RF Resistors...

[Artist]

Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the front
end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1 kohm
resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire, and
the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency.

--
To email me directly remove sj. from my email address\'s domain name.
This is a spam jammer.

 

[Phil Allison]

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============

Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.

** Where is the problem ?

> So now I am looking at HF resistors.

** Why?

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency.

** Ever heard of Google ?

https://passive-components.eu/resistor-voltage-and-frequency-dependence/

Note. The letter W has been substituted for the ohm symbol omega in the captions.


...... Phil

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 25 Jul 2022 16:12:52 -0700, Artist <sepflanze@sj.gmail.com>
wrote:

Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.

A common resistor really doesn\'t have a self-resonant frequency, or
one that you\'d notice.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the front
end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1 kohm
resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire, and
the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency.

Ordinary surface-mount resistors will be fine at 1 GHz, much less 5
MHz. The parallel capacitance of an 0603 is around 0.05 pF. You\'re
probably putting a bigger cap in parallel in the TIA.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 9:13:00 AM UTC+10, Artist wrote:

Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 MHz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the front
end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1 kohm
resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire, and
the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.

Element 14 has Susumu 4.02k 0.1% parts in stock for less than a dollar each

https://4donline.ihs.com/images/VipMasterIC/IC/SUSU/SUSU-S-A0004582566/SUSU-S-A0004582566-1.pdf?hkey=52A5661711E402568146F3353EA87419

As surface mount parts they will be L-trimmed and have very little inductance or parallel capacitance. They will be fine at 5MHz, as John Larkin has pointed out. Back in the mid-1980\'s we got shocked when Philips put an L-trimmer surface mount roughly 1 Megohm resistor into a video preamp and it worked fine.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency..

Philips - once a upon a time - published frequency response data for their spiral trimmed axial metal film resistors. The L-trimmed sufrace mount part did much better than that. Going to Vishay for you job would be an overkill.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Artist]

On 7/25/22 16:51, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 9:13:00 AM UTC+10, Artist wrote:
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 MHz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the front
end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1 kohm
resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire, and
the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.


Element 14 has Susumu 4.02k 0.1% parts in stock for less than a dollar each

https://4donline.ihs.com/images/VipMasterIC/IC/SUSU/SUSU-S-A0004582566/SUSU-S-A0004582566-1.pdf?hkey=52A5661711E402568146F3353EA87419

As surface mount parts they will be L-trimmed and have very little inductance or parallel capacitance. They will be fine at 5MHz, as John Larkin has pointed out. Back in the mid-1980\'s we got shocked when Philips put an L-trimmer surface mount roughly 1 Megohm resistor into a video preamp and it worked fine.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency.

Philips - once a upon a time - published frequency response data for their spiral trimmed axial metal film resistors. The L-trimmed sufrace mount part did much better than that. Going to Vishay for you job would be an overkill.

Thank you for this response. I will try this resistor.

--
To email me directly remove sj. from my email address\'s domain name.
This is a spam jammer.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

Artist wrote:

Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

I\'d recommend Guy Macon\'s moderated group. misc.business.product-dev,
but it died out 15 or so years back. (Old inhabitants of SED will
remember.)

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz.

Is it for a photodiode, or something else? The usual issue is input
capacitance.

The analog anti aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like
the front end to have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D
converter\'s sample rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D
conversions will alias very little noise in the bandwidth region 5
MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors that have self resonance well beyond
10 MHz.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the
front end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1
kohm resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire,
and the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.

What problem are you trying to solve? As others have mentioned, you can
use a 4k resistor up into the hundreds of megahertz with no issues. You
shouldn\'t even notice its shunt capacitance.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I
would like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this
frequency.

The main issue is that the shunt capacitance across a resistor depends
on the configuration of nearby conductors and dielectrics.

Last week I was tweaking up a TIA with a 10M feedback resistor that
works up beyond 1 MHz. It uses a combination of a bootstrapped pour on
one end of the resistor and an adjustable RC lead-lag network to flatten
out the gain.

From an RC point of view, that\'s about 500 times harder than what
you\'re aiming at--the shunt capacitance of a SMT resistor all by itself
is about 0.1 pF, and it\'s more like 0.05 pF when mounted on a
ground-plane PC board. (You can measure this yourself, if you pony up
$100 for a used Boonton 72 three-terminal capacitance meter.)

At 4k, the RC corner frequency will be around

f_c ~= 1/(2 pi * 4k * 100 fF) = 400 MHz,

and probably well above that when it\'s board-mounted. Any bandwidth
problems you may be having are coming from elsewhere.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Artist]

On 7/25/22 16:32, Phil Allison wrote:

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.


I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz. The analog anti
aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like the front end to
have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D converter\'s sample
rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D conversions will alias very
little noise in the bandwidth region 5 MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors
that have self resonance well beyond 10 MHz.


** Where is the problem ?

So now I am looking at HF resistors.

** Why?


I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I would
like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this frequency.

** Ever heard of Google ?

https://passive-components.eu/resistor-voltage-and-frequency-dependence/

Note. The letter W has been substituted for the ohm symbol omega in the captions.


..... Phil

Apologies for that.

It had been a long time since I have been in this group. Just before
starting this thread what I saw was spam, off topic postings, and
nothing about electronic design. I have since seen several on topic threads.


--
To email me directly remove sj. from my email address\'s domain name.
This is a spam jammer.

 

[Artist]

On 7/26/22 05:34, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Artist wrote:
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
 posts are on topic for electronic design?

I\'d recommend Guy Macon\'s moderated group. misc.business.product-dev,
but it died out 15 or so years back.  (Old inhabitants of SED will
remember.)

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
 here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz.

Is it for a photodiode, or something else?  The usual issue is input
capacitance.

The analog anti aliasing filter is to be set at 5 MHz. I would like
the front end to have a transimpedance value of 4.02 kohm. The A to D
converter\'s sample rate is to be 10 Mhz. So that the A to D
conversions will alias very little noise in the bandwidth region 5
MHz, to 10 MHz, I need resistors that have self resonance well beyond
10 MHz.

So now I am looking at HF resistors. Because noise is primarily
determined by the gain of the first stage, it is desirable for the
front end\'s feedback resistor to be 4.02 kohm.

The Vishay FC series resistors are made in values only up to 1 kohm.
 They are very expensive, and so I am reluctant to put 4 of these 1
kohm resistors in series. They are, however, available.

The Visay HCHP series is made in values well beyond 4.02 kohm. But I
 cannot find them on the shelf anywhere, and they are extraordinarily
 expensive. The minimum buy makes them cost prohibitive to acquire,
and the lead times are too long.

I would appreciate advice on any alternatives.

What problem are you trying to solve?  As others have mentioned, you can
use a 4k resistor up into the hundreds of megahertz with no issues.  You
shouldn\'t even notice its shunt capacitance.

I am not able to find device models for the common thin film metal
resistors. I do not know how well they would work up to 10 MHz. I
would like to hear from any who are experienced in using them up this
frequency.

The main issue is that the shunt capacitance across a resistor depends
on the configuration of nearby conductors and dielectrics.

Last week I was tweaking up a TIA with a 10M feedback resistor that
works up beyond 1 MHz.  It uses a combination of a bootstrapped pour on
one end of the resistor and an adjustable RC lead-lag network to flatten
out the gain.

From an RC point of view, that\'s about 500 times harder than what
you\'re aiming at--the shunt capacitance of a SMT resistor all by itself
is about 0.1 pF, and it\'s more like 0.05 pF when mounted on a
ground-plane PC board.  (You can measure this yourself, if you pony up
$100 for a used Boonton 72 three-terminal capacitance meter.)

At 4k, the RC corner frequency will be around

f_c ~= 1/(2 pi * 4k * 100 fF) = 400 MHz,

and probably well above that when it\'s board-mounted.  Any bandwidth
problems you may be having are coming from elsewhere.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It will be a photodiode, currently it is the OSI Optoelectronics
InGaAs-120L-FC . This might change.
https://www.osioptoelectronics.com/standard-products/ingaas-photodiodes/high-speed-ingaas.aspx

The currently selected op amp is the LTC6226
https://www.analog.com/en/products/ltc6226.html#product-overview
or the TMUX7462F
https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tmux7412f.pdf

I would like to be able to have several gain options for the first stage
gain from 4K all the way up to 630k. The switch in consideration for
this is:
MAX14777.
https://datasheets.maximintegrated.com/en/ds/MAX14777.pdf
TMUX7412F
https://www.ti.com/product/TMUX7412F
The current idea is to have a high value resistor in the vicinity of
630k in parallel with the switches, and arrange the switches to switch a
choice of one of 4 parallel resistors. The would provide 5 gain options.
and more if more then one resistor is switched into the feedback path. I
know having this option will add capacitance to the virtual ground, even
though the analog switch would be between the op amp output, and the
resistors.

I am aware of your virtual ground bootstrap techniques for high
capacitance photodiodes to raise bandwidth, and reduce noise, by
reducing the capacitance seen by the virtual ground. I do not know right
now if bootstraping would add more capacitance than would be reduced.

Is the next edition of your book in which you describe bootstraping out?
I already have the one before it.

--
To email me directly remove sj. from my email address\'s domain name.
This is a spam jammer.

 

[server]

On Mon, 25 Jul 2022 16:32:57 -0700 (PDT), Phil Allison
<pallison49@gmail.com> wrote:

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.

 

[Phil Allison]

jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
================================

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.

** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


...... Phil

 

[server]

On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 02:39:02 -0700 (PDT), Phil Allison
<pallison49@gmail.com> wrote:

jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
================================

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


..... Phil

He stated the plain truth: most posts here are dumb and off-topic,
posted by people obviously unskilled in electronic design.

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Wed, 27 Jul 2022 02:39:02 -0700 (PDT)) it happened Phil
Allison <pallison49@gmail.com> wrote in
<ba1abfe4-a39e-4fe4-9864-06fe4f4bf79cn@googlegroups.com>:

jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
================================

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


..... Phil

Jo La is just an ego tripper
his business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here
and insult people.

People like Artist come and go, thought he was an alter-ego of Ph Ho
to sell his book.

TIA is not the ony way

My poppolologies if I am wrong

 

[Phil Hobbs]

Artist wrote:

On 7/26/22 05:34, Phil Hobbs wrote:
Artist wrote:
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
 posts are on topic for electronic design?

I\'d recommend Guy Macon\'s moderated group. misc.business.product-dev,
but it died out 15 or so years back.  (Old inhabitants of SED will
remember.)

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
 here is my question:

I need to design a TIA of bandwidth up to 5 MHz.

Is it for a photodiode, or something else?  The usual issue is input
capacitance.

snip

It will be a photodiode, currently it is the OSI Optoelectronics
InGaAs-120L-FC . This might change.
https://www.osioptoelectronics.com/standard-products/ingaas-photodiodes/high-speed-ingaas.aspx

That\'s a really small one, about 2 pF. e_N*C noise current will start
to dominate the Johnson noise current when

f > sqrt(4 k T / R_F) / (2 pi * e_N * C_in),

where C_in is the total summing junction capacitance, which includes
board strays and diode capacitance as well as the amplifier\'s C_in.

Some good things to remember:
1 nV is the 1-Hz voltage noise of 60.4 ohms,
1 pA is the noise of 16.3k ohms, and
1 pA is also the shot noise of 3 uA.

Figuring 10 pF for all the gingerbread you\'re planning to hang on the
summing junction, a decent (5 nV) CMOS or JFET amp with a 4k feedback
resistor will be in the e_N*C region above

f = 1 pA*sqrt(16.3k / 4k)/(2 pi * 10 pF * 5 nV) = 6.5 MHz.

Which isn\'t horrible, but could be better--you\'ll lose a dB or so of SNR
at low light.

However, at 600k ohms, things start falling apart at only 43 kHz, and it
gets _cubically_ worse above there--since the e_N*C current spectral
density goes as f, the noise power density goes as f**2, so the integral
goes as BW**3.

The currently selected op amp is the LTC6226
https://www.analog.com/en/products/ltc6226.html#product-overview

Marginally okay at 4k, but not a good choice for higher resistances--its
input current noise is 2.7 pA in 1 Hz.

From the rules above, that 2.7 pA equals the shot noise current of

3 uA * 2.7**2 = 22 uA

and the Johnson noise current of

16.3k / 2.7**2 = 2.2k.

On the other hand, that 1 nV typical noise number helps the e_N*C
problem a lot--it goes away at 4k, and is 14 dB better at the higher
resistances.

or the TMUX7462F
https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tmux7412f.pdf

Completely unsuitable--its OFF capacitance is over 10 pF. At 600k ohms,
you\'ll have 4k + 10 pF from the SJ either to the output or to ground.

If it\'s to the output, it appears in parallel with the 600k, and so will
reduce the bandwidth to about 25 kHz.

If it\'s to ground, that will give you an AC noise gain of 150, besides
dumping almost the full Johnson noise of the 4k resistor into the
summing junction. (You\'ll also need two switches per resistor.)

Relays are the ticket for that job. Sometimes you can get away with a
lower-capacitance MUX such as a TMUX1511.

I would like to be able to have several gain options for the first stage
gain from 4K all the way up to 630k. The switch in consideration for
this is:
MAX14777.
https://datasheets.maximintegrated.com/en/ds/MAX14777.pdf
TMUX7412F
https://www.ti.com/product/TMUX7412F
The current idea is to have a high value resistor in the vicinity of
630k in parallel with the switches, and arrange the switches to switch a
choice of one of 4 parallel resistors. The would provide 5 gain options.
and more if more then one resistor is switched into the feedback path. I
know having this option will add capacitance to the virtual ground, even
though the analog switch would be between the op amp output, and the
resistors.

Sounds like you\'re going to need to use more than one complete TIA, and
use relays to switch them in and out. If you\'re not bootstrapping, you
can use one TIA at each end of the photodiode, with suitable bias
arrangements. That does cost some supply headroom, because the PD
always wants to make the TIA move in the inconvenient direction.

I am aware of your virtual ground bootstrap techniques for high
capacitance photodiodes to raise bandwidth, and reduce noise, by
reducing the capacitance seen by the virtual ground. I do not know right
now if bootstraping would add more capacitance than would be reduced.

Sounds like a candidate for what I call a type-2 bootstrap, where the op
amp\'s inverting input is driven by the bootstrap output, so that the
bootstrap is inside the TIA\'s feedback loop instead of being off to one
side.

That gets rid of the op amp\'s C_in, which is a big win in this instance,
and allows you to use low-e_N bipolar amps such as the LT6226. It does
add the JFET\'s offset and noise voltage, but that\'s an excellent trade.

It works much better than the old-fashioned JFET-pair + op amp approach.

Is the next edition of your book in which you describe bootstrapping out?
I already have the one before it.

Yup, it came out in January. Fully revised, and with a whole lot of new
material (the LaTeX source is about 37% longer, but some of it is
commented out in both editions).

Wiley had to issue it in coffee-table size (8.5x11) to avoid going over
their mystical 900-page limit. New stuff is now mostly going into the
new book manuscript, tentatively titled \"Designing Electro-Optical
Systems: 30 Instruments\".

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 16:07:09 GMT, Jan Panteltje
<pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

On a sunny day (Wed, 27 Jul 2022 02:39:02 -0700 (PDT)) it happened Phil
Allison <pallison49@gmail.com> wrote in
ba1abfe4-a39e-4fe4-9864-06fe4f4bf79cn@googlegroups.com>:

jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
================================

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


..... Phil

Jo La is just an ego tripper
his business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here
and insult people.

Actually, biz is excellent and trending better.

 

[Phil Allison]

John Larkin wrote:
-------------------------------

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


Jo La is just an ego tripper
his business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here
and insult people.

Actually, biz is excellent and trending better.

** Despite JL\'s presence , not because of it.

Seem many examples of exactly that, where staff have to conspire to keep their nutty boss at bay.


...... Phil

 

[Phil Hobbs]

Phil Allison wrote:

John Larkin wrote:
-------------------------------

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


Jo La is just an ego tripper
his business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here
and insult people.

Actually, biz is excellent and trending better.

** Despite JL\'s presence , not because of it.

Seem many examples of exactly that, where staff have to conspire to keep their nutty boss at bay.


..... Phil

Round SED, of course we have no experience with conspiring to manage
nutty posters.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 16:30:12 -0700 (PDT), Phil Allison
<pallison49@gmail.com> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:
-------------------------------

BS Artist ? wrote:

==============
Is there still an engineering Usenet group where the vast majority of
posts are on topic for electronic design?

In case there are any electronic engineers still watching this group,
here is my question:

** Thanks for the insults.

He insulted engineers, not you.


** The \"BS Artist\" troll insulted the entire NG, including YOU.

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


Jo La is just an ego tripper
his business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here
and insult people.

Actually, biz is excellent and trending better.

** Despite JL\'s presence , not because of it.

No, really, I have function. Crazy ideas. Inventing things.

Nowadays, I can\'t do everything. FPGAs, Linux, Python test set
software, PCB layout, mechanical design, all that can be mostly
delegated to saner people.

\"Oh, but it just may be a lunatic you\'re looking for...\"

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Thursday, July 28, 2022 at 10:49:02 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 16:30:12 -0700 (PDT), Phil Allison
palli...@gmail.com> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:
BS Artist ? wrote:

<snip>

JL treats usenet posting as a joke, a self fulfilling belief in his case.


Jo La is just an ego tripper. His business must run bad with all that time on his hands to post here and insult people.

Actually, biz is excellent and trending better.

** Despite JL\'s presence , not because of it.

No, really, I have function. Crazy ideas. Inventing things.

That\'s what John Larkin tells himself.

> Nowadays, I can\'t do everything. FPGAs, Linux, Python test set software, PCB layout, mechanical design, all that can be mostly delegated to saner people.

Who have had a lot of practice at flattering the boss until he moves on to pester somebody else.

> \"Oh, but it just may be a lunatic you\'re looking for...\"

He can talk to customers for ages, and the more time he spends doing that, the less time he spends distracting people who can still design circuits that work.

Even the most lunatic idea can be repackaged into something that can be made to work, as long as you can keep the geriatric clown out of the detailed design.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney