Vaccination anyone? What about diverse adverse consequences to human health?...

[Flyguy]

So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027869152200206X):

The mRNA SARS-CoV-2 vaccines were brought to market in response to the public health crises of Covid-19. The utilization of mRNA vaccines in the context of infectious disease has no precedent. The many alterations in the vaccine mRNA hide the mRNA from cellular defenses and promote a longer biological half-life and high production of spike protein. However, the immune response to the vaccine is very different from that to a SARS-CoV-2 infection. In this paper, we present evidence that vaccination induces a profound impairment in type I interferon signaling, which has diverse adverse consequences to human health. Immune cells that have taken up the vaccine nanoparticles release into circulation large numbers of exosomes containing spike protein along with critical microRNAs that induce a signaling response in recipient cells at distant sites. We also identify potential profound disturbances in regulatory control of protein synthesis and cancer surveillance. These disturbances potentially have a causal link to neurodegenerative disease, myocarditis, immune thrombocytopenia, Bell\'s palsy, liver disease, impaired adaptive immunity, impaired DNA damage response and tumorigenesis. We show evidence from the VAERS database supporting our hypothesis. We believe a comprehensive risk/benefit assessment of the mRNA vaccines questions them as positive contributors to public health.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 12:17:09 PM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:

So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027869152200206X):

The mRNA SARS-CoV-2 vaccines were brought to market in response to the public health crises of Covid-19. The utilization of mRNA vaccines in the context of infectious disease has no precedent. The many alterations in the vaccine mRNA hide the mRNA from cellular defenses and promote a longer biological half-life and high production of spike protein. However, the immune response to the vaccine is very different from that to a SARS-CoV-2 infection.. In this paper, we present evidence that vaccination induces a profound impairment in type I interferon signaling, which has diverse adverse consequences to human health. Immune cells that have taken up the vaccine nanoparticles release into circulation large numbers of exosomes containing spike protein along with critical microRNAs that induce a signaling response in recipient cells at distant sites. We also identify potential profound disturbances in regulatory control of protein synthesis and cancer surveillance. These disturbances potentially have a causal link to neurodegenerative disease, myocarditis, immune thrombocytopenia, Bell\'s palsy, liver disease, impaired adaptive immunity, impaired DNA damage response and tumorigenesis. We show evidence from the VAERS database supporting our hypothesis. We believe a comprehensive risk/benefit assessment of the mRNA vaccines questions them as positive contributors to public health.

The Seneff retard from MIT has embarrassed herself ( insofar as that\'s possible with a moron) on several occasions in the past.

Co-author from Truth for Health Foundation in nutcase Tuscon Az, also advocated for hydroxychloroquine early in the pandemic, he\'s totally political.

Then that Nigh shit-for-brains is a graduate of National College of Natural Medicine and founded some holistic cancer care ripoff in dumbville aka Portland OR- osteopathic has become synonymous with psychopathic.

The handling editor is an academic toxicologist who\'s way out of his league..

Not going to waste any time on the others. These useless fearmongers obviously have an agenda to disparage modern medicine, so they write these phony scientific papers like the one you cited. Any moron can throw out a bunch of terminology and claim this or that is happening or could be happening. Looks like their so-called paper is just a superficial summary of a literature search, and doesn\'t contain a whit of research specific to their claims.

Fence post.

 

[Martin Brown]

On 22/07/2022 17:17, Flyguy wrote:

So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027869152200206X):

The mRNA SARS-CoV-2 vaccines were brought to market in response to the public health crises of Covid-19. The utilization of mRNA vaccines in the context of infectious disease has no precedent. The many alterations in the vaccine mRNA hide the mRNA from cellular defenses and promote a longer biological half-life and high production of spike protein. However, the immune response to the vaccine is very different from that to a SARS-CoV-2 infection. In this paper, we present evidence that vaccination induces a profound impairment in type I interferon signaling, which has diverse adverse consequences to human health. Immune cells that have taken up the vaccine nanoparticles release into circulation large numbers of exosomes containing spike protein along with critical microRNAs that induce a signaling response in recipient cells at distant sites. We also identify potential profound disturbances in regulatory control of protein synthesis and cancer surveillance. These disturbances potentially have a causal link to neurodegenerative disease, myocarditis, immune thrombocytopenia, Bell\'s palsy, liver disease, impaired adaptive immunity, impaired DNA damage response and tumorigenesis. We show evidence from the VAERS database supporting our hypothesis. We believe a comprehensive risk/benefit assessment of the mRNA vaccines questions them as positive contributors to public health.

It looks like random word salad from some paranoid delusional nutters.
I can see exactly why it appeals to you.

Empirical evidence so far in the UK and elsewhere is that where it has
been accepted vaccination has pretty much decreased fatalities by more
than an order of magnitude but has done little or nothing to prevent
onward transmission. UK is now 1:17 infected with Covid (and rising)
BA.5 now represents 80% of all new cases. The rate of increase appears
to be slowing (in previous years it all but stopped in mid summer).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274

I haven\'t been to a live performance since unlocking yet where at least
one of the named soloists is indisposed due to a Covid infection.

Even in Japan where they are still ultra cautious and wear masks indoors
in major venues the July sumo basho in Nagoya is in disarray because so
many of the top wrestlers and judges have Covid that they had to screen
not just fights from the division below but the one below that.

https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20220721/p2a/00m/0sp/021000c

Problem with contact sports in a pandemic is well contact.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

 

[a a]

On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 21:31:32 UTC+2, Martin Brown wrote:

On 22/07/2022 17:17, Flyguy wrote:
So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027869152200206X):

The mRNA SARS-CoV-2 vaccines were brought to market in response to the public health crises of Covid-19. The utilization of mRNA vaccines in the context of infectious disease has no precedent. The many alterations in the vaccine mRNA hide the mRNA from cellular defenses and promote a longer biological half-life and high production of spike protein. However, the immune response to the vaccine is very different from that to a SARS-CoV-2 infection. In this paper, we present evidence that vaccination induces a profound impairment in type I interferon signaling, which has diverse adverse consequences to human health. Immune cells that have taken up the vaccine nanoparticles release into circulation large numbers of exosomes containing spike protein along with critical microRNAs that induce a signaling response in recipient cells at distant sites. We also identify potential profound disturbances in regulatory control of protein synthesis and cancer surveillance. These disturbances potentially have a causal link to neurodegenerative disease, myocarditis, immune thrombocytopenia, Bell\'s palsy, liver disease, impaired adaptive immunity, impaired DNA damage response and tumorigenesis. We show evidence from the VAERS database supporting our hypothesis. We believe a comprehensive risk/benefit assessment of the mRNA vaccines questions them as positive contributors to public health.
It looks like random word salad from some paranoid delusional nutters.
I can see exactly why it appeals to you.

Empirical evidence so far in the UK and elsewhere is that where it has
been accepted vaccination has pretty much decreased fatalities by more
than an order of magnitude but has done little or nothing to prevent
onward transmission. UK is now 1:17 infected with Covid (and rising)
BA.5 now represents 80% of all new cases. The rate of increase appears
to be slowing (in previous years it all but stopped in mid summer).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274

I haven\'t been to a live performance since unlocking yet where at least
one of the named soloists is indisposed due to a Covid infection.

Even in Japan where they are still ultra cautious and wear masks indoors
in major venues the July sumo basho in Nagoya is in disarray because so
many of the top wrestlers and judges have Covid that they had to screen
not just fights from the division below but the one below that.

https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20220721/p2a/00m/0sp/021000c

Problem with contact sports in a pandemic is well contact.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died


From the 7/15/2022 release of VAERS data:
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
Government Disclaimer on use of this data


Case Details
This is page 2946 out of 2,964
Result pages: prev 2937 2938 2939 2940 2941 2942 2943 2944 2945 2946 2947 2948 2949 2950 2951 2952 2953 2954 2955 next

VAERS ID: 2353779 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age:
Sex: Female
Location: Foreign
Vaccinated: 2021-11-25
Onset: 2022-02-01
Days after vaccination: 68
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2022-07-02
Vaccin­ation / Manu­facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH SCVT5 / 3 - / -

Administered by: Other Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Atrioventricular block complete
SMQs:, Conduction defects (narrow), Hypokalaemia (broad), Noninfectious myocarditis/pericarditis (broad)

Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2022-06-11
Days after onset: 129

...

Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died

https://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?EVENTS=on&PAGENO=2946&PERPAGE=10&ESORT=&REVERSESORT=&VAX=(COVID19)&DIED=Yes

 

[whit3rd]

On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 1:04:47 PM UTC-7, a a wrote:

On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 21:31:32 UTC+2, Martin Brown wrote:
On 22/07/2022 17:17, Flyguy wrote:
So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again...

Empirical evidence so far in the UK and elsewhere is that where it has
been accepted vaccination has pretty much decreased fatalities by more
than an order of magnitude but has done little or nothing to prevent
onward transmission. UK is now 1:17 infected with Covid (and rising)
BA.5 now represents 80% of all new cases. The rate of increase appears
to be slowing (in previous years it all but stopped in mid summer).

From the 7/15/2022 release of VAERS data:
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died

So what? Vaccine isn\'t intended to confer immortality, just improved
immune response to one pathogen. A variety of different vaccines
have been tested, they all, more or less, work as advertised.

 

[Martin Brown]

On 23/07/2022 03:20, whit3rd wrote:

On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 1:04:47 PM UTC-7, a a wrote:
On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 21:31:32 UTC+2, Martin Brown wrote:
On 22/07/2022 17:17, Flyguy wrote:
So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again...


Empirical evidence so far in the UK and elsewhere is that where it has
been accepted vaccination has pretty much decreased fatalities by more
than an order of magnitude but has done little or nothing to prevent
onward transmission. UK is now 1:17 infected with Covid (and rising)
BA.5 now represents 80% of all new cases. The rate of increase appears
to be slowing (in previous years it all but stopped in mid summer).


From the 7/15/2022 release of VAERS data:
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died

So what? Vaccine isn\'t intended to confer immortality, just improved
immune response to one pathogen. A variety of different vaccines
have been tested, they all, more or less, work as advertised.

Just killfile \"a a\" - he is even more brain dead than Flyguy


--
Regards,
Martin Brown

 

[Jasen Betts]

On 2022-07-22, Flyguy <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

So, vaccination wasn\'t supposed to be harmful (well, maybe for a
small, unlucky few, say tens of thousands). Think again

Given that the disease has killed more than a million it doesn\'t seem as bad as
the alternative, even if it only gives 10% immunity.

--
Jasen.

 

[a a]

On Saturday, 23 July 2022 at 05:10:01 UTC+2, bill....@ieee.org wrote:

On Saturday, July 23, 2022 at 6:04:47 AM UTC+10, a a wrote:
On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 21:31:32 UTC+2, Martin Brown wrote:
On 22/07/2022 17:17, Flyguy wrote:
snipped Flyguy being as idiotic as ever and people pointing it out
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Bill is mega idiot spammer from Australia
IEEE.org is ashamed of idiot Bill, using official mail of ieee.org
for generating public insults.

 

[Mike Monett]

Martin Brown <\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

Don\'t waste time with trolls. You can\'t tell them anything. All you do is
waste everyone\'s time reading your post.

The sooner everyone PLONKs trolls, the quieter and more useful the newsgroup
will become.




--
MRM

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Monday, July 25, 2022 at 11:26:57 AM UTC-4, Mike Monett wrote:

Martin Brown <\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

Don\'t waste time with trolls. You can\'t tell them anything. All you do is
waste everyone\'s time reading your post.

The sooner everyone PLONKs trolls, the quieter and more useful the newsgroup
will become.

You mean like this one?

The record is very clear. The self-appointed police are the scourge of usenet- in addition to invariably being complete idiots.

--
MRM

 

[a a]

On Monday, 25 July 2022 at 17:26:57 UTC+2, Mike Monett wrote:

Martin Brown <\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

Don\'t waste time with trolls. You can\'t tell them anything. All you do is
waste everyone\'s time reading your post.

The sooner everyone PLONKs trolls, the quieter and more useful the newsgroup
will become.




--
MRM

don\'t be silly Mike,
people are aware, covid19 vaccines don\'t work
I am the only human from Europe, who got trained in Wuhan in early 2020 on covid19 diagnosis, treatment
and this China only, who cured every covid19 patient within 3 months, early 2020

There is no success story coming from US, Europe, Taiwan, Australia, Canada..

Albert Bourla, Pfizer Chairman experimented with covid19 vaccines in Israel and failed, since
the 5th dose got rejected by patients, since a single dose has had protection period limited to 3 months only.

There have been 1,000 coronaviruses (Sauci) living with humans for thousands of years
and autogenic vaccine is the only single-dose vaccine which worked for military personnel.

Robert Kennedy, jr is a good man, who supported the development of VAERS interface

https://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?EVENTS=on&PAGENO=2946&PERPAGE=10&ESORT=&REVERSESORT=&VAX=(COVID19)&DIED=Yes

Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
Government Disclaimer on use of this data


Case Details
This is page 2946 out of 2,964
Result pages: prev 2937 2938 2939 2940 2941 2942 2943 2944 2945 2946 2947 2948 2949 2950 2951 2952 2953 2954 2955 next

VAERS ID: 2353779 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age:
Sex: Female
Location: Foreign
Vaccinated: 2021-11-25
Onset: 2022-02-01
Days after vaccination: 68
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2022-07-02
Vaccin­ation / Manu­facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH SCVT5 / 3 - / -

Administered by: Other Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Atrioventricular block complete
SMQs:, Conduction defects (narrow), Hypokalaemia (broad), Noninfectious myocarditis/pericarditis (broad)

Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2022-06-11

already 30,000 patients died in US alone, as covid19 vaccination NOP

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Monday, July 25, 2022 at 4:50:11 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:

On Monday, 25 July 2022 at 17:26:57 UTC+2, Mike Monett wrote:
Martin Brown <\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

Don\'t waste time with trolls. You can\'t tell them anything. All you do is
waste everyone\'s time reading your post.

The sooner everyone PLONKs trolls, the quieter and more useful the newsgroup
will become.




--
MRM
don\'t be silly Mike,
people are aware, covid19 vaccines don\'t work
I am the only human from Europe, who got trained in Wuhan in early 2020 on covid19 diagnosis, treatment
and this China only, who cured every covid19 patient within 3 months, early 2020

Sure you did...

There is no success story coming from US, Europe, Taiwan, Australia, Canada.

Or China either with their crummy whole virus vaccine. They can\'t give that thing away. A few Middle Eastern countries tried it as national vaccination and soon dropped it. Then there are similar nightmare stories out of South America with the same non-performance.

Albert Bourla, Pfizer Chairman experimented with covid19 vaccines in Israel and failed, since
the 5th dose got rejected by patients, since a single dose has had protection period limited to 3 months only.

You\'re cherry picking the facts there too. You have the form of psychopathy in which your delusional about beating conventions of all kinds. I\'ll give a tip: you\'re not.

There have been 1,000 coronaviruses (Sauci) living with humans for thousands of years
and autogenic vaccine is the only single-dose vaccine which worked for military personnel.

There was no such demonstration. It is quack science.

Robert Kennedy, jr is a good man, who supported the development of VAERS interface

https://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?EVENTS=on&PAGENO=2946&PERPAGE=10&ESORT=&REVERSESORT=&VAX=(COVID19)&DIED=Yes
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
Government Disclaimer on use of this data


Case Details
This is page 2946 out of 2,964
Result pages: prev 2937 2938 2939 2940 2941 2942 2943 2944 2945 2946 2947 2948 2949 2950 2951 2952 2953 2954 2955 next

VAERS ID: 2353779 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age:
Sex: Female
Location: Foreign
Vaccinated: 2021-11-25
Onset: 2022-02-01
Days after vaccination: 68
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2022-07-02
Vaccin­ation / Manu­facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH SCVT5 / 3 - / -

Administered by: Other Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Atrioventricular block complete
SMQs:, Conduction defects (narrow), Hypokalaemia (broad), Noninfectious myocarditis/pericarditis (broad)

Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2022-06-11
already 30,000 patients died in US alone, as covid19 vaccination NOP

 

[a a]

--> > Robert Kennedy, jr is a good man, who supported the development of VAERS interface

--> > https://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?EVENTS=on&PAGENO=2946&PERPAGE=10&ESORT=&REVERSESORT=&VAX=(COVID19)&DIED=Yes
Found 29,635 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
Government Disclaimer on use of this data


Case Details
This is page 2946 out of 2,964
Result pages: prev 2937 2938 2939 2940 2941 2942 2943 2944 2945 2946 2947 2948 2949 2950 2951 2952 2953 2954 2955 next

--> > VAERS ID: 2353779 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age:
Sex: Female
Location: Foreign
Vaccinated: 2021-11-25
Onset: 2022-02-01
Days after vaccination: 68
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2022-07-02
Vaccin­ation / Manu­facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH SCVT5 / 3 - / -

--> > Administered by: Other Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Atrioventricular block complete
SMQs:, Conduction defects (narrow), Hypokalaemia (broad), Noninfectious myocarditis/pericarditis (broad)

--> > Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2022-06-11
already 30,000 patients died in US alone, as covid19 vaccination NOP

you are stupid dog

 

[whit3rd]

On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 11:45:47 AM UTC-7, a a wrote:

> PCR test generates false-positive results in 90% of cases

Nonsense, of course; there\'s LOTS of PCR tests, with major differences,
and they\'re engineered for tradeoffs (sensitivity versus false-positives).

It\'s like saying \'resistors are 20% accurate\', which is true of SOME resistors,
but not a problem; those are suitable for powering popcorn kettles.

 

[Martin Brown]

On 27/07/2022 02:39, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Wednesday, July 27, 2022 at 4:45:47 AM UTC+10, a a wrote:
On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 17:31:55 UTC+2, amdx wrote:
On 7/25/2022 8:27 AM, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Monday, July 25, 2022 at 9:00:59 PM UTC+10, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2022-07-22, Flyguy <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

snip

PCR test generates false-positive results in 90% of cases

It doesn\'t. The polymerase chain reaction test just produces multiple copes of any RNA sequence it gets exposed to. It doesn\'t generate novel sequences.

PCR test generates about 20% of false negatives though - variously
attributed to effects of inadequate sample taking and contamination of
samples by home users (samples taken by medic do slightly better).

PCR test is inclined to pick up fragments of smashed up Covid DNA in
people who have already recovered from Covid which means that as an
assay of how many people currently have Covid it reads high by an
unknown factor but unlikely to be more than a factor of two.

The stats were derived from the Liverpool mass testing programme back
when they were trying to calibrate the new quick LF home tests for
efficacy when compared to the gold standard PCR test. LF did better than
the initial evidence implied because PCR was picking up people still
shedding DNA fragments but were well past the infective stage. The
difficulty being that with 20-30% showing no symptoms at all you are
entirely reliant on the tests to know who should be isolating.

Correspondingly the PCR test only really detects people who are shedding
enormous amounts of virus and are an immediate danger to others. It\'s
false positive rate is about 0.1% which is a nuisance when applied for
mass screening. PCR testing was used as definitive in such edge cases
back when the pandemic was running wild in the UK (but then you have the
problem of about 20% of those LF positives and with all the symptoms
really being Covid positive but testing negative).

People I know who have had Covid were still testing positive for Covid
on LF more than a week after first showing symptoms so it is by no means
clear when infectivity ceases from a specific infected individual.

Testing negative two days running is generally accepted as an all clear.

The results can be misunderstood by inexpert users, and a a won\'t pay attention to anybody who isn\'t at least a silly as he is.

Just killfile the stupid \"a a\" troll and be done with it.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Wednesday, July 27, 2022 at 4:42:24 AM UTC-4, Martin Brown wrote:

On 27/07/2022 02:39, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Wednesday, July 27, 2022 at 4:45:47 AM UTC+10, a a wrote:
On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 17:31:55 UTC+2, amdx wrote:
On 7/25/2022 8:27 AM, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Monday, July 25, 2022 at 9:00:59 PM UTC+10, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2022-07-22, Flyguy <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

snip

PCR test generates false-positive results in 90% of cases

It doesn\'t. The polymerase chain reaction test just produces multiple copes of any RNA sequence it gets exposed to. It doesn\'t generate novel sequences.
PCR test generates about 20% of false negatives though - variously
attributed to effects of inadequate sample taking and contamination of
samples by home users (samples taken by medic do slightly better).

PCR test is inclined to pick up fragments of smashed up Covid DNA in
people who have already recovered from Covid which means that as an
assay of how many people currently have Covid it reads high by an
unknown factor but unlikely to be more than a factor of two.

The stats were derived from the Liverpool mass testing programme back
when they were trying to calibrate the new quick LF home tests for
efficacy when compared to the gold standard PCR test. LF did better than
the initial evidence implied because PCR was picking up people still
shedding DNA fragments but were well past the infective stage. The
difficulty being that with 20-30% showing no symptoms at all you are
entirely reliant on the tests to know who should be isolating.

Correspondingly the PCR test only really detects people who are shedding
enormous amounts of virus and are an immediate danger to others. It\'s
false positive rate is about 0.1% which is a nuisance when applied for
mass screening. PCR testing was used as definitive in such edge cases
back when the pandemic was running wild in the UK (but then you have the
problem of about 20% of those LF positives and with all the symptoms
really being Covid positive but testing negative).

People I know who have had Covid were still testing positive for Covid
on LF more than a week after first showing symptoms so it is by no means
clear when infectivity ceases from a specific infected individual.

Testing negative two days running is generally accepted as an all clear.

When you see outrageously large false negative rates like 20% it means there are major systemic errors in the system. It is scientifically impossible for the laboratory test to be that bad all by itself. Field workers are not handling and storing their swabs properly, and probably taking inadequate swabs, same goes for the whole lab chain from manufacture and delivery of materials, storing materials, using materials, and conducting the actual instrumentation centric process. The false negatives in UK probably translates to less than 1% in places like Germany with a much more intelligent, conscientious, and superior workforce....

The results can be misunderstood by inexpert users, and a a won\'t pay attention to anybody who isn\'t at least a silly as he is.
Just killfile the stupid \"a a\" troll and be done with it.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

 

[Martin Brown]

On 28/07/2022 19:11, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Wednesday, July 27, 2022 at 4:42:24 AM UTC-4, Martin Brown wrote:
On 27/07/2022 02:39, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Wednesday, July 27, 2022 at 4:45:47 AM UTC+10, a a wrote:
On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 17:31:55 UTC+2, amdx wrote:
On 7/25/2022 8:27 AM, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Monday, July 25, 2022 at 9:00:59 PM UTC+10, Jasen Betts
wrote:
On 2022-07-22, Flyguy <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

snip

PCR test generates false-positive results in 90% of cases

It doesn\'t. The polymerase chain reaction test just produces
multiple copes of any RNA sequence it gets exposed to. It doesn\'t
generate novel sequences.
PCR test generates about 20% of false negatives though - variously
attributed to effects of inadequate sample taking and contamination
of samples by home users (samples taken by medic do slightly
better).

PCR test is inclined to pick up fragments of smashed up Covid DNA
in people who have already recovered from Covid which means that as
an assay of how many people currently have Covid it reads high by
an unknown factor but unlikely to be more than a factor of two.

The stats were derived from the Liverpool mass testing programme
back when they were trying to calibrate the new quick LF home tests
for efficacy when compared to the gold standard PCR test. LF did
better than the initial evidence implied because PCR was picking up
people still shedding DNA fragments but were well past the
infective stage. The difficulty being that with 20-30% showing no
symptoms at all you are entirely reliant on the tests to know who
should be isolating.

Correspondingly the PCR test only really detects people who are
shedding enormous amounts of virus and are an immediate danger to
others. It\'s false positive rate is about 0.1% which is a nuisance
when applied for mass screening. PCR testing was used as definitive
in such edge cases back when the pandemic was running wild in the
UK (but then you have the problem of about 20% of those LF
positives and with all the symptoms really being Covid positive but
testing negative).

People I know who have had Covid were still testing positive for
Covid on LF more than a week after first showing symptoms so it is
by no means clear when infectivity ceases from a specific infected
individual.

Testing negative two days running is generally accepted as an all
clear.

When you see outrageously large false negative rates like 20% it
means there are major systemic errors in the system. It is

No that is the accepted number. I personally know individuals who had
*all* the symptoms of Covid and tested negative on PCR and were told in
no uncertain terms that they must isolate for 10 days *despite* their
apparent negative PCR result. This was early in the pandemic when the
tests were as rare as hens teeth and no-one ever got a retest.

scientifically impossible for the laboratory test to be that bad all
by itself. Field workers are not handling and storing their swabs
properly, and probably taking inadequate swabs, same goes for the
whole lab chain from manufacture and delivery of materials, storing
materials, using materials, and conducting the actual instrumentation
centric process. The false negatives in UK probably translates to
less than 1% in places like Germany with a much more intelligent,
conscientious, and superior workforce....

The 20% false positive number comes from fairly early in the pandemic
and originally from Switzerland rather than the UK. My 20% is probably
slightly conservative more recent BMJ papers put it at 30% in the real
world allowing for home user errors and fatigue of medical testers.

https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n287/rr

I reckon they would have got better results if they had included 2 swabs
in the home testing kits since it is all too easy to contaminate it by
accidentally touching your teeth.

Debate about the impact of false positives and negatives on the testing
and verification of lateral flow tests was a hot topic a while back.

Your faith in the Covid testing labs labs is sadly misplaced. They were
all in it for the loadsa money and many were *NOT* properly qualified to
even do the work. Beggars can\'t be choosers so they still got work even
when their standards were demonstrably way below par.

In the rush to jump on the extremely profitable bandwagon corners were
cut and cheap unskilled labour was used working two to a laminar flow
cabinet and breaking an insane number of QC and safety rules.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54552620

One glaring example was a company that told over 40k people they were
negative when the result was positive. Profit motive means that they
really didn\'t care! They still got additional work for over a month
after the huge problem with their testing regime was identified!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-60940877

You really couldn\'t make it up.

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Regards,
Martin Brown