Repir problem on Velodyne F-1800RII subwoofer speaker

[Bob F]

I have a Velodyne F-1800RII that failed. One wire that connects to the voice
coil on the speaker has disconnected. There is a tab on the tube that the voice
coil is wound on where braided cables attach to the voice coil wire. The braid
and connection is then sealed under what looks like white epoxy. That epoxy
separated from the tab it was one, allowing the braids to move and break their
connection to the voice coil.

To repair the connection, it seems I need to remove the epoxy from the tab to
get to the voice coil wire I need to solder. Does anyone have any hints on how
to proceed, which I imagine means removing the epoxy? I've thought about using
my heat gun with a small tube to direct the heat at only the offending area, but
don't know if this would be appropriate.

If I need to carefully cut loose the rear spider from the voice coil tube to get
enough voice coil to solder to, is it likiely that the coil is a bit below the
spider so I won't damage it while cutting the glue joint between the spider and
the tube?

 

[N_Cook]

Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:j23l7v$lqs$1@dont-email.me...

I have a Velodyne F-1800RII that failed. One wire that connects to the
voice
coil on the speaker has disconnected. There is a tab on the tube that the
voice
coil is wound on where braided cables attach to the voice coil wire. The
braid
and connection is then sealed under what looks like white epoxy. That
epoxy
separated from the tab it was one, allowing the braids to move and break
their
connection to the voice coil.

To repair the connection, it seems I need to remove the epoxy from the tab
to
get to the voice coil wire I need to solder. Does anyone have any hints on
how
to proceed, which I imagine means removing the epoxy? I've thought about
using
my heat gun with a small tube to direct the heat at only the offending
area, but
don't know if this would be appropriate.

If I need to carefully cut loose the rear spider from the voice coil tube
to get
enough voice coil to solder to, is it likiely that the coil is a bit below
the
spider so I won't damage it while cutting the glue joint between the
spider and
the tube?

With good forced ventillation, excavate it with an old soldering iron and a
needle of some sort

 

[Gareth Magennis]

"Bob F" <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:j23l7v$lqs$1@dont-email.me...

I have a Velodyne F-1800RII that failed. One wire that connects to the
voice coil on the speaker has disconnected. There is a tab on the tube
that the voice coil is wound on where braided cables attach to the voice
coil wire. The braid and connection is then sealed under what looks like
white epoxy. That epoxy separated from the tab it was one, allowing the
braids to move and break their connection to the voice coil.

To repair the connection, it seems I need to remove the epoxy from the tab
to get to the voice coil wire I need to solder. Does anyone have any hints
on how to proceed, which I imagine means removing the epoxy? I've thought
about using my heat gun with a small tube to direct the heat at only the
offending area, but don't know if this would be appropriate.

If I need to carefully cut loose the rear spider from the voice coil tube
to get enough voice coil to solder to, is it likiely that the coil is a
bit below the spider so I won't damage it while cutting the glue joint
between the spider and the tube?

I suspect the speaker most probably didn't fail, it was overdriven and was
broken by a Human Being.
If you force the cone to move way beyond its limits, it will indeed
eventually pull its own braids out to stop the torture.


I gave up years ago trying to repair this sort of damage as it never holds
up for very long.
Mostly because the user is incapable of understanding that it was him that
broke it, so quickly breaks it again, but also because it is very difficult
to make a proper flexible repair using solder.


Gareth.

 

[spamtrap1888]

On Aug 12, 9:43 am, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:

I have a Velodyne F-1800RII that failed. One wire that connects to the voice
coil on the speaker has disconnected. There is a tab on the tube that the voice
coil is wound on where braided cables attach to the voice coil wire.  The braid
and connection is then sealed under what looks like white epoxy. That epoxy
separated from the tab it was one, allowing the braids to move and break their
connection to the voice coil.

Epoxy is used to make rigid connections, not flexible connections. The
cone will flex and the wire should flex with it. The white glue should
be some sort of emulsion.

To repair the connection, it seems I need to remove the epoxy from the tab to
get to the voice coil wire I need to solder. Does anyone have any hints on how
to proceed, which I imagine means removing the epoxy?

The glue should just peel off. You could carefully peel it with a
razor knife.

I've thought about using
my heat gun with a small tube to direct the heat at only the offending area, but
don't know if this would be appropriate.

If I need to carefully cut loose the rear spider from the voice coil tube to get
enough voice coil to solder to, is it likiely that the coil is a bit below the
spider so I won't damage it while cutting the glue joint between the spider and
the tube?

This is more likely to fuch the speaker up royally. I wouldn't try it.

For linearity, the coil should extend well out of the voice coil gap.
Pull up the VC stub, and solder a bit of same gauge magnet wire to it
to where the braid goes in.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Gareth Magennis"

I suspect the speaker most probably didn't fail, it was overdriven and was
broken by a Human Being.

** Still called a failure by most.

If you force the cone to move way beyond its limits,

** That should never be possible using electrical input alone. It is simple
enough to arrange things so the voice coil moves out of the magnetic gap and
loses most of the driving force before mechanical damage occurs.

However, some sub woofers are designed (?) with very long voice coils
rendering this precaution impossible.

Such woofers are bound to fail.

it will indeed eventually pull its own braids out to stop the torture.

** That should not be the case - easy to make the braids long enough so
any possible excursion is allowed

I gave up years ago trying to repair this sort of damage as it never holds
up for very long.

** Fitting longer braids is possible, done that a few times.

I had one job where the two braids had welded together half way along - the
maker ( Alesis ) had arranged to braids to vibrate towards each other and
touch if enough level were applied. Shortening each braid fixed it.

Mostly because the user is incapable of understanding that it was him that
broke it, so quickly breaks it again,

** Had one guy who repeatedly damaged his JBL K120s this way. He had them
in an open backed 100W Marshall combo amp and played BASS guitar through
them.

JBL specifically warn against doing this with the K120s.


...... Phil

 

[Gareth Magennis]

"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:9aonvpFbhsU1@mid.individual.net...

"Gareth Magennis"

I suspect the speaker most probably didn't fail, it was overdriven and
was broken by a Human Being.

** Still called a failure by most.

If you force the cone to move way beyond its limits,


** That should never be possible using electrical input alone. It is
simple enough to arrange things so the voice coil moves out of the
magnetic gap and loses most of the driving force before mechanical damage
occurs.

However, some sub woofers are designed (?) with very long voice coils
rendering this precaution impossible.

Such woofers are bound to fail.


it will indeed eventually pull its own braids out to stop the torture.


** That should not be the case - easy to make the braids long enough so
any possible excursion is allowed


I gave up years ago trying to repair this sort of damage as it never
holds up for very long.

** Fitting longer braids is possible, done that a few times.

I had one job where the two braids had welded together half way along -
the maker ( Alesis ) had arranged to braids to vibrate towards each other
and touch if enough level were applied. Shortening each braid fixed it.


Mostly because the user is incapable of understanding that it was him
that broke it, so quickly breaks it again,


** Had one guy who repeatedly damaged his JBL K120s this way. He had them
in an open backed 100W Marshall combo amp and played BASS guitar through
them.

JBL specifically warn against doing this with the K120s.


..... Phil

I've seen a lot of Peavey black Widows with broken braids, mostly 15"
drivers from the 1 x 15 bass bins.

Is there anything about their design that makes them more susceptible to
this than other models, or are there just a lot of Peavey bass bins out
there?


Gareth.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Gareth Magennis"

I've seen a lot of Peavey black Widows with broken braids, mostly 15"
drivers from the 1 x 15 bass bins.

** Fatigue failures - not being yanked off by force.

There is only so much a piece of cotton cored tinsel can take.



.... Phil

 

[Bob F]

spamtrap1888 wrote:

On Aug 12, 9:43 am, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a Velodyne F-1800RII that failed. One wire that connects to
the voice coil on the speaker has disconnected. There is a tab on
the tube that the voice coil is wound on where braided cables attach
to the voice coil wire. The braid and connection is then sealed
under what looks like white epoxy. That epoxy separated from the tab
it was one, allowing the braids to move and break their connection
to the voice coil.

Epoxy is used to make rigid connections, not flexible connections. The
cone will flex and the wire should flex with it. The white glue should
be some sort of emulsion.

This really does seem to be epoxy. It is hard and brittle.

To repair the connection, it seems I need to remove the epoxy from
the tab to get to the voice coil wire I need to solder. Does anyone
have any hints on how to proceed, which I imagine means removing the
epoxy?

The glue should just peel off. You could carefully peel it with a
razor knife.

I tried snipping between the two leads, and separated the damaged one. The
covering came off in flying chips. Very brittle stuff. Unfortunately, the voice
coil wire coming out is broken off right where it comes out between the rear
spider and the tube of the voice coil, so I am going to have to separate the
spider from the voice coil tube a bit to repair it. It appears they used the
same glue to glue the spider to the tube.

This speaker is interesting. It has the normal front spider, and another at the
back of the magnet assembly. The two are maybe 5 inches apart.

I've thought about using
my heat gun with a small tube to direct the heat at only the
offending area, but don't know if this would be appropriate.

If I need to carefully cut loose the rear spider from the voice coil
tube to get enough voice coil to solder to, is it likiely that the
coil is a bit below the spider so I won't damage it while cutting
the glue joint between the spider and the tube?

This is more likely to fuch the speaker up royally. I wouldn't try it.

For linearity, the coil should extend well out of the voice coil gap.
Pull up the VC stub, and solder a bit of same gauge magnet wire to it
to where the braid goes in.

You are suggesting that if I can get a hold on the wire, I can just pull a
little loose from the coil to get enough to solder to?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Gareth Magennis]

"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:9aptujFdadU1@mid.individual.net...

"Gareth Magennis"

I've seen a lot of Peavey black Widows with broken braids, mostly 15"
drivers from the 1 x 15 bass bins.



** Fatigue failures - not being yanked off by force.

There is only so much a piece of cotton cored tinsel can take.



... Phil

I replaced one of my customers' Peavey baskets which had a detached braid,
and told him he was probably overdriving his speakers.
6 months later he came back and the new basket had suffered the same damage.

Either he IS overdriving it, or it is suffering from some sort of Bang, Pop
thing coming out of his amplifier. I can't see a speaker failing, in
weekend use, from fatigue in 6 months.
Curiously, neither of the voice coils showed any abnormal signs of
overheating.




Gareth.