Magnetic Field Q

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

I will be using large(ish) volume fields of a strength comparable to the
geomagnetic field.

How will the volume alter if the coil is parallel to the geomagnetic as compared
to right angles?

Could propagation be enhanced or retarded by the geomagnetic ie is there a
modulation effect or just the simple vector addition?

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Larry Brasfield wrote:

"Dirk Bruere at Neopax" <dirk@neopax.com> wrote in message
news:3556lkF4gnd32U1@individual.net...

I will be using large(ish) volume fields of a strength comparable to the geomagnetic field.

How will the volume alter if the coil is parallel to the geomagnetic as compared to right angles?


I thought I knew a bit about magnetics, but I cannot
grok your "volume" here. Volume of what? Field at
least half as strong as its maximum? Please explain.


Could propagation be enhanced or retarded by the geomagnetic ie is there a modulation effect or just the simple vector addition?


Propagation? Are you generating an AC field
and worrying about its propagation? That would
occur very close to the speed of light in air. If
you are thinking of a DC field, where "largish"
is small compared to Earth, your created field
will most likely just add to the existing field. The
exception would be if you use superconductors.

I'll explain further.
I'm generating a modulated field roughly the volume of a room - or at least, the
coil is around a metre in dia.

How does this interact with the steady state geomagnetic field, which is about
the same strength, when the coil is either parallel or anti-parallel to it?


--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[John Woodgate]

I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
<dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <3556lkF4gnd32U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:

I will be using large(ish) volume fields of a strength comparable to the
geomagnetic field.

How will the volume alter if the coil is parallel to the geomagnetic as
compared to right angles?

There is no defined 'volume' of a magnetic field in space (or air). The
field strength just gets weaker and weaker as you go away from the
source.

Could propagation be enhanced or retarded by the geomagnetic ie is there
a modulation effect or just the simple vector addition?

There is no propagation (apart from an ephemeral period when you first
set up the field) in the sense that you appear to mean. You are
producing a magnetic field, not launching electromagnetic waves (to any
significant extent).

The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales. Your
field is simply superimposed on it like ripple on a power supply output.
At any instant, at a given point, the magnetic field vector has a
specific direction. There is no modulation effect in the sense that you
appear to mean.
--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
The good news is that nothing is compulsory.
The bad news is that everything is prohibited.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk

 

[Larry Brasfield]

"Dirk Bruere at Neopax" <dirk@neopax.com> wrote in message
news:3558sdF4illrlU1@individual.net...

I'm generating a modulated field roughly the volume of a room - or at least, the coil is around a metre in dia.

How does this interact with the steady state geomagnetic field, which is about the same strength, when the coil is either parallel
or anti-parallel to it?

If G is Earth's field, and D is Dirk's field (as it would be
analyzed or measured in the absence of Earth's field),
then, neglecting the effects of non-linear magnetic media
in the vicinity, the net field would be G + D. If you were
to measure the AC field, using a method that rejects the
DC field, you would measure D's AC component.

--
--Larry Brasfield
email: donotspam_larry_brasfield@hotmail.com
Above views may belong only to me.

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

John Woodgate wrote:

I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <3556lkF4gnd32U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:


I will be using large(ish) volume fields of a strength comparable to the
geomagnetic field.

How will the volume alter if the coil is parallel to the geomagnetic as
compared to right angles?


There is no defined 'volume' of a magnetic field in space (or air). The
field strength just gets weaker and weaker as you go away from the
source.

I know. More precisely, the volume in which the field equals or exceeds that of
the Earth.

Could propagation be enhanced or retarded by the geomagnetic ie is there
a modulation effect or just the simple vector addition?


There is no propagation (apart from an ephemeral period when you first
set up the field) in the sense that you appear to mean. You are
producing a magnetic field, not launching electromagnetic waves (to any
significant extent).

The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales. Your
field is simply superimposed on it like ripple on a power supply output.
At any instant, at a given point, the magnetic field vector has a
specific direction. There is no modulation effect in the sense that you
appear to mean.

That's what I thought - a simple vector addition.

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 19:34:12 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax
<dirk@neopax.com> wrote:

I will be using large(ish) volume fields of a strength comparable to the
geomagnetic field.

How will the volume alter if the coil is parallel to the geomagnetic as compared
to right angles?

Could propagation be enhanced or retarded by the geomagnetic ie is there a
modulation effect or just the simple vector addition?

Simple vector addition at any point in space.

John

 

[John Woodgate]

I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
<dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <355bkjF4h7875U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:

I know. More precisely, the volume in which the field equals or exceeds
that of the Earth.

The three-dimensional field pattern produced by your coil is not simple,
and its sum with the geomagnetic field is even less simple. You have
really only given rather vague information on your coil and field
strength. With a very full description of your set-up, some results
could be obtained. But it is usual when considering effects due to AC
fields to disregard the geomagnetic field.
--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
The good news is that nothing is compulsory.
The bad news is that everything is prohibited.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk

 

[Ken Smith]

In article <GlZEvVBeVX7BFw0Y@jmwa.demon.co.uk>,
John Woodgate <noone@yuk.yuk> wrote:
[...]

The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales.

Depending on where you are, the field is about 50,000nT and varies daily
by about 100nT. On top of that are shorter term natural variations of
about 1nT at periods of about 1 second or so. There is a long term
downwards drift by several nT per year.

Mains frequency noise is usually strongest at the 3rd harmonic and is
about 100nT also.


--
--
kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge

 

[Rich Grise]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 22:21:44 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

John Woodgate wrote:

I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <355bkjF4h7875U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:


I know. More precisely, the volume in which the field equals or exceeds
that of the Earth.


The three-dimensional field pattern produced by your coil is not simple,
and its sum with the geomagnetic field is even less simple. You have
really only given rather vague information on your coil and field
strength. With a very full description of your set-up, some results
could be obtained. But it is usual when considering effects due to AC
fields to disregard the geomagnetic field.

I expect that the only effect the geomagnetic field will have is to distort the
pattern, depending upon orientation of the generator coil. Ideally I want the
field to be symmetrical about the coil.

Other details are rather vague.
As I wrote in the Editor thread
"I want to use a PC soundcard to play a suitable .wav file through an amp into
the coil. The .wav is a series of pseudorandom pulses of millisecond duration at
around 150Hz."

Coil size, impedance, power etc to be determined.

So, get out your trusty magnetometer, and measure it!

Good Luck!
Rich

 

[Rich The Philosophizer]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 23:23:34 +0000, Ken Smith wrote:

In article <GlZEvVBeVX7BFw0Y@jmwa.demon.co.uk>,
John Woodgate <noone@yuk.yuk> wrote:
[...]
The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales.

Depending on where you are, the field is about 50,000nT and varies daily
by about 100nT. On top of that are shorter term natural variations of
about 1nT at periods of about 1 second or so.

This would be Mother's Heartbeat.
http://www.godchannel.com/ruowdisc.html#psalm

Thanks,
Rich

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Rich Grise wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 22:21:44 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:


John Woodgate wrote:


I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <355bkjF4h7875U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:



I know. More precisely, the volume in which the field equals or exceeds
that of the Earth.


The three-dimensional field pattern produced by your coil is not simple,
and its sum with the geomagnetic field is even less simple. You have
really only given rather vague information on your coil and field
strength. With a very full description of your set-up, some results
could be obtained. But it is usual when considering effects due to AC
fields to disregard the geomagnetic field.

I expect that the only effect the geomagnetic field will have is to distort the
pattern, depending upon orientation of the generator coil. Ideally I want the
field to be symmetrical about the coil.

Other details are rather vague.
As I wrote in the Editor thread
"I want to use a PC soundcard to play a suitable .wav file through an amp into
the coil. The .wav is a series of pseudorandom pulses of millisecond duration at
around 150Hz."

Coil size, impedance, power etc to be determined.


So, get out your trusty magnetometer, and measure it!

First, thanks to all who have replied. I am checking out possibilities now.

To give you all some idea of the 'resource allocation' for this project - it's
all got to come from scrap lying around the house. The coil is going to be wound
from some #22 copper wire. No idea how many turns or what inductance it will
come out as. I'll probably put a big cap in series with the coil and hope none
of the waveforms come close to the resonance point. The amp is a bodged FET
audio amp I had previously butchered for expt in inductive heating and is 100W
in 4 Ohms up to 100kHz.

Assuming I don't fry my brain (or that of my neighbours) I'll let you all know
how it gets on.

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Rich The Philosophizer wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 23:23:34 +0000, Ken Smith wrote:


In article <GlZEvVBeVX7BFw0Y@jmwa.demon.co.uk>,
John Woodgate <noone@yuk.yuk> wrote:
[...]

The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales.

Depending on where you are, the field is about 50,000nT and varies daily
by about 100nT. On top of that are shorter term natural variations of
about 1nT at periods of about 1 second or so.


This would be Mother's Heartbeat.
http://www.godchannel.com/ruowdisc.html#psalm

"geopsyche"
http://www.bariumblues.com/persinger.htm

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[Rich The Philosophizer]

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:14:14 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Rich The Philosophizer wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 23:23:34 +0000, Ken Smith wrote:


In article <GlZEvVBeVX7BFw0Y@jmwa.demon.co.uk>,
John Woodgate <noone@yuk.yuk> wrote:
[...]

The geomagnetic field is normally 'DC' over diurnal timescales.

Depending on where you are, the field is about 50,000nT and varies daily
by about 100nT. On top of that are shorter term natural variations of
about 1nT at periods of about 1 second or so.


This would be Mother's Heartbeat.
http://www.godchannel.com/ruowdisc.html#psalm

"geopsyche"
http://www.bariumblues.com/persinger.htm

Feh. Nothing but an end-around run. An attempt to define reality while
continuing to deny the very existence of Our Mother.

They need to learn to feel.

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Scott Stephens]

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Scott Stephens wrote:

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

There is a report of work Persinger did with LSD and mag fields.
Seems the subject could actually sense the fields as light.
I'm interested in doing weird combo expts like that.

Recently I read that LSD, rather than enhancing perception, degraded it
by messing up the brains ability to filter and route sensation.

I think it was in Becker's 1st or 2nd book he describes magnetic
experiments in which people were trained to sense magnetic fields so
they had an internal compass. An ancient training technique for some
Buddhist monks was to have a lodestone waved around behind them.

So I thought it might be an interesting idea to take a TV deflection
yoke, and create a slowly rotating magnetic field while lighting an
appropriate indicator. Pushbuttons or a joystick would be used to
"guess" which orientation the field would be at next. Sort of like a
game, you get a score based on correct guesses, along with a pleasant
chime and a pretty jpg, or a buzzer and an ugly jpg for wrong guesses.

Even more useful than the internal compass training would be a
course/kit to train you to detect the presence of other people, like the
monks proportedly could. Somewhere I read this was actual military
training. Sensing the electric fields of other living creatures,
similarly to sharks sensing electric fields of their prey in the ocean.

This time you have a Quake mod, and shoot a bazooka at a cardboard box.
If the magnetic field connected to the computer game is pulsing at 12 Hz
alpha brainwave freq, the enemy is in/behind the box you frag and score.
If the magnetic field isn't pulsing, the box blows up and wounds you.
Color-tint hints are first overtly given, then the colors and pulse
duration fade into subliminal until finally no clue but the pulsing
field remains.

Checkout www.sumeria.net/tech/emfwar.html

The pineal gland actually has some ferrite in it, just like migratory
birds. But I'm skeptical about the mind-control stuff at
vericom/mindnet. Some paranoids have been subjected to mental cruelty
(the kind of stuff in Santoro's "Gaslighting") and attribute the vague,
nebulous feelings their being messed with to some technology they don't
comprehend, when actually, they've been conditioned not to perceive the
insults or there to subtle to identify.

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Scott Stephens wrote:

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Scott Stephens wrote:

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:



There is a report of work Persinger did with LSD and mag fields.
Seems the subject could actually sense the fields as light.
I'm interested in doing weird combo expts like that.



Recently I read that LSD, rather than enhancing perception, degraded it
by messing up the brains ability to filter and route sensation.


Sort of. It really does expand consciousness, or conscious awareness, to
a great many areas of the brain normally inaccessible.

I think it was in Becker's 1st or 2nd book he describes magnetic
experiments in which people were trained to sense magnetic fields so
they had an internal compass. An ancient training technique for some
Buddhist monks was to have a lodestone waved around behind them.

So I thought it might be an interesting idea to take a TV deflection
yoke, and create a slowly rotating magnetic field while lighting an
appropriate indicator. Pushbuttons or a joystick would be used to
"guess" which orientation the field would be at next. Sort of like a
game, you get a score based on correct guesses, along with a pleasant
chime and a pretty jpg, or a buzzer and an ugly jpg for wrong guesses.

Even more useful than the internal compass training would be a
course/kit to train you to detect the presence of other people, like the
monks proportedly could. Somewhere I read this was actual military
training. Sensing the electric fields of other living creatures,
similarly to sharks sensing electric fields of their prey in the ocean.

This time you have a Quake mod, and shoot a bazooka at a cardboard box.
If the magnetic field connected to the computer game is pulsing at 12
Hz alpha brainwave freq, the enemy is in/behind the box you frag and
score. If the magnetic field isn't pulsing, the box blows up and
wounds you. Color-tint hints are first overtly given, then the colors
and pulse duration fade into subliminal until finally no clue but the
pulsing field remains.

Checkout www.sumeria.net/tech/emfwar.html

The pineal gland actually has some ferrite in it, just like migratory
birds. But I'm skeptical about the mind-control stuff at
vericom/mindnet. Some paranoids have been subjected to mental cruelty
(the kind of stuff in Santoro's "Gaslighting") and attribute the vague,
nebulous feelings their being messed with to some technology they don't
comprehend, when actually, they've been conditioned not to perceive the
insults or there to subtle to identify.


There does seem to be a very large gap between reported research on
small volume fields eg Persingers work, and the effect of much larger
fields on whole groups of people. It's the latter that interests me.

BTW, here's a 'freeby' of an idea that has not been mentioned in the literature.
Since I'm feeling rather craetive at present I thought I'd share it with you
(that and precedence in case Dr Evil applies for a patent...).

How to saturate a whole neighbourhood with Persinger style modulated (spike)
fields. Use a thyrister chopping the mains power into a 1kW heater. The
resulting spikes will propagate far and wide, along with their associated mag
fields.

Of course, the downside is that you will get shut down fairly rapidly given the
electrical noise will interfere with far more than brains.

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org

 

[Rich The Philosophizer]

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 13:48:42 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Scott Stephens wrote:

I've seen a schematic for some CIA confusion device, that is basically a
bjt avalanche or marx generator, pulsing RF centered around 300 MHz at a
repetition rate of 10's of KHz, and is sub-modulated at alpha brainwave
frequency. Suppose to make you forget your name. And mess up your immune
system, and have female children.

That's the problem with a lot of this stuff - all rumours.
Which is suprising considering how easy it is to replicate.

Well, don't forget the mountains of Dogma that you're up against!

Good Luck!
Rich

 

[Winfield Hill]

Mark Fergerson wrote...

Where's news2020 when we need a test subject?

He was here 10 months ago. Or perhaps 5 months ago, e.g., subject:
"Topic- Lasers : Where is News2020 ??? Calling once, calling twice ..."

Or in soc.culture.indian, on Aug 8th, posting from google,
"Where is News2020 ??"

news2020-Aug04, Aug 8 2004, 5:53 pm
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: netm4...@netscape.net (news2020-Aug04)
Date: 8 Aug 2004 17:53:54 -0700
Local: Sun, Aug 8 2004 5:53 pm
Subject: Where is News2020 ??

This is a test message.
This news2020 has been blocked out for months now.
Finally this is a fresh attempt.
...

8 Aug 2004
From Library Computer system... Home computer not usable due to
laser blanking screen...

-----

Or on August 9th from groups.google.com:
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/soc.culture.indian/browse_thread/
thread/20e2dde1ce811f4d

-- Shot through the head by lasers while sleeping - upto about 4 am ...
-- Electrocution of feet by lasers throughout the day ...
... etc ...

-----

And later in the soc.culture.indian newsgroup, on 19 August...

From: netm4...@netscape.net (news2020-Aug04)
Subject: News2020 posts are blocked (?)
Date: 19 Aug 2004 20:10:25 -0700
Message-ID: <1b796e6d.0408191910.64f0cf48@posting.google.com>

It appears that my posts to the newsgroups are being blocked or
operating in one direction only. I am not able to read articles past
Aug 13 '04. Also, I am not even sure that my posts are reaching the
newsgroups soc.culture.indian and sci.electronics.design, etc. even
though the confirmation does show up when searched for. (only one
article seen)

We are dealing with virtual reality for sure !

- news2020

-----

Hmm. Hopefully he's not finally been permanently blanked out?


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Rich Grise]

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 17:44:38 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Mark Fergerson wrote...

Where's news2020 when we need a test subject?

He was here 10 months ago. Or perhaps 5 months ago, e.g., subject:
"Topic- Lasers : Where is News2020 ??? Calling once, calling twice ..."
....
We are dealing with virtual reality for sure !

- news2020
....
Hmm. Hopefully he's not finally been permanently blanked out?

Nah. He finally got laid, and lost interest in the newsgroups. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Mark Jones]

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 22:21:44 +0000, Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:


John Woodgate wrote:


I read in sci.electronics.design that Dirk Bruere at Neopax
dirk@neopax.com> wrote (in <355bkjF4h7875U1@individual.net&gt about
'Magnetic Field Q', on Tue, 18 Jan 2005:



I know. More precisely, the volume in which the field equals or
exceeds that of the Earth.



The three-dimensional field pattern produced by your coil is not
simple,
and its sum with the geomagnetic field is even less simple. You have
really only given rather vague information on your coil and field
strength. With a very full description of your set-up, some results
could be obtained. But it is usual when considering effects due to AC
fields to disregard the geomagnetic field.


I expect that the only effect the geomagnetic field will have is to
distort the pattern, depending upon orientation of the generator
coil. Ideally I want the field to be symmetrical about the coil.

Other details are rather vague.
As I wrote in the Editor thread
"I want to use a PC soundcard to play a suitable .wav file through an
amp into the coil. The .wav is a series of pseudorandom pulses of
millisecond duration at around 150Hz."

Coil size, impedance, power etc to be determined.



So, get out your trusty magnetometer, and measure it!


First, thanks to all who have replied. I am checking out possibilities now.

To give you all some idea of the 'resource allocation' for this project
- it's all got to come from scrap lying around the house. The coil is
going to be wound from some #22 copper wire. No idea how many turns or
what inductance it will come out as. I'll probably put a big cap in
series with the coil and hope none of the waveforms come close to the
resonance point. The amp is a bodged FET audio amp I had previously
butchered for expt in inductive heating and is 100W in 4 Ohms up to 100kHz.

Assuming I don't fry my brain (or that of my neighbours) I'll let you
all know how it gets on.

Whatever you do, avoid having that guy over with the nail in his head....

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Scott Stephens wrote:

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

I'll explain further.
I'm generating a modulated field roughly the volume of a room - or at
least, the coil is around a metre in dia.

How does this interact with the steady state geomagnetic field, which
is about the same strength, when the coil is either parallel or
anti-parallel to it?


Space is a linear field medium, until you get to astronomical power
levels. So the earth's field and your coil field are linear
superpositions, simple vector additions of each source field contribution.

But if you're replicating Persinger's experiments involving
bio-electromagnetic effects, the material your studying has non-linear
characteristic, and may disproportionately respond to either individual
field sources.

Biologists call it the "window effect". If you bias a Si diode near
conduction, say .6 volts with one source, then another 100mV AC source
is going to cause a relatively giant variation on the diode current.

Similar effect has been observed regarding the efflux of calcium ions in
the earths DC bias field, when a ~10Hz AC magnetic field excites an
ion-cyclotron resonance.

Becker's "Body Electric" is an interesting book, perhaps it inspired
Persinger, who seems to agree with Becker that all our brains can be
mutually influenced by our mutual magnetic coupling to the earth.

Becker describes a guy who took some LSD and, probably having tried a
TENS, decided to enhance his trip by putting his head in a magnetic tape
d de-gausser. He said he freaked out and had to be taken to the hospital
8^) (ROTFLMAO)

There is a report of work Persinger did with LSD and mag fields.
Seems the subject could actually sense the fields as light.
I'm interested in doing weird combo expts like that.

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org