D
Don Reinoga
Guest
Anyone know where to get a second hand transformer up to say 30KV?
Thanks,
Don
** remover dontvirusme for email reply **
Thanks,
Don
** remover dontvirusme for email reply **
V
Vermin
Guest
On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 06:09:32 GMT, Don Reinoga
<dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote:
Here are a couple of suggestions:
TV / monitor flyback transformer.
Neon sign transformer (probably only available up to 15kV).
Vermin.
<dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote:
What sort of VA and frequency?
Here are a couple of suggestions:
TV / monitor flyback transformer.
Neon sign transformer (probably only available up to 15kV).
Vermin.
A
Arpit
Guest
n Wed, 08 Oct 2003 08:28:21 GMT, Vermin <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote:
and saying you want big sparks, I'd say car ignition coils and neon
sign transformers would do the trick. FLybacks are cool, but don't put
out a lot of power. only about 200 watts or so IIRC. Ignition coils,
properly cooleed, can take an input of 5000 watts. Dont hook more
than 2 of any transformer in series, without special connecting
'circuitry' ( wiring) , or the insulation will break down.
Yeah, it really depends on what you want it for. going out on a limb
and saying you want big sparks, I'd say car ignition coils and neon
sign transformers would do the trick. FLybacks are cool, but don't put
out a lot of power. only about 200 watts or so IIRC. Ignition coils,
properly cooleed, can take an input of 5000 watts. Dont hook more
than 2 of any transformer in series, without special connecting
'circuitry' ( wiring) , or the insulation will break down.
D
Don Reinoga
Guest
No I need it for a CO2 laser. Spec's on it say it can take up to 30KV, I
currently have a 15KV Neon sign transformer, but want to see what its max
power output is.
Currnetly wood starts to smoke and burn after about 1 sec, I can get steel
to glow red after a min, and that is without a focusing lens, beam
straight out the end of the tube.
So your saying I can put a ignition coil after the neon sign transformer?
I only need about 30ma....
Arpit wrote:
currently have a 15KV Neon sign transformer, but want to see what its max
power output is.
Currnetly wood starts to smoke and burn after about 1 sec, I can get steel
to glow red after a min, and that is without a focusing lens, beam
straight out the end of the tube.
So your saying I can put a ignition coil after the neon sign transformer?
I only need about 30ma....
Arpit wrote:
B
Brian Goldsmith
Guest
"Don Reinoga" wrote
No I need it for a CO2 laser. Spec's on it say it can take up to 30KV, I
currently have a 15KV Neon sign transformer, but want to see what its
max
power output is.
Currnetly wood starts to smoke and burn after about 1 sec, I can get
steel
to glow red after a min, and that is without a focusing lens, beam
straight out the end of the tube.
**** Another possble candidate for a Darwin Award!!!
Brian Goldsmith.
No I need it for a CO2 laser. Spec's on it say it can take up to 30KV, I
currently have a 15KV Neon sign transformer, but want to see what its
max
power output is.
Currnetly wood starts to smoke and burn after about 1 sec, I can get
steel
to glow red after a min, and that is without a focusing lens, beam
straight out the end of the tube.
**** Another possble candidate for a Darwin Award!!!
Brian Goldsmith.
A
Arpit
Guest
On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:53:36 GMT, Don Reinoga
<dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote:
<dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote:
sweet
your laser. Id get another neon sign transformer and hook it in series
V
Vermin
Guest
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:55:07 +1000, Arpit
<DONTSPAMMEF00Lneko4@dodo.com.au> wrote:
Neon sign transformers (NSTs) have an internally center taped earth.
If you hook them up in series you will have two shorted halves (draw
the circuit if you don't believe me).
Disconnecting the center tap from the chassis is not an option as the
voltage rating of the coil to chassis will be exceeded.
You can however hook up two in parallel for increased current if they
have the same voltage *and* current rating.
An NST will only put out it's max current at about half the o/p
voltage so paralleling up differing current rated NSTs (with the same
rated o/p voltage) is not a good idea.
I was going to tell you to search the tesla list at
http://www.pupman.com/ for more info on paralleling NSTs but it
appears to be down at the moment.
Vermin.
<DONTSPAMMEF00Lneko4@dodo.com.au> wrote:
NO NO NO NO!
Neon sign transformers (NSTs) have an internally center taped earth.
If you hook them up in series you will have two shorted halves (draw
the circuit if you don't believe me).
Disconnecting the center tap from the chassis is not an option as the
voltage rating of the coil to chassis will be exceeded.
You can however hook up two in parallel for increased current if they
have the same voltage *and* current rating.
An NST will only put out it's max current at about half the o/p
voltage so paralleling up differing current rated NSTs (with the same
rated o/p voltage) is not a good idea.
I was going to tell you to search the tesla list at
http://www.pupman.com/ for more info on paralleling NSTs but it
appears to be down at the moment.
Vermin.
A
Arpit
Guest
Whoops, sorry <g> Ive never actually owned a NST (can't find them
anywhere), only heard the legends, so yeah
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 06:36:03 GMT, Vermin <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote:
anywhere), only heard the legends, so yeah
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 06:36:03 GMT, Vermin <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote:
G
gcd
Guest
**RESENDING THIS AS MY ISP IS ROOTED**
Hi all,
Neon transformers are usually either DC output or high frequency AC output
(given your application I suggest you have a DC unit).
So either way you are not going to be able to do to much with it, ie you
cannot run it into an ignition coil.
If you are able to remove the internal rectifier (highly unlikely), you
could use 2 of these transformers with the secondaries in series and then
rectify to produce 30kV @ 30mA. Make sure you get the phasing right! and use
safety cut outs etc.
Or again if you can remove the rectifier, you could replace it with a
voltage doubling rectifier to get the 30kV, with a little less than 15mA
out - depending on how effecient the doubler is.
By increasing the voltage to 30kV you will provide higher energy electrons.
This may produce more optical power but as you are already exciting enough
atoms to produce lasing and enough lasing emissions to produce
amplification, I'm not sure there will be much of an effect. You may start
producing lasing of other transitions which may not necessarily produce the
effect you are after?
I expect this is a sealed (CW) CO2 laser, not a convential or waveguide or
pulsed laser?
Typical optical power outputs are between 50 to 80W per metre of discharge
length, with sealed units typically 60W/m.
ie if you want more output power you need more length. Also, sealed lasers
do have a finite life and the ouput power will decrease as the electrode
used to catalyse CO back to CO2 loses effeciency amongst other reasons.
What protection are you using? At least 5th order reflections are capable
of damage to the eye with this sort of laser. I'd invest in some suitable IR
safety goggles and even IR sticks which convert IR to visible red, some are
available from kodak.
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F8494DD.910ED407@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
Hi all,
Neon transformers are usually either DC output or high frequency AC output
(given your application I suggest you have a DC unit).
So either way you are not going to be able to do to much with it, ie you
cannot run it into an ignition coil.
If you are able to remove the internal rectifier (highly unlikely), you
could use 2 of these transformers with the secondaries in series and then
rectify to produce 30kV @ 30mA. Make sure you get the phasing right! and use
safety cut outs etc.
Or again if you can remove the rectifier, you could replace it with a
voltage doubling rectifier to get the 30kV, with a little less than 15mA
out - depending on how effecient the doubler is.
By increasing the voltage to 30kV you will provide higher energy electrons.
This may produce more optical power but as you are already exciting enough
atoms to produce lasing and enough lasing emissions to produce
amplification, I'm not sure there will be much of an effect. You may start
producing lasing of other transitions which may not necessarily produce the
effect you are after?
I expect this is a sealed (CW) CO2 laser, not a convential or waveguide or
pulsed laser?
Typical optical power outputs are between 50 to 80W per metre of discharge
length, with sealed units typically 60W/m.
ie if you want more output power you need more length. Also, sealed lasers
do have a finite life and the ouput power will decrease as the electrode
used to catalyse CO back to CO2 loses effeciency amongst other reasons.
What protection are you using? At least 5th order reflections are capable
of damage to the eye with this sort of laser. I'd invest in some suitable IR
safety goggles and even IR sticks which convert IR to visible red, some are
available from kodak.
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F8494DD.910ED407@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
V
Vermin
Guest
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 07:53:16 GMT, "gcd" <gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au>
wrote:
origin).
There are modern switch mode versions (I don't know what they output)
but the majority are still just step up transformers.
rated for 12v, well you could but it would break down the insulation).
input due to reduced current and inefficiencies in the doubler.
I know very little about lasers so I wont comment on the rest.
Vermin.
wrote:
No, they output 50 or 60 Hz AC (depending on supply and country of
origin).
There are modern switch mode versions (I don't know what they output)
but the majority are still just step up transformers.
Agreed, but for different reasons (you can't put 15kV into a coil
rated for 12v, well you could but it would break down the insulation).
No you can't, see my previous post regarding center tapped earth.
Voltage doubling is feasible but would not give him increased power
input due to reduced current and inefficiencies in the doubler.
I know very little about lasers so I wont comment on the rest.
Vermin.
V
Vermin
Guest
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 20:44:03 +1000, Arpit
<DONTSPAMMEF00Lneko4@dodo.com.au> wrote:
required tho). Ebay has a few now and then.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2563259126&category=4660
Vermin.
<DONTSPAMMEF00Lneko4@dodo.com.au> wrote:
Neon sign shops are the place to try (a bit of social engineering isWhoops, sorry <g> Ive never actually owned a NST (can't find them
anywhere), only heard the legends, so yeah
required tho). Ebay has a few now and then.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2563259126&category=4660
Vermin.
V
Vermin
Guest
Sounds like you are thinking of flyback transformers not NSTs???
Vermin.
Vermin.
G
gcd
Guest
Hi,
I'll give to your better knowledge on neon stuff. I've seen info on both
current limited centre tapped transformers for neon and elsewhere stuff
about high frequency ac and also dc.
Perhaps I'm confused, thinking about my HeNe lasers which use high voltage
dc.
Simplest solution - talk to a transformer manufacturer and get one made. Not
sure if they do that voltage rating but try Tortech in Sydney, I've used
them for high power transformers and inductors in the past with great
success. There is also a mob here in Melb I've used for isolation
transformers to my spec, Altro transformers, you could try them.
For the CO2 laser, he wants a DC supply, so a rectifier will be needed with
current limiting if you don't want to damage the HV secondary in the event
of an accident.
op fyi
from the ANU
Class 1 - laser devices are safe for use under all conditions of exposure,
based upon current medical knowledge. This class includes all lasers or
laser systems that cannot emit levels of optical radiation above the
exposure limits for the eye under any exposure conditions inherent in the
design of the laser product. However, caution should be expressed when
repairing a class 1 laser product, as a higher class laser may be embedded
within it.
Class 2- laser or laser system emit a visible laser beam, which by its very
bright nature will be too dazzling to stare into for extended periods.
Momentary viewing is not considered hazardous, with potential damage to the
eyes avoided by normal blink and aversion responses (turning head, looking
away etc). class 2 lasers are only in the visible spectrum. Some controls
to prevent direct staring are required.
Class 3 - laser or laser system can emit any wavelength, but it cannot
produce a diffuse (scattered) reflection hazard unless focused or viewed for
extended periods at close range. These lasers are of medium to high power
and risk (output power is 0.5 W or less). They emit radiation that is
hazardous to the eye, but not a serious skin hazard. More stringent
controls are required, concentrating on eliminating intra-beam viewing.
Class 3 is further divided into:
Class 3A - mainly (visible) medium power lasers, (less than 5 mW in
visible). Marginal eye hazard. The beam must be expanded to an irradiance
of less than 25 Wm-2, to ensure that only 1 mW or less can enter the 7 mm
pupil.
Class 3B (restricted) - medium to high power visible lasers with more
stringent conditions of use. These are usually restricted to daylight
conditions where the pupil size is less than 5 mm in diameter. (eg. outdoor
lasers in the construction industry). They operate at similar power levels
to a class 3A laser, but have higher levels of irradiance (up to 50 Wm-2).
If used in low light conditions, the controls for a class 3B laser are
appropriate. This classification is unique to Australia.
Class 3B - mainly medium to high power lasers, with many operating in the
non - visible spectrum. Significant eye hazard (up to 500 mW in visible).
Diffuse reflection viewing is only safe if exposure is less than 10 s and
the distance to the reflecting surface is greater then 130 mm.
Class 4 - laser or laser system is any that exceeds the output limits
(Accessible Emission Limits, AELs) of a Class 3 device. These lasers are of
high power and risk. They are capable of producing diffuse reflections
hazardous to the eye and skin. They may be a fire risk. Very stringent
control measures are required for a Class 4 laser or laser system.
You are using a class 4 laser.
Cheers
Greg
"Vermin" <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:hhqcovk5mnjan9qc6a1etf6jkdrmpdlomp@4ax.com...
I'll give to your better knowledge on neon stuff. I've seen info on both
current limited centre tapped transformers for neon and elsewhere stuff
about high frequency ac and also dc.
Perhaps I'm confused, thinking about my HeNe lasers which use high voltage
dc.
Simplest solution - talk to a transformer manufacturer and get one made. Not
sure if they do that voltage rating but try Tortech in Sydney, I've used
them for high power transformers and inductors in the past with great
success. There is also a mob here in Melb I've used for isolation
transformers to my spec, Altro transformers, you could try them.
For the CO2 laser, he wants a DC supply, so a rectifier will be needed with
current limiting if you don't want to damage the HV secondary in the event
of an accident.
op fyi
from the ANU
Class 1 - laser devices are safe for use under all conditions of exposure,
based upon current medical knowledge. This class includes all lasers or
laser systems that cannot emit levels of optical radiation above the
exposure limits for the eye under any exposure conditions inherent in the
design of the laser product. However, caution should be expressed when
repairing a class 1 laser product, as a higher class laser may be embedded
within it.
Class 2- laser or laser system emit a visible laser beam, which by its very
bright nature will be too dazzling to stare into for extended periods.
Momentary viewing is not considered hazardous, with potential damage to the
eyes avoided by normal blink and aversion responses (turning head, looking
away etc). class 2 lasers are only in the visible spectrum. Some controls
to prevent direct staring are required.
Class 3 - laser or laser system can emit any wavelength, but it cannot
produce a diffuse (scattered) reflection hazard unless focused or viewed for
extended periods at close range. These lasers are of medium to high power
and risk (output power is 0.5 W or less). They emit radiation that is
hazardous to the eye, but not a serious skin hazard. More stringent
controls are required, concentrating on eliminating intra-beam viewing.
Class 3 is further divided into:
Class 3A - mainly (visible) medium power lasers, (less than 5 mW in
visible). Marginal eye hazard. The beam must be expanded to an irradiance
of less than 25 Wm-2, to ensure that only 1 mW or less can enter the 7 mm
pupil.
Class 3B (restricted) - medium to high power visible lasers with more
stringent conditions of use. These are usually restricted to daylight
conditions where the pupil size is less than 5 mm in diameter. (eg. outdoor
lasers in the construction industry). They operate at similar power levels
to a class 3A laser, but have higher levels of irradiance (up to 50 Wm-2).
If used in low light conditions, the controls for a class 3B laser are
appropriate. This classification is unique to Australia.
Class 3B - mainly medium to high power lasers, with many operating in the
non - visible spectrum. Significant eye hazard (up to 500 mW in visible).
Diffuse reflection viewing is only safe if exposure is less than 10 s and
the distance to the reflecting surface is greater then 130 mm.
Class 4 - laser or laser system is any that exceeds the output limits
(Accessible Emission Limits, AELs) of a Class 3 device. These lasers are of
high power and risk. They are capable of producing diffuse reflections
hazardous to the eye and skin. They may be a fire risk. Very stringent
control measures are required for a Class 4 laser or laser system.
You are using a class 4 laser.
Cheers
Greg
"Vermin" <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:hhqcovk5mnjan9qc6a1etf6jkdrmpdlomp@4ax.com...
A
Arpit
Guest
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 08:26:02 GMT, Vermin <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote:
Ill give them a try, thanks.
hehehhee- social engineering- havent heard that term in a whileOn Thu, 09 Oct 2003 20:44:03 +1000, Arpit
DONTSPAMMEF00Lneko4@dodo.com.au> wrote:
Whoops, sorry <g> Ive never actually owned a NST (can't find them
anywhere), only heard the legends, so yeah
Neon sign shops are the place to try (a bit of social engineering is
required tho). Ebay has a few now and then.
Ill give them a try, thanks.
D
Don Reinoga
Guest
Thanks Guys,
Spot on re the type of laser, Class 4 Sealed 1 meter CO2 tube.Saftey glass def
in use. We get some great beam reflections off a hard disk platter
The neon sign transformer we have it a 15KV rated to 60mA, which is more than we
need, and we are having some difficulty finding a resister rated to 225Watts.
We have got together 60 odd diodes for our bridge rectifer, which is working
fine.
The voltage doubler sounds like the way to go, this would give the required
voltage and reduce the current as well. We are using a variac to slowly bring up
the voltage till we get lasing.
Got to stuff from http://www.circlec.com.au
Prefer not to pull apart the neon sign transformer, its a sealed unit. So I will
investigate the voltage doubler.
I can't wait for my focusing lens to arrive....
Thanks, Don
gcd wrote:
Spot on re the type of laser, Class 4 Sealed 1 meter CO2 tube.Saftey glass def
in use. We get some great beam reflections off a hard disk platter
The neon sign transformer we have it a 15KV rated to 60mA, which is more than we
need, and we are having some difficulty finding a resister rated to 225Watts.
We have got together 60 odd diodes for our bridge rectifer, which is working
fine.
The voltage doubler sounds like the way to go, this would give the required
voltage and reduce the current as well. We are using a variac to slowly bring up
the voltage till we get lasing.
Got to stuff from http://www.circlec.com.au
Prefer not to pull apart the neon sign transformer, its a sealed unit. So I will
investigate the voltage doubler.
I can't wait for my focusing lens to arrive....
Thanks, Don
gcd wrote:
D
Don Reinoga
Guest
Opps forgot to ask, any more info on those IR Sticks?
Thanks
Don Reinoga wrote:
Thanks
Don Reinoga wrote:
G
gcd
Guest
Hi Don,
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
G
gcd
Guest
**HERE IT IS AGAIN COS MY ISP DECIDED THIS MESSAGE HAD BEEN ROUND LONG
ENOUGH AFTER 3-4HRS AND NUKED IT? - sorry to those who see this twice cos
they have superior ISPs**
Hi Don,
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
ENOUGH AFTER 3-4HRS AND NUKED IT? - sorry to those who see this twice cos
they have superior ISPs**
Hi Don,
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
D
Dave
Guest
OK I admit defeat !
What does Aus Post use these IR detection sticks for ?
Dave
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 08:05:30 GMT, "gcd" <gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au>
wrote:
What does Aus Post use these IR detection sticks for ?
Dave
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 08:05:30 GMT, "gcd" <gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au>
wrote:
**HERE IT IS AGAIN COS MY ISP DECIDED THIS MESSAGE HAD BEEN ROUND LONG
ENOUGH AFTER 3-4HRS AND NUKED IT? - sorry to those who see this twice cos
they have superior ISPs**
Hi Don,
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
Opps forgot to ask, any more info on those IR Sticks?
Thanks
Don Reinoga wrote:
Thanks Guys,
Spot on re the type of laser, Class 4 Sealed 1 meter CO2 tube.Saftey
glass def
in use. We get some great beam reflections off a hard disk platter
The neon sign transformer we have it a 15KV rated to 60mA, which is more
than we
need, and we are having some difficulty finding a resister rated to
225Watts.
We have got together 60 odd diodes for our bridge rectifer, which is
working
fine.
The voltage doubler sounds like the way to go, this would give the
required
voltage and reduce the current as well. We are using a variac to slowly
bring up
the voltage till we get lasing.
Got to stuff from http://www.circlec.com.au
Prefer not to pull apart the neon sign transformer, its a sealed unit.
So I will
investigate the voltage doubler.
I can't wait for my focusing lens to arrive....
Thanks, Don
gcd wrote:
Hi,
I'll give to your better knowledge on neon stuff. I've seen info on
both
current limited centre tapped transformers for neon and elsewhere
stuff
about high frequency ac and also dc.
Perhaps I'm confused, thinking about my HeNe lasers which use high
voltage
dc.
Simplest solution - talk to a transformer manufacturer and get one
made. Not
sure if they do that voltage rating but try Tortech in Sydney, I've
used
them for high power transformers and inductors in the past with great
success. There is also a mob here in Melb I've used for isolation
transformers to my spec, Altro transformers, you could try them.
For the CO2 laser, he wants a DC supply, so a rectifier will be needed
with
current limiting if you don't want to damage the HV secondary in the
event
of an accident.
op fyi
from the ANU
Class 1 - laser devices are safe for use under all conditions of
exposure,
based upon current medical knowledge. This class includes all lasers
or
laser systems that cannot emit levels of optical radiation above the
exposure limits for the eye under any exposure conditions inherent in
the
design of the laser product. However, caution should be expressed
when
repairing a class 1 laser product, as a higher class laser may be
embedded
within it.
Class 2- laser or laser system emit a visible laser beam, which by its
very
bright nature will be too dazzling to stare into for extended periods.
Momentary viewing is not considered hazardous, with potential damage
to the
eyes avoided by normal blink and aversion responses (turning head,
looking
away etc). class 2 lasers are only in the visible spectrum. Some
controls
to prevent direct staring are required.
Class 3 - laser or laser system can emit any wavelength, but it cannot
produce a diffuse (scattered) reflection hazard unless focused or
viewed for
extended periods at close range. These lasers are of medium to high
power
and risk (output power is 0.5 W or less). They emit radiation that is
hazardous to the eye, but not a serious skin hazard. More stringent
controls are required, concentrating on eliminating intra-beam
viewing.
Class 3 is further divided into:
Class 3A - mainly (visible) medium power lasers, (less than 5 mW in
visible). Marginal eye hazard. The beam must be expanded to an
irradiance
of less than 25 Wm-2, to ensure that only 1 mW or less can enter the 7
mm
pupil.
Class 3B (restricted) - medium to high power visible lasers with more
stringent conditions of use. These are usually restricted to daylight
conditions where the pupil size is less than 5 mm in diameter. (eg.
outdoor
lasers in the construction industry). They operate at similar power
levels
to a class 3A laser, but have higher levels of irradiance (up to 50
Wm-2).
If used in low light conditions, the controls for a class 3B laser are
appropriate. This classification is unique to Australia.
Class 3B - mainly medium to high power lasers, with many operating in
the
non - visible spectrum. Significant eye hazard (up to 500 mW in
visible).
Diffuse reflection viewing is only safe if exposure is less than 10 s
and
the distance to the reflecting surface is greater then 130 mm.
Class 4 - laser or laser system is any that exceeds the output limits
(Accessible Emission Limits, AELs) of a Class 3 device. These lasers
are of
high power and risk. They are capable of producing diffuse
reflections
hazardous to the eye and skin. They may be a fire risk. Very
stringent
control measures are required for a Class 4 laser or laser system.
You are using a class 4 laser.
Cheers
Greg
"Vermin" <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:hhqcovk5mnjan9qc6a1etf6jkdrmpdlomp@4ax.com...
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 07:53:16 GMT, "gcd"
gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au
wrote:
**RESENDING THIS AS MY ISP IS ROOTED**
Hi all,
Neon transformers are usually either DC output or high frequency AC
output
(given your application I suggest you have a DC unit).
No, they output 50 or 60 Hz AC (depending on supply and country of
origin).
There are modern switch mode versions (I don't know what they
output)
but the majority are still just step up transformers.
So either way you are not going to be able to do to much with it,
ie you
cannot run it into an ignition coil.
Agreed, but for different reasons (you can't put 15kV into a coil
rated for 12v, well you could but it would break down the
insulation).
If you are able to remove the internal rectifier (highly unlikely),
you
could use 2 of these transformers with the secondaries in series
and then
rectify to produce 30kV @ 30mA. Make sure you get the phasing
right! and
use
safety cut outs etc.
No you can't, see my previous post regarding center tapped earth.
Or again if you can remove the rectifier, you could replace it with
a
voltage doubling rectifier to get the 30kV, with a little less than
15mA
out - depending on how effecient the doubler is.
Voltage doubling is feasible but would not give him increased power
input due to reduced current and inefficiencies in the doubler.
I know very little about lasers so I wont comment on the rest.
Vermin.
G
gcd
Guest
Hi Dave,
AFAIK Aus post use them in work on the ir readers (mail sorters) of the pink
or invisible bar codes
Cheers
Greg
"Dave" <dave50_8@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:kkt6pv0thebmb0o6itglis3kd4hhl9tdk0@4ax.com...
AFAIK Aus post use them in work on the ir readers (mail sorters) of the pink
or invisible bar codes
Cheers
Greg
"Dave" <dave50_8@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:kkt6pv0thebmb0o6itglis3kd4hhl9tdk0@4ax.com...
OK I admit defeat !
What does Aus Post use these IR detection sticks for ?
Dave
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 08:05:30 GMT, "gcd" <gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au
wrote:
**HERE IT IS AGAIN COS MY ISP DECIDED THIS MESSAGE HAD BEEN ROUND LONG
ENOUGH AFTER 3-4HRS AND NUKED IT? - sorry to those who see this twice cos
they have superior ISPs**
Hi Don,
yes have some info that follows.
Its a Kodak IR detection Stick 0.7 - 1.3um Translucent, # 27535Z, Cat 827
8673. These are used by Aus post.
It has a small section of phosphorescent material which is sensitive to
IR
radiation and emits visible red.
Have fun........ safe fun that is
Cheers
Greg
"Don Reinoga" <dreinoga@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3F89EAD9.7D3A046B@dontvirusmebigpond.net.au...
Opps forgot to ask, any more info on those IR Sticks?
Thanks
Don Reinoga wrote:
Thanks Guys,
Spot on re the type of laser, Class 4 Sealed 1 meter CO2 tube.Saftey
glass def
in use. We get some great beam reflections off a hard disk platter
The neon sign transformer we have it a 15KV rated to 60mA, which is
more
than we
need, and we are having some difficulty finding a resister rated to
225Watts.
We have got together 60 odd diodes for our bridge rectifer, which is
working
fine.
The voltage doubler sounds like the way to go, this would give the
required
voltage and reduce the current as well. We are using a variac to
slowly
bring up
the voltage till we get lasing.
Got to stuff from http://www.circlec.com.au
Prefer not to pull apart the neon sign transformer, its a sealed
unit.
So I will
investigate the voltage doubler.
I can't wait for my focusing lens to arrive....
Thanks, Don
gcd wrote:
Hi,
I'll give to your better knowledge on neon stuff. I've seen info on
both
current limited centre tapped transformers for neon and elsewhere
stuff
about high frequency ac and also dc.
Perhaps I'm confused, thinking about my HeNe lasers which use high
voltage
dc.
Simplest solution - talk to a transformer manufacturer and get one
made. Not
sure if they do that voltage rating but try Tortech in Sydney, I've
used
them for high power transformers and inductors in the past with
great
success. There is also a mob here in Melb I've used for isolation
transformers to my spec, Altro transformers, you could try them.
For the CO2 laser, he wants a DC supply, so a rectifier will be
needed
with
current limiting if you don't want to damage the HV secondary in
the
event
of an accident.
op fyi
from the ANU
Class 1 - laser devices are safe for use under all conditions of
exposure,
based upon current medical knowledge. This class includes all
lasers
or
laser systems that cannot emit levels of optical radiation above
the
exposure limits for the eye under any exposure conditions inherent
in
the
design of the laser product. However, caution should be expressed
when
repairing a class 1 laser product, as a higher class laser may be
embedded
within it.
Class 2- laser or laser system emit a visible laser beam, which by
its
very
bright nature will be too dazzling to stare into for extended
periods.
Momentary viewing is not considered hazardous, with potential
damage
to the
eyes avoided by normal blink and aversion responses (turning head,
looking
away etc). class 2 lasers are only in the visible spectrum. Some
controls
to prevent direct staring are required.
Class 3 - laser or laser system can emit any wavelength, but it
cannot
produce a diffuse (scattered) reflection hazard unless focused or
viewed for
extended periods at close range. These lasers are of medium to
high
power
and risk (output power is 0.5 W or less). They emit radiation that
is
hazardous to the eye, but not a serious skin hazard. More
stringent
controls are required, concentrating on eliminating intra-beam
viewing.
Class 3 is further divided into:
Class 3A - mainly (visible) medium power lasers, (less than 5 mW in
visible). Marginal eye hazard. The beam must be expanded to an
irradiance
of less than 25 Wm-2, to ensure that only 1 mW or less can enter
the 7
mm
pupil.
Class 3B (restricted) - medium to high power visible lasers with
more
stringent conditions of use. These are usually restricted to
daylight
conditions where the pupil size is less than 5 mm in diameter.
(eg.
outdoor
lasers in the construction industry). They operate at similar
power
levels
to a class 3A laser, but have higher levels of irradiance (up to 50
Wm-2).
If used in low light conditions, the controls for a class 3B laser
are
appropriate. This classification is unique to Australia.
Class 3B - mainly medium to high power lasers, with many operating
in
the
non - visible spectrum. Significant eye hazard (up to 500 mW in
visible).
Diffuse reflection viewing is only safe if exposure is less than 10
s
and
the distance to the reflecting surface is greater then 130 mm.
Class 4 - laser or laser system is any that exceeds the output
limits
(Accessible Emission Limits, AELs) of a Class 3 device. These
lasers
are of
high power and risk. They are capable of producing diffuse
reflections
hazardous to the eye and skin. They may be a fire risk. Very
stringent
control measures are required for a Class 4 laser or laser system.
You are using a class 4 laser.
Cheers
Greg
"Vermin" <Vermin@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:hhqcovk5mnjan9qc6a1etf6jkdrmpdlomp@4ax.com...
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 07:53:16 GMT, "gcd"
gcdnoSPAM@austarmetro.com.au
wrote:
**RESENDING THIS AS MY ISP IS ROOTED**
Hi all,
Neon transformers are usually either DC output or high frequency
AC
output
(given your application I suggest you have a DC unit).
No, they output 50 or 60 Hz AC (depending on supply and country
of
origin).
There are modern switch mode versions (I don't know what they
output)
but the majority are still just step up transformers.
So either way you are not going to be able to do to much with
it,
ie you
cannot run it into an ignition coil.
Agreed, but for different reasons (you can't put 15kV into a coil
rated for 12v, well you could but it would break down the
insulation).
If you are able to remove the internal rectifier (highly
unlikely),
you
could use 2 of these transformers with the secondaries in series
and then
rectify to produce 30kV @ 30mA. Make sure you get the phasing
right! and
use
safety cut outs etc.
No you can't, see my previous post regarding center tapped earth.
Or again if you can remove the rectifier, you could replace it
with
a
voltage doubling rectifier to get the 30kV, with a little less
than
15mA
out - depending on how effecient the doubler is.
Voltage doubling is feasible but would not give him increased
power
input due to reduced current and inefficiencies in the doubler.
I know very little about lasers so I wont comment on the rest.
Vermin.