OT: \"Suspend\" a treaty?...

[Don Y]

What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

 

[Dean Hoffman]

On Wednesday, February 22, 2023 at 12:00:27 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:

What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

I\'ve read that Japan is strengthening its armed forces. Taiwan and Australia
might be too but I don\'t remember for sure.

 

[Don Y]

On 2/22/2023 11:39 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

On Wednesday, February 22, 2023 at 12:00:27 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:
What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

I\'ve read that Japan is strengthening its armed forces. Taiwan and Australia
might be too but I don\'t remember for sure.

I think bits of Europe have, as well. Amusing that all of Trump\'s
chest beating did nothing in that regard but his buddy, Putin,
has been able to do it, instead! :>

China has (indirectly) benefited from our arms agreements with
Russia. If those are \"on-hold\" or abandoned, China has to worry
that any increases in armaments won\'t ONLY be usable against
Russia...

Seems like a smart countermove by Biden would be to pull out of the
agreement, making such an announcement sound as if Russia already
*had*!

 

[Dean Hoffman]

On Wednesday, February 22, 2023 at 12:00:27 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:

What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

Temporally withdraw with the possibility of reentering might be one way to put it.
<https://www.richtmann.org/journal/index.php/ajis/article/view/12359/11954>
<https://www.oas.org/legal/english/docs/Vienna%20Convention%20Treaties.htm>
I have plenty of time but not the patience to read all of that crap.
The U.S. is sending more soldiers to Taiwan by the way.

 

[Don Y]

On 2/23/2023 4:47 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

On Wednesday, February 22, 2023 at 12:00:27 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:
What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

Temporally withdraw with the possibility of reentering might be one way to put it.
https://www.richtmann.org/journal/index.php/ajis/article/view/12359/11954
https://www.oas.org/legal/english/docs/Vienna%20Convention%20Treaties.htm
I have plenty of time but not the patience to read all of that crap.
The U.S. is sending more soldiers to Taiwan by the way.

So, can we suspend our participation? Start rebuilding the
nuclear stockpile and then, once we have augmented it substantially,
formally *withdraw* from it?

I.e., what value (to the other party) does \"suspend\" have?

 

[Dean Hoffman]

On Thursday, February 23, 2023 at 7:18:54 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:

On 2/23/2023 4:47 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On Wednesday, February 22, 2023 at 12:00:27 PM UTC-6, Don Y wrote:
What, exactly, does that mean? \"The rules won\'t apply, for now\"?

Maybe time to start rebuilding the nuclear stockpile? Esp if
they\'re spending time rebuilding their conventional arms stockpile?

I don\'t think Xi will be too happy about that!

Temporally withdraw with the possibility of reentering might be one way to put it.
https://www.richtmann.org/journal/index.php/ajis/article/view/12359/11954
https://www.oas.org/legal/english/docs/Vienna%20Convention%20Treaties.htm
I have plenty of time but not the patience to read all of that crap.
The U.S. is sending more soldiers to Taiwan by the way.
So, can we suspend our participation? Start rebuilding the
nuclear stockpile and then, once we have augmented it substantially,
formally *withdraw* from it?

I.e., what value (to the other party) does \"suspend\" have?

I guess all bets are off once a party to a bilateral agreement suspends it. Either one can go full blast making weapons. Suspensions can be temporary or permanent. Our Presidents have quite a bit of leeway. I got the impression that suspending a treaty is a bit like a bluff in a poker game.
That Peeler character on a.h.r. seems a lot like a teenager with nothing to do. He/it likes insulting Bowman for some reason. Could it be some sort of A.I. thing?
The news this morning had a lot about the winter storm blowing through the country. It showed people surfing Lake Superior. Floating ice adds to the adventure.
<https://www.wdio.com/weather-news/surfs-up-on-lake-superior/>
I guess California is catching it weather wise again. Lots of rain.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Friday, February 24, 2023 at 8:43:21 AM UTC-5, Dean Hoffman wrote:

I guess all bets are off once a party to a bilateral agreement suspends it. Either one can go full blast making weapons. Suspensions can be temporary or permanent. Our Presidents have quite a bit of leeway. I got the impression that suspending a treaty is a bit like a bluff in a poker game.
That Peeler character on a.h.r. seems a lot like a teenager with nothing to do. He/it likes insulting Bowman for some reason. Could it be some sort of A.I. thing?
The news this morning had a lot about the winter storm blowing through the country. It showed people surfing Lake Superior. Floating ice adds to the adventure.
https://www.wdio.com/weather-news/surfs-up-on-lake-superior/
I guess California is catching it weather wise again. Lots of rain.

It\'s not that complicated. The treaty in question is the SALT Treaty which put specific numerical limits on the kinds of armament each nation would build and/ or maintain. Putin\'s announcement means they plan to exceed those limits, they will no longer abide by the treaty. They\'re increasing their nuclear strike force iow, especially in regard to MIRVs. They have the brand new SARMAT (RS-28) aka Satan II they want to use.

https://2009-2017.state.gov/t/isn/5195.htm

Problem is they can\'t get anything to work.

Russian test launch of \"Satan II\" missile failed, U.S. says, as Putin suspends role in nuclear treaty

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-test-launch-satan-ii-icbm-missile-failed-putin-new-start-nuclear-treaty/

 

[Don Y]

On 2/24/2023 6:43 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

I.e., what value (to the other party) does \"suspend\" have?

I guess all bets are off once a party to a bilateral agreement suspends it.
Either one can go full blast making weapons. Suspensions can be temporary
or permanent. Our Presidents have quite a bit of leeway. I got the
impression that suspending a treaty is a bit like a bluff in a poker game.

That\'s my point. To be prudent, the other party should treat \"suspend\"
as \"unilaterally pull out of\". If other party balks and says, \"that\'s
not what we meant\", just shrug and say, \"How would I know? Would YOU assume
WE were still observing the terms of the treaty if WE said we were
suspending it? If so, then treat OUR pull out as a suspension...\"

That Peeler character on a.h.r. seems a lot like a teenager with nothing
to do. He/it likes insulting Bowman for some reason. Could it be some sort
of A.I. thing?

Dunno. I\'m not subscribed to a.h.r. Glad to hear bowman is still
alive and kicking, though. When he went silent (here), I dropped him
a line but got no reply.

This is USENET. You shouldn\'t *expect* anything from others, here.
If you want rules, participate in one of the innumerable moderated
forums. And, prepare to be actively moderated! :>

The news this morning had a lot about the winter storm blowing through the
country. It showed people surfing Lake Superior. Floating ice adds to
the adventure.
https://www.wdio.com/weather-news/surfs-up-on-lake-superior/> I guess
California is catching it weather wise again. Lots of rain.

We\'re in wacky mode -- 80\'s to 20\'s... and back again. We\'re not
making any \"long term\" adjustments to HVAC, yard, etc. until we see
how it all shakes out.

We;re waiting for the trees to tell us when we *must* harvest the
fruit (opting to leave the fruit on as long as possible as the
sugars just get more and more intense... the *skins* are exuding
sugars!).

And, of course, postponing (procrastinating!) that task has value...