OT: My birthday present, a WT310E.

W

Winfield Hill

Guest
I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com>
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/
Click to expand...

Is it AC or DC coupled?
 
On Sun, 08 Sep 2019 21:55:21 -0700, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com
wrote:

On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?
Click to expand...

I ~think~ they are DC coupled ?. They use a shunt.
We use them for AC.

Hopefully Win got the communications options ? For measuring
efficiency... Unless this one has multiple channels.
 
On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?
Click to expand...

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"
 
boB wrote...
Hopefully Win got the communications options?
For measuring efficiency...
Click to expand...

No, it's single-channel, with the standard RS-232
interface. For any serious job it'd take the hard-
to-get AC measurements and would be used with one
of my dual-channel SMUs, that can take better than
0.1% measurements on the DC portions. Good for
AC offline supply circuits, PFC stages, inverters,
etc., areas I've avoided, because, how to measure?


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
Tom Gardner wrote...
On 09/09/19, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com> wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"
Click to expand...

Here's the WT300 series datasheet.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/quh5s4bw6ehdb33/WT300-series.pdf?dl=1

I had to use Google to find it, because Yokogawa's web
pages don't seem to admit to the WT310's existence.


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
Winfield Hill wrote...
Tom Gardner wrote...

On 09/09/19, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com> wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

Here's the WT300 series datasheet.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/quh5s4bw6ehdb33/WT300-series.pdf?dl=1

I had to use Google to find it, because Yokogawa's web
pages don't seem to admit to the WT310's existence.
Click to expand...

OK, I found it. Here's the WT310E datasheet, where they
say E means enhanced, introduced in 2015. (Another spot
said E means economy. Haha, I wonder which is correct.)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/a1h2wzupp05agzu/WT300E-series.pdf?dl=1


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
<spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"
Click to expand...

What does that mean?
 
On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?
Click to expand...

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".

That's confirmed by Win's second PDF which states
"The WT300E series cover broad ranges of current input from a
few mA up to 40 A rms. It can measure waveforms which include
both AC and DC. Users can use it from the low currents of
standby power to the high currents of induction cooking."

and

"The WT300E series can
measure all DC and AC
parameters. It can also
measure harmonics
and perform integration
simultaneously without
changing the measurement
mode. The WTViewerFreePlus
software is used to monitor
and save all measurement items of up to 200 parameters."

with a crest factor of 3 or 6 or 6A.
I don't know what "6A" might mean.
 
On Monday, September 9, 2019 at 11:45:40 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 15:49:22 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?
Click to expand...

LF is either DC or 0.1Hz (ac), the HF end is 100 kHz.
(at least that's how I read it.)

George H.
 
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 15:49:22 +0100, Tom Gardner
<spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".
Click to expand...

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?
 
George Herold wrote...
On September 9, 2019, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?

LF is either DC or 0.1Hz (ac), the HF end is 100 kHz.
(at least that's how I read it.)
Click to expand...

Since it can do RMS calcs at 100kHz, I suppose
its sampling rate is somewhat higher than that.


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
On 9 Sep 2019 10:39:54 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com>
wrote:

George Herold wrote...

On September 9, 2019, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?

LF is either DC or 0.1Hz (ac), the HF end is 100 kHz.
(at least that's how I read it.)

Since it can do RMS calcs at 100kHz, I suppose
its sampling rate is somewhat higher than that.
Click to expand...

Power and RMS measurement is statistical, so the Nyquist Rate/Sampling
Theorem is not applicable. I did a lot (a LOT) of 60 Hz power
measurements sampling at around 27 Hz, a magic rate that did not alias
with significant harmonics of 60 Hz.
 
On 09/09/19 16:45, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 15:49:22 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?
Click to expand...

RTFDS, as provided by Win.

There are graphs of error vs frequency there.
 
Winfield Hill wrote...
OK, I found it. Here's the WT310E datasheet, where they
say E means enhanced, introduced in 2015. (Another spot
said E means economy. Haha, I wonder which is correct.)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/a1h2wzupp05agzu/WT300E-series.pdf?dl=1
Click to expand...

The "E" version of the datasheet makes clear it's
enhanced, with improved specs and new features.
Anybody know WT310E list price? I paid $2250.


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
On 9 Sep 2019 05:24:18 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com>
wrote:

boB wrote...

Hopefully Win got the communications options?
For measuring efficiency...

No, it's single-channel, with the standard RS-232
interface.
Click to expand...

Good enough. If you ever decide to get another one, you can control
them to capture at the same time for simultaneous measurements like
efficiency.


For any serious job it'd take the hard-
to-get AC measurements and would be used with one
of my dual-channel SMUs, that can take better than
0.1% measurements on the DC portions. Good for
AC offline supply circuits, PFC stages, inverters,
etc., areas I've avoided, because, how to measure?
Click to expand...
 
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 20:02:57 +0100, Tom Gardner
<spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 16:45, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 15:49:22 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?

RTFDS, as provided by Win.

There are graphs of error vs frequency there.
Click to expand...

It confused me at first too...
It's probably...

0.1Hz to 100kHz
or
DC to 100kHz

I think
 
On Mon, 09 Sep 2019 21:44:00 -0700, boB <boB@K7IQ.com> wrote:

On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 20:02:57 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 16:45, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 15:49:22 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 15:17, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 09:04:30 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 09/09/19 05:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On 8 Sep 2019 19:42:34 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

I broke down and bought myself a birthday
present, new-in-box on eBay. It measures
complex AC waveforms, to 0.05% of range,
0.1% of reading. Aha, now measure loss to
an honest 0.1%, efficiency to 99.9%, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7117tms0h1c9x5w/WT310E.jpg?dl=1
https://tmi.yokogawa.com/solutions/products/power-analyzers/

Is it AC or DC coupled?

That yokogawa link states
"Bandwidth DC, 0.1 Hz to 100 kHz"

What does that mean?

It means the answer to your question appears to be "yes".

Can you draw the frequency response graph for me?

RTFDS, as provided by Win.

There are graphs of error vs frequency there.


It confused me at first too...
It's probably...

0.1Hz to 100kHz
or
DC to 100kHz

I think
Click to expand...

Probably so, badly worded.
 
On 2019-09-09 22:25, Winfield Hill wrote:
Winfield Hill wrote...

OK, I found it. Here's the WT310E datasheet, where they say E
means enhanced, introduced in 2015. (Another spot said E means
economy. Haha, I wonder which is correct.)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/a1h2wzupp05agzu/WT300E-series.pdf?dl=1

The "E" version of the datasheet makes clear it's enhanced, with
improved specs and new features. Anybody know WT310E list price? I
paid $2250.
Click to expand...

Yokogawa's japanese language page has PDF catalog pages, they include
list prices. Apparently this is considered a basic necessity in Japan.
Other test instrument manufacturers like Sanwa also show their list
prices openly on their japanese site, but not on their overseas sites.

This one is for the 300E series, prices are on the last page:

https://cdn.tmi.yokogawa.com/BUWT300E-01JA.jp.pdf

A basic WT310E with nothing else is 187000 JPY, Harmonic measurement
option is 5000 JPY, external sensor input (without sensors themselves)
is 10000 JPY, Ethernet is 5000 JPY, D-A module with 4 channel analog
outputs is 10000 JPY. List prices are pre-tax, so add tax for total.

Assuming yours has harmonic measurement (-G5), no ethernet and nothing
else, that would be listed new at 192000 JPY = ca. 1780 USD.
With sensor inputs and harmonic measurement: 202000 JPY ~ 1870 USD.

Consumption tax (like a VAT in Japan) is 8% currently (may become 10%
in the near future).
 
Dimitrij Klingbeil wrote...
This one is for the 300E series, prices are on the last page:
https://cdn.tmi.yokogawa.com/BUWT300E-01JA.jp.pdf

A basic WT310E with nothing else is 187000 JPY, Harmonic measurement
option is 5000 JPY, external sensor input (without sensors themselves)
is 10000 JPY, Ethernet is 5000 JPY, D-A module with 4 channel analog
outputs is 10000 JPY. List prices are pre-tax, so add tax for total.

Assuming yours has harmonic measurement (-G5), no ethernet and
nothing else, that would be listed new at 192000 JPY = ca. 1780 USD.
With sensor inputs and harmonic measurement: 202000 JPY ~ 1870 USD.

Consumption tax (like a VAT in Japan) is 8% currently (may become
10% in the near future).
Click to expand...

From what I've been able to tell, seeking quotes, the sales
restrictions for these products is very strong. By the time
you purchase from the authorized distributor at your location,
the prices have gone up through the roof.


--
Thanks,
- Win
 
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