Solder Lead free?

S

SD

Guest
Hi all

For solder this chips, Maxim1987, which solder wire using? and the liquid
flux?

http://www.techimo.com/forum/mobile-computing/126058-hp-compaq-nc6000-problems-15.html
http://www.laptoppartwholesale.com/Eblog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/max1987-2.jpg


Thanks
 
In my limited experience with hand soldering on micro-sized circuit board
pads, adding any additional solder greatly increases the chances of creating
short circuits from excess solder remaining on the pins or pads.

A small amount of liquid flux is adequate, and I mean barely more than a
slight trace of flux, because a drop is way too much, and will prevent good
visibility.
I generally use a toothpick with a little liquid flux on it, but much of it
wiped onto a scrap of paper to leave just a thin coat of flux on the
toothpick, then dragging the toothpick along one side of the IC, followed by
a close inspection to see that a tiny amount of the flux is on each pin or
pad, and then proceed to apply flux to the other sides of the IC.

I can't work on items that small anymore without magnification and very good
lighting, and wouldn't attempt it without a good magnifier lamp, even with
great eyesight.

Just touching a clean, hot soldering iron tip on the connection is normally
all that's required for complete reflow of the existing solder.
If there is excess solder on the iron's tip, it will likely cause problems.

With enough magnification, it's easy to determine if the proper reflow has
been accomplished.
If any of the connections appear to have too little solder for a reliable
connection under close inspection, then it may require the application of a
very slight amount of solder.
Adding the solder can be tricky, but remember that it's probably going to be
easier to add too much, than it will be to remove the excess, so just wet
the iron's tip enough to get a little solder to transfer to the connection.
The liquid flux will insure that transfer takes place.

I would use ordinary flux core 60/40 solder on the iron's tip, or a very
small amount of paste solder, of the type intended for surface mount
components applied to the pads (only if needed though).

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


"SD" <gfegk@gfdsd> wrote in message
news:4ca0bf5b$0$12122$4fafbaef@reader4.news.tin.it...
Hi all

For solder this chips, Maxim1987, which solder wire using? and the liquid
flux?

http://www.techimo.com/forum/mobile-computing/126058-hp-compaq-nc6000-problems-15.html
http://www.laptoppartwholesale.com/Eblog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/max1987-2.jpg


Thanks
Click to expand...
 
many thanks.

One last question.This flux liquid is acceptable?

http://cgi.ebay.it/Advanced-Solder-Soldering-Paste-Flux-Grease-RMA223-10cc-/220664019690?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item336099baea


Regards
 
"SD" <gfegk@gfdsd> wrote in message
news:4ca0bf5b$0$12122$4fafbaef@reader4.news.tin.it...

Hi all

For solder this chips, Maxim1987, which solder wire using? and the liquid
flux?

http://www.techimo.com/forum/mobile-computing/126058-hp-compaq-nc6000-problems-15.html
http://www.laptoppartwholesale.com/Eblog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/max1987-2.jpg


Thanks
Click to expand...
"Wild_Bill" <wb_wildbill@XSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mb4oo.219089$iV7.51098@en-nntp-15.dc1.easynews.com...
In my limited experience with hand soldering on micro-sized circuit board
pads, adding any additional solder greatly increases the chances of
creating short circuits from excess solder remaining on the pins or pads.

A small amount of liquid flux is adequate, and I mean barely more than a
slight trace of flux, because a drop is way too much, and will prevent
good visibility.
I generally use a toothpick with a little liquid flux on it, but much of
it wiped onto a scrap of paper to leave just a thin coat of flux on the
toothpick, then dragging the toothpick along one side of the IC, followed
by a close inspection to see that a tiny amount of the flux is on each pin
or pad, and then proceed to apply flux to the other sides of the IC.

I can't work on items that small anymore without magnification and very
good lighting, and wouldn't attempt it without a good magnifier lamp, even
with great eyesight.

Just touching a clean, hot soldering iron tip on the connection is
normally all that's required for complete reflow of the existing solder.
If there is excess solder on the iron's tip, it will likely cause
problems.

With enough magnification, it's easy to determine if the proper reflow has
been accomplished.
If any of the connections appear to have too little solder for a reliable
connection under close inspection, then it may require the application of
a very slight amount of solder.
Adding the solder can be tricky, but remember that it's probably going to
be easier to add too much, than it will be to remove the excess, so just
wet the iron's tip enough to get a little solder to transfer to the
connection. The liquid flux will insure that transfer takes place.

I would use ordinary flux core 60/40 solder on the iron's tip, or a very
small amount of paste solder, of the type intended for surface mount
components applied to the pads (only if needed though).

--
Cheers,
WB
.............
Click to expand...
If the correct amount of liquid flux is on the job, then relatively huge
quantities of solder can be added in via the iron's tip to 'drag solder' all
the pins along a side pretty much 'en masse'. Only the correct amount of
solder will adhere to each joint, pulled in by capillary action, and the
liquid flux will do a remarkably good job of ensuring that shorts between
pins do not occur. If they do, it is a very simple task to remove the excess
solder causing the short, by the use of (good quality) desoldering braid. I
agree that good light and high levels of magnification are needed to be able
to do the job successfully. From the pictures in the links, that chip
doesn't have a particularly high pin density, so should not present too much
of a problem to resolder to the experienced hand.

The board was probably originally constructed with lead-free solder, so
strictly speaking, lead free should be used for the rework. However, in this
case, I think a much greater chance of success will be stood, by using
conventional 60/40 leaded solder. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea to wick
off as much of the original solder as possible, before adding new solder in.

Here is an excellent video of soldering technique, which gives a good demo
of drag soldering, and use of desolder braid

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2860197/soldering_basic_to_advance_surface_mount_through_hole_wires_terminals/

Arfa
 
The product you asked about isn't liquid, it's a paste. I prefer liquid
which comes in bottles, and is also available in pen applicators.
The pens may dry out, but liquid rosin flux in a bottle can be thinned with
denatured alcohol if it becomes too thick with age.

Paste flux will probably work fine, but may leave more of a mess to be
cleaned up, if it can't be applied in very small amounts.

The SMD paste product I referred to is flux and powdered solder combined
together in a syringe cartridge, or small jar, and it works well for
reflowing existing soldered connections.

--
WB
..........


"SD" <gfegk@gfdsd> wrote in message
news:4ca11345$0$40286$4fafbaef@reader2.news.tin.it...
many thanks.

One last question.This flux liquid is acceptable?

http://cgi.ebay.it/Advanced-Solder-Soldering-Paste-Flux-Grease-RMA223-10cc-/220664019690?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item336099baea


Regards
Click to expand...
 
The close-up pic of the OP's Maxim 1987 shows that the package doesn't have
long pins extending from the body of the IC, as the ICs in the training
video do.
So, if a solder bridge occurs, it might possibly be under the edge of the
IC.. and maybe not easy to see or remove.

I didn't go to Maxim's site to look up the style of pins on that IC, but
they appear to be very sshort, and I would consider 12 contacts within the
width of a screw head to be a fairly fine pitch for anyone that isn't
experienced at soldering small contacts.

I noticed that the training board solder pads aren't connected to real
circuit traces or components, so it's not really the same as repair work.
There doesn't appear to be any obstructions or tall components near the
training board ICs, so it looks very easy, since there is nothing to impede
the iron or hand motion.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:yxboo.22766$YS6.11887@newsfe27.ams2...
http://www.laptoppartwholesale.com/Eblog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/max1987-2.jpg



If the correct amount of liquid flux is on the job, then relatively huge
quantities of solder can be added in via the iron's tip to 'drag solder'
all the pins along a side pretty much 'en masse'. Only the correct amount
of solder will adhere to each joint, pulled in by capillary action, and
the liquid flux will do a remarkably good job of ensuring that shorts
between pins do not occur. If they do, it is a very simple task to remove
the excess solder causing the short, by the use of (good quality)
desoldering braid. I agree that good light and high levels of
magnification are needed to be able to do the job successfully. From the
pictures in the links, that chip doesn't have a particularly high pin
density, so should not present too much of a problem to resolder to the
experienced hand.

The board was probably originally constructed with lead-free solder, so
strictly speaking, lead free should be used for the rework. However, in
this case, I think a much greater chance of success will be stood, by
using conventional 60/40 leaded solder. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea to
wick off as much of the original solder as possible, before adding new
solder in.

Here is an excellent video of soldering technique, which gives a good demo
of drag soldering, and use of desolder braid

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2860197/soldering_basic_to_advance_surface_mount_through_hole_wires_terminals/

Arfa
Click to expand...
 
Wild_Bill wrote:
The close-up pic of the OP's Maxim 1987 shows that the package doesn't have
long pins extending from the body of the IC, as the ICs in the training
video do.
So, if a solder bridge occurs, it might possibly be under the edge of the
IC.. and maybe not easy to see or remove.
Click to expand...

That doesn't matter. Some fresh RMA liquid flux and a drop of fresh
solder, un gently along the row of the pins will remove most bridges,
anywhere along the length of the pins, with just a little practice. Just
make sure the solder bridge is above the pool of molten solder, and that
the flux has covered the solder bridge before you start. I've even
removed loose solder balls that were trapped between an IC body and the
pins that way.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.
 
"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:yxboo.22766$YS6.11887@newsfe27.ams2...

http://www.laptoppartwholesale.com/Eblog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/max1987-2.jpg



If the correct amount of liquid flux is on the job, then relatively huge
quantities of solder can be added in via the iron's tip to 'drag solder'
all the pins along a side pretty much 'en masse'. Only the correct amount
of solder will adhere to each joint, pulled in by capillary action, and
the liquid flux will do a remarkably good job of ensuring that shorts
between pins do not occur. If they do, it is a very simple task to remove
the excess solder causing the short, by the use of (good quality)
desoldering braid. I agree that good light and high levels of
magnification are needed to be able to do the job successfully. From the
pictures in the links, that chip doesn't have a particularly high pin
density, so should not present too much of a problem to resolder to the
experienced hand.

The board was probably originally constructed with lead-free solder, so
strictly speaking, lead free should be used for the rework. However, in
this case, I think a much greater chance of success will be stood, by
using conventional 60/40 leaded solder. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea
to wick off as much of the original solder as possible, before adding new
solder in.

Here is an excellent video of soldering technique, which gives a good
demo of drag soldering, and use of desolder braid

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2860197/soldering_basic_to_advance_surface_mount_through_hole_wires_terminals/

Arfa

"Wild_Bill" <wb_wildbill@XSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
Click to expand...
news:Hheoo.183880$Bh.91260@en-nntp-12.dc1.easynews.com...
The close-up pic of the OP's Maxim 1987 shows that the package doesn't
have long pins extending from the body of the IC, as the ICs in the
training video do.
So, if a solder bridge occurs, it might possibly be under the edge of the
IC.. and maybe not easy to see or remove.

I didn't go to Maxim's site to look up the style of pins on that IC, but
they appear to be very sshort, and I would consider 12 contacts within the
width of a screw head to be a fairly fine pitch for anyone that isn't
experienced at soldering small contacts.

I noticed that the training board solder pads aren't connected to real
circuit traces or components, so it's not really the same as repair work.
There doesn't appear to be any obstructions or tall components near the
training board ICs, so it looks very easy, since there is nothing to
impede the iron or hand motion.

--
Cheers,
WB
.............
Click to expand...
The length or size of the pins doesn't matter, the technique is the same,
and I don't see any nearby components that would get in the way of an iron
being dragged sideways. If there are, where you can't see them, then they
will be too close anyway to allow soldering 'by the pin' with the iron tip
held at the appropriate angle for conventional hand soldering. In my
experience and humble opinion, any attempt to rework an IC of this style
using 'conventional' hand soldering techniques, is *much* more likely to
result in un-recoverable disaster in the form of shorted pins, than drag
soldering.

Your point about the pitch being fairly fine for anyone not used to
soldering small contacts is valid, but then I wouldn't expect anyone not
experienced *enough* to even try this rework ...

The package looks like a PLCC see -
http://www.interfacebus.com/ic-package-plcc-dimension-outline-drawing.html

You will see that the pins are of a perfectly conventional length and type,
They are just wrapped around under the IC body.

Watch it being done at - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOE5QYhWkkI

And here you can see both techniques being used -
http://store.curiousinventor.com/guides/Surface_Mount_Soldering/101/

but note the iron angle and space around the IC that's needed for
'conventional' soldering of these devices

Arfa
 
I'm merely making comments for the possible benefit of the OP and
potentially others with limited or zero soldering experience.

Here is a 2006-2007 forum discussion of the same type of problem. There is a
link for an exact replacement part, and as I suspected, there are no pins on
that IC package.
The metal contacts don't appear to be bent under the package, such as a PLCC
package does. I've worked with PLCCs, and I was certain that the MAX1987
package wasn't the same as soon as I saw the close-up pic.
I was also certain it wasn't a conventional QFP which also sit elevated
above the board.

The Maxim package is described as Quad Flat No Lead at the end of the
Curious Inventor 101 video, and they neglected to show one being soldered to
a training board.

http://forums13.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/questionanswer.do?admit=109447627+1285669829765+28353475&threadId=1046903

http://www.pchub.com/uph/laptop/507-29494-6753/Maxim-MAX1987-ETM-IC-Component.html
Click image to enlarge..

I wouldn't experience any aprehension in approaching the OP's motherboard
reflow repair with only a clean soldering iron tip and slight amount of
liquid flux (my original recommendation).
I have a hot air station, but those aren't the absolute perfect method for
many rework jobs, either.
For that matter, the possibility of a cracked trace isn't impossible in a
situation where opening and closing the laptop lid is causing the board to
flex.

I'm not debating the drag method suggested, my comments were intended to be
cautionary recommendations for a first-time or beginner at soldering.

For almost any applied material, it's nearly always easier to put it on,
than it is to remove it. Not putting too much on eliminates the need to
remove the excess, if that would take place.
Many folks live by the rule of; if a little bit is good, then a lot is
better. Maybe true for jam on toast, but not always good where equipment or
machines are concerned.

Another note WRT training boards.. they don't have to work when completed,
because they're not real circuits. Overheating may only be obvious if the
pads lift off the 'glass board.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:L%hoo.23225$HG7.21751@newsfe30.ams2...
The length or size of the pins doesn't matter, the technique is the same,
and I don't see any nearby components that would get in the way of an iron
being dragged sideways. If there are, where you can't see them, then they
will be too close anyway to allow soldering 'by the pin' with the iron tip
held at the appropriate angle for conventional hand soldering. In my
experience and humble opinion, any attempt to rework an IC of this style
using 'conventional' hand soldering techniques, is *much* more likely to
result in un-recoverable disaster in the form of shorted pins, than drag
soldering.

Your point about the pitch being fairly fine for anyone not used to
soldering small contacts is valid, but then I wouldn't expect anyone not
experienced *enough* to even try this rework ...

The package looks like a PLCC see -
http://www.interfacebus.com/ic-package-plcc-dimension-outline-drawing.html

You will see that the pins are of a perfectly conventional length and
type, They are just wrapped around under the IC body.

Watch it being done at - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOE5QYhWkkI

And here you can see both techniques being used -
http://store.curiousinventor.com/guides/Surface_Mount_Soldering/101/

but note the iron angle and space around the IC that's needed for
'conventional' soldering of these devices

Arfa
Click to expand...
 
The notebook is HP Compaq NC6000 of the year 2003/2004.
http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/2917.jpg
In the year 2003/04 HP soldering with lead free? :)


Thanks

Regards
 
In article <yxboo.22766$YS6.11887@newsfe27.ams2>,
"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:


If the correct amount of liquid flux is on the job, then relatively huge
quantities of solder can be added in via the iron's tip to 'drag solder' all
the pins along a side pretty much 'en masse'. Only the correct amount of
solder will adhere to each joint, pulled in by capillary action, and the
liquid flux will do a remarkably good job of ensuring that shorts between
pins do not occur.
Click to expand...
Absolutely agreed. You know I'm the militant SER liquid flux advocate.

agree that good light and high levels of magnification are needed to be able
to do the job successfully.
Click to expand...
I'm also an advocate of serious lighting and magnification, but once the
chip is accurately positioned neither is required, because the technique
you describe is so automatic that you don't need to see it to make it
work.
 
I really don't know about the solder composition on that board. The
Lead-free initiative was to begin in 2006, I think, but that doesn't mean
the HP board has lead solder.

http://www.bradyid.com.sg/web/SiteBuilder/ISST-SISBv1r0.nsf/FLV/Lead_Free_FAQs

Solder with lead will very likely work fine for the HP repair.

I wouldn't want to use lead-free solders for repairs, only because I'm
completely confident of lead solders.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............

"SD" <gfegk@gfdsd> wrote in message
news:4ca1f7da$0$12122$4fafbaef@reader4.news.tin.it...
The notebook is HP Compaq NC6000 of the year 2003/2004.
http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/2917.jpg
In the year 2003/04 HP soldering with lead free? :)


Thanks

Regards
Click to expand...
 
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