How to implement the bus?

[Vagant]

Hello All.

I am a beginner in VHDL and want to ask how to implement a bus.
The system which I want to design consists of host PC computer running
Windows XP, a digital system which I want to design in ISE WebPack
and implement on FPGA and a USB interface between the host and the
system.
The system consists of subcurcuits which have to communicate with host
via USB interface as I have already said. My question is how to
implement
a bus which will connect the subcurcuits? What kind of bus it should
be?
Is a tristate bus a proper choice for this?

Thank you.
If my question is too general please give me some idea how it can be
specialised.

 

[Ralf Hildebrandt]

Vagant schrieb:

My question is how to
implement
a bus which will connect the subcurcuits?

Is a tristate bus a proper choice for this?

A tristate bus is an option, that works. The advantage is, that you can
easily add components to the bus without changes in other components.
The disadvantage is, that tristate drivers are not always available
(especially not in all FPGAs) and if the bus becomes huge, which means
the load of the bus becomes huge, then it may be that your target does
not offer strong enough tristate drivers to drive the bus.

Another option would be a classic multiplexer. This means every
subcomponent drives its data output and a big multiplexer selects witch
one is to be read. This solution is not too bad even if it sounds "huge".

But I think a better solution is an OR- or AND-Bus. For an OR-Bus every
subcomponent drives the selected value if it is selected or the data
word zero if not. All outputs of all subcomponents then have to be ORed
together. The AND bus is similar. Both OR and AND bus scale very well
with the bus size (the synthesis tool can easily add buffers), are quite
fast and dissipate less power than a tristate bus or a big classic
multiplexer.

Ralf

 

[Mike Treseler]

Vagant wrote:

I am a beginner in VHDL and want to ask how to implement a bus.
The system which I want to design consists of host PC computer running
Windows XP, a digital system which I want to design in ISE WebPack
and implement on FPGA and a USB interface between the host and the
system.

I would work out the USB interface details first.
It could be an external chip, a purchased IP
or your own vhdl code. This decision will affect
your design entity interface. Connections
between internal processes is a smaller problem.

-- Mike Treseler

 

[Vagant]

On Oct 9, 5:52 pm, Mike Treseler <mike_trese...@comcast.net> wrote:

Vagant wrote:
I am a beginner in VHDL and want to ask how to implement a bus.
The system which I want to design consists of host PC computer running
Windows XP, a digital system which I want to design in ISE WebPack
and implement on FPGA and a USB interface between the host and the
system.

I would work out the USB interface details first.
It could be an external chip, a purchased IP
or your own vhdl code. This decision will affect
your design entity interface. Connections
between internal processes is a smaller problem.

-- Mike Treseler

Hi Mike,
I am going to use USB module called UM245R from FTDI. There is a user
mode driver (.dll) for this module and I believe that it makes working
of USB just transparent - data just go forth and back through it
without problems. Output
of the UM245R module looks like a parallel port (8 bidirectional data
lines).
By the way, I wonder how such output can be connected to my system
bus? As I know (from textbooks) there has to be adddress and command
lines as well, not
only data lines.

 

[Vagant]

On Oct 9, 4:13 pm, Ralf Hildebrandt <Ralf-Hildebra...@gmx.de> wrote:

Vagant schrieb:

My question is how to
implement
a bus which will connect the subcurcuits?
Is a tristate bus a proper choice for this?

A tristate bus is an option, that works. The advantage is, that you can
easily add components to the bus without changes in other components.
The disadvantage is, that tristate drivers are not always available
(especially not in all FPGAs) and if the bus becomes huge, which means
the load of the bus becomes huge, then it may be that your target does
not offer strong enough tristate drivers to drive the bus.

Another option would be a classic multiplexer. This means every
subcomponent drives its data output and a big multiplexer selects witch
one is to be read. This solution is not too bad even if it sounds "huge".

But I think a better solution is an OR- or AND-Bus. For an OR-Bus every
subcomponent drives the selected value if it is selected or the data
word zero if not. All outputs of all subcomponents then have to be ORed
together. The AND bus is similar. Both OR and AND bus scale very well
with the bus size (the synthesis tool can easily add buffers), are quite
fast and dissipate less power than a tristate bus or a big classic
multiplexer.

Ralf

Well, I never heard of OR- and AND- buses. I thought that only mux and
tri-state buses exists. Thanks for this! I actually start thinking
whether I should have bus at all. My system consists of pulse
programmer, digital receiver, few filters - that's all and it is
supposed to be controlled by host PC. Maybe it's better to connect all
of them directly as required and do not implement bus at all. Though,
in order to organise interface between host and system I have to use
some sort of circuitry which allows bidirectional dataflow. Any
suggestions, please!

 

[Brian Drummond]

On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 07:59:19 -0700, Vagant
<vladimir.v.korostelev@rambler.ru> wrote:

Hello All.

I am a beginner in VHDL and want to ask how to implement a bus.
The system which I want to design consists of host PC computer running
Windows XP, a digital system which I want to design in ISE WebPack
and implement on FPGA and a USB interface between the host and the
system.
The system consists of subcurcuits which have to communicate with host
via USB interface as I have already said. My question is how to
implement
a bus which will connect the subcurcuits? What kind of bus it should
be?
Is a tristate bus a proper choice for this?

It's probably the best choice between chips; e.g. your USB chip, the
FPGA, and possibly also external memory. (That is, it's the most
economical. But you can also keep connecting devices up to their own
FPGA pins until you run out of pins).

On-chip, between systems on the FPGA, other choices are better, such as
the "Or" bus described elsewhere.

An alternative, if you need to implement an embedded CPU on the FPGA,
would be the CPU's own bus, e.g. OPB for Microblaze, or PLB for the
Power PC in the Virtex-II Pro. These tend to be more complex, but have
extensive tool support such as EDK (not free). IMO the complexity is not
worthwhile unless you are using EDK or some such for system
development.

- Brian

 

[Mike Treseler]

Vagant wrote:

Hi Mike,
I am going to use USB module called UM245R from FTDI. There is a user
mode driver (.dll) for this module and I believe that it makes working
of USB just transparent - data just go forth and back through it
without problems. Output
of the UM245R module looks like a parallel port (8 bidirectional data
lines).

Your fpga probably reads or writes or read data from a fifo.

By the way, I wonder how such output can be connected to my system
bus? As I know (from textbooks) there has to be adddress and command
lines as well, not
only data lines.

Unless you have more than one USB port,
this an external interface, not a bus.
These are ports on your top design entity.

See the data sheet or app notes for details.
I would assume you would drive data to
write to the interface and drive 'Z'
to read using control bits from the chip
and from the fpga to handshake somehow.

Good luck.

-- Mike Treseler

 

[Ralf Hildebrandt]

Vagant schrieb:

My system consists of pulse
programmer, digital receiver, few filters - that's all

Don't think of specific components. It does not matter what are these
components for. You just have some components, that have to be connected.

and it is
supposed to be controlled by host PC.

That are two problems: (1) the connection of the internal components and
(2) the connection between a component and a host PC.

Maybe it's better to connect all
of them directly as required and do not implement bus at all.

No, because then you need dedicated communication capabilities (for
communication to the host) for each component.

Communication to a host is one problem and it is not too simple.

Though,
in order to organise interface between host and system I have to use
some sort of circuitry which allows bidirectional dataflow. Any
suggestions, please!

RS232? USB?
This strongly depends on the amount of data to be transferred and the
available application at the host for data exchange. The host software
is another bigger problem.

The type of the internal bus is the most simple problem.

Ralf