OT: Why do people shout into mobile phones?

N

N_Cook

Guest
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
 
N_Cook wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
Four reasons.

* Attitude,
* Deafness,
* Can't align earhole with speaker,
* Can't change speaker volume.

--
Adrian C
 
"N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk> wrote in
news:hgvmr6$vj5$1@news.eternal-september.org:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
why do people shout when they are wearing headphones?

because they use their hearing to regulate their own voice.Headphones block
them from hearing themselves.


Speculation;with a cellphone,they are so intent on trying to hear the other
person,they lose regulation on their own voice.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com
 
On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:30:23 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk> wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
The same stupid people are here in Sweden.
 
Ken <ken_3@telia.com> wrote in message
news:khs6j5dvb4hm66qtvfpuhrhvk9k2nar996@4ax.com...
On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:30:23 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk> wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.

The same stupid people are here in Sweden.
Click to expand...

If the intent is for clarity then woefully wrong - overloads the
system/compression/codec or whatever is in the transmission system so
clipped/semi-garbled voice at the receiving end
 
"N_Cook"

Or is it just a UK pervertion.
Click to expand...

** The reason is they cannot hear their own voice in their ear.

Which is quite unlike a wired phone.



...... Phil
 
Phil Allison <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:7phbk5FarrU1@mid.individual.net...
"N_Cook"

Or is it just a UK pervertion.


** The reason is they cannot hear their own voice in their ear.

Which is quite unlike a wired phone.



..... Phil
Click to expand...

I've only ever seen single earpiece mobile phones, surely all these shouters
are not deaf in their other ear.
 
On 12/24/2009 7:33 AM, Adrian C wrote:
N_Cook wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.

Four reasons.

* Attitude,
* Deafness,
* Can't align earhole with speaker,
* Can't change speaker volume.
Click to expand...
Over here it's usually called 'cell yell'. Probably caused by emotional
insecurity due to the lack of a microphone near the mouth.

I also suspect that cell phones' (very irritating) half-duplex mode
makes people feel like the other person can't hear them, so they talk
louder.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal
ElectroOptical Innovations
55 Orchard Rd
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
845-480-2058

email: hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net
 
N_Cook wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.


They like to hear themselves talk.
Click to expand...
 
On Dec 24, 4:30 am, "N_Cook" <dive...@tcp.co.uk> wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
Lack of audio feedback.

People are going to have to learn some personal discipline and control
their voice amplitude.

Just talk at a normal level and it actually works best, no distortion,
etc.
 
On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:30:23 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk>
wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
People are used to hearing themselves in the earpiece when talking. In
telco terminology, it's called "sidetone".
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidetone>
The problem is that there's about a 250 msec audio delay inherent in
digital cellular phone encoding that will drive the user nuts if
there's even the slightest leakage between the sidetone and the
microphone or through the system. Analog cellular did not have the
delay. At best, there will be an echo. More typically, there is
massive confusion when the user hears themselves somewhat delayed. In
addition, the level of side tone necessary to convince the typical
user that they're getting through, is insufficient to prevent leakage
back into the microphone, especially with a BlueGoof headset. If the
handset manufacturer or cellular vendor added sidetone, you would
instead be complaining about either feedback squeal if injected
locally in the handset or echo if injected at the switch.

Another contributory phenomenon is cellular garble causes people to
think they're not getting through, so people normally talk louder to
compensate. The more garble, the more louder they yell.

One interesting observation is that few people yell into a half-duplex
phone, or phone that requires a PTT (push to talk) to be heard. That's
because there's no expectation of ever hearing oneself in the
earpiece.

I've had a cell/mobile phone of sorts since before IMTS, so I'm quite
familiar with the problem. I've taught myself not to yell and have
convinced a few others to make the attempt. It does take some
practice, but is easy enough. The problem is convincing other people
that it's a problem. I have a digital sound level meter and sometimes
drag it into a restaurant for some entertainment. Most people are
rather surprised when I mention that they're yelling anywhere from 3
to 6dB louder into the phone than their normal conversation (while
talking to me). Although I expected considerable resistance from my
waving sound level meters at people, most are generally curious and
interested in the effect.

Also, for truly irritating cell phones, the Nextel IDEN phones with
the *VERY* loud speaker, is the worst. While suitable for noisy
construction sites, having one of those go off in a restaurant is the
epitome of obnoxious behavior.

There are some really interesting comments and observations in this
article (4 pages):
<http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/22/technology/circuits/22YELL.html?pagewanted=1>

More. (NPR audio 5 min):
<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4229967>

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 14:09:10 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk>
wrote:

If the intent is for clarity then woefully wrong - overloads the
system/compression/codec or whatever is in the transmission system so
clipped/semi-garbled voice at the receiving end
Click to expand...
Won't happen. In the handset, between the microphone and the A/D
converter (CODEC) is an AGC (automagic gain control) circuit with
considerable dynamic range. No matter how loud one yells into the
microphone, the AGC makes sure that the audio input to the A/D
converter never sees more than the peak to peak level necessary to use
all the digital bits available. It is possible to overload the AGC
using an external audio device (i.e. headset), but those are designed
to also deliver a fixed maximum output.

Here's a simple test you can do yourself. Call your answering machine
from your cell phone. Do NOT listen to your answering machine while
doing this test. Speak a test phrase, starting with a very low voice
level and with the phone perhaps 20 cm away. Move closer in stages.
Talk louder in stages, until you're eating the microphone and
screamiing into the phone. Play back the answering machine message
and compare results. If you're ambitious, attach an audio level meter
or scope to the answering machine speaker. I think you'll find that
except for the first low level test, they'll all be almost identical
in volume with perhaps a 3dB spread. Clarity and distortion might be
a problem at the screaming end of the test, but I think you'll find
that there's no garble because no bits were lost during the test
transmission.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
 
"N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hgvmr6$vj5$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists
of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...
If you repeat everything they say immediately after they say it, they seem
to quiet down.

Mike
 
N_Cook wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.
Click to expand...

Dian brammahge.


--
Offworld checks no longer accepted!
 
"N_Kook"

Phil Allison


Or is it just a UK pervertion.


** The reason is they cannot hear their own voice in their ear.

Which is quite unlike a wired phone.


I've only ever seen single earpiece mobile phones, surely all these
shouters
are not deaf in their other ear.
Click to expand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidetone


...... Phil
 
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in message
news:8sc7j5l9h8ahs70bvsv6dd4oq5587p6v4b@4ax.com...
On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:30:23 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk
wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists
of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.

People are used to hearing themselves in the earpiece when talking. In
telco terminology, it's called "sidetone".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidetone
The problem is that there's about a 250 msec audio delay inherent in
digital cellular phone encoding that will drive the user nuts if
there's even the slightest leakage between the sidetone and the
microphone or through the system. Analog cellular did not have the
delay. At best, there will be an echo. More typically, there is
massive confusion when the user hears themselves somewhat delayed. In
addition, the level of side tone necessary to convince the typical
user that they're getting through, is insufficient to prevent leakage
back into the microphone, especially with a BlueGoof headset. If the
handset manufacturer or cellular vendor added sidetone, you would
instead be complaining about either feedback squeal if injected
locally in the handset or echo if injected at the switch.

Another contributory phenomenon is cellular garble causes people to
think they're not getting through, so people normally talk louder to
compensate. The more garble, the more louder they yell.

One interesting observation is that few people yell into a half-duplex
phone, or phone that requires a PTT (push to talk) to be heard. That's
because there's no expectation of ever hearing oneself in the
earpiece.

I've had a cell/mobile phone of sorts since before IMTS, so I'm quite
familiar with the problem. I've taught myself not to yell and have
convinced a few others to make the attempt. It does take some
practice, but is easy enough. The problem is convincing other people
that it's a problem. I have a digital sound level meter and sometimes
drag it into a restaurant for some entertainment. Most people are
rather surprised when I mention that they're yelling anywhere from 3
to 6dB louder into the phone than their normal conversation (while
talking to me). Although I expected considerable resistance from my
waving sound level meters at people, most are generally curious and
interested in the effect.

Also, for truly irritating cell phones, the Nextel IDEN phones with
the *VERY* loud speaker, is the worst. While suitable for noisy
construction sites, having one of those go off in a restaurant is the
epitome of obnoxious behavior.

There are some really interesting comments and observations in this
article (4 pages):

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/22/technology/circuits/22YELL.html?pagewante
Click to expand...
d=1>
More. (NPR audio 5 min):
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4229967

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Click to expand...

That 1/4 sec or so delay was used for a device to "cure" people with
stutter, it seems to do the opposite for people without a stutter.
 
N_Cook wrote:
Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.


Depends how far away the other person is, if they are on the other side
Click to expand...
of the world you have to shout louder.
 
"F Murtz"
Nutcase Kook wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology consists
of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.


Depends how far away the other person is, if they are on the other side of
the world you have to shout louder.
Click to expand...
** If they speak a different language - shouting simple English phrases at
them always gets across.

Amazing that.


...... Phil
 
"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:7pmh73Fi00U1@mid.individual.net...
"F Murtz"
Nutcase Kook wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.


Depends how far away the other person is, if they are on the other side
of the world you have to shout louder.

** If they speak a different language - shouting simple English phrases
at them always gets across.

Amazing that.


..... Phil
Click to expand...
On a technological point I will try and explain one reason. When Mr. Bell
and his friends first made the telephone thingie they did it in such a way
that the person that was speaking could in fact hear their own voice in
their ear piece. This cause a sort of feed back loop, as well as caused the
talker to not try and holler across the pond as it were. Now with the
advent of these mobile thingies and some extra technology thrown in for fun,
that does not happen anymore. Therefore the talker thinks they need to
raise their voice so that the other person can hear them no matter how close
or how far away they are.

Hope that makes sense. On the other hand some people are just plain
rude..........................................

Happy New Year!!!

Les
 
On Dec 26, 8:07 am, "ABLE1" <royboynos...@somewhere.net> wrote:
"Phil Allison" <phi...@tpg.com.au> wrote in message

news:7pmh73Fi00U1@mid.individual.net...







"F Murtz"
Nutcase Kook wrote:

Or is it just a UK pervertion. Anyone would think the technology
consists of
baked bean cans separated by a long piece of string.

Depends how far away the other person is, if they are on the other side
of the world you have to shout louder.

** If they speak a different language -  shouting simple English phrases
at them always gets across.

  Amazing that.

.....  Phil

On a technological point I will try and explain one reason.  When Mr. Bell
and his friends first made the telephone thingie they did it in such a way
that the person that was speaking could in fact hear their own voice in
their ear piece.  This cause a sort of feed back loop, as well as caused the
talker to not try and holler across the pond as it were.  Now with the
advent of these mobile thingies and some extra technology thrown in for fun,
that does not happen anymore.  Therefore the talker thinks they need to
raise their voice so that the other person can hear them no matter how close
or how far away they are.

Hope that makes sense.  On the other hand some people are just plain
rude..........................................

Happy New Year!!!

Les
Click to expand...
I'm old enough to remember my grandparents NEVER getting over the
habit of yelling into the phone when they think they're talking over a
long distance connection. Even with technology providing adequate
'noisefree' amplification and adequate sidetone, they still had that
mental attitude that they had to yell.

Yelling into the cellphone for me is caused by not being able to hear
the person I'm speaking with, all caused by the invisible placement
and very poor ear speaker in the Motorola RAZR [possibly every
cellphone] not being able to overcome background noise. Thus, just
like in a crowded room when you can't hear someone, you start to yell.
Worse, if don't maximize the sound from the speaker, the amplitude
drops/disappears and thus there is also a tendency to yell.
 
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