Solid State Relays and EMI

Spehro Pefhany wrote:

On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 11:28:08 +0100, the renowned John Woodgate
jmw@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote:


I read in sci.electronics.design that Chris S. <chrisks@NOSPAMudel.edu
wrote (in <ce2dgg$aga$1@scrotar.nss.udel.edu>) about 'Solid State Relays
and EMI', on Mon, 26 Jul 2004:

True, although it does mention semiconductors, and I can count the
number of semiconductors composed of moving parts on zero hands.

Not any more. Consider the TI micro-mirror-matrix chips, for example,
and solid-state microphones are appearing on the market, too.


Solid-state accelerometers with on-chip bending arms have been
available for about a decade- and have sold in large quantity.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't necessarily classify MEMS devices as solid-state. While
certain types make use of "bending" to move small actuators, they still
rely on this movement to perform their function. The characteristic I
typically associate with solid-state is a lack of dependence on physical
motion to function.
 
"Ryerson" <careyr@coloradotime.com> wrote in message
news:10gac3q7o9k052e@corp.supernews.com...
I have just begun a project for a device that will be submerged in
pool
water. The depth will be a maximum of ten feet. I am trying to find
sealed
and booted rocker and toggle switches that will withstand continuous
submersion in pool water with a chlorine content of 2-3 ppm. I am also
looking for a three-pin panel mount connector that I can use to
recharge the
batteries in the unit when not in use. This connector will be capped
when
the unit is submerged.

Any ideas?
Click to expand...
Yeah, for switches, use reed switches behind a sealed enclosure, and a
plastic coated magnet on the outside to turn the reed switch on.

Every switch boot I've seen cracks after time. I wouldn't trust one
underwater. Use clear plastic for at least part of the case, so you can
see condensation buildup inside. But by then, it may be too late. :-(

As for the connector, you had better make sure that the unit is totally
dry when you uncap it. Any slight amount of moisture that gets into the
capped connector will corrode it, and eventually get inside and corrode
everything else.

Thanks,

C. Ryerson
Click to expand...
 
suggest you search ebay for X 10 under consumer electronics...
I have several of these items running in my house. Good luck


"Jeff Broner" <toplite@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:BX1Mc.7811$_K2.614@lakeread02...
I don't know anything about electronics, but I'm willing to learn if this
project is possible: I'd like to build a very compact timer that runs on
AC
115v 60hz. It would consist of a simple clock circuit that outputs to some
kind of programmable logic circuit. This circuit would be programmed to
turn
a relay on/off at specific times of the day (it could be a one time
programmable type of thing). My ideal design would be all solid state and
fairly compact, like less that 1.5" (~ 40 mm) cube. What I'd basically be
making is a lamp timer like the ones you can find at walmart, but much
smaller and minus the digital interface. Is this possible, and if so how
cheap could it be made? Any suggestions on manufacturers of the
components?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
 
What exactly would prompt a company, that does sell 10,000 components at a
time, to sell you a packet of 10?. What would their profit motive be?.
Believe me, as a bulk supplier of a product to industry...I know. We have a
small line of home based machines, and we get 2 or 3 people a day as walk in
customers, as well as internet customers.....and believe me... its nothing
but a pain in the ass!
Individual packaging, manuals/spec sheets, shipping, tracking, RETURNS with
a individual customer who thinks that the entire company revolves around his
or her ass, in comparison to loading up a tractor trailer load, saying
goodbye to it, and NEVER HEARING ABOUT IT AGAIN. Our profit margin with
internet items is less than 5%, after you deal with boxing, packing,
shipping, phoney credit card orders (we get about 10 of those a day) and the
occasional return.
With bulk sales, our profit is often better than 60%, everyone pays in
advance, no scams, no complaints...etc.
As a business owner...which would you prefer to deal with?.
Kim


"EBG" <maberger@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:j5SdnYkE1vLnFJTcRVn-tQ@comcast.com...
Is there such a thing as a web based distributor(s) for asian electronic
components?

You know kind of like the Digi key of Japan or the Newark of Hong Kong?

Places where you can actually use a charge card maybe and tap into some of
that great pricing without having to buy 10,000 pcs and wait for the ship
to
arrive.

I know it's an odd question.....but you never know.
Click to expand...
 
L24? L usually stands for inductor.

"BigBadger" <big_badger@NOSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:ceeil2$4b2$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
--
*****Replace 'NOSPAM' with 'btinternet' in the reply address*****
"Graham W" <graham@his.com.puter.INVALID> wrote in message
news:410aca07$0$62923$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

"BigBadger" <big_badger@NOSPAM_replace_NOSPAM_with_btinternet.com> wrote
in message news:Xns9536E9F47EC63bigbadgerbtinternet@195.92.193.157...
I have a Asus dual cpu motherboard on which one of the CPU sockets
does
not
work. On examination I've found a surface mounted component near the
fauly
socket that has been damaged during removal or installation of the CPU
heatsink.

Are you really sure it hasn't exploded? There's a splash of solder
on the solder resist which is a clue that something got very hot?

the component is rectangular and black and is marked 34 08, next to
the
component the PCB is marked D3.

It is a diode and may be a part of the voltage regulator for the CPU.

If you follow this link you will see a photo of the damaged component:
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/abz_piper/component.JPG

Can you get a better picture of the big black one nearby with the stubby
non-connected middle leg?

I can tell you what is marked on the MOSFET, this: 10N03L I049

By the way, yes I'm 99% sure that ot's mechanical damage, ther is no sign
of
the component exploding and it is positioned right where the screwdriver
goes in the heatsink clip. Plus the owner of the board (not me) has a
history of this sort of thing, in fact I've just spotted another component
with similar damage, marked L24 on the pcb, this is a smaller component,
looks very like a SMT resistor.



--
Graham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial
WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex
Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps
Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter.
Click to expand...
 
Your best bet would be to find the same motherboard and write down
values/types of components that you are missing.

"BigBadger" <big_badger@NOSPAM_replace_with_btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9537BBB66AA4bigbadgerbtinternet@195.92.193.157...
Here is another one for you clever people to answer.

I've got another motherboard with damage to surface mounted components.
This time the components have been knocked off completely.

The only clue to what they were is the marking on the board.
Some are Resistors (marked 'R')
Some are capacitors (marked 'C')
Another marked 'L' which I believe to be an Inductor
There is a couple marked 'BC' not sure what this is... some type of
capacitor?
There is one marked 'TC'... another capacitor?


I was hoping someone could confirm what is what?

Here is a link to a photo if you want a laugh: http://mysite.wanadoo-
members.co.uk/abz_piper/missing_components.JPG
Click to expand...
 
On Fri, 30 Jul 2004 23:38:25 +0100, "BigBadger"
<big_badger@NOSPAM.com> put finger to keyboard and composed:

--
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"Graham W" <graham@his.com.puter.INVALID> wrote in message
news:410aca07$0$62923$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

"BigBadger" <big_badger@NOSPAM_replace_NOSPAM_with_btinternet.com> wrote
in message news:Xns9536E9F47EC63bigbadgerbtinternet@195.92.193.157...
I have a Asus dual cpu motherboard on which one of the CPU sockets does
not
work. On examination I've found a surface mounted component near the
fauly
socket that has been damaged during removal or installation of the CPU
heatsink.

Are you really sure it hasn't exploded? There's a splash of solder
on the solder resist which is a clue that something got very hot?

the component is rectangular and black and is marked 34 08, next to the
component the PCB is marked D3.

It is a diode and may be a part of the voltage regulator for the CPU.

If you follow this link you will see a photo of the damaged component:
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/abz_piper/component.JPG

Can you get a better picture of the big black one nearby with the stubby
non-connected middle leg?

I can tell you what is marked on the MOSFET, this: 10N03L I049

By the way, yes I'm 99% sure that ot's mechanical damage, ther is no sign of
the component exploding and it is positioned right where the screwdriver
goes in the heatsink clip. Plus the owner of the board (not me) has a
history of this sort of thing, in fact I've just spotted another component
with similar damage, marked L24 on the pcb, this is a smaller component,
looks very like a SMT resistor.
Click to expand...
The MOSFET is an N-channel, logic level, low Rds(on) device with a
30V, 73A rating:
http://www.infineon.com/cmc_upload/documents/058/486/IPP_B_10N03L.pdf

Its circuit symbol shows an internal 30V (?) zener diode connected
between drain and source. This inverse diode's continuous
forward current rating is 73A. The external diode, D3, appears to be
connected in parallel with this internal diode. I wonder why it is
there at all?


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
 
Hi,

It is obviously a diode (marked D3) and IF the characters on
it are the actual device number, then it is a 1N3408, 33V, 500mW
zener.


What would a 33-volt Zener be doing on a PC motherboard whose highest
incoming supply voltage is 12 volts?
Click to expand...

Even I realised the disparity in voltages.

Please note my use of capitals on the word 'IF'.


Cheers - Joe
 
"(0) -^- (0)" <transistorPLEASE@REMOVEkc.rrTHISTOREPLY.com> wrote in
message news:410bb1a1.31702454@news-server.kc.rr.com...
In a recent discussion, people were speaking of a TO-36 Germanium
Power Transistor. Thought I would post a picture of one so younger
folks could see how ugly they were.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-7/794359/Mvc-020l.jpg

and the specs...

http://www.villagephotos.com/viewimage.asp?id_=9479419
Click to expand...
I never thought they looked ugly; the gold plated ones looked awesome.
The specs left something to be desired, tho.
 
"Norm Dresner" <ndrez@att.net> wrote in message
news:68QOc.360662$Gx4.6510@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
"(0) -^- (0)" <transistorPLEASE@REMOVEkc.rrTHISTOREPLY.com> wrote in
message
news:410bb1a1.31702454@news-server.kc.rr.com...
In a recent discussion, people were speaking of a TO-36 Germanium
Power Transistor. Thought I would post a picture of one so younger
folks could see how ugly they were.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-7/794359/Mvc-020l.jpg


Why do you call that "ugly". It takes only one screw to mount it
instead of
2 for the TO-3 can that replaced it. And the leads have eyelets for
attaching wires securely. Perfect ;-)
Click to expand...
I agree. And if you don't like the eyelets on the ends of the leads,
you can get the transistor in the TO-68 package, which is exactly the
same as the TO-36 except the leads are straight pins.

> Norm
 
"Mark (UK)" <jumbos.bazzar@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:cegokj$45p$3@hercules.btinternet.com...
I love the description on the package:

"for the hobbiest, experimenter & professional applications"

So....erm....for everything then!

Yours, Mark.
Click to expand...
You didn't get it. It's Hobbyist,
Experimenter, Professional, which spells

HEP.

That's why they called it the HEP line.


(0) -^- (0) wrote:

In a recent discussion, people were speaking of a TO-36 Germanium
Power Transistor. Thought I would post a picture of one so younger
folks could see how ugly they were.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-7/794359/Mvc-020l.jpg

and the specs...

http://www.villagephotos.com/viewimage.asp?id_=9479419
Click to expand...
 
We have a term for this. It is FUBAR.

I'd say the effort of the repair will far exceed the effort to earn enough
cash to buy another one.
 
--
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"Dan Fraser" <dmfraser@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jciPc.102744$cK4.54360@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
We have a term for this. It is FUBAR.

I'd say the effort of the repair will far exceed the effort to earn enough
cash to buy another one.

yeah... I'm coming to the same conclusion.
Click to expand...
 
By the way.... there are 15 such components either missing or damaged!

--
*****Replace 'NOSPAM' with 'btinternet' in the reply address*****
"Dan Fraser" <dmfraser@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jciPc.102744$cK4.54360@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
We have a term for this. It is FUBAR.

I'd say the effort of the repair will far exceed the effort to earn enough
cash to buy another one.
Click to expand...
 
On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 18:18:42 GMT, "Norm Dresner" <ndrez@att.net>
wrote:

Well http://www.radanpro.com/el/datasheets_lm1.htm claims to have it but
"registration" is required and the registration page wasn't working for me
today.
At http://www.datasheetarchive.com/cgi-bin/search.php?search=lm376 I was
able to get it but their bandwidth leaves a lot to be desired.

The key I've found is to Google for part# + datasheet.

Norm
Click to expand...
thanks a lot, but yea a tried the radanpro one, but all i got from the
registration is a bunch of spam...


....

scam the rich, and resell cheap, to the poor...
 
On 2 Aug 2004 04:52:20 -0700, dreetn2001@hotmail.com (Dr.Eetn) put
finger to keyboard and composed:

Hi, I've a Seiko Graphical LCD here, but I'd like to know the pinout
of its controller.
There are a lot of numbers on the LCD, but don't find what I need with
any of the numbers.
First of all I got some possible model numbers: SII YWP-C and C397005
Then I got some chip-numbers: NEC C1100G, C324G
Click to expand...
uPC324G = LM324 quad op amp
http://www.necel.com/cgi-bin/nesdis/dl_docpdf.cgi?lang=E&litcode=G11763EJ4V0DS00
http://www.necel.com/nesdis/image/G11763EJ4V0DS00.pdf

uPC1100G = Switching regulator
http://www.necel.com/cgi-bin/nesdis/dl_docpdf.cgi?lang=E&litcode=IC-2122A
http://www.necel.com/nesdis/image/IC-2122A.pdf

and (with the mark of
Seiko) 9150 C06
Click to expand...
9150 may be a YYWW date code.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
 
"Thomas P. Gootee" <tomg@fullnet.com> wrote in message
news:11915d6.0408021000.7495e52f@posting.google.com...
"Roger Hamlett" <rogerspamignored@ttelmah.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:<o%nPc.207$Uk3.87@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net>...
"Thomas P. Gootee" <tomg@fullnet.com> wrote in message
news:11915d6.0408012108.59369103@posting.google.com...
"Ryan Wheeler" <mojo@nospam_netscape.com> wrote in message
news:<f27Pc.5216$zXz1.4031@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>...
Thomas P. Gootee wrote:

I am re-designing some pcbs, to make the equipment they're in
easier
to manufacture, and service or upgrade.

The pcbs currently have quite a few wires that are soldered
directly
to them, that go to front-panel controls (and to other pcbs).

The wires to all of the front-panel controls are also soldered
directly to the solder lugs of the controls (switches, pots,
etc).

To make manufacturing and service/maintenance/upgrading faster
and
easier, I think that ALL of the wire connections to the pcbs
should
use removable connectors, such as pin headers on the boards and
crimp
sockets on the wires. Also, where desirable and logical, I
think
that
sets of multiple individual wires should be replaced with ribbon
cables, with appropriate headers and sockets.

To make this possible, I think that I will have to re-design the
front
panel controls, to use a pcb behind the front panel, changing
all of
the controls from solder-lug types to pcb-mount types. That way,
I
can
use headers, sockets, ribbon cables, etc, to connect the
existing
pcbs
to the front panel controls (via headers on the new
front-panel-interface pcb).

Here's where I would like some help:

I am not very familiar with the vast majority of the myriad
different
types of wire-to-board (and board-to-board) connector systems
that
are
available. There seem to be zillions of different ones. And the
catalogs, and even the manufacturers' websites, seem to assume
that
I
already know how they're assembled and installed, etc. But
THAT'S
what
I'm trying to find out, so I can decide which ones would be
convenient
and cost-effective to put into the design.

So: Does anybody have any "favorite" makes and models of
wire-to-board
(or board-to-board) connectors? (They need to be able to handle
at
least 1.5 Amps and up to at least 15 V DC. And they need to be
easy
and cheap to assemble.) Or any least favorites?

What I was also HOPING to find was someplace that sells
ready-made
ribbon-cable types of assemblies, in short lengths (4 to 6
inches),
with versions having 2, 4, and 6 conductors, with connectors
already
installed on both ends. I have looked long and hard and can only
find
standard computer-type cables that are ready-made (i.e. either
way
too
many conductors, or way too long).

Anybody?

Regards,

Tom Gootee

http://www.fullnet.com/u/tomg

-----------------------------

look at MOLEX or AMP

Gee... THANKS!!!

I *HAVE* been looking at them, for quite some time. Too long of a
time.

I realize that beggars can't be choosers. But I was hoping for
something just a LITTLE more-specific than THAT.

But thanks for at least replying.

Regards,

Tom Gootee
It really does depend massively on the 'nature' of your front panel.
You
are doing a balancing act between tooling cost on the front panel, and
assembly costs, and the changeover point, will depend on the
quantities
involved, and the actual parts used on the front panel. As an example,
I
had a panel, which had a keypad, LCD, some seperate buttons, and a
single
pot. For genuinely 'mass' production, it was cheaper to get rid of the
pot
completely, change the main electronics to use a computer controlled
pot,
then have a flexible PCB made for the front panel, with direct
connection
to the LCD, and the key matrix all built onto one board, with a couple
of
new buttons to adjust the digital pot. The connection then became a
matter
of using a single strip connector, that goes directly to such flexible
boards. Manufacturers like Molex, and AMP, provide most connector
families
you ae likely to need. You need to work out the best way of laying out
the
front panel, and the number of connections you need. Then the design
you
have chosen here, will 'set' the nature of the plugs you need. The
reason
for no specific replies, is that you have not presented enough data to
make anything 'better' really possible...

Best Wishes

Roger,

Thanks for responding!

I am planning to probably just have a ribbon cable or multi-wire
socket or header on each pcb, to connect them each to the front
panel's new pcb (i.e. to another socket or header, there), and then
route traces from the sockets or headers to the appropriate control
and i/o connectors.

In this case, while it MAY eventually be truly mass-produced by
another company, right now it will be produced in relatively small
quantities (just in the hundreds per year, probably). BUT, it will
ALSO still be made available as a KIT version. So I "have" to try to
keep it simple and easy to construct, especially since one of the kit
options that I would LIKE to continue to offer (but don't care too
much if I can't) is an even-lower-cost version of the kit that
includes do-it-yourself PCBs (i.e. blank boards, iron-on patterns,
etchant, etc).

So, in this case, I will be using a plain single-sided standard PCB,
which will be almost the size of the front panel, and will be parallel
to and just behind the panel. The front-panel controls include only
rotary switches, pots, mini-toggle switches, and an LED, all of which
also come in versions with PCB-pin connectors instead of solder lugs.

On the front panel, there are two 2P6T rotary switches, a 1P12T
rotary, two 4P3T rotaries, 2 pots, and 6 SPDT toggle switches, plus an
LED, and i/o connectors, including 5 BNC, three banana jacks, and an
8-pin transistor socket. But there are three different PCBs that
everything connects to (only certain things connect to each pcb). I
also want to use plug and socket connectors for the power and ground
distribution, from the power supply board to the two other boards, and
to power-supply outputs (banana), on the rear panel.

I am planning to probably just have ribbon cable or multi-wire
socket(s) or header(s) on each pcb, to connect them each to the front
panel's new pcb's sockets or headers, and then route traces to the
appropriate control or i/o connectors.

It looks like the Molex KK line, or something similar, might work
well, for this, using a separate wire for each pin. But their
flex-cable (ribbon-like) jumpers, or something like them, look
attractive, too, if appropriate connectors are installed on both ends.

BUT, what I had **HOPED** to find available was ribbon-cable-type, or
similar but multi-discrete-wire-type, **ASSEMBLIES**, that already had
the connectors installed on both ends. I guess that that was too much
to hope for.

One other option that I can think of is card-edge ribbon-cable
connections, since it would be pretty easy for me to put in traces to
match them, and cut slots for the connectors to fit into the edges of
all of the boards. But, again, the fewer steps that are involved in
the production process, the better. However, if I could find
pre-assembled card-edge-connector ribbon cables with a reasonable
number of conductors and enough current-carrying capacity, that might
not be a bad way to go.
For your application, look at simple 0.05" pitch IDC ribbon connectors.
Click to expand...
These are the connectors used on the IDE hard drives etc.. The cables can
be made any length you want. If you have noise considerations, 'twist and
flat' versions of the cable, and shielded cables are available. Relative
to most similar connectors, they are cheap, and reliable.

Best Wishes
 
I don't think all missing components got broken off - sometimes there are
just places for components for different versions and layouts.

"BigBadger" <big_badger@NOSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:cekl4n$vd3$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
By the way.... there are 15 such components either missing or damaged!

--
*****Replace 'NOSPAM' with 'btinternet' in the reply address*****
"Dan Fraser" <dmfraser@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jciPc.102744$cK4.54360@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
We have a term for this. It is FUBAR.

I'd say the effort of the repair will far exceed the effort to earn
enough
cash to buy another one.
Click to expand...
 
--
*****Replace 'NOSPAM' with 'btinternet' in the reply address*****
"Eugen T" <viperz@nomorespam.com> wrote in message
news:13SPc.24702$Vm1.484010@news20.bellglobal.com...
I don't think all missing components got broken off - sometimes there are
just places for components for different versions and layouts.
Click to expand...
No, I'm sure they are broken off... There are 'spare' locations for
components but they are easy to spot because the solder points are clean and
smooth. Where the components are missing I can clearly see the solder left
behind and in some cases fragments of the component... have a look at this
picture:
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/abz_piper/missing_components.JPG
I think you will agree there was something there.... this is typical.
 
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