one too. I couldn't find a data sheet
on the TEA1007. Have you got a link for that?

Boy, this is going to be tricky. I have to watch
that I do not pass on my sloppy wet finger testing
methods to you. So lets be super careful.
Do you have an isolating transformer, variac and
oscilloscope? If not, you are welcome to bring
your kits up to my place and you can use my gear
with a bit of help from me if you wish.

I take it that you have double and triple checked
all component values, orientation of diodes, electros
and even the ICs. Used a magnifying glass and
checked for solder splash bridging of tracks.
Checked the leg of an IC hasn't accidentaly buckled
underneath itself.

Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
 
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote in message
news:kswyb.810$hX1.24840@news.optus.net.au...
I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart
from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

** Now I have the schema - a few questions:

Did you build the 24, 120 or 240 volt version ??

Did they ever work ?

Is the light locked on or off ?




........... Phil
 
Hi John,

Thank you for your reply.

I think I still have same doco on the TEA1007 at home. I will look for it
tonight. But the chip is no longer being manufactured and there does not
seem an obvious replacement available. :-(
Would that be OK if I emailed it directly to you if I find it?

Yes, I did double check all of what you mentioned. I suspect the problem
might be with the TEA1007, but I don't have an oscilloscope (nor do I know
how to use one :)) available.

I must also say that my electronics knowledge is fairly limited. I know how
to test a diode, cap, maybe a transistor. But that is about it. I built
the first kit about a year ago, it worked for about 2 days. Since then I
have been trying to fix it or source some replacement parts. I sourced some
TEA1007's and 4N27's but replacing both did not help either.
Eventually I managed to buy another kit from overseas, which I built
yesterday. But the damned thing does not seem to work either!

Although this time I have not tried replacing the chips yet. I have them at
friend's place so I will try that ASAP.
One possible problem could be that in place of the "load" I used a "pigtail
neon" globe yesterday. Maybe that was the problem. However with my old kit
I used an ordinary 240V globe and it did not work.

I am worried that this kit has some design flaw and that it only works for a
short while. That is why I was interested to know if anyone is actually
using it.

Peter


"John Crighton" <john_c@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:3fcab252.10459499@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 02:34:18 GMT, "Peter Vlaciky"
peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote:

Well, it is available here:
http://www.velleman.be/Downloads/0/Manual_K8003.pdf


Hello Peter,
I found that one too. I couldn't find a data sheet
on the TEA1007. Have you got a link for that?

Boy, this is going to be tricky. I have to watch
that I do not pass on my sloppy wet finger testing
methods to you. So lets be super careful.
Do you have an isolating transformer, variac and
oscilloscope? If not, you are welcome to bring
your kits up to my place and you can use my gear
with a bit of help from me if you wish.

I take it that you have double and triple checked
all component values, orientation of diodes, electros
and even the ICs. Used a magnifying glass and
checked for solder splash bridging of tracks.
Checked the leg of an IC hasn't accidentaly buckled
underneath itself.

Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
Click to expand...
 
Hi Phil,

Thank you for taking time to reply to my post.

I built the 240V. I triple checked the resistors, definitely 240V.

I don't remember what exactly was the problem with the first kit I built,
but I rememeber that it only worked for a couple of days. Since then I
tried replacing both chips (AFAIK all other compenents tested OK) but that
did not help at all.

Finally I managed to get yet another kit which I built yesterday. The
problem I am seeing is that the light (load) stays on at all times, no
matter how I set the trimpots or the control voltage. However I must admitt
that I used a "pigtail neon" globe yesterday and I was told since that it
does not behave like an ordinary globe. I will try a normal globe tonight.

I find it really strange that testing all components (out of the circuit
too) and replacing both chips did not fix the problem.
That is why I am thinking that the kit has some design flaw and therefore
only works for a short time.

I think I still have some doco on both chips at home if that would be of any
help.

Peter

"Phil Allison" <philallison@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3fcab8ac$0$14056$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote in message
news:kswyb.810$hX1.24840@news.optus.net.au...
I am curious if anyone has managed to get this dimmer to work in AUS?
It used to be sold by Dick Smith Electronics a few years back.

I have 2 of them, but neither of them is working.
I checked most of the components on the board and the schema, but apart
from
the two IC's which I am unable to test, everything checks out.
A friend of mine suspects that the kit has a bad design to start off
with,
could that be true?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.


** Now I have the schema - a few questions:

Did you build the 24, 120 or 240 volt version ??

Did they ever work ?

Is the light locked on or off ?




.......... Phil
Click to expand...
 
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote in message
news:sPzyb.824$hX1.25363@news.optus.net.au...
Hi Phil,

Thank you for taking time to reply to my post.

I built the 240V. I triple checked the resistors, definitely 240V.

I don't remember what exactly was the problem with the first kit I built,
but I rememeber that it only worked for a couple of days. Since then I
tried replacing both chips (AFAIK all other compenents tested OK) but that
did not help at all.

Finally I managed to get yet another kit which I built yesterday. The
problem I am seeing is that the light (load) stays on at all times, no
matter how I set the trimpots or the control voltage. However I must
admitt
that I used a "pigtail neon" globe yesterday and I was told since that it
does not behave like an ordinary globe. I will try a normal globe
tonight.
Click to expand...


** Forget the neon - it will stay lit if used on its own.

Use a standard 40 watt globe or larger - some triacs will not
work with smaller globes.





.......... Phil
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 04:43:40 GMT, "Peter Vlaciky"
<peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote:

Hi John,

Thank you for your reply.

I think I still have same doco on the TEA1007 at home. I will look for it
tonight. But the chip is no longer being manufactured and there does not
seem an obvious replacement available. :-(
Would that be OK if I emailed it directly to you if I find it?

Yes, I did double check all of what you mentioned. I suspect the problem
might be with the TEA1007, but I don't have an oscilloscope (nor do I know
how to use one :)) available.

I must also say that my electronics knowledge is fairly limited. I know how
to test a diode, cap, maybe a transistor. But that is about it. I built
the first kit about a year ago, it worked for about 2 days. Since then I
have been trying to fix it or source some replacement parts. I sourced some
TEA1007's and 4N27's but replacing both did not help either.
Eventually I managed to buy another kit from overseas, which I built
yesterday. But the damned thing does not seem to work either!

Although this time I have not tried replacing the chips yet. I have them at
friend's place so I will try that ASAP.
One possible problem could be that in place of the "load" I used a "pigtail
neon" globe yesterday. Maybe that was the problem. However with my old kit
I used an ordinary 240V globe and it did not work.

I am worried that this kit has some design flaw and that it only works for a
short while. That is why I was interested to know if anyone is actually
using it.

Peter
Click to expand...
Hello Peter,
Yes, send the TEA1007 data sheet to me. I am interested to see it.
Where did you buy your spare TEA107 and how much was it?

It might be a good idea, safetywise, to alter your circuit board for
24 volt AC operation and use a 240V to 24 V transformer.
You can then fault find the circuit board without worrying about
getting a belt from mains voltage. Once you sort out the problem
and get the kit to work well at 24V you can then change the two
resistors for 240V mains operation and hopefully it will still work.

For a 24 Volt test load, just use a couple of 12Volt car tail
lamp globes or similar in series.

If you could borrow an oscilloscope from your work place
or had a friendly TAFE teacher that would be good. You
could then look for trigger pulses on the gate of the triac
and output of the IC.

Don't dispair, this is the fun part of electronics, getting stuff
to work and learning something. This is your kit, you paid for
it, and yet Phil and I are having fun. Great isn't it! :)

Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 06:17:05 GMT, john_c@tpg.com.au (John Crighton)
put finger to keyboard and composed:

Yes, send the TEA1007 data sheet to me. I am interested to see it.
Click to expand...
http://www.prelcoparts.com/datasheets/temic/TEA1007.PDF


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 17:47:53 +1100, Franc Zabkar
<fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote:

On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 06:17:05 GMT, john_c@tpg.com.au (John Crighton)
put finger to keyboard and composed:

Yes, send the TEA1007 data sheet to me. I am interested to see it.

http://www.prelcoparts.com/datasheets/temic/TEA1007.PDF


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
Click to expand...
Hello Frank,
thanks for that.
Regards,
John Crighton
 
"Peter Vlaciky" wrote


I must also say that my electronics knowledge is fairly limited.

I am worried that this kit has some design flaw and that it only works
for a
short while.

****You admitted that your knowledge is "limited" and yet you still
think the kit has a design flaw.In your tiny mind you think that those
people at Velleman are all dummies!!
The mind boggles!!!!!!
By your own admission you are limited in your knowledge yet you persist
in playing with 240 Volts.
The mind boggles!!!!!

Another contender for the Darwin Award.
Brian Goldsmith.
 
"Phil Allison" wrote

Use a standard 40 watt globe


**** A globe is a spherical chart of the Earth amongst other
things,which I don't think comes in a 40 Watt size! :)


Brian Goldsmith.
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 08:26:07 GMT, "Brian Goldsmith"
<brian.goldsmith@nospamecho1.com.au> wrote:

"Phil Allison" wrote

Use a standard 40 watt globe


**** A globe is a spherical chart of the Earth amongst other
things,which I don't think comes in a 40 Watt size! :)
Click to expand...
and a bulb is something you plant in the ground...
 
They're everywhere.
http://www.diyweldor.com/EasyWelder/TEA1007.pdf

GtG
 
Well, I assume that there is a flaw in the design either in the kit itself,
or maybe in the TEA IC.
The reason I suspect that is because:
a) DSE has stopped importing this unit
b) the TEA chip is no longer being manufactured
c) the first kit only lasted for 2 days
d) a while back I contacted Velleman and they sent me a replacement TEA
IC and at the same time said that they were working on a new design
(although this has not happened to date).

As for my knowledge of electronics and playing with 240V... well just
because I don't know much about circuits or design, I am not a dummy either.

Peter

"Brian Goldsmith" <brian.goldsmith@nospamecho1.com.au> wrote in message
news:CQCyb.34667$aT.8589@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
"Peter Vlaciky" wrote


I must also say that my electronics knowledge is fairly limited.

I am worried that this kit has some design flaw and that it only works
for a
short while.

****You admitted that your knowledge is "limited" and yet you still
think the kit has a design flaw.In your tiny mind you think that those
people at Velleman are all dummies!!
The mind boggles!!!!!!
By your own admission you are limited in your knowledge yet you persist
in playing with 240 Volts.
The mind boggles!!!!!

Another contender for the Darwin Award.
Brian Goldsmith.
Click to expand...
 
Yes! That was the problem!

A standard globe worked. On the second kit. I am still puzzled by the
first kit not working.
But at least having one working kit I am one step further.

Thank you for your advice.

Peter


"Phil Allison" <philallison@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3fcad1e0$0$20482$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Peter Vlaciky" <peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote in message
news:sPzyb.824$hX1.25363@news.optus.net.au...
Hi Phil,

Thank you for taking time to reply to my post.

I built the 240V. I triple checked the resistors, definitely 240V.

I don't remember what exactly was the problem with the first kit I
built,
but I rememeber that it only worked for a couple of days. Since then I
tried replacing both chips (AFAIK all other compenents tested OK) but
that
did not help at all.

Finally I managed to get yet another kit which I built yesterday. The
problem I am seeing is that the light (load) stays on at all times, no
matter how I set the trimpots or the control voltage. However I must
admitt
that I used a "pigtail neon" globe yesterday and I was told since that
it
does not behave like an ordinary globe. I will try a normal globe
tonight.


** Forget the neon - it will stay lit if used on its own.

Use a standard 40 watt globe or larger - some triacs will not
work with smaller globes.





......... Phil
Click to expand...
 
Hello John,

Thank you for your reply.

Meanwhile it turned out that my second kit is actually working, I just had
to use a bigger globe (thanks Phil).
Now with one kit working it should be easier to work on the second,
non-working one.

Yes, it looks like I will have to speak to someone who could measure the
chip using an oscilloscope.
Although I still find it strange that simply replacing the chip did not
help. Unless the circuit damaged it straight away. :-(

As for the TEA1007... yeah, it was not easy as you can imagine. I friend of
mine bought it on his trip to Europe about 6 months ago. It was a couple of
dollars if I remember correctly. The worst thing is, that once this chip
goes, I can throw the whole kit away as it is near to impossible to find a
replacement. I wonder why Velleman have not altered the design yet. :-(

Peter

"John Crighton" <john_c@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:3fcad5bc.920653@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 04:43:40 GMT, "Peter Vlaciky"
peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote:

Hi John,

Thank you for your reply.

I think I still have same doco on the TEA1007 at home. I will look for
it
tonight. But the chip is no longer being manufactured and there does not
seem an obvious replacement available. :-(
Would that be OK if I emailed it directly to you if I find it?

Yes, I did double check all of what you mentioned. I suspect the problem
might be with the TEA1007, but I don't have an oscilloscope (nor do I
know
how to use one :)) available.

I must also say that my electronics knowledge is fairly limited. I know
how
to test a diode, cap, maybe a transistor. But that is about it. I built
the first kit about a year ago, it worked for about 2 days. Since then I
have been trying to fix it or source some replacement parts. I sourced
some
TEA1007's and 4N27's but replacing both did not help either.
Eventually I managed to buy another kit from overseas, which I built
yesterday. But the damned thing does not seem to work either!

Although this time I have not tried replacing the chips yet. I have them
at
friend's place so I will try that ASAP.
One possible problem could be that in place of the "load" I used a
"pigtail
neon" globe yesterday. Maybe that was the problem. However with my old
kit
I used an ordinary 240V globe and it did not work.

I am worried that this kit has some design flaw and that it only works
for a
short while. That is why I was interested to know if anyone is actually
using it.

Peter


Hello Peter,
Yes, send the TEA1007 data sheet to me. I am interested to see it.
Where did you buy your spare TEA107 and how much was it?

It might be a good idea, safetywise, to alter your circuit board for
24 volt AC operation and use a 240V to 24 V transformer.
You can then fault find the circuit board without worrying about
getting a belt from mains voltage. Once you sort out the problem
and get the kit to work well at 24V you can then change the two
resistors for 240V mains operation and hopefully it will still work.

For a 24 Volt test load, just use a couple of 12Volt car tail
lamp globes or similar in series.

If you could borrow an oscilloscope from your work place
or had a friendly TAFE teacher that would be good. You
could then look for trigger pulses on the gate of the triac
and output of the IC.

Don't dispair, this is the fun part of electronics, getting stuff
to work and learning something. This is your kit, you paid for
it, and yet Phil and I are having fun. Great isn't it! :)

Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
Click to expand...
 
On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 21:46:04 GMT, "Peter Vlaciky"
<peterv@catuity.com.au.delete> wrote:

Yes! That was the problem!

A standard globe worked. On the second kit. I am still puzzled by the
first kit not working.
But at least having one working kit I am one step further.

Thank you for your advice.

Peter

Hello Peter,
Click to expand...
you are making progress, Great!
Here is a suggestion for getting the second kit
to work. Mark the ICs on the good unit with say a G
Mark the ICs on the suspect unit with say an S
Remove the ICs from both units and do resistance
checks of the components. Comparing the dud unit
to the bad unit.
Do resistance checks of the tracks also.
Investigate any differences.
Swap each set of ICs from bad to good unit and
see if the fault follows the set of ICs.
Test again.
Let us know how you get on.
Fun isn't it!

Regards,
John Crighton
Hornsby
 
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