Digital 7 Segment Display

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Wombat-Pipex-News

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Hi all
Can Anyone tell me if the CA3162E is compatible with the 74HC4511
Im talking about the 4 data lines that go from chip to chip. ABCD - 0123
Normaly the CA3162 is used with the CA3161 but I was hoping to us the
74HC4511 instead as Ive got loads of them.
The 74HC4511 uses Common Cathode displays but the CA3161 uses the Common
Anode types.
I've got lots of the CC type and that was another reason for wanting to use
this chip.

Would the data lines be inverted and need to be inverted to be compatible
with the display dirver IC.?

Ive so far not had much luck as Ive conected ABCD to 0123 but nothing lights
up. :-/
Would an inverter fix ths problem, or is the lines not connected correctly.?

Regards
Wombat.

--
Find more info at:
http://www.wombatppc.dsl.pipex.com/
 
On Mon, 2 Apr 2007 22:09:21 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
<wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:

Hi all
Can Anyone tell me if the CA3162E is compatible with the 74HC4511
Im talking about the 4 data lines that go from chip to chip. ABCD - 0123
Normaly the CA3162 is used with the CA3161 but I was hoping to us the
74HC4511 instead as Ive got loads of them.
The 74HC4511 uses Common Cathode displays but the CA3161 uses the Common
Anode types.
I've got lots of the CC type and that was another reason for wanting to use
this chip.

Would the data lines be inverted and need to be inverted to be compatible
with the display dirver IC.?

Ive so far not had much luck as Ive conected ABCD to 0123 but nothing lights
up. :-/
Would an inverter fix ths problem, or is the lines not connected correctly.?
Click to expand...
---
You've probably made a wiring error or you're not using the part
properly.

For the 3162 data sheet, go to:

http://www.intersil.com/data/fn/fn1080.pdf

then go to page 6 for data on using it with the 4511.

The display they've shown is a single HP5082-7433, but you can do
the same thing with three single 7-segment digits if you wire the
segments in parallel and mux the cathodes with PNPs.

Want a schematic?



--
JF
 
"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:b30313dst4v87h8s07jlu65q4ceabgsfdu@4ax.com...
On Mon, 2 Apr 2007 22:09:21 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:

Hi all
Can Anyone tell me if the CA3162E is compatible with the 74HC4511
Im talking about the 4 data lines that go from chip to chip. ABCD - 0123
Normaly the CA3162 is used with the CA3161 but I was hoping to us the
74HC4511 instead as Ive got loads of them.
The 74HC4511 uses Common Cathode displays but the CA3161 uses the Common
Anode types.
I've got lots of the CC type and that was another reason for wanting to
use
this chip.

Would the data lines be inverted and need to be inverted to be compatible
with the display dirver IC.?

Ive so far not had much luck as Ive conected ABCD to 0123 but nothing
lights
up. :-/
Would an inverter fix ths problem, or is the lines not connected
correctly.?

---
You've probably made a wiring error or you're not using the part
properly.

For the 3162 data sheet, go to:

http://www.intersil.com/data/fn/fn1080.pdf

then go to page 6 for data on using it with the 4511.

The display they've shown is a single HP5082-7433, but you can do
the same thing with three single 7-segment digits if you wire the
segments in parallel and mux the cathodes with PNPs.

Want a schematic?



--
JF
Click to expand...
Hi John... agian !! :)
Ya I'd not mind a little diagram if you have one to hand, but only if you
have it to hand, dont go and spend hours making it just for me mate!
I already had that PDF But just missed that part on page 6 !! Now seing it
again I remember it. :-/ Tipical
I just figured that the ABCD was a streight 0123 connection like on the
CA3161. But didnt think to check first.
Right looks like it needs some pull Up resistors.
Am I right in thinking that I dont realy need those bits in the dotted lined
area, as I don't want the display to show -99
or any over volts anyway. Which I think that part is meant to do. Its for a
Speedo and Tach in a car, so it will only operate in a fixed range anyhow.

As for the 7 Segment displays, I am using 3 singles like you described. But
looking at the diagram it looks to have 3 buffers (CD4050B) instead.
Why.? I thought the CA3162E multiplexed the display anyhow using the PNPs.

Also.. Is that an error on the PDF, Pins 2 and 7 are joined via x2 100k
Resistors and not used like pull-up resistors.?
I would have expected them to be wire up like pins 1 and 7 with a 100k Res
going to +V.
But looking at the diagram pin 2 is direct to +V. Did they cock up and put
the BLOB (wire joint) on the wrong line.?

Regards
Wombat.
 
On Tue, 3 Apr 2007 08:05:22 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
<wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:


Hi John... agian !! :)
Ya I'd not mind a little diagram if you have one to hand, but only if you
have it to hand, dont go and spend hours making it just for me mate!
I already had that PDF But just missed that part on page 6 !! Now seing it
again I remember it. :-/ Tipical
I just figured that the ABCD was a streight 0123 connection like on the
CA3161. But didnt think to check first.
Right looks like it needs some pull Up resistors.
Am I right in thinking that I dont realy need those bits in the dotted lined
area, as I don't want the display to show -99
or any over volts anyway. Which I think that part is meant to do. Its for a
Speedo and Tach in a car, so it will only operate in a fixed range anyhow.
Click to expand...
---
Right. you can get rid of everything in the dotted lines and also
the two diodes outside of the dotted lines. I don't know what those
black triangles are that connect to the 4012, but you can ignore
them as well.
---

As for the 7 Segment displays, I am using 3 singles like you described. But
looking at the diagram it looks to have 3 buffers (CD4050B) instead.
Why.?
Click to expand...
---
Dunno. Maybe another mistake?
---

I thought the CA3162E multiplexed the display anyhow using the PNPs.
Click to expand...
---
It does, and for common cathode displays using a 7447, you'd hook
them up like this:


a>----[LED>]---+
|
b>----[LED>]---+
|
.
.
.
|
g>----[LED>]---+
|
E
FROM 3162>----B PNP
C
|
GND

With the segments going to the 7447 through current limiting
resistors.

---

Also.. Is that an error on the PDF, Pins 2 and 7 are joined via x2 100k
Resistors and not used like pull-up resistors.?
I would have expected them to be wire up like pins 1 and 7 with a 100k Res
going to +V.
But looking at the diagram pin 2 is direct to +V. Did they cock up and put
the BLOB (wire joint) on the wrong line.?
Click to expand...
---
Yeah. The joint ought to connect the two 100k resistors to V+, and
3162-15 ought to go to 4511-2



--
JF
 
"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:r1v413dpo599n5h646gmnonn2a70v0i6ua@4ax.com...
On Tue, 3 Apr 2007 08:05:22 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:


Hi John... agian !! :)
Ya I'd not mind a little diagram if you have one to hand, but only if you
have it to hand, dont go and spend hours making it just for me mate!
I already had that PDF But just missed that part on page 6 !! Now seing it
again I remember it. :-/ Tipical
I just figured that the ABCD was a streight 0123 connection like on the
CA3161. But didnt think to check first.
Right looks like it needs some pull Up resistors.
Am I right in thinking that I dont realy need those bits in the dotted
lined
area, as I don't want the display to show -99
or any over volts anyway. Which I think that part is meant to do. Its for
a
Speedo and Tach in a car, so it will only operate in a fixed range anyhow.

---
Right. you can get rid of everything in the dotted lines and also
the two diodes outside of the dotted lines. I don't know what those
black triangles are that connect to the 4012, but you can ignore
them as well.
---

As for the 7 Segment displays, I am using 3 singles like you described.
But
looking at the diagram it looks to have 3 buffers (CD4050B) instead.
Why.?

---
Dunno. Maybe another mistake?
---

I thought the CA3162E multiplexed the display anyhow using the PNPs.

---
It does, and for common cathode displays using a 7447, you'd hook
them up like this:


a>----[LED>]---+
|
b>----[LED>]---+
|
.
.
.
|
g>----[LED>]---+
|
E
FROM 3162>----B PNP
C
|
GND

With the segments going to the 7447 through current limiting
resistors.

---

Also.. Is that an error on the PDF, Pins 2 and 7 are joined via x2 100k
Resistors and not used like pull-up resistors.?
I would have expected them to be wire up like pins 1 and 7 with a 100k Res
going to +V.
But looking at the diagram pin 2 is direct to +V. Did they cock up and
put
the BLOB (wire joint) on the wrong line.?

---
Yeah. The joint ought to connect the two 100k resistors to V+, and
3162-15 ought to go to 4511-2



--
JF
Click to expand...
Well a quick update on whats happened so far.
I wired it up just as it showed on the diagram, Including the possible
mistakes.!!
First off I tried it with just the pullups but it didnt work. Just stayed
Black.
Then I removed them.
Tried the Buffers ( Used a 74HC14N instead of the 4050) with the pullup
resistors. That then replaced the NPNs.
It did actualy work !! although I only used 3 buffers and not 6 like it said
too. But.. It just displayed 444.
So I added the original pullups again, and bingo it all lit up but with a
major glitch. !
The display just flashes random numbers. over volts under volts, display
going on and off. very bizzare effect.
Now either I've got a serious power instability problem (Possible) or the
wireing diagram is wrong !! Possible
I say its possible, because the same problem happened with my other speedo
design. Though that only got random when the speed sensor was active.
When the display was just on, with out any pulses, it was dead steady. At
first I though it was a design fault of that original diagram. But now Im
starting to think otherwise.
That design was only meant to uses 2 pulses per rotation, but the speed
sensor give 6. I just figured it would show more faster. I contacted the
guy who originaly designed the board, and he said a possible power
instability problem. I though otherwise !! hence the total re-design.
I prefer the 4511 to the 3161 as its got the dimmable display option. which
worked on the other board, but not with this one. :-/

I think im going to break this down into a much more controlled manner
first. Then I can correct the stability faults on Both the designs to have
the best of both worlds.
At the moment Ive got lots of other IC sharing the +V and GNDs which could
be causing the problems.
I though I could get around it by having separet Volt Regs, for different
parts, but that didnt work. they all take the voltage from the same source.
Plus they all share the same GNDs. I guess this is where im supposed to
use -Volts and complex supressors !
Or
Make shit loads of sepate boards !! :)

Well the boards both look grovey and complex but so far fail to work
properly. both do 90% of the job. but are both let down by the main bit. the
speedo. :-/
Though the odomiter worked OK im pleased to say. so that shows the speed
sensor and counting circuits are fine.

I guess its, Back to the drawing board....... Again.!!

Regards
Wombat.
 
On Tue, 3 Apr 2007 22:32:55 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
<wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:


Well the boards both look grovey and complex but so far fail to work
properly. both do 90% of the job. but are both let down by the main bit. the
speedo. :-/
Though the odomiter worked OK im pleased to say. so that shows the speed
sensor and counting circuits are fine.
Click to expand...
---
Let's back up a minute.

The 3162 is an Analog to Digital converter, and if you're connecting
the pulses from your speedo directly to its analog input it won't
work. Is that what you're doing?


--
JF
 
"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message
news:5gl513dbl5k7o8qcui3ul8o2ug1m9nvln4@4ax.com...
On Tue, 3 Apr 2007 22:32:55 +0100, "Wombat-Pipex-News"
wombatppc@nospam@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:


Well the boards both look grovey and complex but so far fail to work
properly. both do 90% of the job. but are both let down by the main bit.
the
speedo. :-/
Though the odomiter worked OK im pleased to say. so that shows the speed
sensor and counting circuits are fine.

---
Let's back up a minute.

The 3162 is an Analog to Digital converter, and if you're connecting
the pulses from your speedo directly to its analog input it won't
work. Is that what you're doing?

Well im connecting the speed sensor via 2 wires 1 to +12V then it goes
Click to expand...
through the sensor to the LN2917N pin 1.
It goes to pin 1 via 10K Resistor, which is followed by a 22K pulldown, and
a .022uf Cap. which I think is to reduce and smooth the input.
All the diagram says is Frequency Input. Which acording to the blurb, is the
sensor.
Then the output from all that goes to the CA3162E. and also to a pair of
LM3914N`s which drive 20 LEDs in a bar graph.
Though even with this latest board that ive done its still unstable even
Without the sensor connected.
Now I've not tried cutting the track from LM2917N to isolate the CA3162E
(which is todays job. along with a new Volt Reg)

Though the first Board I did was NOT fed output data from the LM2917N as it
was a totaly different design. and used Common Cathode displays
But I did have the input from the speedsensor pigybacked to the LM2917N as
that was used for a bargraph part.
I now know that the inputs arnt compatible. as the LM2917N needs voltage to
go INTO it. but the other speedo had Voltage coming OUT. !
That then registered the drop in voltage to triger a counter. Now thinking
about it I should be able to do a work around.

This latest board was just laid out as the original diagrams showed, apart
from the 4511 replacing the 3162. which turned out to be more complex than I
thought.!
I have 2 speedo designs. I used the first design as I had most parts to
hand, but that was designed for a totaly different speed sensor, without any
bargraphs.
The second one and latest design was based on a Book I bought, for making
Speedos and fancey displays, this one uses Common Anode displays.
Though Im trying to make use of the first ones 7 segments and drivers.
Basicaly because I bought the CC.
Plus this one does Not have a dimmable display like my first one. That is
done by basicaly blinking the display via a blanking pulse. Very fast.
the CA3161E does not have a blanking pin like the CD4511 (Pin 4). which for
some reason does not work properly on this latest board !

Regards
Wombat.
 
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