OT Trying to copy a VHS tape in NTSC format (UK)

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Graz

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I need to copy a PAL-VHS tape in NTSC format for someone in the US. I
have a Sony VCR which can read tapes in NTSC format and I want to dub
this tape from a second VCR. My first attempt produced a tape which
can be played whether the Sony is in NTSC mode or PAL mode. Have I
succeeded or am I wasting my time?

I appreciate this is off topic here; perhaps someone could point me to
a more appropriate newsgroup if there is no simple answer?
 
The European and North American TV systems use different standards -- 625/50
and 525/30, respectively. You cannot copy from one to the other without
conversion at some point.

If the tape is PAL, you need a VCR that can output the image in NTSC format
(or something closely approximating it), which you would then copy to a VCR
that records in NTSC format.

If you would tell us more about the VCRs you have (make and model, specific
features), it would be easier to help you.
 
In article <494e1e13.267499515@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
I need to copy a PAL-VHS tape in NTSC format for someone in the US. I
have a Sony VCR which can read tapes in NTSC format and I want to dub
this tape from a second VCR. My first attempt produced a tape which
can be played whether the Sony is in NTSC mode or PAL mode. Have I
succeeded or am I wasting my time?
Click to expand...
NTSC tapes are usually viewed in the UK by a cludge between the VHS and TV
- the VHS doesn't actually convert them to PAL.

You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

--
*Never miss a good chance to shut up *

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 04:10:47 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
<grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote:

The European and North American TV systems use different standards -- 625/50
and 525/30, respectively. You cannot copy from one to the other without
conversion at some point.

If the tape is PAL, you need a VCR that can output the image in NTSC format
(or something closely approximating it), which you would then copy to a VCR
that records in NTSC format.

If you would tell us more about the VCRs you have (make and model, specific
features), it would be easier to help you.
Click to expand...
I think you've answered my question. The source VCR (JVC HR-J470EK)
doesn't have the capability of outputting in NTSC format. The object
VCR has the capability of reading NTSC tapes but probably not
recording them (Sony SLV-F900). So it looks like the idea is a
non-starter.
 
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 12:53:56 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
<dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:

In article <494e1e13.267499515@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
I need to copy a PAL-VHS tape in NTSC format for someone in the US. I
have a Sony VCR which can read tapes in NTSC format and I want to dub
this tape from a second VCR. My first attempt produced a tape which
can be played whether the Sony is in NTSC mode or PAL mode. Have I
succeeded or am I wasting my time?

NTSC tapes are usually viewed in the UK by a cludge between the VHS and TV
- the VHS doesn't actually convert them to PAL.
Click to expand...
Cludge? Is that a technical term? :)

You might be able to do it properly via your PC.
Click to expand...
I'd be interested to know what's involved.
 
On 21 dic, 16:38, g...@gmail.com (Graz) wrote:
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 12:53:56 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"

d...@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:
In article <494e1e13.267499...@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <g...@gmail.com> wrote:
I need to copy a PAL-VHS tape in NTSC format for someone in the US. I
have a Sony VCR which can read tapes in NTSC format and I want to dub
this tape from a second VCR. My first attempt produced a tape which
can be played whether the Sony is in NTSC mode or PAL mode. Have I
succeeded or am I wasting my time?

NTSC tapes are usually viewed in the UK by a cludge between the VHS and TV
- the VHS doesn't actually convert them to PAL.

Cludge? Is that a technical term? :)

You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

I'd be interested to know what's involved.
Click to expand...
you will need a vcr which outputs in NTSC 3.58 - not just NTSC 4.43,
WHICH IS USED TO PROVIDE COLOUR ON A PAL tv but is useless for copying
(sorry- caps lock jammed!)
I have a sony SLV-ER7UY which has a switch for both modes, but there
were a number of Uk models offering this. try ebay.

once you get such a machine you just set your pc card and capture
software to ntsc.you can them make a vcd or dvd . I have done this.
-B
 
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 15:38:38 GMT, Graz wrote:
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Cludge? Is that a technical term? :)
Click to expand...
Yes. Spelled wrong. "Kludge", IIANM
 
In article <494e62d0.285096421@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

I'd be interested to know what's involved.
Click to expand...
A PC should have the processing power required to do a pukka standards
conversion. But I dunno if the required software/hardware exists. A Google
might help there.

--
*If you try to fail, and succeed, which have you done?

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
In message <5011446ef1dave@davenoise.co.uk>, "Dave Plowman (News)"
<dave@davenoise.co.uk> writes
In article <494e62d0.285096421@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

I'd be interested to know what's involved.

A PC should have the processing power required to do a pukka standards
conversion. But I dunno if the required software/hardware exists. A Google
might help there.
Click to expand...
Using a PC, "just for fun", I've successfully converted PAL TV DVD
recordings to NTSC, and vice versa. But of course, I wasn't starting
with raw video, which is what you would have when the source is a VCR.
With a DVD, you pick the files off the DVD, and transcode them. However,
with a cheap TV video card, you should be able to feed the VCR video
into a PC, and get it into a file format suitable for transcoding. After
that, instead of transferring to tape, burn the finished product to a
DVD (if this is an acceptable alternative).

[Just a note: I have a dirt-cheap Alba DVD player which, when playing an
'NTSC' DVD, the output composite video is switchable between original
video (with the NTSC 3.58MHz subcarrier) and the PAL 4.43MHz. With NTSC
output, the PAL TV set goes to B&W, and the subcarrier is very visible.
This 'feature' is useful for determining if a NTSC-PAL conversion has
actually worked. I'm not sure if the 'feature' works the other way
around. I must check some day.]

The success of my home-made transcodings can only be described as
'fair'. Occasionally, there is a certain amount of 'juddering' because
of the 50Hz-60Hz difference of field frequency. Also, there is a
possibility of the video and audio being a bit out-of-sync.
--
Ian
 
On 21 Dec 2008 17:48:43 GMT, Allodoxaphobia <bit-bucket@config.com>
put finger to keyboard and composed:

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 15:38:38 GMT, Graz wrote:
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Cludge? Is that a technical term? :)

Yes. Spelled wrong. "Kludge", IIANM
Click to expand...
It was originally spelt "kluge":
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=kluge

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
 
On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 11:13:24 +1100, Franc Zabkar
<fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote:

On 21 Dec 2008 17:48:43 GMT, Allodoxaphobia <bit-bucket@config.com
put finger to keyboard and composed:

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 15:38:38 GMT, Graz wrote:
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Cludge? Is that a technical term? :)

Yes. Spelled wrong. "Kludge", IIANM

It was originally spelt "kluge":
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=kluge
Click to expand...
Ah, as I thought - related to botch/bodge.
 
On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:58:41 +0000, Ian Jackson
<ianREMOVETHISjackson@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:

In message <5011446ef1dave@davenoise.co.uk>, "Dave Plowman (News)"
dave@davenoise.co.uk> writes
In article <494e62d0.285096421@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

I'd be interested to know what's involved.

A PC should have the processing power required to do a pukka standards
conversion. But I dunno if the required software/hardware exists. A Google
might help there.


Using a PC, "just for fun", I've successfully converted PAL TV DVD
recordings to NTSC, and vice versa. But of course, I wasn't starting
with raw video, which is what you would have when the source is a VCR.
With a DVD, you pick the files off the DVD, and transcode them. However,
with a cheap TV video card, you should be able to feed the VCR video
into a PC, and get it into a file format suitable for transcoding. After
that, instead of transferring to tape, burn the finished product to a
DVD (if this is an acceptable alternative).

[Just a note: I have a dirt-cheap Alba DVD player which, when playing an
'NTSC' DVD, the output composite video is switchable between original
video (with the NTSC 3.58MHz subcarrier) and the PAL 4.43MHz. With NTSC
output, the PAL TV set goes to B&W, and the subcarrier is very visible.
This 'feature' is useful for determining if a NTSC-PAL conversion has
actually worked. I'm not sure if the 'feature' works the other way
around. I must check some day.]

The success of my home-made transcodings can only be described as
'fair'. Occasionally, there is a certain amount of 'juddering' because
of the 50Hz-60Hz difference of field frequency. Also, there is a
possibility of the video and audio being a bit out-of-sync.
Click to expand...
Incidentally, how common are multi-region DVD players in the USA?
Over here, it seems that many of the cheap brands are multi-region
while the known brands are Region 2 (Europe) only.
 
On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 05:40:37 GMT, graz@gmail.com (Graz) wrote:

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:58:41 +0000, Ian Jackson
ianREMOVETHISjackson@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:

In message <5011446ef1dave@davenoise.co.uk>, "Dave Plowman (News)"
dave@davenoise.co.uk> writes
In article <494e62d0.285096421@news.motzarella.org>,
Graz <graz@gmail.com> wrote:
You might be able to do it properly via your PC.

I'd be interested to know what's involved.

A PC should have the processing power required to do a pukka standards
conversion. But I dunno if the required software/hardware exists. A Google
might help there.


Using a PC, "just for fun", I've successfully converted PAL TV DVD
recordings to NTSC, and vice versa. But of course, I wasn't starting
with raw video, which is what you would have when the source is a VCR.
With a DVD, you pick the files off the DVD, and transcode them. However,
with a cheap TV video card, you should be able to feed the VCR video
into a PC, and get it into a file format suitable for transcoding. After
that, instead of transferring to tape, burn the finished product to a
DVD (if this is an acceptable alternative).

[Just a note: I have a dirt-cheap Alba DVD player which, when playing an
'NTSC' DVD, the output composite video is switchable between original
video (with the NTSC 3.58MHz subcarrier) and the PAL 4.43MHz. With NTSC
output, the PAL TV set goes to B&W, and the subcarrier is very visible.
This 'feature' is useful for determining if a NTSC-PAL conversion has
actually worked. I'm not sure if the 'feature' works the other way
around. I must check some day.]

The success of my home-made transcodings can only be described as
'fair'. Occasionally, there is a certain amount of 'juddering' because
of the 50Hz-60Hz difference of field frequency. Also, there is a
possibility of the video and audio being a bit out-of-sync.

Incidentally, how common are multi-region DVD players in the USA?
Over here, it seems that many of the cheap brands are multi-region
while the known brands are Region 2 (Europe) only.
Click to expand...
If you want to do one tape I sugest to go to a store that does that
type of conversion.
 
In message <501219e0a9dave@davenoise.co.uk>, "Dave Plowman (News)"
<dave@davenoise.co.uk> writes
In article <nri0l4lqc0cjgj5cs2i4qa748u8hfvpjhr@4ax.com>,
"John,A" <> wrote:
If you want to do one tape I sugest to go to a store that does that
type of conversion.

Could you easily find a store in the US that does NTSC to PAL conversion?
The other way round is more likely.

Same applies in the UK.

I agree that, for just one tape, a 'store conversion' would save a lot
Click to expand...
of messing about. I was more interested in trying to defeat the
idiosyncrasies of Nero (and other multimedia processing software) than
actually trying to do anything useful.

I'm no real expert. Ten years ago, I had a couple of tapes (of a wedding
in the USA) 'professionally' converted (in the UK) to PAL. I recall that
the results were not too impressive. [Soon afterwards, my old PAL-only
VCR packed up. The replacement could play NTSC tapes anyway, so the
conversion was a bit of a waste of money!] I think that my own
more-recent efforts on the PC were actually better.

I'm not sure how common 'store conversion' facilities are these days.
However, ten years ago, when I was interested, I think that most used to
offer conversions either way. I don't think that there should be any
difficulty in getting a PAL-to-NTSC conversion done in the UK.
--
Ian
 
In article <nri0l4lqc0cjgj5cs2i4qa748u8hfvpjhr@4ax.com>,
"John,A" <> wrote:
If you want to do one tape I sugest to go to a store that does that
type of conversion.
Click to expand...
Could you easily find a store in the US that does NTSC to PAL conversion?
The other way round is more likely.

Same applies in the UK.

--
*Errors have been made. Others will be blamed.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
In article <Y+2FMdFetKUJFw$G@g3ohx.demon.co.uk>,
Ian Jackson <ianREMOVETHISjackson@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
I'm no real expert. Ten years ago, I had a couple of tapes (of a wedding
in the USA) 'professionally' converted (in the UK) to PAL. I recall that
the results were not too impressive.
Click to expand...
Likely done by pointing a camera at a monitor. Proper standards convertors
were/are extremely expensive. And only really to be found within broadcast
facilities. But then copying any VHS results in very noticeable
degradation - even without standards conversion.

--
*I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Likely done by pointing a camera at a monitor. Proper standards convertors
were/are extremely expensive. And only really to be found within broadcast
facilities. But then copying any VHS results in very noticeable
degradation - even without standards conversion.
Click to expand...
I had done that in the 1980's. By 1991, I had a panasonic converting VCR
that did digital conversions. That worked until about 3 years ago when it
had a mechanical fault, and the people that repaired it tore the ribbon cable
that controlled the converter. I still have it and was able to replace enough
wires in the cable to get to work as a VCR, but for now the converter is gone.

I've since replaced it with an Aiwa that does the same thing.

BTW, the OP's problem is with Nero, PAL DVD players have no trouble playing
NTSC DVD's on PAL TV sets. Some of them automaticly adjust, some have a
setup option.

Geoff.


--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel gsm@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM
 
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article <nri0l4lqc0cjgj5cs2i4qa748u8hfvpjhr@4ax.com>,
"John,A" <> wrote:
If you want to do one tape I sugest to go to a store that does that
type of conversion.

Could you easily find a store in the US that does NTSC to PAL conversion?
The other way round is more likely.
Click to expand...

At one time I knew of three, but I moved from that small town. One
was a professional video duplication house that only worked with VHS &
U-matic, while the others converted almost anything from 8 mm film, to
foreign tape formats.

Some TV stations have the capability to import foreign tape formats
to NTSC time base corrected video and can record in NTSC VHS format, if
yo know someone in the video engineering department.


Same applies in the UK.

--
*Errors have been made. Others will be blamed.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
Click to expand...

--
http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

aioe.org, Goggle Groups, and Web TV users must request to be white
listed, or I will not see your messages.

If you have broadband, your ISP may have a NNTP news server included in
your account: http://www.usenettools.net/ISP.htm


There are two kinds of people on this earth:
The crazy, and the insane.
The first sign of insanity is denying that you're crazy.
 
In article <slrngl1d7o.ft0.gsm@cable.mendelson.com>,
Geoffrey S. Mendelson <gsm@mendelson.com> wrote:
BTW, the OP's problem is with Nero, PAL DVD players have no trouble
playing NTSC DVD's on PAL TV sets. Some of them automaticly adjust, some
have a setup option.
Click to expand...
Thing is it's a bit of a misnomer talking about PAL or NTSC DVDs - as they
aren't actually coded to either. It's just the line and frame rates that
differ - and of course there are different ones of those on both PAL and
NTSC, IIRC, in various countries. In other words the digits on the disc
aren't PAL or NTSC encoded. And if you're feeding them to the TV in
digital, RGB or components again it doesn't matter - only if composite or
RF does PAL or NTSC really come into the equation. So I suppose it's
really just convention that they are marked PAL or NTSC - to show the
countries they're for.

--
*To steal ideas from *one* person is plagiarism; from many, research*

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
In article <rpadnfZ38aRrVc3UnZ2dnUVZ_vjinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
Michael A. Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

In article <nri0l4lqc0cjgj5cs2i4qa748u8hfvpjhr@4ax.com>,
"John,A" <> wrote:
If you want to do one tape I sugest to go to a store that does that
type of conversion.

Could you easily find a store in the US that does NTSC to PAL
conversion? The other way round is more likely.
Click to expand...

At one time I knew of three, but I moved from that small town. One
was a professional video duplication house that only worked with VHS &
U-matic, while the others converted almost anything from 8 mm film, to
foreign tape formats.
Click to expand...
As I said earlier it depends on what quality you want the conversion done
to - a proper one cost a lot of money. But a camera on a monitor will do
the conversion - that's how early broadcast ones worked.

Some TV stations have the capability to import foreign tape formats
to NTSC time base corrected video and can record in NTSC VHS format, if
yo know someone in the video engineering department.
Click to expand...
Indeed - my former employer had a full blown standards convertor which
cost 100s of thousands of pounds. How else did you get to watch
Benny Hill? ;-)


Same applies in the UK.
Click to expand...
--
*Constipated People Don't Give A Crap*

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
 
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