OT a sign of the times

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

 

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 16:53:30 -0500, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

Hey, defacing the US currency is a felony!

John

 

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 14:34:00 -0800, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 16:53:30 -0500, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

Hey, defacing the US currency is a felony!

John

The "penny presses" that create souvenirs from a penny certainly
deface a coin, but they are legal. Even usage "defaces" a coin - you
should have seen the silver half dollar I found in the back of the
drum of a electric dryer when replacing all the rollers ;-)

Maybe there's a difference between hard "coinage" and paper
"currency"?

John

 

[krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz]

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 14:34:00 -0800, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 16:53:30 -0500, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

Hey, defacing the US currency is a felony!

Only if you attempt to pass it as currency after.

 

[Tim Wescott]

On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

 

On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:

On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers.  The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold.  Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers!  Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Serviceshttp://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you.
See details athttp://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

G˛

 

[Tom Biasi]

wrote in message
news:40c80c5a-a85d-4d30-ae42-9dbb8c18c779@r29g2000yqj.googlegroups.com...

On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:

On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Serviceshttp://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you.
See details athttp://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

G˛

There is a problem with using the copper clad zinc coins as washers.
They will act as a cell in a reactive environment and disappear.
BTW: Its not against the law to deface currency, you can burn all of your
money if you like.

Tom

 

[Rich Grise]

John Larkin wrote:

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 16:53:30 -0500, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

Hey, defacing the US currency is a felony!

Do coins count as "currency?" I thought that "currency was only the paper.

Are they going to arrest everybody who's ever put a penny on the railroad
tracks? ;-)

I even saw some construction thing for some kind of EKG or EEG or EMG
or something, that actually recommended using pennies for electrodes,
in PopTronics some decades ago.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

stratus46@yahoo.com wrote:

On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:
On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers.  The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold.  Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers!  Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

Maybe one from 1943. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[amdx]

BTW: Its not against the law to deface currency, you can burn all of your
money if you like.

Tom

Ya, the government does it everyday!
MikeK

 

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 21:10:42 -0800 (PST), stratus46@yahoo.com wrote:

On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:
On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers.  The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold.  Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers!  Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

--

Well, I had some aluminum ground wire that straightened with a little
effort and used that since I couldn't find spare coat hangers.

It is indoors so rust or galvanic action isn't an issue.

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow ties
(same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded is
better than floating).

The next time I was at the dollar store I picked up some "el cheapo"
cake trivets (cooling racks) out of really wimpy gauge wire; they
work as well as the grill top and are lots lighter.

My question ... if this is a "reflector" why won't the hardware cloth
work? I haven't tried to figure out where the stations are exactly,
but I'm thinking that they are probably on the reflector side, since
there's an ocean to the east of me.

Defacing? -

http://coins.thefuntimesguide.com/2007/12/coin_facts_fiction_myths.php
12. It is against the law to deface U.S. coins. Fact or Fiction?

12. Trick Question. It is somewhat fact and somewhat fiction. It is
not illegal to deface coins BUT they can no longer be used anywhere
for currency or you would be breaking the law. It is perfectly legal
to drill a small hole in a nickel, paint a quarter, or bend a penny if
you want.

According to U.S. code Title 18, Chapter 17, Section 331:

" Whoever fraudulently alters, defaces, mutilates, impairs,
diminishes, falsifies, scales, or lightens any of the coins coined at
the mints of the United States, or any foreign coins which are by law
made current or are in actual use or circulation as money within the
United States; or

Whoever fraudulently possesses, passes, utters, publishes, or
sells, or attempts to pass, utter, publish, or sell, or brings into
the United States, any such coin, knowing the same to be altered,
defaced, mutilated, impaired, diminished, falsified, scaled, or
lightened --

Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five
years, or both."




I seem to remember copper pennies having a law protecting them when
the value of the metal went over the metal in the penny.

 

[Baron]

default Inscribed thus:

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow ties
(same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded is
better than floating).

I'm not sure as to what hardware cloth is, but you can run into strange
behavior if the distance between two conductors in the reflector is a
half or quarter wave length apart at the operating frequency. Ideally
the conductors in the reflector should be 1/10th or less, of a wave
length apart. The closer to approximating a solid sheet the better.

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

 

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 16:12:40 +0000, Baron
<baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow ties
(same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded is
better than floating).

I'm not sure as to what hardware cloth is, but you can run into strange
behavior if the distance between two conductors in the reflector is a
half or quarter wave length apart at the operating frequency. Ideally
the conductors in the reflector should be 1/10th or less, of a wave
length apart. The closer to approximating a solid sheet the better.

I'll drag it out and try again with a much closer spacing.

Hardware cloth is just wires in a cross pattern forming 1/2" squares,
that is hot dipped in zinc to rustproof and bond them.

 

[Baron]

default Inscribed thus:

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 16:12:40 +0000, Baron
baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a
wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow
ties (same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded
is better than floating).

I'm not sure as to what hardware cloth is, but you can run into
strange behavior if the distance between two conductors in the
reflector is a
half or quarter wave length apart at the operating frequency. Ideally
the conductors in the reflector should be 1/10th or less, of a wave
length apart. The closer to approximating a solid sheet the better.

I'll drag it out and try again with a much closer spacing.

Hardware cloth is just wires in a cross pattern forming 1/2" squares,
that is hot dipped in zinc to rustproof and bond them.

Ahh ! "Chicken Mesh" Comes in 25ft rolls 3ft wide. Thanks.

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

 

[Tom Biasi]

"Rich Grise" wrote in message
news:id5bit$cmh$8@news.eternal-september.org...

stratus46@yahoo.com wrote:

On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:
On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

Maybe one from 1943. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich
I have several 1943 U.S. one cent pieces and they are made of copper.
Someone told me that was unusual, are they worthless?

Tom

 

[Tom Biasi]

"amdx" wrote in message news:b22e8$4cf63f5b$18ec6dd7$26743@KNOLOGY.NET...

BTW: Its not against the law to deface currency, you can burn all of your
money if you like.

Tom

Ya, the government does it everyday!
MikeK
Amen brother.

 

[Rich Grise]

Tom Biasi wrote:

"Rich Grise" wrote in message
stratus46@yahoo.com wrote:
On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:
On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each and 45
minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and only
took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel and
electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

Maybe one from 1943. ;-)

I have several 1943 U.S. one cent pieces and they are made of copper.
Someone told me that was unusual, are they worthless?

I can't swear to the date, but I do seem to recall that during some year

in WWII, they made pennies out of steel because copper was needed for the
war effort. I learned this about 40 years ago, when everybody was on a
coin-collecting jag, and I do remember seeing some description of steel
pennies.

Or, I might have dreamed it. I'd say the best route would be to check with
a "real" coin person - if you have copper (or, actually bronze) pennies from
1943, they could be worth a fortune, or maybe you could get a couple of
bucks for the value of the copper.

Good Luck!
Rich

 

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 17:39:28 +0000, Baron
<baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 16:12:40 +0000, Baron
baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a
wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow
ties (same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded
is better than floating).

I'm not sure as to what hardware cloth is, but you can run into
strange behavior if the distance between two conductors in the
reflector is a
half or quarter wave length apart at the operating frequency. Ideally
the conductors in the reflector should be 1/10th or less, of a wave
length apart. The closer to approximating a solid sheet the better.

I'll drag it out and try again with a much closer spacing.

Hardware cloth is just wires in a cross pattern forming 1/2" squares,
that is hot dipped in zinc to rustproof and bond them.

Ahh ! "Chicken Mesh" Comes in 25ft rolls 3ft wide. Thanks.

Actually what we call "chicken wire" is twisted into hexagonal
patterns with all the wires going longitudinally with the length of
the roll. It is galvanized before it is twisted - unless you buy the
marine grade - for fish or crab traps which is hot dipped or plastic
coated after it is twisted.

 

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 17:39:28 +0000, Baron
<baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 16:12:40 +0000, Baron
baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote:

default Inscribed thus:

Here's one for an RF guru though: I made this reflector out of a
wood
frame and "hardware cloth" (1/2" mesh). Doesn't work at all well.
Whilst experimenting I tried an unused BBQ grill as a reflector -
worked pretty well as long as the wires were aligned with the bow
ties (same plane, parallel wires with ~10" between them - grounded
is better than floating).

I'm not sure as to what hardware cloth is, but you can run into
strange behavior if the distance between two conductors in the
reflector is a
half or quarter wave length apart at the operating frequency. Ideally
the conductors in the reflector should be 1/10th or less, of a wave
length apart. The closer to approximating a solid sheet the better.

I'll drag it out and try again with a much closer spacing.

Hardware cloth is just wires in a cross pattern forming 1/2" squares,
that is hot dipped in zinc to rustproof and bond them.

Ahh ! "Chicken Mesh" Comes in 25ft rolls 3ft wide. Thanks.

I got the reflector I made out of the shed. I was mistaken it is 1/4"
(fine) mesh.

Same game, it doesn't work. At ~18+" it has little effect then it
steadily attenuates the signal as it gets closer to the dipoles.

I tried rotating it 180 degrees putting the reflector on the other
side and that is even worse.

I looked at some ads for that type antenna and they also seem to use
horizontal parallel reflector wires not a cross hatch. If they have
vertical wires on the reflector it is in the center and edges only -
more for structural strength.

Seems to me a "reflector" is intended to reflect so wouldn't you want
to observe some multiple of 1/4 wave? Ideally shouldn't the reflected
signal get back to the dipoles in phase with the primary wave?

 

[Baron]

Rich Grise Inscribed thus:

Tom Biasi wrote:
"Rich Grise" wrote in message
stratus46@yahoo.com wrote:
On Nov 30, 5:41 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:
On 11/30/2010 01:53 PM, default wrote:

I was futzing around building a uhf bowtie antenna and needed
some
fender washers. The hardware store is 6 miles away in a truck
that
gets 12 mpg when cold. Figure the 8 washers for ~3 cents each
and 45 minutes wasted, and I'm about ready to drop the project .

An Edison moment... pick up the metal punch, fish 8 cents out of
my
pocket and instant fender washers! Cost 8 cents versus~$4, and
only took about two minutes.

I needed a larger one when repairing my truck today - a nickel
and electric drill...

But the ones you get from the store are made with steel, not zinc.

I suspect he's trying to hold pieces of coat hanger wire so zinc vs
steel won't be an issue. It may be better as pennies don't rust - or
do they?

Maybe one from 1943. ;-)

I have several 1943 U.S. one cent pieces and they are made of copper.
Someone told me that was unusual, are they worthless?

I can't swear to the date, but I do seem to recall that during some
year in WWII, they made pennies out of steel because copper was needed
for the war effort. I learned this about 40 years ago, when everybody
was on a coin-collecting jag, and I do remember seeing some
description of steel pennies.

Or, I might have dreamed it. I'd say the best route would be to check
with a "real" coin person - if you have copper (or, actually bronze)
pennies from 1943, they could be worth a fortune, or maybe you could
get a couple of bucks for the value of the copper.

Good Luck!
Rich

Certainly in the UK a lot, not all pennies are attracted by a magnet as
are a lot of two pence coins. Non of the old (12 to the Shilling)
pennies are.

--
Best Regards:
Baron.