GPIB cards

John Devereux · Oct 31, 2005

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

--

John Devereux

Andrew Holme · Oct 31, 2005

John Devereux wrote:

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

I lashed-up a minimal GPIB to RS232 converter using a PIC 16F84, to capture
plotter output from my spectrum analyzer. My SA doesn't use the ATN
Talk/Listen stuff; so I only needed to support the basic handshake lines
(NRFD, NDAC, DAV).

It's serial-port-powered, with the GPIB signals connected directly to the
PIC. I just needed a pull-up resistor on DAV, and I toggle the DDR bits to
simulate open-collector outputs on NRFD and NDAC.

qrk · Oct 31, 2005

On 31 Oct 2005 20:35:14 +0000, John Devereux
<jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk> wrote:

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?
John Devereux

You may want to look into NI's GPIB to Ethernet boxes. You can find
these on EBay periodically. NI also has some drivers/programs that
allow you to issue GPIB commands from the command line. You can do
almost all of your GPIB commands from a batch file and go out/in thru
the Ethernet port.

On the plotting side, if you can't find a suitable HPGL to printer
program, you can do a data dump and use Gnuplot
<http://www.gnuplot.info/> to plot the results. This can be part of
your batch file. Some HP instruments (late 80s and newer) allow you to
do a PCL printer dump via GPIB. I have a program that will take the
PCL data dump and convert it into a PCX image format (ask if you want
it). You can use Nconvert (get the "XnView Complete version (Plugins &
NConvert)" zip version and extract nconvert)
<http://perso.wanadoo.fr/pierre.g/xnview/en_ncdownload.html> to change
it to GIF or PNG if you want smaller file sizes. Perfect for word
processor documentation.

---
Mark

mike · Oct 31, 2005

John Devereux wrote:

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

There are a bunch of issues surrounding the older GPIB cards.
You'd think you could get 488-1 functionality from 488.1 cards.
But you'd be optimistic.
It's as though NI purposely obsoleted them thru hardware and sw changes...
Unless you get one of the 488-2 cards, you'll be stuck in dos mode.

I've had success bit banging a card with a 9914 chip. Never tried the
ones with the NEC chip.

The cheapest solution for plots is a GPIB thinkjet printer.
mike

--
Wanted, Serial cable for Dell Axim X5 PDA.
Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
with links. Delete this sig when replying.
FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/

mike · Oct 31, 2005

Andrew Holme wrote:

John Devereux wrote:

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

I lashed-up a minimal GPIB to RS232 converter using a PIC 16F84, to capture
plotter output from my spectrum analyzer. My SA doesn't use the ATN
Talk/Listen stuff; so I only needed to support the basic handshake lines
(NRFD, NDAC, DAV).

It's serial-port-powered, with the GPIB signals connected directly to the
PIC. I just needed a pull-up resistor on DAV, and I toggle the DDR bits to
simulate open-collector outputs on NRFD and NDAC.

I have a similar configuration built around a 16F877A. I had trouble
powering it. With 5V on the PIC, the GPIB levels didn't go high enough
to reliably drive the PIC.
Pullups dragged the serial port power down. I was trying to drive it
with a HP 200LX...not exactly a serial port powerhouse ;-)
Found out by accident that the thing
runs off the gpib port powered parasitically thru the PIC output pins.
I unplugged the power and it just kept running...
But I wouldn't trust it for anything critical. Ended up adding a wall wart.
How did you power yours?

mike

--
Wanted, Serial cable for Dell Axim X5 PDA.
Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
with links. Delete this sig when replying.
FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/

John Miles · Nov 1, 2005

In article <87zmopctml.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk>,
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk says...

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

NI's PCI-GPIB is what I'd recommend. Their USB solution is also good,
if the budget is there.

Software-wise, you can acquire plots with 7470.exe from
http://www.speakeasy.org/~jmiles1/ke5fx/7470.htm , along with several
commercial (non-free) utilities. 7470 will work only with NI hardware.

-- jm

------------------------------------------------------
http://www.qsl.net/ke5fx
Note: My E-mail address has been altered to avoid spam
------------------------------------------------------

John Devereux · Nov 1, 2005

mark@reson.DELETE.ME.com (qrk) writes:

On 31 Oct 2005 20:35:14 +0000, John Devereux
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk> wrote:
I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?
John Devereux

You may want to look into NI's GPIB to Ethernet boxes. You can find
these on EBay periodically. NI also has some drivers/programs that
allow you to issue GPIB commands from the command line. You can do
almost all of your GPIB commands from a batch file and go out/in thru
the Ethernet port.

I have indeed been looking at these - a bit pricy but like the idea of
independence from a particular computer / driver.

On the plotting side, if you can't find a suitable HPGL to printer
program, you can do a data dump and use Gnuplot
http://www.gnuplot.info/> to plot the results. This can be part of
your batch file.

I have just been playing with gnuplot too - a nice utility especially
for batch use as you suggest.

Some HP instruments (late 80s and newer) allow you to
do a PCL printer dump via GPIB. I have a program that will take the
PCL data dump and convert it into a PCX image format (ask if you want
it). You can use Nconvert (get the "XnView Complete version (Plugins &
NConvert)" zip version and extract nconvert)

OK, thanks for the offer. I expect there is a linux utility somewhere
to do this, but if not I know where to come!

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/pierre.g/xnview/en_ncdownload.html> to change
it to GIF or PNG if you want smaller file sizes. Perfect for word
processor documentation.

---
Mark

--

John Devereux

John Devereux · Nov 1, 2005

mike <spamme0@netscape.net> writes:

John Devereux wrote:
Hi,
I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.
What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The
"standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.
Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

There are a bunch of issues surrounding the older GPIB cards.
You'd think you could get 488-1 functionality from 488.1 cards.
But you'd be optimistic.
It's as though NI purposely obsoleted them thru hardware and sw changes...

No! Surely not!

Unless you get one of the 488-2 cards, you'll be stuck in dos mode.

I've had success bit banging a card with a 9914 chip. Never tried the
ones with the NEC chip.

The cheapest solution for plots is a GPIB thinkjet printer.

I wanted to be able to capture the plot to a file - I can already take
a "screen shot" with a digital camera...

--

John Devereux

John Devereux · Nov 1, 2005

John Miles <jmiles@pop.removethistomailme.net> writes:

In article <87zmopctml.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk>,
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk says...
Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

NI's PCI-GPIB is what I'd recommend. Their USB solution is also good,
if the budget is there.

Software-wise, you can acquire plots with 7470.exe from
http://www.speakeasy.org/~jmiles1/ke5fx/7470.htm , along with several
commercial (non-free) utilities. 7470 will work only with NI hardware.

Thanks, do you know if it works with the NI USB and ethernet products?

--

John Devereux

Johnson · Nov 1, 2005

"John Devereux" <jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk> wrote in message
news:87zmopctml.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk...

Hi,

SNIP
--

I used an National Instruments card purchased from EBay -- but have found it
much easier to pull the analog signal directly from the machine -- here's a
link to some of the HP G/L language which I scanned from a HP publication:
http://www.tech-diy.com/HP%20Graphics%20Language.htm

For USB consider this -- the Measurement Computing ADC/DAC cards are set up
for USB -- you could use Softwire to program the digital out to interface
the GPIB with a shift register -- it would be somewhat slow (and you will
have to figure out how to solder a 50 pin SCSI jack.)

For USB, consider the FTDI cihps: http://www.ftdichip.com/FTProducts.htm
they have free USB drivers.

Fred Bloggs · Nov 1, 2005

John Devereux wrote:

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

These people look pretty cheap if you go to a basic GPIB<->SERIAL at
$300 it is a giveaway. http://www.team-solutions.com/TeamProductsFamily.htm

John Devereux · Nov 1, 2005

"Johnson" <jdwalton@comt.net> writes:

"John Devereux" <jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk> wrote in message
news:87zmopctml.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk...
Hi,

SNIP
--

I used an National Instruments card purchased from EBay -- but have found it
much easier to pull the analog signal directly from the machine -- here's a
link to some of the HP G/L language which I scanned from a HP publication:
http://www.tech-diy.com/HP%20Graphics%20Language.htm

What analog signal? Sorry, I am not following you here.

--

John Devereux

Andrew Holme · Nov 1, 2005

mike wrote:

Andrew Holme wrote:
John Devereux wrote:
[snip]
I have a similar configuration built around a 16F877A. I had trouble
powering it. With 5V on the PIC, the GPIB levels didn't go high
enough
to reliably drive the PIC.
Pullups dragged the serial port power down. I was trying to drive it
with a HP 200LX...not exactly a serial port powerhouse ;-)
Found out by accident that the thing
runs off the gpib port powered parasitically thru the PIC output pins.
I unplugged the power and it just kept running...
But I wouldn't trust it for anything critical. Ended up adding a
wall wart. How did you power yours?

"DTR"->|----.
|
| ____
| | | +5V
"RTS"->|----o-----| L05|-----o----------------------.
| |____| | |
| + | | |
### | --- ----||-+ PMOS
100uF --- | --- 100n ||->
| | | ||-+
| | | | 100
=== === === | ___ "Rx"
GND GND GND o---|___|--->Data
| Out
|
| ___
'---|___|----"Tx"
(-10V)
15k

View in a fixed-pitch font.

John Miles · Nov 2, 2005

In article <87mzkocx9v.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk>,
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk says...

John Miles <jmiles@pop.removethistomailme.net> writes:
Software-wise, you can acquire plots with 7470.exe from
http://www.speakeasy.org/~jmiles1/ke5fx/7470.htm , along with several
commercial (non-free) utilities. 7470 will work only with NI hardware.

Thanks, do you know if it works with the NI USB and ethernet products?

USB: definitely. Ethernet: yes, it should be fine too, since they both
support the NI488.2 driver standard.

However, I don't believe their Ethernet adapter drivers are a free
download. If you buy an Ethernet adapter, be sure the seller includes
the drivers for it.

-- jm

------------------------------------------------------
http://www.qsl.net/ke5fx
Note: My E-mail address has been altered to avoid spam
------------------------------------------------------

John Devereux · Nov 2, 2005

John Miles <jmiles@pop.removethistomailme.net> writes:

In article <87mzkocx9v.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk>,
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk says...
John Miles <jmiles@pop.removethistomailme.net> writes:
Software-wise, you can acquire plots with 7470.exe from
http://www.speakeasy.org/~jmiles1/ke5fx/7470.htm , along with several
commercial (non-free) utilities. 7470 will work only with NI hardware.

Thanks, do you know if it works with the NI USB and ethernet products?

USB: definitely. Ethernet: yes, it should be fine too, since they both
support the NI488.2 driver standard.

However, I don't believe their Ethernet adapter drivers are a free
download. If you buy an Ethernet adapter, be sure the seller includes
the drivers for it.

-- jm

Thanks for the info. I have just twigged that you are the author of
7470.EXE, I think it was seeing this program that started me down this
road!

--

John Devereux

John Miles · Nov 2, 2005

In article <87wtjrbcyo.fsf@cordelia.devereux.me.uk>,
jdREMOVE@THISdevereux.me.uk says...

Thanks for the info. I have just twigged that you are the author of
7470.EXE, I think it was seeing this program that started me down this
road!

Guilty as charged...

I'm actually about to start work on a version of 7470 that will support
this new, economy-priced GPIB adapter:

http://www.sparkfun.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&itemid=500

The guy who designed it came over a few days ago to try his latest
version out on the HP 8566B and a few other "challenging" instruments
here in the basement. If you can wait a few weeks, this board could be
one option for you. It is not a full-fledged GPIB bus controller
(meaning it can't be used to address specific instruments under host
control), but it should be able to handle device-initiated plots for
most of the equipment supported by 7470 and PrintCapture.

-- jm

------------------------------------------------------
http://www.qsl.net/ke5fx
Note: My E-mail address has been altered to avoid spam
------------------------------------------------------

John Devereux · Nov 4, 2005

Joerg <notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> writes:

Hello John,

Just in case you haven't found a solution yet these folks have one for
about $100 but I don't know anything about how good it works:
http://www.sparkfun.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cart=453828&cat=66&

I believe the designer had posted here in the NG.

Thanks Joerg, John Miles pointed this out too. Apparently he is
modifying his 7470.exe GPIB plot capture utility to work with it.

<http://www.speakeasy.org/~jmiles1/ke5fx/7470.htm>

--

John Devereux

Dave · Nov 11, 2005

John Devereux wrote:

Hi,

I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.

What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The "standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Unless you are particlarly short of cash, save youself a lot of hassle
and buy a NI card on eBay. As you say, NI are the standard now.

ISA ones are very cheap indeed, but you will not get drivers for the
latest versions of Windoze.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

Others have, but I personally would rather take some intersting
mesurements than mess about saving a few pounds whilst giving myself a
headache.

If you make one youself, it is extreamly unlikely to be 100% NI
compatable. So you might as well buy a used one from Computer Boards
(good choice) or similar, which will cost even less than a NI one, and
probably more compatable than anything you could make in a reasonable
period of time.

John Devereux · Nov 11, 2005

Dave <nospam@nowhere.com> writes:

John Devereux wrote:
Hi,
I have several "older" instruments, acquired through ebay. They all
can plot via their GPIB bus. I gather it is possible to run software
on a PC that emulates a HP plotter, and so capture the result.
What are the current recommended GPIB cards to do this? The
"standard"
seems to be NI cards (ISA and PCI). These are quite expensive,
although seem to turn up on ebay. Any others? A low cost USB type
would be nice (if they exist), but unsure about compatibility with
available software.

Unless you are particlarly short of cash, save youself a lot of hassle
and buy a NI card on eBay. As you say, NI are the standard now.

Done. The card just arrived today!

Working very nicely so far - can download plots from spectrum analyser
and dynamic signal analyser. I am using a demo version of PrintCapture
on Windows to get everything working. Next step is to do the same on
Linux. I need to figure out how to put the interface into "listen"
mode and capture the HPGL data into a file. Something for the weekend!

ISA ones are very cheap indeed, but you will not get drivers for the
latest versions of Windoze.

Has anyone programmed one of the USB microcontrollers to bit-bang
GPIB, and fit it into a GPIB plug?

Others have, but I personally would rather take some intersting
mesurements than mess about saving a few pounds whilst giving myself a
headache.

If you make one youself, it is extreamly unlikely to be 100% NI
compatable. So you might as well buy a used one from Computer Boards
(good choice) or similar, which will cost even less than a NI one, and
probably more compatable than anything you could make in a reasonable
period of time.

Agreed, I was not really thinking of making one myself. I thought
someone else might have something on sale that was compatible and
cheap...

--

John Devereux

Joel Kolstad · Nov 11, 2005

"Dave" <nospam@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:43740f3e@212.67.96.135...

ISA ones are very cheap indeed, but you will not get drivers for the latest
versions of Windoze.

Not true. Some of the old ISA cards are still supported under at least
Windows 2000, and I believe Windows XP. Somewhere on their web site NI has a
chart showing which cards is supported by which OS.

We did end up stuck with NI's first USB --> GPIB converter that they supported
under Windows 95 and 98 and then dropped support for in later OSes! @#$@#$%

GPIB cards

John Devereux

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