Guest
Does better math skills really equal a better engineer in the future?
S
Simon Peacock
Guest
defiantly.. all that math you try to forget at school will suddenly become
useful when you start calculating track impedance and capacitor reactance
Simon
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
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useful when you start calculating track impedance and capacitor reactance
Simon
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
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N
Nicolas Matringe
Guest
user@domain.invalid a écrit:
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No, although it helps
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K
Kelvin
Guest
not exactly equal...but you will impress the client when you give the
frequency of a
timing path of 14.4ns without using a calculator...
Kelvin
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
news:w8tzc.540$XFF1.47@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
frequency of a
timing path of 14.4ns without using a calculator...
Kelvin
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
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D
David Brown
Guest
"Kelvin" <student@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:40ce99dc@news.starhub.net.sg...
For any technical profession you need to be fast and reliable at basic
arithmetic - if you have difficulty working out how a 4.7uF capacitor
compares to a 4700nF capacitor, you will have problems. But no one is going
to blame you for using a calculator to multiply it by a 33k resistance.
Maths skill is something else - it is about logical thinking, reasoning, and
analysis. The skill is in the ability to work with symbolic
representations, to understand, manipulate and interprete such systems, with
a care for the details and an attention to all special cases, while still
being able to sort the relevant from the irrelevant. In short, maths is
most important as training for your mind (although obviously particular
branches of maths are directly relevant to particular branches of
engineering).
It's not enough on its own, but if you are not good at maths, or don't study
enough maths, then you will have great difficulty being a good engineer
(except perhaps a social engineer...).
news:40ce99dc@news.starhub.net.sg...
That's not maths skill, that's arithmetic skill.not exactly equal...but you will impress the client when you give the
frequency of a
timing path of 14.4ns without using a calculator...
Kelvin
For any technical profession you need to be fast and reliable at basic
arithmetic - if you have difficulty working out how a 4.7uF capacitor
compares to a 4700nF capacitor, you will have problems. But no one is going
to blame you for using a calculator to multiply it by a 33k resistance.
Maths skill is something else - it is about logical thinking, reasoning, and
analysis. The skill is in the ability to work with symbolic
representations, to understand, manipulate and interprete such systems, with
a care for the details and an attention to all special cases, while still
being able to sort the relevant from the irrelevant. In short, maths is
most important as training for your mind (although obviously particular
branches of maths are directly relevant to particular branches of
engineering).
It's not enough on its own, but if you are not good at maths, or don't study
enough maths, then you will have great difficulty being a good engineer
(except perhaps a social engineer...).
K
Kelvin
Guest
it's true...
but it's no big deal to calculate 47X33 anyway...
arithmetic is part of mathematics...every engineer needs to be proficient in
math...
Kelvin
"David Brown" <david@no.westcontrol.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cam9d4$npo$1@news.netpower.no...
but it's no big deal to calculate 47X33 anyway...
arithmetic is part of mathematics...every engineer needs to be proficient in
math...
Kelvin
"David Brown" <david@no.westcontrol.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cam9d4$npo$1@news.netpower.no...
"Kelvin" <student@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:40ce99dc@news.starhub.net.sg...
not exactly equal...but you will impress the client when you give the
frequency of a
timing path of 14.4ns without using a calculator...
Kelvin
That's not maths skill, that's arithmetic skill.
For any technical profession you need to be fast and reliable at basic
arithmetic - if you have difficulty working out how a 4.7uF capacitor
compares to a 4700nF capacitor, you will have problems. But no one is
going
to blame you for using a calculator to multiply it by a 33k resistance.
Maths skill is something else - it is about logical thinking, reasoning,
and
analysis. The skill is in the ability to work with symbolic
representations, to understand, manipulate and interprete such systems,
with
a care for the details and an attention to all special cases, while still
being able to sort the relevant from the irrelevant. In short, maths is
most important as training for your mind (although obviously particular
branches of maths are directly relevant to particular branches of
engineering).
It's not enough on its own, but if you are not good at maths, or don't
study
enough maths, then you will have great difficulty being a good engineer
(except perhaps a social engineer...).
D
David Brown
Guest
"Kelvin" <student@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:40cece16$1@news.starhub.net.sg...
handwriting is to essay-writing - you can get a computer to help with the
larger stuff as long as you understand what you are doing, but it's going to
be a pain if you need a computer for every little note, and being able to
write well does not make you a good essay writer.
There are three sorts of mathematicians - those who can count, and those who
can't.
There are 10 sorts of software engineers - those that understand binary, and
those who don't.
Anyway, we agree that an engineer needs to be good at maths.
David
news:40cece16$1@news.starhub.net.sg...
Arithmetic is to maths what letters are to English, or perhaps what
handwriting is to essay-writing - you can get a computer to help with the
larger stuff as long as you understand what you are doing, but it's going to
be a pain if you need a computer for every little note, and being able to
write well does not make you a good essay writer.
There are three sorts of mathematicians - those who can count, and those who
can't.
There are 10 sorts of software engineers - those that understand binary, and
those who don't.
Anyway, we agree that an engineer needs to be good at maths.
David
"David Brown" <david@no.westcontrol.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cam9d4$npo$1@news.netpower.no...
"Kelvin" <student@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:40ce99dc@news.starhub.net.sg...
not exactly equal...but you will impress the client when you give the
frequency of a
timing path of 14.4ns without using a calculator...
Kelvin
That's not maths skill, that's arithmetic skill.
For any technical profession you need to be fast and reliable at basic
arithmetic - if you have difficulty working out how a 4.7uF capacitor
compares to a 4700nF capacitor, you will have problems. But no one is
going
to blame you for using a calculator to multiply it by a 33k resistance.
Maths skill is something else - it is about logical thinking, reasoning,
and
analysis. The skill is in the ability to work with symbolic
representations, to understand, manipulate and interprete such systems,
with
a care for the details and an attention to all special cases, while
still
being able to sort the relevant from the irrelevant. In short, maths is
most important as training for your mind (although obviously particular
branches of maths are directly relevant to particular branches of
engineering).
It's not enough on its own, but if you are not good at maths, or don't
study
enough maths, then you will have great difficulty being a good engineer
(except perhaps a social engineer...).
T
thangkho
Guest
Engineer math skill is what remains after you forget everything in school, and what's gain from works.
U
Uwe Bonnes
Guest
Kelvin <student@nowhere.com> wrote:
: it's true...
: but it's no big deal to calculate 47X33 anyway...
Well, start with 50X30 , we're engineers
--
Uwe Bonnes bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de
Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 162516 -------- Fax. 06151 164321 ----------
: it's true...
: but it's no big deal to calculate 47X33 anyway...
Well, start with 50X30 , we're engineers
--
Uwe Bonnes bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de
Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 162516 -------- Fax. 06151 164321 ----------
H
Hendra Gunawan
Guest
How about digital logic design engineer? What kind of math required other
than basic arithmetic? And don't they need a lot less math than say an RF
engineer?
Hendra
than basic arithmetic? And don't they need a lot less math than say an RF
engineer?
Hendra
S
Simon Peacock
Guest
same as RF engineer .. ever seen what a 2 gig processor looks like ...
infact anything over 500 MHz is RF
Simon
"Hendra Gunawan" <u1000393@email.sjsu.edu> wrote in message
news:cao5ji$7epp0$1@hades.csu.net...
...infact anything over 500 MHz is RF
Simon
"Hendra Gunawan" <u1000393@email.sjsu.edu> wrote in message
news:cao5ji$7epp0$1@hades.csu.net...
G
glen herrmannsfeldt
Guest
Simon Peacock wrote:
500MHz is the low end of the microwave region.same as RF engineer .. ever seen what a 2 gig processor
looks like
The US government runs a radio transmitter on 60kHz, so I
would have to call that the low end of RF. They used to
run one at 20KHz, but don't anymore.
That is not counting the 7Hz transmitter used to communicate
with submarines. (The resonant frequency of the earth.)
-- glen
B
Brannon King
Guest
Let me give you a list of math/CS skills used by myself and two coworkers in
the past year and expect to use on a regular basis as a reconfigurable
computing engineer:
Basic trig and linear algebra: BLAS accelerator, ray tracer, 3D
transformations and rendering
Numerical methods for integration and general integration: Seismic data
processing
General calculus minimization and maximization technics
Turing complete issues, BNF, language design, compiler design
DCT, FFT, general butterfly expansion and theory
General algorithms such as Greedy, general Branch and Bound, Dijkstra (sp?),
etc.
General timing, error percentages, error bayesian
Seive and other prime number searches and manipulations
On a daily basis I do pointer calculations/arithmatic and some kind timing
analisys
I work with two other engineers who have insufficient math. They are total
peons. They have nothing to do with any product design because, basically,
they can't. They just don't have the background, the nomencalture, and the
mental partioning ability to be a part of the process. If you base your
"better engineer" criteria on how well a person follows orders, comments
code, and produces bugfree code, which seem to be standard mesurements, then
let me ask you this? Wouldn't you feel better knowing they understand the
orders, understand the code they're commenting, and can effectively prove
their code is bugfree? These skills all require an understanding of what's
going on at all levels, and you can't have that without math.
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
news:w8tzc.540$XFF1.47@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
the past year and expect to use on a regular basis as a reconfigurable
computing engineer:
Basic trig and linear algebra: BLAS accelerator, ray tracer, 3D
transformations and rendering
Numerical methods for integration and general integration: Seismic data
processing
General calculus minimization and maximization technics
Turing complete issues, BNF, language design, compiler design
DCT, FFT, general butterfly expansion and theory
General algorithms such as Greedy, general Branch and Bound, Dijkstra (sp?),
etc.
General timing, error percentages, error bayesian
Seive and other prime number searches and manipulations
On a daily basis I do pointer calculations/arithmatic and some kind timing
analisys
I work with two other engineers who have insufficient math. They are total
peons. They have nothing to do with any product design because, basically,
they can't. They just don't have the background, the nomencalture, and the
mental partioning ability to be a part of the process. If you base your
"better engineer" criteria on how well a person follows orders, comments
code, and produces bugfree code, which seem to be standard mesurements, then
let me ask you this? Wouldn't you feel better knowing they understand the
orders, understand the code they're commenting, and can effectively prove
their code is bugfree? These skills all require an understanding of what's
going on at all levels, and you can't have that without math.
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
news:w8tzc.540$XFF1.47@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
J
jtw
Guest
How about Abstract Algebra? The math needed to understand Reed-Solomon,
BCH, and other codes is not intuitive--at least for most of us. The "rules"
are a little different over finite fields....
On a more basic note, you need math to budget your interfaces (how much
bandwidth is required, etc.) and, of course, your parts lists.
And let's not neglect FFTs, and other digital signal processing
opportunities.
Jason
"Hendra Gunawan" <u1000393@email.sjsu.edu> wrote in message
news:cao5ji$7epp0$1@hades.csu.net...
BCH, and other codes is not intuitive--at least for most of us. The "rules"
are a little different over finite fields....
On a more basic note, you need math to budget your interfaces (how much
bandwidth is required, etc.) and, of course, your parts lists.
And let's not neglect FFTs, and other digital signal processing
opportunities.
Jason
"Hendra Gunawan" <u1000393@email.sjsu.edu> wrote in message
news:cao5ji$7epp0$1@hades.csu.net...
V
Victor Schutte
Guest
Better understanding of engineering (and the world) develops better math
skills.
If you understand your problem then the mathematics will fall into place. If
you don't understand the problem the mathematics will seem pointless.
I only really started understanding some of my school math after I applied
it in the practical field.
Low math skills/marks = low understanding of applications/problems.
Victor
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
news:w8tzc.540$XFF1.47@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
skills.
If you understand your problem then the mathematics will fall into place. If
you don't understand the problem the mathematics will seem pointless.
I only really started understanding some of my school math after I applied
it in the practical field.
Low math skills/marks = low understanding of applications/problems.
Victor
<user@domain.invalid> wrote in message
news:w8tzc.540$XFF1.47@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
T
Thomas Stanka
Guest
"Hendra Gunawan" <u1000393@email.sjsu.edu> wrote:
the nasty stuff, so you don't even need to know boolean arithmetic.
However it's still good to know the basics, of what your tools doing
to get good results.
I think you need less skills in "applied higher mathematic" than an RF
engineer but at least the same amount in more abstract mathematics
like coding theory, formal algorithms, complexity theory, automation
therory and so on.
If you like to implement eg a booth multiplier you end up with more
mathematic
than you ever wanted to learn.
The actual needed mathematics may be strongly dependent on the kind of
circuits your doing. When working on digital ASICs for RF you need
other mathematical skills then needed in CPU development or similar
ASICS for number crunching.
Image processing has other needs than lowpower design.
bye Thomas
Depending on the level of abstraction. Nowadays your tools doing all
the nasty stuff, so you don't even need to know boolean arithmetic.
However it's still good to know the basics, of what your tools doing
to get good results.
I think you need less skills in "applied higher mathematic" than an RF
engineer but at least the same amount in more abstract mathematics
like coding theory, formal algorithms, complexity theory, automation
therory and so on.
If you like to implement eg a booth multiplier you end up with more
mathematic
than you ever wanted to learn.
The actual needed mathematics may be strongly dependent on the kind of
circuits your doing. When working on digital ASICs for RF you need
other mathematical skills then needed in CPU development or similar
ASICS for number crunching.
Image processing has other needs than lowpower design.
bye Thomas
J
john jakson
Guest
"Brannon King" <bking@starbridgesystems.com> wrote in message
snipping
Not sure if I would have broadcast that from the company email though
Next time I think of SB, I will remember those 2 "peons";, poor guys!
regards
johnjakson_usa_com
snipping
Its part of the job to work with "peons" unfortunately.
Not sure if I would have broadcast that from the company email though
Next time I think of SB, I will remember those 2 "peons";, poor guys!
regards
johnjakson_usa_com