difference between surge protectors and overkill?

[Gaikokujin Kyofusho]

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Any ideas, commentary, etc would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers

-Gaiko

 

[Richard Freeman]

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in message
news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike protectors.
What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little extra
protection than already exists in the power distribution system and built
into equipment already.

Regards
Richard Freeman

 

[four_season_photo]

Laptop AC adapters generally have built-in surge surpressors; at least that's true of the Apple and IBM units I've opened. In theory I suppose it's better to let an outboard surge surpressor take all of the hits, so AC adaptor's built in protectors won't have to, but I've never actually seen a surge surpressor get fried, and I've had several powered up continuously for years. During severe elecrical storms, I unplug everything which probably improves the odds.

On 22 Mar 2004 15:13:21 -0800
gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com (Gaikokujin Kyofusho) wrote:

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Any ideas, commentary, etc would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers

-Gaiko

 

[Keith Willshaw]

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...

In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.

Which is far better than smoking the devices plugged
into it. When the house next to mine was struck by lightning
2 years ago the only electronic gizmos in my place not
wiped out were those on the surge protector in my
home office. The interior of my home DVD player
was blackened, the TV main board was burnt out
but my PC, Printer and external hard drive were fine.

Keith

 

[someone]

"Richard Freeman" <deletethisrichard@atps.net> wrote in message
news:405f93ad_1@news.iprimus.com.au...

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in message
news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...
Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm


Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike
protectors.
What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little extra
protection than already exists in the power distribution system and built
into equipment already.

Actually the power distribution system is built to protect itself and not
consumer electronics.
Buy the best power protection you can afford for the particular situation. I
would put this question to
some of the large providers of power protection equipment The cost of the
power protection is
insignificant when compared to the potential loss of protected equipment.
What is the value of the equipment to be protected?

I am not familar with the power system in Eastern Europe so I can not
suggest one particular solution.

Dave
NC, USA

Regards
Richard Freeman

 

[Dan Koren]

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in message
news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...
Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Any ideas, commentary, etc would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers

-Gaiko

In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.

Maybe you don't have enough experience ?!?



dk

 

[Hatunen]

On Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:31:14 -0000, "Keith Willshaw"
<keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote:

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...

In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.

Which is far better than smoking the devices plugged
into it. When the house next to mine was struck by lightning
2 years ago the only electronic gizmos in my place not
wiped out were those on the surge protector in my
home office. The interior of my home DVD player
was blackened, the TV main board was burnt out
but my PC, Printer and external hard drive were fine.

I assume that any device that derives it's power from a wall
adaptor or loose adaptor only ends up with a smoked adaptor?

************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *

 

[Keith Willshaw]

"Hatunen" <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message
news:ml316010aer7t13h4jkvdtilj2sgok6nv0@4ax.com...

On Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:31:14 -0000, "Keith Willshaw"
keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote:

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...

In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even
bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a
power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part
small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.

Which is far better than smoking the devices plugged
into it. When the house next to mine was struck by lightning
2 years ago the only electronic gizmos in my place not
wiped out were those on the surge protector in my
home office. The interior of my home DVD player
was blackened, the TV main board was burnt out
but my PC, Printer and external hard drive were fine.

I assume that any device that derives it's power from a wall
adaptor or loose adaptor only ends up with a smoked adaptor?

Thats what happened in my case, the surge protector was
wiped out but the devices plugged in were OK.

Keith

 

[Lawrence Glasser]

James Sweet wrote:

"Keith Willshaw" <keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:c3p16v$tli$1@selma.aspentech.com...

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...



In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even
bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a
power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part
small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.



Which is far better than smoking the devices plugged
into it. When the house next to mine was struck by lightning
2 years ago the only electronic gizmos in my place not
wiped out were those on the surge protector in my
home office. The interior of my home DVD player
was blackened, the TV main board was burnt out
but my PC, Printer and external hard drive were fine.

Keith


You got lucky, I've seen lightning strikes blow up the surge protector and
punch right through to fry whatever's plugged into them. Some offer
insurance though, I would think that would be worthwhile if the equipment is
expensive. Depends where you live too, lightning is quite rare around here,
it's been years since I've seen a lightning strike, but when the storms do
come I just unplug the valuable stuff, don't forget the cable and phone
lines, they can carry in a surge just as well.

And that's why God invented Computer Insurance.

Most policies cover damage due to lightning strikes.

Larry

 

[Keith Willshaw]

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
newsq48c.80137$po.636536@attbi_s52...

"Keith Willshaw" <keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:c3p16v$tli$1@selma.aspentech.com...

"James Sweet" <jamessweet@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wwL7c.60932$_w.934421@attbi_s53...



In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even
bother
with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated into a
power
strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for the most part
small
surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke the surge protector.



Which is far better than smoking the devices plugged
into it. When the house next to mine was struck by lightning
2 years ago the only electronic gizmos in my place not
wiped out were those on the surge protector in my
home office. The interior of my home DVD player
was blackened, the TV main board was burnt out
but my PC, Printer and external hard drive were fine.

Keith



You got lucky, I've seen lightning strikes blow up the surge protector and
punch right through to fry whatever's plugged into them. Some offer
insurance though, I would think that would be worthwhile if the equipment
is
expensive. Depends where you live too, lightning is quite rare around
here,
it's been years since I've seen a lightning strike, but when the storms do
come I just unplug the valuable stuff, don't forget the cable and phone
lines, they can carry in a surge just as well.

Good advice that doesnt help when the lightning storm hits at 3 AM
and the first thing you know is being rudely wakened by an
almighty bang as your neighbours house is hit.

Everbody within 100 yards had his electronic gear fried and
he had a hold blown in his roof, his entire electical system fried
and the insulation in the cavity wall set on fire.

Keith

 

[Watson A.Name \"Watt Sun]

James Sweet wrote:

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in
message news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around
at a few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an
industrial strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will
be traveling quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly
for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Any ideas, commentary, etc would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers

-Gaiko

In my experience surge protectors are mostly useless, I don't even
bother with them anymore unless they just happen to be incorporated
into a power strip. You can get really good spike absorbers but for
the most part small surges are harmless and big ones will just smoke
the surge protector.

I agree. And suerge protectors do absolutely nothing to protect you
against voltage sags and dropouts, which are more likely to hit you and
do damage. Get a good lightweight UPS instead.

 

[w_tom]

Surge has traveled miles through non-conductive air. Is a
silly little protector adjacent to the laptop going to do what
miles of air could not? Of course not. We have installed
effective protection even before WWII. Its not expensive or
complex. But anything effective at the laptop is already
inside the laptop.

Internal laptop protection assumes the destructive surge has
been earthed before entering the building. Not stopped,
blocked, or absorbed. Shunted to earth before it can enter
the building. Protection already inside the laptop is not
overwhelmed is the destructive common mode transient is
earthed.

So what are you going to do? Haul around a separate
protector for various voltage systems? Protection that works
adjacent to that laptop should be already installed inside
that laptop. Protection is a building wide 'system'. Laptop
internal protection works as part of a building wide 'system'
- single point earth ground - that must be part of that
building. Nothing you carry can solve a missing earth ground
problem. So plug-in protectors sell by forgetting to mention
these other essential facts. Bottom line: a surge protector
is only as effective as its earth ground. Where does that
travel protector even mention earthing let alone the 'system'
called surge protection? They forget to mention earthing so
as to make the sale. Laptop be damned.

Gaikokujin Kyofusho wrote:

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around at a
few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an industrial
strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will be traveling
quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Any ideas, commentary, etc would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers

-Gaiko

 

[Watson A.Name \"Watt Sun]

Richard Freeman wrote:

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in
message news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around
at a few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an
industrial strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will
be traveling quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly
for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike
protectors. What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best
all round spike protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these
are heavy and expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors
provide little extra protection than already exists in the power
distribution system and built into equipment already.

Regards Richard Freeman

Correct. But surge protectors are the goose that layed the golden egg
for the salesman who wants to make a quick buck. For less than a
dollar's worth of parts, they can sell you a 'surge strip' that costs
$30 or more, which is mostly pure profit. Ferengis love it! It
probably cost less than $2 to make, sold to the salesman for $5, and
he's getting $25 of your money!

 

[JW]

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:13:25 -0800 "Watson A.Name \"Watt Sun - the Dark
Remover\"" <NOSPAM@dslextreme.com> wrote in Message id:
<c41kok$6fffe$1@hades.csu.net>:

Richard Freeman wrote:

"Gaikokujin Kyofusho" <gaikokujin_kyofusho@mindless.com> wrote in
message news:991c4d67.0403221513.401dacee@posting.google.com...

Hi, I need to get a travel surge protector. I have looked around
at a few but was wondering how necessary it is to have an
industrial strength protector vs a not so industrial one. I will
be traveling quite a bit in Eastern Europe and will use it mostly
for electronics.

a good example between possible protectors would be these:
http://www.walkabouttravelgear.com/surge.htm

Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike
protectors. What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best
all round spike protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these
are heavy and expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors
provide little extra protection than already exists in the power
distribution system and built into equipment already.

Regards Richard Freeman

Correct. But surge protectors are the goose that layed the golden egg
for the salesman who wants to make a quick buck. For less than a
dollar's worth of parts, they can sell you a 'surge strip' that costs
$30 or more, which is mostly pure profit. Ferengis love it! It
probably cost less than $2 to make, sold to the salesman for $5, and
he's getting $25 of your money!

Think of them as insurance. Some of the better surge protector
manufacturers will pay for any damage done to your system if you ever
get whacked.

 

[w_tom]

Good luck with that "insurance". History says that warranty
is so chock full of exemptions as to be virtually useless:
W D Loughman on 11 May 2001 in comp.os.os2.misc
entitled "UPS advice"

Described in this newsgroup late last year, their UPS failure
caused me to spend c. $1200 on replacement equipment. After
their own investigation of the damagING unit, they did not
dispute the UPS failure. However, they reimbursed me only $200,
no arguments accepted, with a required waiver = "Sign this now",
or get nothing. They use a sort of "Blue Book" for computers, and
paid only the values listed therein. NOT replacement cost.
Cover your financial losses some other way, 'cause they sure
won't. Buyer beware!

So if you get lucky and get the warranty honored, then you
might get a $hundred for a few $thousand computer.
Furthermore one of those exemptions may include using the
protector in another country. No warranty coverage if used
there. Something learned after the damage occurs. They are
very careful not to completely honest - to make a sale.

The good protector is one that can work; that does not
violate basic protection principles. That means an essential
'less than 10 foot' connection to earth ground. Warranties
are found mostly on protectors that are not effective (have no
such earthing) but that are over hyped and grossly
overpriced. Serious protector manufacturers offer no
warranty. Instead there product is part of a real protection
system.

 

[Dr Engelbert Buxbaum]

Richard Freeman wrote:

Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike protectors.
What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little extra
protection than already exists in the power distribution system and built
into equipment already.

From bad experience, I do not quite agree. Once upon a time I was
operating scientific equipment in a university where the electrical
system (like in most universities) was heavily (over)loaded.

The equipment consisted of a robotic motor supposed to drive the
syringes of a stopped-flow system. A surge on the power line led to the
inadvertent start of the motor at the wrong time, leading to the
destruction of the syringes and the contamination of the lab with their
radioactive contents.

Appart from a day of my time wasted in the cleanup the value of the
destroyed equipment totalled several hundred dollars.

Bolting the barn door after the horse had run, I installed a a power
strip with surge protector between wall outlet and the maschine. No
mishaps ever since. YMMV.

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

Well, people can debate the value of MOVs and discharge tubes forever, based
on theory and assumptions, but I have to rely on many years of experience.
Having run service shops and worked in dealers that do lots of mid and high
end installations of consumer audio and video in Louisiana and Florida, I
have learned that good surge suppressors appear to be useful.

We install Panamax protection on most of our systems. In the five years
that I have been with this dealer, I have rearely had a system on one of
these where I suspected was due to a line surge or lightning. I do get the
same brands of equipment for repair all the time that people report as
rarely failed during a lightning strike or with the typical signs such as
violently blown fuses, burned circuit boards, ground foils on the inputs of
audio systems cooked, multiple circuit damage with no internal failure that
explains it, etc. Funny how we never see these things on the systems that
we put the surge suppression on.

The way I see it is that it is pretty obvious from some of the failures that
we see in coordination with lightning storms that surges damage consumer
electronics. An MOV or gas discharge tube simply gives another path for the
current to take other than through the equipment. w_tom may think that he
can explain away the variables that suggest the need for component level
protection, but the reality is that it seems to work for lots of people.
I'm glad most people don't use good suppression and verify the integrity of
their grounds, however. Summertime storms in FL make for lots of repair
business.

Leonard

"Dr Engelbert Buxbaum" <engelbert_buxbaum@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c45vfe$h9i$00$1@news.t-online.com...

Richard Freeman wrote:

Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike
protectors.
What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little
extra
protection than already exists in the power distribution system and
built
into equipment already.

From bad experience, I do not quite agree. Once upon a time I was
operating scientific equipment in a university where the electrical
system (like in most universities) was heavily (over)loaded.

The equipment consisted of a robotic motor supposed to drive the
syringes of a stopped-flow system. A surge on the power line led to the
inadvertent start of the motor at the wrong time, leading to the
destruction of the syringes and the contamination of the lab with their
radioactive contents.

Appart from a day of my time wasted in the cleanup the value of the
destroyed equipment totalled several hundred dollars.

Bolting the barn door after the horse had run, I installed a a power
strip with surge protector between wall outlet and the maschine. No
mishaps ever since. YMMV.

 

[Tony Hwang]

Leonard Caillouet wrote:

Well, people can debate the value of MOVs and discharge tubes forever, based
on theory and assumptions, but I have to rely on many years of experience.
Having run service shops and worked in dealers that do lots of mid and high
end installations of consumer audio and video in Louisiana and Florida, I
have learned that good surge suppressors appear to be useful.

We install Panamax protection on most of our systems. In the five years
that I have been with this dealer, I have rearely had a system on one of
these where I suspected was due to a line surge or lightning. I do get the
same brands of equipment for repair all the time that people report as
rarely failed during a lightning strike or with the typical signs such as
violently blown fuses, burned circuit boards, ground foils on the inputs of
audio systems cooked, multiple circuit damage with no internal failure that
explains it, etc. Funny how we never see these things on the systems that
we put the surge suppression on.

The way I see it is that it is pretty obvious from some of the failures that
we see in coordination with lightning storms that surges damage consumer
electronics. An MOV or gas discharge tube simply gives another path for the
current to take other than through the equipment. w_tom may think that he
can explain away the variables that suggest the need for component level
protection, but the reality is that it seems to work for lots of people.
I'm glad most people don't use good suppression and verify the integrity of
their grounds, however. Summertime storms in FL make for lots of repair
business.

Leonard

"Dr Engelbert Buxbaum" <engelbert_buxbaum@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c45vfe$h9i$00$1@news.t-online.com...

Richard Freeman wrote:


Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike

protectors.

What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little

extra

protection than already exists in the power distribution system and

built

into equipment already.

From bad experience, I do not quite agree. Once upon a time I was
operating scientific equipment in a university where the electrical
system (like in most universities) was heavily (over)loaded.

The equipment consisted of a robotic motor supposed to drive the
syringes of a stopped-flow system. A surge on the power line led to the
inadvertent start of the motor at the wrong time, leading to the
destruction of the syringes and the contamination of the lab with their
radioactive contents.

Appart from a day of my time wasted in the cleanup the value of the
destroyed equipment totalled several hundred dollars.

Bolting the barn door after the horse had run, I installed a a power
strip with surge protector between wall outlet and the maschine. No
mishaps ever since. YMMV.



Hi,

Does the utility power cables run overhead in the air or underground in
your area? It's all underground in my area. For past 30 years never
suffered any damage.
Tony

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

There are both. Even in the areas with underground I see lots of damage.
We have many time the average number of lightning strikes in north central
FL compared to the rest of the country.

A client near my home in a development with underground wiring had lightning
strike a tree in the adjacent lot recently and the set failed concurrent
with the strike. Blew the line fuse apart and shorted a diode in the
bridge. A set in another room on a surge suppressor had no damage but the
MOV in the surge suppressor was toasted. Not an uncommon scenario...

I was once skeptical of the value of these things. Still am skeptical about
"line conditioners" and high end cables, but surge suppressors seem
practical to me.

Leonard

"Tony Hwang" <dragon40@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:7qE9c.36283$li5.764@pd7tw3no...

Leonard Caillouet wrote:
Well, people can debate the value of MOVs and discharge tubes forever,
based
on theory and assumptions, but I have to rely on many years of
experience.
Having run service shops and worked in dealers that do lots of mid and
high
end installations of consumer audio and video in Louisiana and Florida,
I
have learned that good surge suppressors appear to be useful.

We install Panamax protection on most of our systems. In the five years
that I have been with this dealer, I have rearely had a system on one of
these where I suspected was due to a line surge or lightning. I do get
the
same brands of equipment for repair all the time that people report as
rarely failed during a lightning strike or with the typical signs such
as
violently blown fuses, burned circuit boards, ground foils on the inputs
of
audio systems cooked, multiple circuit damage with no internal failure
that
explains it, etc. Funny how we never see these things on the systems
that
we put the surge suppression on.

The way I see it is that it is pretty obvious from some of the failures
that
we see in coordination with lightning storms that surges damage consumer
electronics. An MOV or gas discharge tube simply gives another path for
the
current to take other than through the equipment. w_tom may think that
he
can explain away the variables that suggest the need for component level
protection, but the reality is that it seems to work for lots of people.
I'm glad most people don't use good suppression and verify the integrity
of
their grounds, however. Summertime storms in FL make for lots of
repair
business.

Leonard

"Dr Engelbert Buxbaum" <engelbert_buxbaum@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c45vfe$h9i$00$1@news.t-online.com...

Richard Freeman wrote:


Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike

protectors.

What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little

extra

protection than already exists in the power distribution system and

built

into equipment already.

From bad experience, I do not quite agree. Once upon a time I was
operating scientific equipment in a university where the electrical
system (like in most universities) was heavily (over)loaded.

The equipment consisted of a robotic motor supposed to drive the
syringes of a stopped-flow system. A surge on the power line led to the
inadvertent start of the motor at the wrong time, leading to the
destruction of the syringes and the contamination of the lab with their
radioactive contents.

Appart from a day of my time wasted in the cleanup the value of the
destroyed equipment totalled several hundred dollars.

Bolting the barn door after the horse had run, I installed a a power
strip with surge protector between wall outlet and the maschine. No
mishaps ever since. YMMV.



Hi,
Does the utility power cables run overhead in the air or underground in
your area? It's all underground in my area. For past 30 years never
suffered any damage.
Tony

 

[Tony Hwang]

Leonard Caillouet wrote:

There are both. Even in the areas with underground I see lots of damage.
We have many time the average number of lightning strikes in north central
FL compared to the rest of the country.

A client near my home in a development with underground wiring had lightning
strike a tree in the adjacent lot recently and the set failed concurrent
with the strike. Blew the line fuse apart and shorted a diode in the
bridge. A set in another room on a surge suppressor had no damage but the
MOV in the surge suppressor was toasted. Not an uncommon scenario...

I was once skeptical of the value of these things. Still am skeptical about
"line conditioners" and high end cables, but surge suppressors seem
practical to me.

Leonard

"Tony Hwang" <dragon40@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:7qE9c.36283$li5.764@pd7tw3no...

Leonard Caillouet wrote:

Well, people can debate the value of MOVs and discharge tubes forever,

based

on theory and assumptions, but I have to rely on many years of

experience.

Having run service shops and worked in dealers that do lots of mid and

high

end installations of consumer audio and video in Louisiana and Florida,

I

have learned that good surge suppressors appear to be useful.

We install Panamax protection on most of our systems. In the five years
that I have been with this dealer, I have rearely had a system on one of
these where I suspected was due to a line surge or lightning. I do get

the

same brands of equipment for repair all the time that people report as
rarely failed during a lightning strike or with the typical signs such

as

violently blown fuses, burned circuit boards, ground foils on the inputs

of

audio systems cooked, multiple circuit damage with no internal failure

that

explains it, etc. Funny how we never see these things on the systems

that

we put the surge suppression on.

The way I see it is that it is pretty obvious from some of the failures

that

we see in coordination with lightning storms that surges damage consumer
electronics. An MOV or gas discharge tube simply gives another path for

the

current to take other than through the equipment. w_tom may think that

he

can explain away the variables that suggest the need for component level
protection, but the reality is that it seems to work for lots of people.
I'm glad most people don't use good suppression and verify the integrity

of

their grounds, however. Summertime storms in FL make for lots of

repair

business.

Leonard

"Dr Engelbert Buxbaum" <engelbert_buxbaum@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c45vfe$h9i$00$1@news.t-online.com...


Richard Freeman wrote:



Well Actually they are not really surge protectors - more spike

protectors.


What do you want to protect against exactly ? the best all round spike
protection tends to be a 1:1 Transformer - but these are heavy and
expensive. In reality AC MOV based 'surge' Protectors provide little

extra


protection than already exists in the power distribution system and

built


into equipment already.

From bad experience, I do not quite agree. Once upon a time I was

operating scientific equipment in a university where the electrical
system (like in most universities) was heavily (over)loaded.

The equipment consisted of a robotic motor supposed to drive the
syringes of a stopped-flow system. A surge on the power line led to the
inadvertent start of the motor at the wrong time, leading to the
destruction of the syringes and the contamination of the lab with their
radioactive contents.

Appart from a day of my time wasted in the cleanup the value of the
destroyed equipment totalled several hundred dollars.

Bolting the barn door after the horse had run, I installed a a power
strip with surge protector between wall outlet and the maschine. No
mishaps ever since. YMMV.



Hi,
Does the utility power cables run overhead in the air or underground in
your area? It's all underground in my area. For past 30 years never
suffered any damage.
Tony



Hi,

I think lightning strike is an issue. Where I live, rarely we have a
strike. My house has very good ground system. I am a ham operator.
Tony, VE6CGX