Garage sensor: How do they work ?

Rodo · May 21, 2005

Hi all,

I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for when I
have the garage door semi-open. Since the system already has sensor in it, I
figure I can just interface to them.

I measure the terminals of the two sensors that stop the door from closing
when interrupted. One shows a 12vdc and the other a 3.6vdc. If I place an
object in the path, the 12vdc goes to 13.6vdc. The other does not change.
How do these things work ?

I figure one is an IR Tx and the other Rx. The beam is interrupted and the
voltage changes (and the LED on it blinks), right ? I measure no AC or
frequency from any of the two sensors ( at any time).

I'm planning to use a PIC18. I'm just puzzled by the 1.6v difference ? Is
that all that they use ?

Thanks

BTW the motor is a Genie unit (belt driven ...very quite kind).

Jim Thompson · May 21, 2005

On 21 May 2005 07:49:07 -0700, "Dave" <cheapscatedave@yahoo.com>
wrote:

If you do this your beeper will only sound when there is an obstruction
between the sensors. The door can be opened without the obstruction
sensors activated (my door will stop when button is pressed when
motion).
I use a reed switch and magnet to sense if the door is not closed. I
made my own (I'm cheap) from junk parts but they can be purchased from
Radio Shack in N/O or N/C types.
Dave

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

Joerg · May 21, 2005

Hello Rodo,

As Dave said, the obstruction sensors won't help you here. I do not know
belt drives but figure they must have something similar to what our
screw drive has at either end: End switches. These are simple mechanical
switches and the one near the door closes (or opens, depending on model)
when the door is fully closed.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Richard H. · May 22, 2005

Rodo wrote:

I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for when I
have the garage door semi-open. Since the system already has sensor in it, I
figure I can just interface to them.

As others have commented, these won't tell you if the door is opened
slightly.

This type of sensor is designed to be floor-mounted (can be driven over)
and will trip the circuit if the door is opened more than an inch or so
- see Overhead Door Contacts:
http://www.security.honeywell.com/hsce/products/sensor/co/su/

Here's a cheap wireless package that you could use as a starting point:
http://www.stanley-garage-door-opener.com/garage_door_monitor_security.htm

Or, you could just get a standard magnetic door sensor, mount it
anywhere on the vertical edge of the door when it's closed, and it'll
trip when the door opens.

HTH,
Richard

Jim Thompson · May 22, 2005

On Sat, 21 May 2005 21:46:31 -0700, "Richard H." <rh86@no.spam> wrote:

Rodo wrote:
I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for when I
have the garage door semi-open. Since the system already has sensor in it, I
figure I can just interface to them.

As others have commented, these won't tell you if the door is opened
slightly.

This type of sensor is designed to be floor-mounted (can be driven over)
and will trip the circuit if the door is opened more than an inch or so
- see Overhead Door Contacts:
http://www.security.honeywell.com/hsce/products/sensor/co/su/

Here's a cheap wireless package that you could use as a starting point:
http://www.stanley-garage-door-opener.com/garage_door_monitor_security.htm

Or, you could just get a standard magnetic door sensor, mount it
anywhere on the vertical edge of the door when it's closed, and it'll
trip when the door opens.

HTH,
Richard

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

May 22, 2005

Rodo <dsp1024@yahoo.com> wrote:

I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for when
I have the garage door semi-open.

As has been said, a burglar-alarm magnetic switch is pretty easy. Also,
if the motor unit has a light on it, and the light doesn't go out after
the door has been open for a while, you might be able to use something
like a cheap wall-wart plugged into the light socket to give you a
signal when the door is open.

Matt Roberds

Rich Grise · May 22, 2005

On Sat, 21 May 2005 21:46:31 -0700, Richard H. wrote:

Rodo wrote:
I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for when I
have the garage door semi-open. Since the system already has sensor in it, I
figure I can just interface to them.

As others have commented, these won't tell you if the door is opened
slightly.

Of course they do. If the "closed" switch isn't giving its "door closed"
signal, then the door isn't closed. And if the switch at the top of the
travel isn't giving its "the door is fully opened" signal, then the door
is obviously someplace in between, which is what Rodo was asking for, as
far as I can tell.

The elecronics comes into play when you decide to sense the state of both
limit switches simultaneously. That's an "AND" gate.

Thanks,
Rich

Joerg · May 22, 2005

Hello Jim,

Is it a segmented-panel door? If so put the tilt switch on the
topmost panel.

But the top panel moves...

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Joerg · May 22, 2005

Hello Rich,

The elecronics comes into play when you decide to sense the state of both
limit switches simultaneously. That's an "AND" gate.

The Genie units usually have that already in them, along with another
"one bit memory" that tells them in which direction the door had moved last.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Rich Grise · May 23, 2005

On Sun, 22 May 2005 22:50:57 +0000, Joerg wrote:

Hello Jim,

Is it a segmented-panel door? If so put the tilt switch on the
topmost panel.

But the top panel moves...

Uh, yeah, that's kinda the point, which would be obvious if whoever
Joerg is responding to hadn't snipped everything.

Let's start plonking googlekiddies.

Thanks,
Rich

Joerg · May 23, 2005

Hello Rich,

Is it a segmented-panel door? If so put the tilt switch on the
topmost panel.

But the top panel moves...

Uh, yeah, that's kinda the point, which would be obvious if whoever
Joerg is responding to hadn't snipped everything.

Well, top panel mount would really only leave a wireless solution with
batteries. A few hot weeks like out here right now and the batteries are
toast. Garage door panels can become so hot that even a brief touch with
a finger leaves a blister.

Seems overkill to me since the usual door drive already has two end
switches. On our system (Genie screw drive) you could buy or make a
spare set of end switches and mount them on the other side of the track
if you wanted to have a completely isolated setup. If they are wired so
they close when the door moves away from the end point they could simply
be hooked up in series with a lamp or whatever to indicated a door that
was left open. No electronics required. Anything mounted to the door
itself is likely to get banged up.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Jim Thompson · May 23, 2005

On Mon, 23 May 2005 18:12:49 GMT, Joerg
<notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> wrote:

Hello Rich,

Is it a segmented-panel door? If so put the tilt switch on the
topmost panel.

But the top panel moves...

Uh, yeah, that's kinda the point, which would be obvious if whoever
Joerg is responding to hadn't snipped everything.

Well, top panel mount would really only leave a wireless solution with
batteries. A few hot weeks like out here right now and the batteries are
toast. Garage door panels can become so hot that even a brief touch with
a finger leaves a blister.

Hmmmm? My doors have about 1" of some kind of insulation between the
metal panels.

Seems overkill to me since the usual door drive already has two end
switches. On our system (Genie screw drive) you could buy or make a
spare set of end switches and mount them on the other side of the track
if you wanted to have a completely isolated setup. If they are wired so
they close when the door moves away from the end point they could simply
be hooked up in series with a lamp or whatever to indicated a door that
was left open. No electronics required. Anything mounted to the door
itself is likely to get banged up.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

Joerg · May 23, 2005

Hello Jim,

Hmmmm? My doors have about 1" of some kind of insulation between the
metal panels.

You must live in a pretty new house then or have newer doors. Ours are
top quality but 30+ years old. Almost undentable metal but insulation or
even double walled? Nope. When someone touches or accidentally leans
against the inside of such a door on a hot summer day you'll hear a
"tsssst", then an expletive, followed by an involuntary tarantella dance.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Jim Thompson · May 23, 2005

On Mon, 23 May 2005 21:17:52 GMT, Joerg
<notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> wrote:

Hello Jim,

Hmmmm? My doors have about 1" of some kind of insulation between the
metal panels.

You must live in a pretty new house then or have newer doors. Ours are
top quality but 30+ years old. Almost undentable metal but insulation or
even double walled? Nope. When someone touches or accidentally leans
against the inside of such a door on a hot summer day you'll hear a
"tsssst", then an expletive, followed by an involuntary tarantella dance.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

Joerg · May 23, 2005

Hello Jim,

11 year old house.

Then you do have a new house. Ours was built in 1970. Good quality stuff
so most of the original hardware is still in place.

I grew up in Europe where a building under 50 years is considered quite
new. The Romans probably thought more along the lines of 400-500 years.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Terry Pinnell · May 24, 2005

"Rodo" <dsp1024@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hmmm. I guess I didn't make myself too clear on this one . I'm not
interested in the state of the door. I know the door will be open
(slightly) because I opened it. I just want to have something beep if a
critter (or not so critter) comes into the garage. My condo sits on top of
the garage and I just want to cool it down on summer days by leaving the
door open a bit. It is also not intended to be open overnight.

Original requirement:
---------------------
"I want to make a circuit that will beep (or something like that) for
when I have the garage door semi-open."

Re-stated requirement:
----------------------
"I just want to have something beep if a critter (or not so critter)
comes into the garage."

Glad I didn't attempt to contribute earlier! 13 replies so far, all
based on your misleading spec.

What size of critter must be detected? (Mouse, rat, cat, squirrel,
Alsatian, neighbour's baby, teenage vandal, 300 lb escaped
convict...?)

Begging answers to those, I'd be thinking along the lines of either an
interrupted IR beam or adapting a proximity detector (PIR).

--
Terry Pinnell
Hobbyist, West Sussex, UK

Guy Macon · May 24, 2005

Rodo wrote:

Hmmm. I guess I didn't make myself too clear on this one . I'm not
interested in the state of the door. I know the door will be open
(slightly) because I opened it. I just want to have something beep if a
critter (or not so critter) comes into the garage. My condo sits on top of
the garage and I just want to cool it down on summer days by leaving the
door open a bit.

Go out and buy a standard electric cattle fence and mount a couple of
isulators so that you can string a wire across the opening a few inches
above the floor. No human intervention needed, and no need to move a
signal from the garage to the house.

Rich Grise · May 24, 2005

On Tue, 24 May 2005 13:19:19 +0000, Guy Macon wrote:

Rodo wrote:

Hmmm. I guess I didn't make myself too clear on this one . I'm not
interested in the state of the door. I know the door will be open
(slightly) because I opened it. I just want to have something beep if a
critter (or not so critter) comes into the garage. My condo sits on top of
the garage and I just want to cool it down on summer days by leaving the
door open a bit.

Go out and buy a standard electric cattle fence and mount a couple of
isulators so that you can string a wire across the opening a few inches
above the floor. No human intervention needed, and no need to move a
signal from the garage to the house.

Wouldn't that make it a little inconvenient to drive in or out? ;-)

Thanks,
Rich

Rodo · May 25, 2005

Dog, cat as long as they're smaller than the 300lb convict

. Seriously,
I just want to leave it open a couple of feet. I don't mind that someone or
something goes inside, I just want to be alerted so I can go check.

Thanks to all for the replies and I apologize for the misinformation.

"Terry Pinnell" <terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:8pk591pb0sm2fia3kj6ub41u5oqhk1i9fh@4ax.com...

"Rodo" <dsp1024@yahoo.com> wrote:

[snip]

What size of critter must be detected? (Mouse, rat, cat, squirrel,
Alsatian, neighbour's baby, teenage vandal, 300 lb escaped
convict...?)

Rich Grise · May 25, 2005

On Wed, 25 May 2005 01:27:35 +0000, Rodo top-posted:

Dog, cat as long as they're smaller than the 300lb convict . Seriously,
I just want to leave it open a couple of feet. I don't mind that someone or
something goes inside, I just want to be alerted so I can go check.

Thanks to all for the replies and I apologize for the misinformation.

"Terry Pinnell" <terrypinDELETE@THESEdial.pipex.com> wrote in message
[snip]

What size of critter must be detected? (Mouse, rat, cat, squirrel,
Alsatian, neighbour's baby, teenage vandal, 300 lb escaped
convict...?)

How about one of those PIR motion sensor yard lights? I think it's
possible to get just the sensor part, or you could just unscrew the
bulb and operate a 120VAC relay; and they have adjustable sensitivity.
Maybe two - one for each side.

Good Luck!
Rich

Garage sensor: How do they work ?

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