Negative charge circuit to repel snow paticles

R

Rajkumar512

Guest
Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative charge circuit. I am
a beginner at circuit designing and i want to confirm my ideas to build a
Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock frequency and use a
operational amplifier LM741 to bring it down to below 0 Volt. I am using a long
copper wire connected to op-amp output for negative charge. I am also aware
there are other passive component needed, but i can work that out by myself.

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.

My Question:
Is positive voltage inverted to negative by an Op-Amp considered as negative
charge?

Thank you.
Raj
 
Rajkumar512 wrote:
Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative charge circuit. I am
a beginner at circuit designing and i want to confirm my ideas to build a
Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock frequency and use a
operational amplifier LM741 to bring it down to below 0 Volt. I am using a long
copper wire connected to op-amp output for negative charge. I am also aware
there are other passive component needed, but i can work that out by myself.

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.

My Question:
Is positive voltage inverted to negative by an Op-Amp considered as negative
charge?

Thank you.
Raj
-----------
Click to expand...
Nobody knows what the hell you mean, it sounds like you've bought in
to some ridiculous phony superstitious version of physics.

-Steve
--
-Steve Walz rstevew@armory.com ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew
Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!!
http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public
 
Wow....I wish I had half this kids imagination.
You know...all he wants to do is build a negative ion deflection
system....like is used aboard the Starship Enterprise to keep asteroids from
hitting the hull. Seems like a perfectly logical idea.
Lets all do him a favour, and not make this a hundred response flame
war..........
Kim

"R. Steve Walz" <rstevew@armory.com> wrote in message
news:3FC165B4.5B98@armory.com...
Rajkumar512 wrote:

Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative charge
circuit. I am
a beginner at circuit designing and i want to confirm my ideas to build
a
Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock frequency and
use a
operational amplifier LM741 to bring it down to below 0 Volt. I am using
a long
copper wire connected to op-amp output for negative charge. I am also
aware
there are other passive component needed, but i can work that out by
myself.

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on
top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential
to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.

My Question:
Is positive voltage inverted to negative by an Op-Amp considered as
negative
charge?

Thank you.
Raj
-----------
Nobody knows what the hell you mean, it sounds like you've bought in
to some ridiculous phony superstitious version of physics.

-Steve
--
-Steve Walz rstevew@armory.com ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew
Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!!
http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public
Click to expand...
 
I'm sorry, if it's not clear... probably i'm not good in electronics term.
Basically what i needed is a negative charge wires, that's why, after doing my
homework in electronices site, i just wondering passing negative voltage to a
wire may introduce negative charge.

Sorry again. :)
 
"Rajkumar512" wrote ...
Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative
charge circuit. I am a beginner at circuit designing and i
want to confirm my ideas to build a Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock
frequency and use a operational amplifier LM741 to bring
it down to below 0 Volt. I am using a long copper wire
connected to op-amp output for negative charge.
Click to expand...
Not clear why you would need an op-amp (or ANY circuit, for
that matter). Just connect the negative side of the output to your
experimental grid wire.

Assumes you have an isolated supply (proper power supply or
battery) which would be the safe way to do the experiment
regardless of how you connect things.

The only real difference between a "Negative Charge Circuit"
and a "Positive Charge Circuit" is which way around you connect
it, isn't it?

My Question:
Is positive voltage inverted to negative by an Op-Amp
considered as negative charge?
Click to expand...
I suppose. It depends somewhat on what YOU mean by "charge"
Voltage? Waveform? (or DC?)
 
Actually i don't reallly know how much power needed to repel the snow
particles.

It's all started when I have seen a ducumentary over the TV about snow
paticles, that really interested me. Searching through internet, by those who
did reseach on the snow particles, did confirm me that snow particles do carry
negetive charge.

Basically what i'm actually wanted to do is "Anti Frost Sign Board". Below are
some of the intresting link that actually inspired me to carry on with my
ideas.


http://snobear.colorado.edu/Markw/SnowHydro/mol.html
http://www.avalanche.org/~issw/96/art_29_.html
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/CuttingEdge/cuttingedge020222.html

I am a secondary drop out, thus do not poses much knowledge in realm of
electronics or physics, however i am a self learning individual through trials
and errors. I love to explorer new knowledges but definately not sitting in
front of book and then take a test to grade me.

p/s: i don't really know what's the end result will be but if i never try i
will never know. :)

Thank you for taking intrest in my idea.

Raj
 
Rajkumar512 wrote:
Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative charge circuit. I am
a beginner at circuit designing and i want to confirm my ideas to build a
Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock frequency and use a
operational amplifier LM741 to bring it down to below 0 Volt. I am using a long
copper wire connected to op-amp output for negative charge. I am also aware
there are other passive component needed, but i can work that out by myself.

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.
Click to expand...
Why screw around with generating extra voltages? You
already have a bipolar source to power your opamp circuit,
just connect it to two (otherwise unconnected) test wires on
your insulating tray. One will be negative, obviously, and
you can compare the two to see which if either repels
snowflakes. You might need a higher voltage than ordinary
batteries can supply to get a visible effect, in which case
your opamp can be used to feed a voltage multiplier circuit.

Mark L. Fergerson
 
Searching through internet, by those who
did reseach on the snow particles, did confirm me that snow particles do
carry
negetive charge.

Basically what i'm actually wanted to do is "Anti Frost Sign Board". Below
are
some of the intresting link that actually inspired me to carry on with my
ideas.


http://snobear.colorado.edu/Markw/SnowHydro/mol.html
http://www.avalanche.org/~issw/96/art_29_.html
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/CuttingEdge/cuttingedge020222.html

p/s: i don't really know what's the end result will be but if i never try
i
will never know. :)

Thank you for taking intrest in my idea.
Click to expand...
Its an interesting idea, but I don't think that passing a negative voltage
through a wire will have any effect on falling snow, unless perhaps the wire
gets hot and melts the snow that touches it! I think what you want to
create is more of a Van de Graf generator that would create a huge static
potential, measured in kilovolts, but possesing little current. If the
potential of the static charge was identical to the snowflake charge, then
you would see the effect of the snowflakes being repelled by the static
charge.

I believe that an effective static charge generator is an expensive
endeavour if you are building one from scratch, but I have seen a design for
an inexpensive "air ionizer" built from an automobile ignition coil that
might help you get closer to your goal. If I remember correctly, there was
a pulse generator (made from a '555 timer) that drove a small amplifier
which in turn was connected to the primary (low voltage input) on the
ignition coil. The secondary (high voltage output) side of the coil was
connected to an exposed wire. The high potential on this exposed wire would
ionize dust particles in the air and cause them to drop out, thus
"purifying" or "ionizing" the air in a room. Never built one though, but it
could be done fairly cheaply, especially if you bought the parts at a
junkyard. Just be very careful with the high voltage side, you know,
dealing with deadly currents stopping you heart and all that.
 
In article <20031124103036.05842.00000837@mb-m13.aol.com>,
rajkumar512@aol.com says...
Basically what i'm actually wanted to do is "Anti Frost Sign Board". Below are
some of the intresting link that actually inspired me to carry on with my
ideas.


http://snobear.colorado.edu/Markw/SnowHydro/mol.html
http://www.avalanche.org/~issw/96/art_29_.html
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/CuttingEdge/cuttingedge020222.html
Looks like some interesting reading there. A quick overiew of the first
Click to expand...
page of the second link gives charge/mass ratios ranging from -10 mC/kg
to -208 mC/kg. Blizzards as current flow, now there's a concept! I
wonder what sort of Hall effect you could get?

One other thing, frost is not snow. Even if you could manage to repel
snow with a voltage frost would still build up, although it could well
have an effect on the orientation of the ice crystals.

Robert
 
Rajkumar512 wrote:

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.
Click to expand...
So what you probably want is to set up a field. One wire negative (where
you do not want snow) and one positive (where you want the snow to go
instead).

You want a high voltage. But it shouldn't be dangerous, so make sure it
is current limited.

It would be the best to try this in open field first. If you think 9
volts should suffice that makes it even easier: just 2 wires to a 9 volt
block - and some way to measure the snowfall under the wires.

Sounds like an interesting and simple experiment. If there is no
measurable effect you could always go to voltages above a 1000 volts,
but safety becomes an issue. Better chance that you will see any effect
though.


Good luck,


Thomas
 
Rajkumar512 wrote:
Is there any one who can advice me on building a negative charge circuit. I am
a beginner at circuit designing and i want to confirm my ideas to build a
Negative Charge Circuit.

I am planning to use a 555 timer to generate 1kHz clock frequency and use a
operational amplifier LM741 to bring it down to below 0 Volt. I am using a long
copper wire connected to op-amp output for negative charge. I am also aware
there are other passive component needed, but i can work that out by myself.

The idea of long copper wire which will be place in zig-zag position on top of
wooden/plastic tray, is basically to test whether it has the potential to repel
snow paticles which is said to be negatively charge by many enviormental
research.

My Question:
Is positive voltage inverted to negative by an Op-Amp considered as negative
charge?

Thank you.
Raj
Click to expand...
Raj,
If you re-read the third page of the first URL you posted, under the
Experimental Results, the last paragraph, you will see that this
experiment used two very high voltage power supplies. Each power supply
was 15 kV (15,000 volts) to achieve a reasonable deflection of the snow
flake after the flakes were "dropped" into a deflection chamber in which
there was very little air disturbance. I hope you will continue to
pursue your interest in this project but I would issue a strong word of
caution - 15 kV power supplies can be very dangerous. If you do buy or
build a high voltage power supply, make _absolutely sure_ that it is
well out of reach in your experiment. For further understanding of the
principles involved in this experiment you might Google on such terms as
"electrostatic deflection", ink jet printers and how they work and as a
last resort, cell sorters (ignoring the fluorescence activation parts).
Please be extra careful!

Best,
Jim
 
Not clear why you would need an op-amp (or ANY circuit, for
that matter). Just connect the negative side of the output to your
experimental grid wire.
Click to expand...
I have gain great knowledge and new ideas based on many people who have shared
thier knowledges with me. Really, i need to explore on those ideas and
experiment on it. Anyway here is answer to your question:

"The reason for using clock is to introduce pulse, it's just and idea i got it
based on my past experiment with magnetics. It's like this, say a fixed and
constant force of North Pole magnet is pushing another North Pole magnet, the
distance is fixed at same point. But when i used a non-constant force at fixed
North Pole magnet (like swinging) the other North Pole reaches greater distance
of point. I hope you understand what i mean.

The Op-Amp is to invert the positive clock to negative, (this is the point
where i am not certain, and the reason for posting the message at this news
group) I think by inverting below zero volt, may introduce negetive charge. My
little knowledge say that zero is ground point, so more than zero is positive
thus it's positively charge, if below zero it may be negatively charge. I am
not certain about this but seeking others opinion and expertise to help me up."

My sincere thanks to all those who have shared your knowledges with me.

Many thanks;
Raj
 
"Rajkumar512" <rajkumar512@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20031124203814.28568.00000883@mb-m14.aol.com...

The Op-Amp is to invert the positive clock to negative, (this is the point
where i am not certain, and the reason for posting the message at this
news
group) I think by inverting below zero volt, may introduce negetive
charge.
Click to expand...

I understand what you are saying and why you might think that - but it's not
what you need to build.

If your idea is to work you will probably need a very large -ve voltage
(much more than an op-amp can produce).

What you really need to build is a large -ve voltage power supply. If you
have a +ve power supply with an _isolated output_ you can turn it into
a -ve supply by connecting the +ve output to earth. That forces the -ve
output to go below 0V.

There are lots of power supply circuits on this page but I urge caution as
it would be easy to kill yourself with many of these circuits.

http://www.epanorama.net/links/psu_hivolt.html
 
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