PCB layout software (Orcad versus Pads)

T

Tom McAndrews

Guest
Hello,
Thank you in advance for your response.

I am looking for a new schematic capture and layout program. To date,
we have been using IVEX (www.ivex.com) tools. Due to the complexity
of our new designs, we need to upgrade to more advanced tools.

I have been looking at the Orcad (www.orcad.com) and Pads
(www.pads.com) suites which seem to be reasonable priced for our
budget. Most of our designs are 2 or 4 layers, but we will be getting
into 6 and 8 layers soon. I have never used an autorouter but would
like to implement such a device for non-critical traces (both orcad
and pads have this option).

I am looking for something that contains the least amount of bugs and
is easy to learn and use. Does anyone have any suggestions? Does
anyone have any comments regarding the two packages I am looking at?

There is a blurb on www.pads.com that the future of orcad is in
jeopardy. Does anyone know about this? Should this be a reason not
to go with orcad?

Thanks again.
 
"Tom McAndrews" <justlearning1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3064eebe.0406302049.2fe87ed9@posting.google.com...
Hello,
Thank you in advance for your response.

I am looking for a new schematic capture and layout program. To date,
we have been using IVEX (www.ivex.com) tools. Due to the complexity
of our new designs, we need to upgrade to more advanced tools.

I have been looking at the Orcad (www.orcad.com) and Pads
(www.pads.com) suites which seem to be reasonable priced for our
budget. Most of our designs are 2 or 4 layers, but we will be getting
into 6 and 8 layers soon. I have never used an autorouter but would
like to implement such a device for non-critical traces (both orcad
and pads have this option).

I am looking for something that contains the least amount of bugs and
is easy to learn and use. Does anyone have any suggestions? Does
anyone have any comments regarding the two packages I am looking at?

There is a blurb on www.pads.com that the future of orcad is in
jeopardy. Does anyone know about this? Should this be a reason not
to go with orcad?
Click to expand...
You might have a look at Pulsonix: http://www.pulsonix.com

It's much easier to use than OrCAD, PADS or Protel, and bugs get eliminated
very quickly. It's also cheaper.

Leon
 
"Tom McAndrews" <justlearning1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3064eebe.0406302049.2fe87ed9@posting.google.com...
I have been looking at the Orcad (www.orcad.com) and Pads
(www.pads.com) suites which seem to be reasonable priced for our
budget. Most of our designs are 2 or 4 layers, but we will be getting
into 6 and 8 layers soon. I have never used an autorouter but would
like to implement such a device for non-critical traces (both orcad
and pads have this option).
Click to expand...
While you are looking, you might also have a look at:

Protel (http://www.protel.com/) and Eagle (http://www.cadsoftusa.com/). Protel
is a direct competitor to the Orcad and Pads suites, is full featured and some
consider expensive to buy and maintain. Eagle is less full featured, can be a
bit quirky, but is a lot less costly and has a very active user group.

--
James T. White
SPAMjtwhiteGUARD@SPAMhal-pcGUARD.org

Note: Remove SPAM-GUARD to reply.
 
On 30 Jun 2004 21:49:52 -0700, justlearning1@hotmail.com (Tom
McAndrews) wrote:

Hello,
Thank you in advance for your response.

I am looking for a new schematic capture and layout program. To date,
we have been using IVEX (www.ivex.com) tools. Due to the complexity
of our new designs, we need to upgrade to more advanced tools.

I have been looking at the Orcad (www.orcad.com) and Pads
(www.pads.com) suites which seem to be reasonable priced for our
budget. Most of our designs are 2 or 4 layers, but we will be getting
into 6 and 8 layers soon. I have never used an autorouter but would
like to implement such a device for non-critical traces (both orcad
and pads have this option).

I am looking for something that contains the least amount of bugs and
is easy to learn and use. Does anyone have any suggestions? Does
anyone have any comments regarding the two packages I am looking at?

There is a blurb on www.pads.com that the future of orcad is in
jeopardy. Does anyone know about this? Should this be a reason not
to go with orcad?

Thanks again.
Click to expand...
People have been saying Orcad is on its death bed for many years. It
hasn't happened yet. Last week, I attended a seminar by EMA
<http://www.ema-eda.com/> who is the reseller for Orcad in the US.
They claim that Orcad is still alive and there are no plans to kill it
in spite of the claims like you mention. The same was said about PCAD
many years ago - it's still alive.

Layout isn't the easiest program to use. Other programs are probably
easier to learn. Manual routing is still goofy, but way better than
versions previous to 9. The autorouters are ok for non-critical stuff.
Now that Cadence owns Orcad, you can get the Specctra router which is
supposed to be a pretty good tool. Specctra may require a bit of time
to use it effectively. The latest version 10 was almost unusable due
to the multitude of bugs. Subsequent updates may have fixed most of
the problems. Version 9.2.0 has been pretty stable. Expect a crash per
12 hour day. As with any program, save often and save your work to a
different filename a few times per day so you can back track. Once you
get used to Layout, it's an ok program. If you also use Capture, you
can do some nifty reuse stuff for multi-channel designs.

Layout doesn't support macros, so you need a third party product like
Macro Express <http://www.macros.com/> to make life easier.

If you have the time, try get demos of the programs mentioned. Things
to consider are making new parts, netlist importation if you use a
different brand schematic program, porting changed netlists into a
fully/partially routed board (it should only rip up the stuff that has
changed), manual routing, handling multiple nets on a plane layer,
autorouter (hard to get a feeling for this in a limited time span),
DRC, and post processing (Gerber plots, pick & place reports, assembly
documentation, ...). Macro capability, or remapping the keyboard is
also nice. All of these should work with minimal cursing. Also
consider add-on tools like Gerber viewers/editors. Some programs come
with third party tools. Layout comes with GerbTool
<http://gerbtool.wssi.com/index.php>. It's nice to verify your Gerber
plots with a third party tool.

---
Mark
 
"qrk" <SpamTrap@reson.com> wrote in message
news:g76ce0p3hbht41qrdkio3qv4aejcih25ep@4ax.com...
On 30 Jun 2004 21:49:52 -0700, justlearning1@hotmail.com (Tom
McAndrews) wrote:
Click to expand...

[deleted]

.. Some programs come
with third party tools. Layout comes with GerbTool
http://gerbtool.wssi.com/index.php>. It's nice to verify your Gerber
plots with a third party tool.
Click to expand...
Not when GerbTool has a bug! This happened to me last year: a PCB supplier
kept insisting that my PCB violated his design rules. I eventually found
that he used GerbTool, got an evaluation copy of it and found that it was
incorrectly reporting the violation. Wise eventually admitted there was a
bug in their software.

Leon
 
"Tom McAndrews" <justlearning1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3064eebe.0406302049.2fe87ed9@posting.google.com...
Hello,
Thank you in advance for your response.

I am looking for a new schematic capture and layout program. To date,
we have been using IVEX (www.ivex.com) tools. Due to the complexity
of our new designs, we need to upgrade to more advanced tools.

I have been looking at the Orcad (www.orcad.com) and Pads
(www.pads.com) suites which seem to be reasonable priced for our
budget. Most of our designs are 2 or 4 layers, but we will be getting
into 6 and 8 layers soon. I have never used an autorouter but would
like to implement such a device for non-critical traces (both orcad
and pads have this option).

I am looking for something that contains the least amount of bugs and
is easy to learn and use. Does anyone have any suggestions? Does
anyone have any comments regarding the two packages I am looking at?

There is a blurb on www.pads.com that the future of orcad is in
jeopardy. Does anyone know about this? Should this be a reason not
to go with orcad?
Click to expand...
A point to seriously consider is how often the software is to be used.
If the software is to be used by one person for 2 or more days every week
then that person becomes well versed in the advantages and idiosyncrasies of
the software and will learn to drive it with some alacrity and assurance.
If the software is just used once a month, software with a steep learning
curve will *never* be fully mastered, and it will seriously slow down the
design of the pcb.

In my travels I have come across more than one site where the purchase of
'flagship' cad has forced the design output to progress at a snails pace
but, with no common reference, they were oblivious to this fact - they
thought that it was always thus difficult and time consuming.
Furthermore when the tools become too complex, engineers design what they
are able to do with the cad rather than what they want to do.

If in doubt get a simple cad package - its also cheaper.

Also do not worry too much about 'bugs' in the software - in the well known
ones anyway.
Serious bugs are generally fixed asap - else their reputation and customer
base soon disappears.
Minor bugs are frequently more 'quirks' that an inexperienced
(non-frequent) user thinks the cad should do in a particular way
but in fact is executed alternatively.
 
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