OT: Al Franken

[R. Steve Walz]

Product developer wrote:

"R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com> wrote in message news:<4089F753.7EC9@armory.com>...
Product developer wrote:

This may sound really simple but the perfect model is natural law. The
only collectives you see in nature is in the ant, termite, and bee
species. You don't see chipmunks collecting nuts for a winter
collective for redistribution to the lazy chipmunk's front. It's every
chipmunk for himself.
-----------------------
Animals who are mechanical/non-conscious, like bees, are merely
programmed. Small mammals who live individually are also simply
instinctive and don't know anything consciously, and thus are so
stupid that they can't manage a systematic communal effort that
would make them much more powerful and secure.

Non-conscious? Programmed? You were out getting high during science
class.
---------------

Bees, ants, and termites, dummy.

You don't think man still operates on instinct along with
acquired learning?
----------------

Whatever we have in the way of instinct it is impossible for us to
perceive, because we perceive from within its reference frame.

It is instinctual to compete for food, shelter, and
a mate.
-------------

No, it is instinctual to enjoy those things, it is our evolved
Human Nature to COOPERATE to get those things.

In your world all those instinctual acts would have to be
sepressed.
---------------------

Just as criminal competition and thievery is suppressed in ALL
decent human societies.

But the animal that is chief species on this planet, homo sapies,
has become so by being smart enough to cooperate and to act as a
group, and they have a reality that is literally a shared mind
among them that they all dwell within mentally.

The cooperation is born of selfish reasoning, survival.
-------------------

So?
Cooperation makes a people far stronger than greed can ever make
any of them individually. Any intelligent species will institute
total cooperation to maximize our victory over Nature and Life.

Not a need to be equal or just one of the drones.
---------------------

We're not mechanical insects, we each need what we want, and we
get it best when we cooperate together to get each of us what we
want as long as it is FAIR to everyone else as well!

Those who dream of becoming
leaders rise up out of crowd while enjoying the benefits that the
"group" provided like security, shelter, and in the real world
freedom.
-------------------------

Those who dream of being leaders are sociopaths.
Those who dream good dreams dream of helping others, making love,
and working together for a better society.

When individuals of this species are raised without other human
contact they behave like lower degenerated animals with no human
nature, they never learn to talk or express ideas, and they die
very early.

In other words without indoctrination the human relies more on
instinct than social programming. He would act according to natural
law. Survival of the fittest. Case made.
--------------------------------------

No one can learn to speak without indoctrination. The only question
is whether that indoctrination will be anti-humane, or pro-humane.

When children bust open a pińata at a birthday party the kid with the
fastest gathering skills gets the booty of candy! The commie kid sits
back lazily and complains that he got nothing because the system was
unfair and favored the rich.
---------------------------
Nonsense. Communists are as industrious as anyone else. You're merely
propagating a myth that the impoverished uneducated social parasite
is the communist, when they aren't anymore communist than the rich
parasite is. They're just as GREEDY as the rich parasite is, or maybe
even LESS so!

Makes total sense. In your world the other kids would have to take the
greedy kid into custody, redistribute his booty to the less capable,
and send him to a special camp to get his head right. You would have
to brainwash the kid to suppress all natural instinct to compete,
which is the essence of communism.
--------------------------------------

Competition is only found in damaged children, all the ones who are
raised gently and who are undamaged wish to cooperate and to achieve
together.

When fish start acting helpless or lazy they get attacked and eaten.
----------------------------
Those are sick or dying, they are eaten because they're slow, not
because they have abandoned some "virtue" and aren't doing a good job.
Again, you spew balderdash.

Not true. An inferior fish can be a mutation like we have many, many
of in society today all guised as Democrat special interest groups.
-------------------------------------

Fish can't imagine. They are machines.
Human Life is entirely different.

If everyone just took care of themselves ala Ayn Rand everything would
be fine.
--------------------------------
She's dead, she must not have taken very good care of herself.

So is Aristotle. So what?
------------------------------

Ever Googled her to see why she is more hated than any other American
author, even by Americans??

That's total garbage, and Rand was a fucking crank, just like you.
The greedy always try to wrongly and malevolently justify their greed.

Rand was a genius. Great minds were often "Cranky".
-----------------------

Cranks are cranks, great minds aren't cranky, or they'd never do
anything.

I would bet it all that if our resident commie wasn't a frustrated
underacheiving misfit and earned a real income, all the goofy, blame
the rich, diatribes would dissapear.
-----------------------------------
My income is just fine, thanks. If I thought you were worth it to
prove it to you, your pitifully wrong little political fantasy would
collapse around you like a house of cards.

Are you designing circuits for a collective? I heard they always pay
late.
----------------------------

They pay fine.

I would venture to guess you were brought up in a single parent,
low-income household in a bad neighborhood by a dominating mother.
-------------------

I was raised by 2 parents who were married till death, we were middle
class, in a fairly privileged suburban semi-rural neighborhood and
my parents were rather gentle people.

You never fit in at school and had few if any friends.
----------------------

I have been disappointed in humans all my life, that's NOT MY fault.
I had lots of friends though, the ones you call geeks and nerds.
I was a paradox, an athletic wrestler street-fighter-type nerd.
I accomplished fabulously at school, even squeaked into the NHS.
I hold numerous academic and achivement testing records.

Your bitterness
grew and you became more reclusive. You searched for answers and found
them reading radical left wing kook doctrines and you found a home
among all the other misfits seeking answers to why they couldn't
compete in a free society. You found that it was much easier to rail
against those "selfish" achievers than to compete against them for
your share of the preverbal pie.
-----------------------

No, I was successful at everything I tried, but there was something
missing, so I followed my intellect and my conscience and began to
back Leftist and Communist causes, and to arrange my work-life with
conscience. Now I do pretty much what I want, a good balance of it.

-Steve
--
-Steve Walz rstevew@armory.com ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew
Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!!
http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public

 

[R. Steve Walz]

John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 04:56:06 GMT, "R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com
wrote:

Your "vision" is merely your lie. Yours is the delusion of the
slave-master, that his slaves surely love him because they suck
up to him. He never really gets it that they would kill him if
they could get away with it.


Gosh Steve, you don't sound a bit like the model employee.

John
----------

Gee, not yours!

-Steve
--
-Steve Walz rstevew@armory.com ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew
Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!!
http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public

 

[R. Steve Walz]

Richard Henry wrote:

"R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com> wrote in message
news:4089F753.7EC9@armory.com...

My income is just fine, thanks. If I thought you were worth it to
prove it to you, your pitifully wrong little political fantasy would
collapse around you like a house of cards.

What? You aren't donating all your income to The People?
-------------------

Communism doesn't ask that, you disingenuous shit.
And the "People" haven't arisen yet.

-Steve
--
-Steve Walz rstevew@armory.com ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew
Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!!
http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 00:17:42 GMT, "R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com>
wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 04:56:06 GMT, "R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com
wrote:

Your "vision" is merely your lie. Yours is the delusion of the
slave-master, that his slaves surely love him because they suck
up to him. He never really gets it that they would kill him if
they could get away with it.


Gosh Steve, you don't sound a bit like the model employee.

John
----------
Gee, not yours!

-Steve

You're right, we might not get along.

John

 

[judgejudy]

What a bunch of Blow-Farts!

I think this group has gotten off topic. What the hell does this have
to do with electronics?

 

[Winfield Hill]

judgejudy wrote...

I think this group has gotten off topic. What the hell
does this have to do with electronics?

You thought that the thread "OT: Al Franken" started with
electronics?

Thanks,
- Win

whill_at_picovolt-dot-com (use hill_at_rowland-dot-org for now)

 

[maxfoo]

On 25 Apr 2004 04:44:25 -0700, Winfield Hill <Winfield_member@newsguy.com>
wrote:

judgejudy wrote...

I think this group has gotten off topic. What the hell
does this have to do with electronics?

You thought that the thread "OT: Al Franken" started with
electronics?

Thanks,
- Win

whill_at_picovolt-dot-com (use hill_at_rowland-dot-org for now)

Does the group charter even allow off-topic threads?
Isn't that why alt.politics is available?




Remove "HeadFromButt", before replying by email.

 

[Chuck Harris]

maxfoo wrote:

Does the group charter even allow off-topic threads?
Isn't that why alt.politics is available?

And your note, pointing this out, was on-topic in what way?

Seriously, regardless of the group's "charter", the only
controlling authority on unmoderated newsgroups is between
your ears. It is up to you, and you alone, to decide whether
you are going to read, or post a particular message.

-Chuck Harris

 

[Richard Henry]

"judgejudy" <judgejudy@shaw.com> wrote in message
news:30nm80pcb5fdq0di1trld45o9mkoq560eb@4ax.com...

What a bunch of Blow-Farts!

I think this group has gotten off topic. What the hell does this have
to do with electronics?

He's on the radio.

 

[maxfoo]

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 10:07:47 -0400, Chuck Harris <cfharris@erols.com> wrote:

maxfoo wrote:

Does the group charter even allow off-topic threads?
Isn't that why alt.politics is available?


And your note, pointing this out, was on-topic in what way?

Seriously, regardless of the group's "charter", the only
controlling authority on unmoderated newsgroups is between
your ears. It is up to you, and you alone, to decide whether
you are going to read, or post a particular message.

-Chuck Harris

One can complain to the offenders ISP.
In your case it's abuse@rcn.com
I suppose as long as no one bitches its permitted.




Remove "HeadFromButt", before replying by email.

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 06:38:24 GMT, judgejudy <judgejudy@shaw.com>
wrote:

What a bunch of Blow-Farts!

I think this group has gotten off topic. What the hell does this have
to do with electronics?

Who the hell is "judgejudy"?

John

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 12:17:35 GMT, maxfoo
<maxfooHeadFromButt@punkass.com> wrote:

Does the group charter even allow off-topic threads?
Isn't that why alt.politics is available?

The group charter, if you can find it, has about as much enforcement
power as the United Nations.

John

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

In news:3iuk80t5rdq5m26r5jk3ag5p96q0vq58mm@4ax.com,
John Larkin typed:

So, what's the distinction between Communism and homicidal mania? It's
too subtle for me.

This is an interesting phenomenon that I've seen before. I have a
friend who worshipped the ground that Noam Chomsky walked on (except
that he doesn't any more, and RSW might), but after 9-11 he just wanted
to kill all the Arabs.

There was a branch of this thread on democracy vs. republicanism where I
said the people have to follow the law, and they can change the law, but
only by legal procedure, and Steve said that the people can do whatever
they want. I think there's a link there. Jefferson said, "Speak not to
me of the goodness of men. Let them be bound by the Constitution." I
think the anarchists expect people to be civilized, and uncivilized
people touch a nerve by proving that the rule of law is necessary.


--
-Reply in group, but if emailing add 2 more zeros-
-and remove the obvious-

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

In news:tqan801ree1njele28s9evabk0u7bkh0gj@4ax.com,
maxfoo typed:

Does the group charter even allow off-topic threads?
Isn't that why alt.politics is available?

It isn't really available, unless you don't mind the totally
unrestrained ranting of complete lunatics. There is a lot of restaint
here from most folks, because they are aware that they aren't really
supposed to be talking about this, and they might have to work with the
people they talk to some day.


--
-Reply in group, but if emailing add 2 more zeros-
-and remove the obvious-

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:02:36 GMT, "Tom Del Rosso"
<tdnews01@att.net.invalid> wrote:

I think the anarchists expect people to be civilized,

And use bombs to prove it.

Communism is infinitely optimistic, and engages in best-case design. I
wouldn't want to drive over a bridge designed on best-case
assumptions.

John

 

[KR Williams]

In article <cg1o80tntkea2hovojk1rku6pduvfgdfa4@4ax.com>,
jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com says...

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:02:36 GMT, "Tom Del Rosso"
tdnews01@att.net.invalid> wrote:


I think the anarchists expect people to be civilized,

And use bombs to prove it.

Communism is infinitely optimistic, and engages in best-case design. I
wouldn't want to drive over a bridge designed on best-case
assumptions.

....or designed by someone who thought that someone else should be
responsible for his work.

--
Keith

 

[Seth Koster]

I agree absolutely, we'd have nuked Mecca, Medina, Riyadh, Teheran,
Bagdadh, Kabul, Islamabad, Damascus, Amman, Cairo, and a few others
with 10 kTonners, and then taken over the oil, cut off all trade with
Islamic nations, and blockaded them with booomers, and set about the
systematic destruction of all Mosques on earth by laser-guided bombs
in our own good time, and burying every media outlet in the middle
east with jamming and alternate broadcasts.

Then we'd target ANY and ALL demonstrations in the streets with
fuel-air bombs and fragmentation clusters, and encourage everyone
of the Islamic bent on earth to kill themselves or be converted
to secularism because we are going to gas them to death if they
don't.

Then over the next 50 years we would pacify each small area one
at a time by cordoning it off and killing anyone resisting or who
has a weapon and taking the weapon. Then we would issue IDs and
require every single person to be where we say they should be or
simply execute them if they don't. They will work for themselves
to better their lives and support themselves under OUR direction.
They will not be allowed to go anywhere that hasn't been swept
clean for our safety. We will prefer killing thousands of them
to losing even one of our own.

Their kids will be schooled by us and the homes will be bugged
and monitored randomly for parental brainwashing efforts, which
will be rewarded with immediate execution. In 50 years Islam
would be a filthy word, nothing more. That's what any religion
should get when it can't control its idiots. Any religion that
spreads nonsense and death DESERVES to be OBLITERATED!

-Steve

You do realize you are insane, right? This is a serious question.
I mean you sound a bit like Hitler with all this talk of immediate
executions, obliteration, bugging, gassing, targetting demonstrations
with bombs, etc... I recommend that you look into treatment options.
None of this is an attack or meant in jest, I really think you might
find some use from either an intensive psycho-therapy regimen or a
voluntary commitment. Advocating genocide on the basis of someones
religion is not a sane position.

 

[Tim Auton]

qtc333@hotmail.com (Seth Koster) wrote:

I agree absolutely, we'd have nuked Mecca, Medina, Riyadh, Teheran,
Bagdadh, Kabul, Islamabad, Damascus, Amman, Cairo, and a few others
with 10 kTonners, and then taken over the oil[...]

You do realize you are insane, right?

Seth, meet sarcasm.


Tim
--
Love is a travelator.

 

[KR Williams]

In article <abqo801u7592ounv8fokcgkfj567kk1mnf@4ax.com>,
tim.auton@uton.[groupSexWithoutTheY] says...

qtc333@hotmail.com (Seth Koster) wrote:

I agree absolutely, we'd have nuked Mecca, Medina, Riyadh, Teheran,
Bagdadh, Kabul, Islamabad, Damascus, Amman, Cairo, and a few others
with 10 kTonners, and then taken over the oil[...]

You do realize you are insane, right?

Seth, meet sarcasm.

You obviously don't know RSW very well! He does belive this and
yes, *is* insane.


--
Keith

 

[Chuck Harris]

Maxfoo wrote:

And your note, pointing this out, was on-topic in what way?

Seriously, regardless of the group's "charter", the only
controlling authority on unmoderated newsgroups is between
your ears. It is up to you, and you alone, to decide whether
you are going to read, or post a particular message.

-Chuck Harris


One can complain to the offenders ISP.
In your case it's abuse@rcn.com
I suppose as long as no one bitches its permitted.

Yes you can, but if I am not violating my ISP's
rules, what will it get you? My ISP is interested in
my not breaking civil, or criminal law, spamming, and
a few other things, but violating a newsgroup charter
is very far off of their radar. (not that I ever would ;-)

-Chuck