Surge / Ground / Lightning

[bud--]

krw wrote:

In article <OKadnRdUKpg42L7VnZ2dnUVZ_tPinZ2d@comcast.com>,
me@nomail.com says...
Mike Tomlinson wrote:

Phone wires were clamped to ground before the 1960s?
It was common to earth one leg of the incoming pair to either the house
ground or to its own rod. An earth connection also allowed "party
lines", where two houses could share one physical phone line pair, each
house with its own number. Disadvantage was that both lines could not
be used simultaneously.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_line_(telephony)

I think they used to ring between the red green for one party, yellow
green for the other party, black green, etc.

No, that would defeat the purpose of the party line. The ringers
either had "distinctive ring" (once for Mabel, twice for Maude) or
were frequency tuned.

They did frequency and distinctive rings. But for 2 parties you can ring
red-to-ground for one and green-to-ground for the other. It is in Mike's
Wikipedia link above. My recollection is black was ground and yellow was
sometimes used for a light in the phone (red and green are phone wires).

--
bud--

 

[krw]

In article <bc45f$48248dbc$4213ea37$25354@DIALUPUSA.NET>,
remove.budnews@isp.com says...

krw wrote:
In article <OKadnRdUKpg42L7VnZ2dnUVZ_tPinZ2d@comcast.com>,
me@nomail.com says...
Mike Tomlinson wrote:

Phone wires were clamped to ground before the 1960s?
It was common to earth one leg of the incoming pair to either the house
ground or to its own rod. An earth connection also allowed "party
lines", where two houses could share one physical phone line pair, each
house with its own number. Disadvantage was that both lines could not
be used simultaneously.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_line_(telephony)

I think they used to ring between the red green for one party, yellow
green for the other party, black green, etc.

No, that would defeat the purpose of the party line. The ringers
either had "distinctive ring" (once for Mabel, twice for Maude) or
were frequency tuned.


They did frequency and distinctive rings. But for 2 parties you can ring
red-to-ground for one and green-to-ground for the other. It is in Mike's
Wikipedia link above. My recollection is black was ground and yellow was
sometimes used for a light in the phone (red and green are phone wires).

Princess phones used the yellow green pair for the dial light. A
transformer was hidden somewhere in teh house to supply the power
(IIRC, a standard 24VAC door bell transformer, but it's been a lot
of years).

--
Keith

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

krw wrote:

Princess phones used the yellow green pair for the dial light. A
transformer was hidden somewhere in teh house to supply the power
(IIRC, a standard 24VAC door bell transformer, but it's been a lot
of years).

The lamp was on yellow & black. Red & Green are the pair to the CO.


--
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prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[Mike Tomlinson]

In article <g03g3n$lj5$1@news.Stanford.EDU>, Alan
<nospam@w6yx.stanford.edu> writes

Similarly, I would question the reliability of ring on a single line
referencing
ground, since party lines tended to be out longer distances -- the ground
resistivity
would make it more difficult to get ring current to the phone(s).

It did work though. The mechanical bells in older phones in the UK had
a lower impedance (500 ohm coils vs. 2000 ohm coils in newer phones), so
the ringer would draw more current. The ringer was also two bells
either side of a balanced clapper, so it took little to make it ring -
the more current it was able to draw from the line, the louder it rang.

I remember a neighbour with a party line whose phone had problems -
calling her would give a ring tone in the earpiece, but she would claim
that she had never heard the phone ring. Several visits from the GPO
(as was BT) engineers found no fault, the phone always working when they
visited.

Eventually it was discovered that her party line was grounded via the
waste pipe (lead pipe into a cast iron stack disappearing into the
ground) of her cloakroom toilet, which was little used, and in the
summer, when the ground dried out and the water in the toilet pan
evaporated and ran low, the phone lost its earth and failed to ring.
Flushing the toilet restored normal operation to the phone

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[Michael A. Terrell]

Mike Tomlinson wrote:

In article <g03g3n$lj5$1@news.Stanford.EDU>, Alan
nospam@w6yx.stanford.edu> writes

Similarly, I would question the reliability of ring on a single line
referencing
ground, since party lines tended to be out longer distances -- the ground
resistivity
would make it more difficult to get ring current to the phone(s).

It did work though. The mechanical bells in older phones in the UK had
a lower impedance (500 ohm coils vs. 2000 ohm coils in newer phones), so
the ringer would draw more current. The ringer was also two bells
either side of a balanced clapper, so it took little to make it ring -
the more current it was able to draw from the line, the louder it rang.

I remember a neighbour with a party line whose phone had problems -
calling her would give a ring tone in the earpiece, but she would claim
that she had never heard the phone ring. Several visits from the GPO
(as was BT) engineers found no fault, the phone always working when they
visited.

Eventually it was discovered that her party line was grounded via the
waste pipe (lead pipe into a cast iron stack disappearing into the
ground) of her cloakroom toilet, which was little used, and in the
summer, when the ground dried out and the water in the toilet pan
evaporated and ran low, the phone lost its earth and failed to ring.
Flushing the toilet restored normal operation to the phone

Now THAT was _crappy_ phone service!


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[krw]

In article <482525B3.3AC27A9E@earthlink.net>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...

krw wrote:

Princess phones used the yellow green pair for the dial light. A
transformer was hidden somewhere in teh house to supply the power
(IIRC, a standard 24VAC door bell transformer, but it's been a lot
of years).


The lamp was on yellow & black. Red & Green are the pair to the CO.

<slap!> There I was typing, looking at bud-'s post and *STILL* got
the wires crossed. I *shoulda* had a V8.

--
Keith

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

krw wrote:

In article <482525B3.3AC27A9E@earthlink.net>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...
krw wrote:

Princess phones used the yellow green pair for the dial light. A
transformer was hidden somewhere in teh house to supply the power
(IIRC, a standard 24VAC door bell transformer, but it's been a lot
of years).


The lamp was on yellow & black. Red & Green are the pair to the CO.

slap!> There I was typing, looking at bud-'s post and *STILL* got
the wires crossed. I *shoulda* had a V8.

No big deal. Do you remember that wall wart being the first one
recalled for being a fire hazard?


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[Michael A. Terrell]

Jim Redelfs wrote:

In article <MdKdnQNUvK94AbrVnZ2dnUVZ_hKdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

Do you remember that wall wart being the first one
recalled for being a fire hazard?

That was one of Western Electric's first uses of a third-party supplier.
In this case, it was Ault Manufacturing.

The Ault transformer recall was HUGE.

There are still MANY Western Electric dial-light transformers in service
to this day. Virtually all are powering NOTHING but have not been
unplugged.

That is very easy to explain: "Rowan & Martin's Laugh-in" with Lilly
Tomlin as Ernestine, the telephone operator: "We're the phone company.
We don't care, we don't have to."

<http://www.lilytomlin.com/charns/ernestine/quotes.htm>
<http://www.lilytomlin.com/lily/lilygal/lilyswitchboard.html>



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