GM-Delco Radio Engineers - Are They For Real

[Tony]

Now I dont claim to be perfect or an expert at fixing electronics but this
weekend I removed the radio from my car figuring this will be a simple fix. The
right front speaker was cutting in and out and crackling/thumping. Put the unit
on the bench and removed the top and bottom covers. From there I was simply
astonished at what I saw. Six or so circuit boards, some vertical, some
horizontal, all hard wired together by either individual wires or ribbons with
no means of disconnect and each only long enough to reach its destination and
absolutely no more. What were they thinking? Does it take six circuit boards to
make a simple AM/FM/Cassette. Would it have broke the bank to use a few 5 cent
connectors? There is no logic to the way this unit is put together - just a
total rats nest and only a mooron could have come up with the enclosure design.
I started to remove the amplifier board but gave up. It would seem that the
only way to get this thing apart would be to remove every single screw and
fastener and then what you would end up with is a bunch off boards flopping
around but still with no chance of access for inspection and certainly not
something you would want to try and power up. What happened to "Keep it simple
stupid"? I guess I'll keep it simple by simply snipping the wires to the front
speakers and living with it.

BTW. This is a 1991 Gran Prix purchased new. With 60K miles on it, it now only
serves as a spare vehicle (i couldnt take it anymore). During its warranty
period the instrument cluster panel failed three times (along with just about
everything else). As soon as the warranty ended it happened again. GM refused
to do anything about it and told me I could "exchange" it for $400. I removed
the cluster and found it loaded with poor solder joints on the PCB. Same
applies to problems it had with the ECM Module, the wiper control pod, the
headlight control pod. Have they learned to solder yet? Im almost sure the
radio problem will be the same thing if I could separate the boards to inspect
them.

Tony

 

[Daniel L. Belton]

On 17-Nov-2003, alg460@aol.comnobs (Tony) wrote:

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Lines: 31
X-Admin: news@aol.com
From: alg460@aol.comnobs (Tony)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.repair
Date: 17 Nov 2003 18:15:36 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Subject: GM-Delco Radio Engineers - Are They For Real
Message-ID: <20031117131536.19987.00000464@mb-m02.aol.com
Xref: news-server.columbus.rr.com sci.electronics.repair:367746

Now I dont claim to be perfect or an expert at fixing electronics but this
weekend I removed the radio from my car figuring this will be a simple
fix. The
right front speaker was cutting in and out and crackling/thumping. Put the
unit
on the bench and removed the top and bottom covers. From there I was
simply
astonished at what I saw. Six or so circuit boards, some vertical, some
horizontal, all hard wired together by either individual wires or ribbons
with
no means of disconnect and each only long enough to reach its destination
and
absolutely no more. What were they thinking? Does it take six circuit
boards to
make a simple AM/FM/Cassette. Would it have broke the bank to use a few 5
cent
connectors? There is no logic to the way this unit is put together - just
a
total rats nest and only a mooron could have come up with the enclosure
design.
I started to remove the amplifier board but gave up. It would seem that
the
only way to get this thing apart would be to remove every single screw and
fastener and then what you would end up with is a bunch off boards
flopping
around but still with no chance of access for inspection and certainly not
something you would want to try and power up. What happened to "Keep it
simple
stupid"? I guess I'll keep it simple by simply snipping the wires to the
front
speakers and living with it.

BTW. This is a 1991 Gran Prix purchased new. With 60K miles on it, it now
only
serves as a spare vehicle (i couldnt take it anymore). During its warranty
period the instrument cluster panel failed three times (along with just
about
everything else). As soon as the warranty ended it happened again. GM
refused
to do anything about it and told me I could "exchange" it for $400. I
removed
the cluster and found it loaded with poor solder joints on the PCB. Same
applies to problems it had with the ECM Module, the wiper control pod, the
headlight control pod. Have they learned to solder yet? Im almost sure the
radio problem will be the same thing if I could separate the boards to
inspect
them.

Tony

They are designed so that they can't be fixed... you have to go to the
dealer and purchase a new one...

 

[Jerry G.]

First of all, concerning the problems you have in the dash, is only one
small example why I would never, ever purchase a GM car again. It took 3 of
them for me to learn the hard way. People told me that I was a bone head.
But, I believed in buying locally made products first.

After a lot of hard knocks and throwing out a lot of money I bought a Nissan
Altima, and have been more than satisfied for the last 6 years of problem
free operation! The same goes for the radio, and all about how the rest of
those cars are made.

The radio in your car was jig aligned and set-up during the manufacturing
process. They are designed to not be serviced. Infact, if you were to find
any defective parts, and the parts are not generic, there is no way you
would be able to buy replacements.

I would change the radio completely. Buy a Sony, Bose, Pioneer, Kenwood, or
any good brand name radio, but not the original. Infact, when you sell the
car, you can take the good radio with you. You then can go to a scrap yard,
and put in anything that works okay (hard to find in a GM radio) when it
comes time to sell the car.

In every GM car that I owned, the radio lasted about 2 years if I was lucky.
After getting a quote from the dealer for a new one, I went to the scrap
yard, and picked up a used one. I generally had to return them about 4
times until I hit one that worked properly. I would be lucky to get more
than a year out of the radio. In my Altima, I put in a Bose radio. It was
expensive, but it works great.



--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg
=========================================


"Tony" <alg460@aol.comnobs> wrote in message
news:20031117131536.19987.00000464@mb-m02.aol.com...
Now I dont claim to be perfect or an expert at fixing electronics but this
weekend I removed the radio from my car figuring this will be a simple fix.
The
right front speaker was cutting in and out and crackling/thumping. Put the
unit
on the bench and removed the top and bottom covers. From there I was simply
astonished at what I saw. Six or so circuit boards, some vertical, some
horizontal, all hard wired together by either individual wires or ribbons
with
no means of disconnect and each only long enough to reach its destination
and
absolutely no more. What were they thinking? Does it take six circuit boards
to
make a simple AM/FM/Cassette. Would it have broke the bank to use a few 5
cent
connectors? There is no logic to the way this unit is put together - just a
total rats nest and only a mooron could have come up with the enclosure
design.
I started to remove the amplifier board but gave up. It would seem that the
only way to get this thing apart would be to remove every single screw and
fastener and then what you would end up with is a bunch off boards flopping
around but still with no chance of access for inspection and certainly not
something you would want to try and power up. What happened to "Keep it
simple
stupid"? I guess I'll keep it simple by simply snipping the wires to the
front
speakers and living with it.

BTW. This is a 1991 Gran Prix purchased new. With 60K miles on it, it now
only
serves as a spare vehicle (i couldnt take it anymore). During its warranty
period the instrument cluster panel failed three times (along with just
about
everything else). As soon as the warranty ended it happened again. GM
refused
to do anything about it and told me I could "exchange" it for $400. I
removed
the cluster and found it loaded with poor solder joints on the PCB. Same
applies to problems it had with the ECM Module, the wiper control pod, the
headlight control pod. Have they learned to solder yet? Im almost sure the
radio problem will be the same thing if I could separate the boards to
inspect
them.

Tony

 

[Jeff]

"Daniel L. Belton" <abuse@spam.gov> wrote in message
news:4S8ub.30461$oC5.9901@clmboh1-nws5.columbus.rr.com...

On 17-Nov-2003, alg460@aol.comnobs (Tony) wrote:

Path:

clmboh1-nws5.columbus.rr.com!news-server.columbus.rr.com!news-east.rr.com!ne

ws.rr.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!audrey-m1.news.aol.com!not-for-mail

Lines: 31
X-Admin: news@aol.com
From: alg460@aol.comnobs (Tony)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.repair
Date: 17 Nov 2003 18:15:36 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Subject: GM-Delco Radio Engineers - Are They For Real
Message-ID: <20031117131536.19987.00000464@mb-m02.aol.com
Xref: news-server.columbus.rr.com sci.electronics.repair:367746

Now I dont claim to be perfect or an expert at fixing electronics but
this
weekend I removed the radio from my car figuring this will be a simple
fix. The
right front speaker was cutting in and out and crackling/thumping. Put
the
unit
on the bench and removed the top and bottom covers. From there I was
simply
astonished at what I saw. Six or so circuit boards, some vertical, some
horizontal, all hard wired together by either individual wires or
ribbons
with
no means of disconnect and each only long enough to reach its
destination
and
absolutely no more. What were they thinking? Does it take six circuit
boards to
make a simple AM/FM/Cassette. Would it have broke the bank to use a few
5
cent
connectors? There is no logic to the way this unit is put together -
just
a
total rats nest and only a mooron could have come up with the enclosure
design.
I started to remove the amplifier board but gave up. It would seem that
the
only way to get this thing apart would be to remove every single screw
and
fastener and then what you would end up with is a bunch off boards
flopping
around but still with no chance of access for inspection and certainly
not
something you would want to try and power up. What happened to "Keep it
simple
stupid"? I guess I'll keep it simple by simply snipping the wires to the
front
speakers and living with it.

BTW. This is a 1991 Gran Prix purchased new. With 60K miles on it, it
now
only
serves as a spare vehicle (i couldnt take it anymore). During its
warranty
period the instrument cluster panel failed three times (along with just
about
everything else). As soon as the warranty ended it happened again. GM
refused
to do anything about it and told me I could "exchange" it for $400. I
removed
the cluster and found it loaded with poor solder joints on the PCB. Same
applies to problems it had with the ECM Module, the wiper control pod,
the
headlight control pod. Have they learned to solder yet? Im almost sure
the
radio problem will be the same thing if I could separate the boards to
inspect
them.

Tony

They are designed so that they can't be fixed... you have to go to the
dealer and purchase a new one...

Thats funny, I fix them, usually with ease.
Jeff

 

[Jeff]

"Tony" <alg460@aol.comnobs> wrote in message
news:20031117131536.19987.00000464@mb-m02.aol.com...
snip

right front speaker was cutting in and out and crackling/thumping. Put the
unit

snip

BTW. This is a 1991 Gran Prix purchased new. With > snip
Tony

If the antenna plugs into the back of the unit and assuming
its a 2000 series radio and not a Bose head unit and not
another type.
Open the heatsink side and replace the bad caps, careful and clean any mess
and repair any damage.
Model number would help as usual.
Jeff

 

[Jeff]

"Jerry G." <jerryg50@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bpbdg8$803$1@news.eusc.inter.net...

First of all, concerning the problems you have in the dash, is only one
small example why I would never, ever purchase a GM car again. It took 3
of
them for me to learn the hard way. People told me that I was a bone head.
But, I believed in buying locally made products first.

After a lot of hard knocks and throwing out a lot of money I bought a
Nissan
Altima, and have been more than satisfied for the last 6 years of problem
free operation! The same goes for the radio, and all about how the rest of
those cars are made.

The radio in your car was jig aligned and set-up during the manufacturing
process. They are designed to not be serviced. Infact, if you were to
find
any defective parts, and the parts are not generic, there is no way you
would be able to buy replacements.

I would change the radio completely. Buy a Sony, Bose, Pioneer, Kenwood,
or
any good brand name radio, but not the original. Infact, when you sell
the
car, you can take the good radio with you. You then can go to a scrap
yard,
and put in anything that works okay (hard to find in a GM radio) when it
comes time to sell the car.

In every GM car that I owned, the radio lasted about 2 years if I was
lucky.
After getting a quote from the dealer for a new one, I went to the scrap
yard, and picked up a used one. I generally had to return them about 4
times until I hit one that worked properly. I would be lucky to get more
than a year out of the radio. In my Altima, I put in a Bose radio. It
was
expensive, but it works great.

Hi Jerry,
What Bose radio? You mean you installed a Wave radio
in a car? or do you mean a Nissan/Clarion radio with a Bose logo on the unit
that feeds to a Bose amp and speakers.
Jeff

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg
=========================================

 

[Jerry G.]

Appantly the radio is sold under the Bose name, and the Nissan dealers here
are promoting the radio as such. Infactl, it is fairly expensive.

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG
=========================================
WebPage http://www.zoom-one.com
Electronics http://www.zoom-one.com/electron.htm
=========================================


"Jeff" <frontline_electronics@NSatt.net> wrote in message
news:6leub.278878$0v4.17764760@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...

"Jerry G." <jerryg50@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bpbdg8$803$1@news.eusc.inter.net...

First of all, concerning the problems you have in the dash, is only one
small example why I would never, ever purchase a GM car again. It took 3
of
them for me to learn the hard way. People told me that I was a bone head.
But, I believed in buying locally made products first.

After a lot of hard knocks and throwing out a lot of money I bought a
Nissan
Altima, and have been more than satisfied for the last 6 years of problem
free operation! The same goes for the radio, and all about how the rest of
those cars are made.

The radio in your car was jig aligned and set-up during the manufacturing
process. They are designed to not be serviced. Infact, if you were to
find
any defective parts, and the parts are not generic, there is no way you
would be able to buy replacements.

I would change the radio completely. Buy a Sony, Bose, Pioneer, Kenwood,
or
any good brand name radio, but not the original. Infact, when you sell
the
car, you can take the good radio with you. You then can go to a scrap
yard,
and put in anything that works okay (hard to find in a GM radio) when it
comes time to sell the car.

In every GM car that I owned, the radio lasted about 2 years if I was
lucky.
After getting a quote from the dealer for a new one, I went to the scrap
yard, and picked up a used one. I generally had to return them about 4
times until I hit one that worked properly. I would be lucky to get more
than a year out of the radio. In my Altima, I put in a Bose radio. It
was
expensive, but it works great.

Hi Jerry,
What Bose radio? You mean you installed a Wave radio
in a car? or do you mean a Nissan/Clarion radio with a Bose logo on the unit
that feeds to a Bose amp and speakers.
Jeff

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg
=========================================

 

[LASERandDVDfan]

First of all, concerning the problems you have in the dash, is only one
small example why I would never, ever purchase a GM car again. It took 3 of
them for me to learn the hard way. People told me that I was a bone head.
But, I believed in buying locally made products first.

You can also say the same for Ford and Chrysler.

Now, you really cannot go wrong by buying a Japanese vehicle. Better designed,
more reliable, and now most are manufactured and even designed in the United
States. The Japs are building the cars here while the big three are
outsourcing more of their manufacturing to Mexico and Canada.

The irony. Buy an American car made in Mexico or buy a Japanese car made in
the USA?

After a lot of hard knocks and throwing out a lot of money I bought a Nissan
Altima, and have been more than satisfied for the last 6 years of problem
free operation! The same goes for the radio, and all about how the rest of
those cars are made.

Nissan radios are usually OEMed by Clarion.

I would change the radio completely. Buy a Sony, Bose, Pioneer, Kenwood, or
any good brand name radio, but not the original.

Sony, Pioneer, JVC, Kenwood, Panasonic, just about any Japanese brand that has
a good reputation. Bose, Blaupunkt, and Clarion are good non-Japanese brands.
Stay away from the other stuff, especially the cheap crap. One particular CD
deck I had seen that was made by a no-name company had an SNR of just over 65
decibels! Can we say "a piece of crap?" - Reinhart

 

[Tony]

Jeff Wrote

If the antenna plugs into the back of the unit and assuming
its a 2000 series radio and not a Bose head unit and not

another type. Open the heatsink side and replace the bad caps, careful and
clean any mess and repair any damage. Model number would help as usual.>


The antenna plugs into the back and its not a Bose. I believe it is the 2000
series. I do have a service manual but its from 1985 models. Seems similar but
different enought that the service info is useless. I'll try and check those
caps under the heatsink if thats a common problem with these.

Tony

 

[Jim Adney]

On 17 Nov 2003 18:15:36 GMT alg460@aol.comnobs (Tony) wrote:

Have they learned to solder yet? Im almost sure the
radio problem will be the same thing if I could separate the boards to inspect
them.

You may be right, but are you sure that the problem is not in the
wires to the speakers in the doors?

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney jadney@vwtype3.org
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

 

[Tony]

Jim Wrote
You may be right, but are you sure that the problem is not in the
wires to the speakers in the doors?

I'm sure the problem is in the radio. When the right front speaker does cut out
the tone controls become inoperative.

Tony

 

[Jeff]

"Tony" <alg460@aol.comnobs> wrote in message
news:20031118071012.03399.00000516@mb-m29.aol.com...

Jeff Wrote

If the antenna plugs into the back of the unit and assuming
its a 2000 series radio and not a Bose head unit and not
another type. Open the heatsink side and replace the bad caps, careful and
clean any mess and repair any damage. Model number would help as usual.


The antenna plugs into the back and its not a Bose. I believe it is the
2000
series. I do have a service manual but its from 1985 models. Seems similar
but
different enought that the service info is useless. I'll try and check
those
caps under the heatsink if thats a common problem with these.

Tony

 

[Grandpa]

How much do you want for the car?

 

[Tony]

How much do you want for the car?

Power steering hose just failed. $85 for hose and $200 labor to install it.
I'll give you $500 to take it off my hands. You must also sign an agreement
that you will not threaten me with bodily harm after you have had the car a few
months.

Maybe I'll just park it on the side of the road and burn it.

Tony

 

[JURB6006]

What kind of car ? I know it's a GM but that's about it.

Also what kinda problem ?

JURB