Help with crazy motor project please

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty
good shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two
drive options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or
overhead shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the
second option was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead
sheave mounted on a short section of shafting and with a couple of
bearings mounted in blocks. The lathe is in pretty good shape and I
want to get it running so customers can see how it was done a century
ago (actually I just want to show off). So I have been looking for a
motor to drive the overhead shafting. The motor has to be made before
1906 because that is the latest date the lathe could have been made.
Every time I find a motor that is old enough, is powerful enough
(about half a HP), and runs well enough the price is way too high. For
me. Cosmetics are important too. The motor needs to look right to me.
I did find a Century (aptly named) motor that the seller swore worked
but just sparked a little. After getting it home I realized that there
are no windings in the stator. Oops. So I get this crazy idea in my
head. I like pancake motors and would really like to have one to drive
the overhead shaft. So I am thinking that I could get some cloth
covered magnet wire and wind me up a multi-pole squirrel cage
induction motor. One that looks like an old overhead fan motor. I
could use mild steel sheet for the laminations, which would work
almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used today in motors.
I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century motor by taking a
picture and using the picture to make a tool path for the CNC mill. I
can easily modify the picture so that the end bells match the size of
my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on the mill and
lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the poles. I would
like to have either a three or four speed motor, which can be done
depending on how the windings are connected together, which I don't
know. I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know
this home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is
not economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none
of that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money
with the motor project. Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

 

[amdx]

On 1/11/2016 8:39 PM, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty
good shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two
drive options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or
overhead shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the
second option was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead
sheave mounted on a short section of shafting and with a couple of
bearings mounted in blocks. The lathe is in pretty good shape and I
want to get it running so customers can see how it was done a century
ago (actually I just want to show off). So I have been looking for a
motor to drive the overhead shafting. The motor has to be made before
1906 because that is the latest date the lathe could have been made.
Every time I find a motor that is old enough, is powerful enough
(about half a HP), and runs well enough the price is way too high. For
me. Cosmetics are important too. The motor needs to look right to me.
I did find a Century (aptly named) motor that the seller swore worked
but just sparked a little. After getting it home I realized that there
are no windings in the stator. Oops. So I get this crazy idea in my
head. I like pancake motors and would really like to have one to drive
the overhead shaft. So I am thinking that I could get some cloth
covered magnet wire and wind me up a multi-pole squirrel cage
induction motor. One that looks like an old overhead fan motor. I
could use mild steel sheet for the laminations, which would work
almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used today in motors.
I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century motor by taking a
picture and using the picture to make a tool path for the CNC mill. I
can easily modify the picture so that the end bells match the size of
my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on the mill and
lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the poles. I would
like to have either a three or four speed motor, which can be done
depending on how the windings are connected together, which I don't
know. I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know
this home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is
not economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none
of that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money
with the motor project. Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

See if anyone on rec.crafts.metalworking has a motor that works for you.
Mikek

 

[George Herold]

On Monday, January 11, 2016 at 9:36:48 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty
good shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two
drive options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or
overhead shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the
second option was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead
sheave mounted on a short section of shafting and with a couple of
bearings mounted in blocks. The lathe is in pretty good shape and I
want to get it running so customers can see how it was done a century
ago (actually I just want to show off). So I have been looking for a
motor to drive the overhead shafting. The motor has to be made before
1906 because that is the latest date the lathe could have been made.
Every time I find a motor that is old enough, is powerful enough
(about half a HP), and runs well enough the price is way too high. For
me. Cosmetics are important too. The motor needs to look right to me.
I did find a Century (aptly named) motor that the seller swore worked
but just sparked a little. After getting it home I realized that there
are no windings in the stator. Oops. So I get this crazy idea in my
head. I like pancake motors and would really like to have one to drive
the overhead shaft. So I am thinking that I could get some cloth
covered magnet wire and wind me up a multi-pole squirrel cage
induction motor. One that looks like an old overhead fan motor. I
could use mild steel sheet for the laminations, which would work
almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used today in motors.
I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century motor by taking a
picture and using the picture to make a tool path for the CNC mill. I
can easily modify the picture so that the end bells match the size of
my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on the mill and
lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the poles. I would
like to have either a three or four speed motor, which can be done
depending on how the windings are connected together, which I don't
know. I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know
this home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is
not economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none
of that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money
with the motor project. Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Wow... sounds like a big project for only a small gain.
(I know nothing about how motors are wound.)
As I read I was thinking about buying one of your old motors,
gutting it, and finding a modern motor that would fit inside
the old housing. Yup, you'd know what was in there, but
you wouldn't have to tell your visitors/customers.

I've got an old GE motor that might be of the right era,
but it's only 1/4 HP... and it is in the barn with a grinding
wheel attached... Could you put a few 1/4 HP motors in parallel?

Hmm looking online I'd guess my motor is no older than the 1920's.

Maybe it would be easier to rebuild one of the old motors?

George H.

 

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 21:11:01 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

On 1/11/2016 8:39 PM, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:
Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty
good shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two
drive options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or
overhead shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the
second option was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead
sheave mounted on a short section of shafting and with a couple of
bearings mounted in blocks. The lathe is in pretty good shape and I
want to get it running so customers can see how it was done a century
ago (actually I just want to show off). So I have been looking for a
motor to drive the overhead shafting. The motor has to be made before
1906 because that is the latest date the lathe could have been made.
Every time I find a motor that is old enough, is powerful enough
(about half a HP), and runs well enough the price is way too high. For
me. Cosmetics are important too. The motor needs to look right to me.
I did find a Century (aptly named) motor that the seller swore worked
but just sparked a little. After getting it home I realized that there
are no windings in the stator. Oops. So I get this crazy idea in my
head. I like pancake motors and would really like to have one to drive
the overhead shaft. So I am thinking that I could get some cloth
covered magnet wire and wind me up a multi-pole squirrel cage
induction motor. One that looks like an old overhead fan motor. I
could use mild steel sheet for the laminations, which would work
almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used today in motors.
I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century motor by taking a
picture and using the picture to make a tool path for the CNC mill. I
can easily modify the picture so that the end bells match the size of
my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on the mill and
lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the poles. I would
like to have either a three or four speed motor, which can be done
depending on how the windings are connected together, which I don't
know. I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know
this home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is
not economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none
of that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money
with the motor project. Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

See if anyone on rec.crafts.metalworking has a motor that works for you.
Mikek

I tried that. And the Seattle Metalheads too. I have been looking for
over a year for this motor.

Eric

 

On Tue, 12 Jan 2016 08:57:07 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<gherold@teachspin.com> wrote:

On Monday, January 11, 2016 at 9:36:48 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:
Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty
good shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two
drive options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or
overhead shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the
second option was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead
sheave mounted on a short section of shafting and with a couple of
bearings mounted in blocks. The lathe is in pretty good shape and I
want to get it running so customers can see how it was done a century
ago (actually I just want to show off). So I have been looking for a
motor to drive the overhead shafting. The motor has to be made before
1906 because that is the latest date the lathe could have been made.
Every time I find a motor that is old enough, is powerful enough
(about half a HP), and runs well enough the price is way too high. For
me. Cosmetics are important too. The motor needs to look right to me.
I did find a Century (aptly named) motor that the seller swore worked
but just sparked a little. After getting it home I realized that there
are no windings in the stator. Oops. So I get this crazy idea in my
head. I like pancake motors and would really like to have one to drive
the overhead shaft. So I am thinking that I could get some cloth
covered magnet wire and wind me up a multi-pole squirrel cage
induction motor. One that looks like an old overhead fan motor. I
could use mild steel sheet for the laminations, which would work
almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used today in motors.
I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century motor by taking a
picture and using the picture to make a tool path for the CNC mill. I
can easily modify the picture so that the end bells match the size of
my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on the mill and
lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the poles. I would
like to have either a three or four speed motor, which can be done
depending on how the windings are connected together, which I don't
know. I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know
this home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is
not economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none
of that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money
with the motor project. Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Wow... sounds like a big project for only a small gain.
(I know nothing about how motors are wound.)
As I read I was thinking about buying one of your old motors,
gutting it, and finding a modern motor that would fit inside
the old housing. Yup, you'd know what was in there, but
you wouldn't have to tell your visitors/customers.

I've got an old GE motor that might be of the right era,
but it's only 1/4 HP... and it is in the barn with a grinding
wheel attached... Could you put a few 1/4 HP motors in parallel?

Hmm looking online I'd guess my motor is no older than the 1920's.

Maybe it would be easier to rebuild one of the old motors?

George H.

I thought about rewinding the Century motor as it is old enough. I may
do that. But I also like the idea of making my own. Partly because 100
years ago it would be an option because in 1906 electric motors were
really spendy. People could and did make their own motors. I have seen
more than one photo of motors said to have been home made, and some
were obviously so.
Eric

 

[Tim Wescott]

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 18:39:02 -0800, etpm wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty good
shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two drive
options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or overhead
shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the second option
was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead sheave mounted on a
short section of shafting and with a couple of bearings mounted in
blocks.

The lathe is in pretty good shape and I want to get it running
so customers can see how it was done a century ago (actually I just want
to show off).

So I have been looking for a motor to drive the overhead
shafting. The motor has to be made before 1906 because that is the
latest date the lathe could have been made.

Every time I find a motor
that is old enough, is powerful enough (about half a HP), and runs well
enough the price is way too high. For me.

Cosmetics are important too.
The motor needs to look right to me.

I did find a Century (aptly named)
motor that the seller swore worked but just sparked a little. After
getting it home I realized that there are no windings in the stator.
Oops.

So I get this crazy idea in my head. I like pancake motors and
would really like to have one to drive the overhead shaft. So I am
thinking that I could get some cloth covered magnet wire and wind me up
a multi-pole squirrel cage induction motor. One that looks like an old
overhead fan motor. I could use mild steel sheet for the laminations,
which would work almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used
today in motors. I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century
motor by taking a picture and using the picture to make a tool path for
the CNC mill. I can easily modify the picture so that the end bells
match the size of my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on
the mill and lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the
poles. I would like to have either a three or four speed motor, which
can be done depending on how the windings are connected together, which
I don't know.

I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of
theory and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a
little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know this
home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is not
economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none of
that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money with the
motor project.

Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Do you need a good shrink?

Why not rewind the Century? It should be loads easier than building a
motor from scratch.

Personally I think I'd take George's suggestion and either mount a motor
inside the Century, or behind it inside a cabinet where it won't show.
But then, I don't have a month's worth of free time to spend messing with
motors.

Alternatively, if such things as motor rewinding places still exist, take
the Century to one and see if they can do anything for you.

--
www.wescottdesign.com

 

[default]

On Tue, 12 Jan 2016 14:57:57 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com>
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 18:39:02 -0800, etpm wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty good
shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two drive
options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or overhead
shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the second option
was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead sheave mounted on a
short section of shafting and with a couple of bearings mounted in
blocks.

The lathe is in pretty good shape and I want to get it running
so customers can see how it was done a century ago (actually I just want
to show off).

So I have been looking for a motor to drive the overhead
shafting. The motor has to be made before 1906 because that is the
latest date the lathe could have been made.

Every time I find a motor
that is old enough, is powerful enough (about half a HP), and runs well
enough the price is way too high. For me.

Cosmetics are important too.
The motor needs to look right to me.

I did find a Century (aptly named)
motor that the seller swore worked but just sparked a little. After
getting it home I realized that there are no windings in the stator.
Oops.

So I get this crazy idea in my head. I like pancake motors and
would really like to have one to drive the overhead shaft. So I am
thinking that I could get some cloth covered magnet wire and wind me up
a multi-pole squirrel cage induction motor. One that looks like an old
overhead fan motor. I could use mild steel sheet for the laminations,
which would work almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used
today in motors. I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century
motor by taking a picture and using the picture to make a tool path for
the CNC mill. I can easily modify the picture so that the end bells
match the size of my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on
the mill and lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the
poles. I would like to have either a three or four speed motor, which
can be done depending on how the windings are connected together, which
I don't know.

I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of
theory and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a
little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know this
home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is not
economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none of
that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money with the
motor project.

Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Do you need a good shrink?

Why not rewind the Century? It should be loads easier than building a
motor from scratch.

Personally I think I'd take George's suggestion and either mount a motor
inside the Century, or behind it inside a cabinet where it won't show.
But then, I don't have a month's worth of free time to spend messing with
motors.

Alternatively, if such things as motor rewinding places still exist, take
the Century to one and see if they can do anything for you.

Motor rewinding places do still exist and they do service the old time
motors. I go to one when I need magnet wire for speaker cross-overs,
they sell it for near scrap prices since they don't fool with remnants
(and their idea of a remnant is usually enough for several speaker
inductors)

In Wilmington NC, on the Cape Fear River, there's even an old machine
shop that dates back to the age of steam. The owner maintains a small
steam gen. to blow a whistle at noon... All overhead shafting with
blocks supported by hewn timbers, for the huge lathes broaches and
milling machines. A big old electric motor runs it these days,
although they have converted some of the smaller machines to
independent electric drive. The overhead shafts only run when they
need the truly gargantuan lathes and broaches.

 

[Terminal Crazy]

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
<etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:

I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch

--
Terminal_Crazy

Mitch - 1995 Z28 LT1 M6 terminal_crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk
Lancashire England http://www.sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk/terminal_crazy/

 

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 08:09:32 -0500, default <default@defaulter.net>
wrote:

On Tue, 12 Jan 2016 14:57:57 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 18:39:02 -0800, etpm wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty good
shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two drive
options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or overhead
shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the second option
was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead sheave mounted on a
short section of shafting and with a couple of bearings mounted in
blocks.

The lathe is in pretty good shape and I want to get it running
so customers can see how it was done a century ago (actually I just want
to show off).

So I have been looking for a motor to drive the overhead
shafting. The motor has to be made before 1906 because that is the
latest date the lathe could have been made.

Every time I find a motor
that is old enough, is powerful enough (about half a HP), and runs well
enough the price is way too high. For me.

Cosmetics are important too.
The motor needs to look right to me.

I did find a Century (aptly named)
motor that the seller swore worked but just sparked a little. After
getting it home I realized that there are no windings in the stator.
Oops.

So I get this crazy idea in my head. I like pancake motors and
would really like to have one to drive the overhead shaft. So I am
thinking that I could get some cloth covered magnet wire and wind me up
a multi-pole squirrel cage induction motor. One that looks like an old
overhead fan motor. I could use mild steel sheet for the laminations,
which would work almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used
today in motors. I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century
motor by taking a picture and using the picture to make a tool path for
the CNC mill. I can easily modify the picture so that the end bells
match the size of my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on
the mill and lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the
poles. I would like to have either a three or four speed motor, which
can be done depending on how the windings are connected together, which
I don't know.

I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of
theory and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a
little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know this
home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is not
economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none of
that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money with the
motor project.

Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Do you need a good shrink?

Why not rewind the Century? It should be loads easier than building a
motor from scratch.

Personally I think I'd take George's suggestion and either mount a motor
inside the Century, or behind it inside a cabinet where it won't show.
But then, I don't have a month's worth of free time to spend messing with
motors.

Alternatively, if such things as motor rewinding places still exist, take
the Century to one and see if they can do anything for you.

Motor rewinding places do still exist and they do service the old time
motors. I go to one when I need magnet wire for speaker cross-overs,
they sell it for near scrap prices since they don't fool with remnants
(and their idea of a remnant is usually enough for several speaker
inductors)

In Wilmington NC, on the Cape Fear River, there's even an old machine
shop that dates back to the age of steam. The owner maintains a small
steam gen. to blow a whistle at noon... All overhead shafting with
blocks supported by hewn timbers, for the huge lathes broaches and
milling machines. A big old electric motor runs it these days,
although they have converted some of the smaller machines to
independent electric drive. The overhead shafts only run when they
need the truly gargantuan lathes and broaches.

I appreciate the suggestions but I did say the project was crazy. I
have it in my head to build my own pancake style induction motor. So I
am looking for any books or sites or somebody who has done something
silmilar. Or I could break down and see if my oldd century motor is
worth rewinding. Or even if I can rewind it myself. Has anyone done
that? If I was looking for the most simple method I would just buy an
expensive old motor and be done with it. I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

 

[Rheilly Phoull]

On 14/01/2016 6:31 AM, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 08:09:32 -0500, default <default@defaulter.net
wrote:

On Tue, 12 Jan 2016 14:57:57 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 18:39:02 -0800, etpm wrote:

Greetings All,
I am a machinist and in my office is an old lathe that is in pretty good
shape. When new, about 110 years ago, it was offered with two drive
options. Either a treadle, similar to a sewing machine, or overhead
shaft drive. Mine came with the second option. When the second option
was chosen the lathe was shipped with the overhead sheave mounted on a
short section of shafting and with a couple of bearings mounted in
blocks.

The lathe is in pretty good shape and I want to get it running
so customers can see how it was done a century ago (actually I just want
to show off).

So I have been looking for a motor to drive the overhead
shafting. The motor has to be made before 1906 because that is the
latest date the lathe could have been made.

Every time I find a motor
that is old enough, is powerful enough (about half a HP), and runs well
enough the price is way too high. For me.

Cosmetics are important too.
The motor needs to look right to me.

I did find a Century (aptly named)
motor that the seller swore worked but just sparked a little. After
getting it home I realized that there are no windings in the stator.
Oops.

So I get this crazy idea in my head. I like pancake motors and
would really like to have one to drive the overhead shaft. So I am
thinking that I could get some cloth covered magnet wire and wind me up
a multi-pole squirrel cage induction motor. One that looks like an old
overhead fan motor. I could use mild steel sheet for the laminations,
which would work almost as well as the more modern silicon steel used
today in motors. I can copy the beautiful end bells of my old Century
motor by taking a picture and using the picture to make a tool path for
the CNC mill. I can easily modify the picture so that the end bells
match the size of my custom motor. I can make the rotor easily enough on
the mill and lathe. But I don't know how to go about winding all the
poles. I would like to have either a three or four speed motor, which
can be done depending on how the windings are connected together, which
I don't know.

I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of
theory and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a
little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor. I know this
home made antique looking motor will take a lot of time and is not
economical if I look at just my time. But this is for fun so none of
that matters in the same way it would if I needed to make money with the
motor project.

Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Eric

Do you need a good shrink?

Why not rewind the Century? It should be loads easier than building a
motor from scratch.

Personally I think I'd take George's suggestion and either mount a motor
inside the Century, or behind it inside a cabinet where it won't show.
But then, I don't have a month's worth of free time to spend messing with
motors.

Alternatively, if such things as motor rewinding places still exist, take
the Century to one and see if they can do anything for you.

Motor rewinding places do still exist and they do service the old time
motors. I go to one when I need magnet wire for speaker cross-overs,
they sell it for near scrap prices since they don't fool with remnants
(and their idea of a remnant is usually enough for several speaker
inductors)

In Wilmington NC, on the Cape Fear River, there's even an old machine
shop that dates back to the age of steam. The owner maintains a small
steam gen. to blow a whistle at noon... All overhead shafting with
blocks supported by hewn timbers, for the huge lathes broaches and
milling machines. A big old electric motor runs it these days,
although they have converted some of the smaller machines to
independent electric drive. The overhead shafts only run when they
need the truly gargantuan lathes and broaches.
I appreciate the suggestions but I did say the project was crazy. I
have it in my head to build my own pancake style induction motor. So I
am looking for any books or sites or somebody who has done something
silmilar. Or I could break down and see if my oldd century motor is
worth rewinding. Or even if I can rewind it myself. Has anyone done
that? If I was looking for the most simple method I would just buy an
expensive old motor and be done with it. I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

My father had a Drummond circular bed lathe which he rigged up with a
foot pedal arrangement. He made the large pulley from wood sections
glued and bolted the turned, the biggest problem might be finding a
lathe with the swing needed to turn it . He also added lead weights for
counter balance.

 

etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor.

I don't know if it will help, but I have a paper copy of a book by
Alexander Gray, "Electrical Machine Design". It is the second edition,
from 1926 - Google has a scan of the original 1913 edition:

https://books.google.com/books?id=1ibOAAAAMAAJ

If nothing else, it's from just a little after the time period you are
interested in, so you'd be working with mostly the same knowledge that
was available back then. Maybe it will help you figure out how to
rewind the Century motor.

Matt Roberds

 

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
<Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch

I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount
the pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis
horizontal and a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use
the mill like a vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

 

On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 07:30:46 -0000 (UTC), mroberds@att.net wrote:

etpm@whidbey.com wrote:
I have looked in the books I have but there is lots of theory
and I would love to find a book that holds my hand, at least a little,
when it comes to the practical aspects of building a motor.

I don't know if it will help, but I have a paper copy of a book by
Alexander Gray, "Electrical Machine Design". It is the second edition,
from 1926 - Google has a scan of the original 1913 edition:

https://books.google.com/books?id=1ibOAAAAMAAJ

If nothing else, it's from just a little after the time period you are
interested in, so you'd be working with mostly the same knowledge that
was available back then. Maybe it will help you figure out how to
rewind the Century motor.

Matt Roberds

Thanks Matt. The motor in question appears to be a replusion start
motor so besides the missing windings there may be other things to
look for that would be in that book. I'll take a look.
Eric

 

[George Herold]

On Monday, January 18, 2016 at 5:26:49 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount
the pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis
horizontal and a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use
the mill like a vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

Hi Eric, Re: turning a big diameter.
This is probably a silly idea, but I needed to wind some big magnetic field coils.
I had a wood lathe and I was able to turn the head around so it stuck out the
back end. (There was some "creative" pulley arrangement to get it power.)
I then wound some ~2' diameter coils... And yeah, you'd
have to rig up some sort of tool rest also.

George H.

 

[default]

On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:30:00 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount
the pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis
horizontal and a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use
the mill like a vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

The old overhead line-shaft power transmission schemes used wide
leather belts running on smooth wide crowned pulleys. I don't know
for a fact, but you may be able to get by with a wooden pulley. A
foot wide belt on a 2 foot diameter pulley should be able to carry a
lot of horsepower.

 

[Tim Wescott]

On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:30:00 -0800, etpm wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making the lathe a foot operated machine. To do
that I need to find a 2 foot diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat
belt pulley. I am still looking for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount the
pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis horizontal and
a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use the mill like a
vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

Hey! Where's the cheap Chinese motor manufacturer with his spam?

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

 

On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 05:50:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<gherold@teachspin.com> wrote:

On Monday, January 18, 2016 at 5:26:49 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:
On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount
the pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis
horizontal and a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use
the mill like a vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

Hi Eric, Re: turning a big diameter.
This is probably a silly idea, but I needed to wind some big magnetic field coils.
I had a wood lathe and I was able to turn the head around so it stuck out the
back end. (There was some "creative" pulley arrangement to get it power.)
I then wound some ~2' diameter coils... And yeah, you'd
have to rig up some sort of tool rest also.

George H.

I have a wood lathe that has the swivel headstock. It is meant to be
turned around for large work and a floor mounted rest is indeed needed
for turning the work. But there is no way I would attempt machine a 2
foot diameter cast iron pulley with the machine. If I was making a
wood pulley I would do it though. And I have thought about making a
wood oulley and adding lead weights.
Eric

 

[George Herold]

On Tuesday, January 19, 2016 at 2:31:25 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 05:50:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gherold@teachspin.com> wrote:

On Monday, January 18, 2016 at 5:26:49 PM UTC-5, et...@whidbey.com wrote:
On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making
the lathe a foot operated machine. To do that I need to find a 2 foot
diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat belt pulley. I am still looking
for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount
the pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis
horizontal and a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use
the mill like a vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

Hi Eric, Re: turning a big diameter.
This is probably a silly idea, but I needed to wind some big magnetic field coils.
I had a wood lathe and I was able to turn the head around so it stuck out the
back end. (There was some "creative" pulley arrangement to get it power.)
I then wound some ~2' diameter coils... And yeah, you'd
have to rig up some sort of tool rest also.

George H.
I have a wood lathe that has the swivel headstock. It is meant to be
turned around for large work and a floor mounted rest is indeed needed
for turning the work. But there is no way I would attempt machine a 2
foot diameter cast iron pulley with the machine. If I was making a
wood pulley I would do it though. And I have thought about making a
wood oulley and adding lead weights.
Eric

My mistake, I thought you were making a wooden pulley.
You need the weights because you want the pulley to be a fly
wheel too?

George H.

 

[George Herold]

On Wednesday, January 20, 2016 at 8:23:12 AM UTC-5, default wrote:

On 20 Jan 2016 05:41:57 GMT, Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> wrote:

On 2016-01-19, default <default@defaulter.net> wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:28:04 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:27:30 -0500, default wrote:

On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:30:00 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making the lathe a foot operated machine. To do
that I need to find a 2 foot diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat
belt pulley. I am still looking for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount the
pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis horizontal and
a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use the mill like a
vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

The old overhead line-shaft power transmission schemes used wide leather
belts running on smooth wide crowned pulleys. I don't know for a fact,
but you may be able to get by with a wooden pulley. A foot wide belt on
a 2 foot diameter pulley should be able to carry a lot of horsepower.

It wouldn't need to be nearly that wide for a single lathe -- I was
looking at a 10-foot long monster that my brother took in, and the
sheaves that the belt runs on are more like two or three inches wide.

I do think you could whomp up a temporary wood lathe to do the job (maybe
even a wooden wood lathe!!!). The properly shade-tree way to do this
would be to make the hub of your pulley blank with a bolt-hole pattern to
match your truck. Then jack up one rear wheel, bolt on the blank, let it
idle in first gear, and turn your pulley on that.

I like your thinking. I suspect it may even be possible to "turn" a
blank by putting a spindle through the center, allowing the work to
rotate, then just hold a belt sander against it. Skew the angle of
the sander so it isn't perpendicular to the rotation and it should
turn a pretty good cylinder.

rough it with a chainsaw, finish with a sander.

I'm not that good with a chain saw. A coarse belt on a good belt
sander can remove an awful lot of material quickly.

A lot depends on the shape of the blank too. I'd be easy to build it
up from 2X6 lumber shaped with a saber saw and then glue up a round
blank. If a belt sander won't cut it, renting a floor sander might do
the trick. Or you could just cheat and build up a pulley from
plywood disks.

Yeah, I think plywood discs would be what I would try.. Make a jig
to cut circles on my band saw, glue, screw and done.

George H.

It's an engineering problem and sounds like a lot of fun. I built a
five foot (long) coil turning lathe to turn out Tesla coils and had so
much fun turning the end caps and mandrels that I went out and bought
a wood turning lathe. The coil lathe got adapted to making a large
kilowatt-class induction coil to excite the Tesla coils and later on a
winder for an alternator rotor and transformers.

 

[default]

On 20 Jan 2016 05:41:57 GMT, Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> wrote:

On 2016-01-19, default <default@defaulter.net> wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:28:04 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:27:30 -0500, default wrote:

On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:30:00 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

On Wed, 13 Jan 2016 23:00:14 +0000 (GMT), Terminal Crazy
Terminal_Crazy@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

In article <pmjd9b9d2lkd8nplo3tqrokrhn4lq6j41l@4ax.com>,
etpm@whidbey.com> wrote:
I am also considering making the lathe a foot operated machine. To do
that I need to find a 2 foot diameter, 5 inch wide, three step flat
belt pulley. I am still looking for one, even one I can modify.
Eric

Really ?
You have a lathe sat there. Machine one. Isn't that what they do best?

Mitch
I don't have a lathe with a 2 foot swing so turning a pulley that big
would be problematic. However, I may have a solution. I could mount the
pulley to the 4th axis on my big mill. With the 4th axis horizontal and
a stationary lathe type tool in the spindle I could use the mill like a
vertical lathe. I might do this if I get crazy enough.
Eric

The old overhead line-shaft power transmission schemes used wide leather
belts running on smooth wide crowned pulleys. I don't know for a fact,
but you may be able to get by with a wooden pulley. A foot wide belt on
a 2 foot diameter pulley should be able to carry a lot of horsepower.

It wouldn't need to be nearly that wide for a single lathe -- I was
looking at a 10-foot long monster that my brother took in, and the
sheaves that the belt runs on are more like two or three inches wide.

I do think you could whomp up a temporary wood lathe to do the job (maybe
even a wooden wood lathe!!!). The properly shade-tree way to do this
would be to make the hub of your pulley blank with a bolt-hole pattern to
match your truck. Then jack up one rear wheel, bolt on the blank, let it
idle in first gear, and turn your pulley on that.

I like your thinking. I suspect it may even be possible to "turn" a
blank by putting a spindle through the center, allowing the work to
rotate, then just hold a belt sander against it. Skew the angle of
the sander so it isn't perpendicular to the rotation and it should
turn a pretty good cylinder.

rough it with a chainsaw, finish with a sander.

I'm not that good with a chain saw. A coarse belt on a good belt
sander can remove an awful lot of material quickly.

A lot depends on the shape of the blank too. I'd be easy to build it
up from 2X6 lumber shaped with a saber saw and then glue up a round
blank. If a belt sander won't cut it, renting a floor sander might do
the trick. Or you could just cheat and build up a pulley from
plywood disks.

It's an engineering problem and sounds like a lot of fun. I built a
five foot (long) coil turning lathe to turn out Tesla coils and had so
much fun turning the end caps and mandrels that I went out and bought
a wood turning lathe. The coil lathe got adapted to making a large
kilowatt-class induction coil to excite the Tesla coils and later on a
winder for an alternator rotor and transformers.