hot spot on moon...

[John Larkin]

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!

https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
<b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!

https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 08 Jul 2023 14:56:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:



When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!

https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

Yes, in a vacuum and looking out into deep space, it doesn\'t take a
lot of power density to make that sort of temp rise at night. Still,
10c is impressive for radioactive decay.

Detecting that temp by passive microwave measurement is also
impressive.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Sunday, July 9, 2023 at 12:56:23 AM UTC+10, Jan Panteltje wrote:
> On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in <b1tiai1kqmdfntar4...@4ax.com>:

<snip>

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer than the rest but have not measured it.

As the article says \" granite possesses significant concentrations of uranium, thorium, and other radioactive elements\"
and claim that this is what is generating the heat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granite

says it can contain up to about. 20 ppm of uraninium, which isn\'t much. It also says \" Potassium-40 is a radioactive isotope of weak emission, and a constituent of alkali feldspar, which in turn is a common component of granitic rocks\". Potassium-40 is the radioactive isotope we tend to run into.
How much heat it generates isn\'t spelled out.

The 20 km lump of granite on the moon is a lot more massive than a bench top and generates a lot more heat. Because it is massive the heat has to travel a lot further before it can radiate away into space, so the core of the lump is going to be a lot warmer than the inner-most layers of your bench-top.

There some suggestion that there\'s enough U-238 in some granite bench tops to generate dangerous amounts of radon, and that might be worth worrying about.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Martin Brown]

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!

https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/

I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

--
Martin Brown

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
<\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

 

[Martin Brown]

On 09/07/2023 06:40, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.

Granite is pretty good for both having uranium in it and being
sufficiently porous that radon can escape. The funny thing about uranium
is not that it is rare it is remarkably common with on average about
2ppm in almost every crustal rock.

Mineable deposits of worthwhile uranium ore are very rare though.

It takes peculiar conditions to concentrate it and at least one ore body
formed early enough back when U235 was more common and in a way that
allowed it to become a natural light water uranium reactor.

https://www.iaea.org/newscenter/news/meet-oklo-the-earths-two-billion-year-old-only-known-natural-nuclear-reactor

ISTR Edinburgh and the New York subway station are both too radioactive
to be nuclear power stations due to their high granite content.

https://piccolanewyorker.com/blog/2018/9/24/grand-central-station-is-more-radioactive-than-a-power-plant


--
Martin Brown

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2023-07-08 13:17, Martin Brown wrote:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!

https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/



I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

Well, that putative granite batholith has been sitting still there for
5.f billion years. Not exactly riveting TV.

No ir sais:
   The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
  and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was
revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
  https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

Was that the one in Sudbury?

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Bananas are hot.

Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, July 10, 2023 at 12:55:46 PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <al...@comet.invalid wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown <\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1...@dont-email.me>:
On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in <b1tiai1kqmdfntar4...@4ax.com>:

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Bananas are hot.

Potassium-40.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potassium-40

> Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

Such a surprise.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Sun, 09 Jul 2023 19:55:34 -0700) it happened John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote in
<aismaipm131ca3sedvf4bht7g88ut78a3l@4ax.com>:

On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!



https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its
surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Bananas are hot.

Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

Yes,
I have some thorium based welding rods, those give some increased readings on the Geiger counter
https://www.gammaspectacular.com/blue/th232-spectrum

also have some Uranium ore etc..
https://panteltje.nl/panteltje/pic/sc_pic/
https://panteltje.nl/panteltje/pic/sc_pic/PMT_with_radium_in_bag_img_2482.jpg

I have a banana almost every other day these days...

There is so much radiation fear probably also because of the US induced bomb fear commercials.
I would be more worried about the Tritium put into the oceans now by the Fuckupshima
waste release they are planning, if you eat a lot of fish..


Sure we have evolved as species in an environment with much higher radiation...
DNA repair mechanisms are build into us.

Some radiation level may actually be beneficial
I always remember that interview with a guy close to that Tjernobyl area
He had the head of some reindeer he shot that was highly radioactive hanging on the wall.
He was sitting right under it,.
Reporter asked: \'Are you not afraid to sit under that thing that radiates so much?\"
He replied: \"It is good for your cancer\'.

All is relative now ain\'t it

I worked at a linear accelerator site in Amsterdam, via some agency once.
First job was calibrating some radiation counters.
I asked: \'With what shall I calibrate this?\"
Reply was: \'Oh there in the window are a several radiation sources\'.
I looked, left and quit the job the same day, looked careless to me, I had radiation fear.
Years later agency put me there again, in an other department.
OK, horror stories what happened to the guy before me..
but I had lost much of that radiation fear by then..
Then I got a other job and started my own company..
A few years later I did read in the paper that whole place got contaminated.
Careless they were, left just in time!

So, there but for fortune go you and I.

As to that hot spot on the moon, could it not be volcanism?
Sort of a hot water spring or hot water trying to come to the surface?
Interesting program on German TV last night about how gold is formed in the US
from gold found in lines along the Californian coast to it being spit out of geysers, to dissolved in stones...
Had to leave and do something so recorded the second part of it, still have to watch the end.
Very interesting..

 

[Martin Brown]

On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

> Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

If you want *really* active then a radium clock hand off a WWII era
watch or Smith\'s instruments aviation dial is impossible to beat. My
dad\'s old radium dial watch was hot enough to set off radiation alarms
on the way into a nuclear site - presumably from its beta emission.

Ideal radiation source if you want to build your own cloud chamber.

I have a few high grade uranium glass ornaments it is a fabulous shade
of deep yellow with a green UV fluorescence and I have touched a piece
of Trinitite (aka Almorgardo glass) from ground zero of the first A-bomb
- someone at the VLA had a chunk of it on their desk. They got it not
long after the event when it was apparently being made into jewellery!

The colour in it was mostly from iron impurities in the almost white
silica sand - it\'s not called White Sands missile base for nothing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinitite#Cultural_impact

--
Martin Brown

 

[Martin Brown]

On 10/07/2023 02:08, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 2023-07-08 13:17, Martin Brown wrote:

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of
the rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

Was that the one in Sudbury?

No. The UK\'s deepest mine which is for potash at Boulby. It was still
potash when I went down - but now it is for polyhalite. I guess the
thicker higher grade nearly pure potash seams have run out now.

I misremembered Wiki says the Dark Matter lab is at 1.1km deep (mine
itself goes deeper). There are two clean rooms (tiny) changing rooms
down there nested one inside the other airlock style to access it.

Difficult to have a clean room in a dusty working mine environment where
literally everything is coated in fine white salty dust. You can taste
the salt in the air all the time (and for a day or so afterwards).

There is also an exobiology group looking at incredibly slow metabolic
rates of extremophile microbes that live in those rocks (and another
study to see if being heavily shielded from natural radiation for 8
hours a day affects the workers). Hints are apparently that it is a very
slight risk factor (about on a par with working night shifts).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boulby_Mine

They have quite a fun collection of beautiful and rare geological
specimens found on the edges of the mineral seams too.

Going down in the lift is an interesting experience as it accelerates at
near to free fall to reach peak speed and especially when the other one
is coming up at the same high speed goes past.

--
Martin Brown

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Mon, 10 Jul 2023 10:07:16 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
<\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8gho6$2g7es$1@dont-email.me>:

On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!



https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its
surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:

https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

If you want *really* active then a radium clock hand off a WWII era
watch or Smith\'s instruments aviation dial is impossible to beat. My
dad\'s old radium dial watch was hot enough to set off radiation alarms
on the way into a nuclear site - presumably from its beta emission.

Yes I have some radium clock hands...

My uncle had 2 jewel shops, did watch repair and also sold watches.
At one point they had to hand over all watches and clocks with radium hands, outlawed here now.
But then I remember light switches that lit up in the dark etc..
I once found Uranium glass tableware in the attic in a big box at my parents house.
Seems I ate and drank from it as a kid until somebody told my mother it was dangerous.
That does explain a few things!

The watch hands came from ebay...
https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_nkw=radium+watch+hand&Brand
You Can Have Anything You Want in Ebay land ...

I also have a scintillation screen to test things...
am still a member of the gamma spectrometry group, not active though,
may change if the nukes fall, or when / if that nuclear power plant in Ukraine is hit,
but then likely no internet, so get your stuff NOW.
https://groups.io/g/GammaSpectrometryGroup

Have a nice gamma spectrometer I designed and build here sitting next to me on the table
https://panteltje.nl/pub/gamma_spectrometer_plus_probe_plus_geiger_counter_2_IMG_4185.JPG
the green cardboard tube holds a PMT and a plastic scintillation crystal.

Ideal radiation source if you want to build your own cloud chamber.

I have a few high grade uranium glass ornaments it is a fabulous shade
of deep yellow with a green UV fluorescence and I have touched a piece
of Trinitite (aka Almorgardo glass) from ground zero of the first A-bomb
- someone at the VLA had a chunk of it on their desk. They got it not
long after the event when it was apparently being made into jewellery!

The colour in it was mostly from iron impurities in the almost white
silica sand - it\'s not called White Sands missile base for nothing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinitite#Cultural_impact

--
Martin Brown

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2023-07-10 05:07, Martin Brown wrote:

On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John
Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/



I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the
moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
    The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich
craters,
   and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located
was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
   terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
   https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more
of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm


I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite
after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted
about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average
radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif

Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

Nah, \"Lite Salt\" is the champ.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2023-07-10 05:31, Martin Brown wrote:

On 10/07/2023 02:08, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2023-07-08 13:17, Martin Brown wrote:

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of
the rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

Was that the one in Sudbury?

No. The UK\'s deepest mine which is for potash at Boulby. It was still
potash when I went down - but now it is for polyhalite. I guess the
thicker higher grade nearly pure potash seams have run out now.

I misremembered Wiki says the Dark Matter lab is at 1.1km deep (mine
itself goes deeper). There are two clean rooms (tiny) changing rooms
down there nested one inside the other airlock style to access it.

Difficult to have a clean room in a dusty working mine environment where
literally everything is coated in fine white salty dust. You can taste
the salt in the air all the time (and for a day or so afterwards).

There is also an exobiology group looking at incredibly slow metabolic
rates of extremophile microbes that live in those rocks (and another
study to see if being heavily shielded from natural radiation for 8
hours a day affects the workers). Hints are apparently that it is a very
slight risk factor (about on a par with working night shifts).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boulby_Mine

They have quite a fun collection of beautiful and rare geological
specimens found on the edges of the mineral seams too.

Going down in the lift is an interesting experience as it accelerates at
near to free fall to reach peak speed and especially when the other one
is coming up at the same high speed goes past.

Yeah, those mine elevators. I remember going down a very deep mine, the
Con, up near Yellowknife, NWT, back when I was twelve. (It was
Cominco\'s only gold mine at the time--my Dad took me with him on a tour
of the northern operations.) The mine was about 1800 m deep, but I
don\'t know how deep the stopes that I visited were. Probably at least
1500 m.

Above ground, I got to hold a 30-lb gold ingot (80% Au, 20% Ag)--the
mine manager joked that if I could get it to the mine gate, I could keep
it, so of course I set off at a trot.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 10 Jul 2023 10:07:16 +0100, Martin Brown
<\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/


I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich craters,
and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm

I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif
Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

Really active are old thorium-impregnated Coleman lantern mantles.

If you want *really* active then a radium clock hand off a WWII era
watch or Smith\'s instruments aviation dial is impossible to beat. My
dad\'s old radium dial watch was hot enough to set off radiation alarms
on the way into a nuclear site - presumably from its beta emission.

I made it to the National Science Fair with my project \"Scintillation
Detection of Alpha Radiation\", which was just a spec of stuff scraped
off an old clock, in a piece of pipe with a PMT. I hung out in
Baltimore with Amory Lovins.

Most cool are the betalight tent zipper pull things. I put them on
bedposts so we don\'t whack them in the dark. Up here in the mountains
it gets very dark.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s3kc839d485d0gc/Tritium.jpg?raw=1

Ideal radiation source if you want to build your own cloud chamber.

I have a few high grade uranium glass ornaments it is a fabulous shade
of deep yellow with a green UV fluorescence and I have touched a piece
of Trinitite (aka Almorgardo glass) from ground zero of the first A-bomb
- someone at the VLA had a chunk of it on their desk. They got it not
long after the event when it was apparently being made into jewellery!

The colour in it was mostly from iron impurities in the almost white
silica sand - it\'s not called White Sands missile base for nothing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinitite#Cultural_impact

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 10 Jul 2023 10:49:36 -0400, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2023-07-10 05:07, Martin Brown wrote:
On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John
Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/



I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the
moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
    The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich
craters,
   and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located
was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
   terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
   https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more
of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm


I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite
after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted
about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average
radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif

Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

Nah, \"Lite Salt\" is the champ.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Lots of surface area per gram.

 

[Jasen Betts]

On 2023-07-10, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2023-07-10 05:07, Martin Brown wrote:
On 10/07/2023 03:55, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jul 2023 05:40:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 8 Jul 2023 18:17:28 +0100) it happened Martin Brown
\'\'\'newspam\'\'\'@nonad.co.uk> wrote in <u8c5n9$1q2si$1@dont-email.me>:

On 08/07/2023 15:56, Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Jul 2023 07:36:56 -0700) it happened John
Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
b1tiai1kqmdfntar4nnttt2au8ddb1h649@4ax.com>:

When I saw the headline, I was expecting millikelvins or some such.
But this is 10 deg C!


https://thedebrief.org/buried-on-the-far-side-of-the-moon-the-detection-of-a-mysterious-heat-emitting-object-leads-to-an-unexpected-discovery/



I think it has come as a surprise to everybody. Wisdom was that the
moon
was a long since dead planet and geologically inactive.

No ir sais:
    The formation is located between the Compton and Belkovich
craters,
   and the area where the granite mass is believed to be located
was revealed to be close to 10 C warmer than its surrounding
   terrain.

So \'10 C warmer than\' is still very cold there.

But it is quite a bit different from local equilibrium.

I\'m a bit surprised that there was enough vulcanism to allow a slab of
granite to be that close to the lunar surface. The lunar dust should be
a fairly good insulator so it may be quite a useful power source.

The moon has almost bimodal temperatures depending on whether it is
under the noon day sun (about 120C) or in the pitch dark of night
(-130C). I suspect it is +10C relative to the latter low temp.

A lunar day is about 28 Earth days long so heat builds up.

I once had a granite kitchen counter top
   https://www.epa.gov/radiation/granite-countertops-and-radiation
never noticed it was warmer thanthe rest but have not measured it.

You need a *very* big slab of it for the self heating to be noticeable.

Deep mines are a pretty weird environment. The one I went down to see
the dark matter rig at about 1.2km depth the ambient temperature of the
rick walls was ~35C which makes physical exertion quite difficult.

U235 has a short enough half life that way back there was a lot more
of it.

There are several places on earth that are hot with Uranium:
https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geology/hot-not-what-makes-some-places-naturally-high-radioactivity.htm


I vagually remember testing my geiger counter on that kitchen granite
after
reading about it containing radioactive stuff, maybe even posted
about that,
but was not enough to trigger alarms.
I have moved twice since then, when I moved here the average
radiation went up a bit
https://panteltje.nl/pub/background_radiation_from_one_place_to_the_other.gif

Geiger counter is running 24/7 and logging.

I had a friend who lived in Opelousas La (don\'t go there) and he had a
geiger counter and we walked all over town probing things. The US Post
Office was very hot from the red bricks, maybe colored with uranium.

Uranium is an impurity in most crustal rocks at the 2ppm level. You have
to be in a very special place for an ore body to form or on granite for
it to be a bit of a problem (with radon gas entering homes).

Bananas are hot.

Bananas, Brazil nuts and instant coffee are about the most radioactive
things sold to the public to eat. Wall plaster is another.

Nah, \"Lite Salt\" is the champ.

For most radioactive in the supermarket \"NoSalt\" beats it. it\'s moslty
potassium chloride, while Lite Salt is only about 50%

--
Jasen.
🇺🇦 Слава Україні