Chip with simple program for Toy

Jon Kirwan · Feb 28, 2009

On Fri, 27 Feb 2009 18:42:07 -0600, krw <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:31:38 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 19:41:03 GMT, Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote:

On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 14:38:34 -0800, John Larkin wrote:

REAL PROGRAMMERS DON'T USE LOWER CASE.

So, how are those FORTRAN FPGAs working out for you? ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

Lots of scientific types still program in FORTRAN. Astronomers, I've
been told.

Not just astronomers. AIUI, FORTRAN still has the best complex number
support, though APL has to be in there.

FORTRAN also has a limitation in passed arrays such that they cannot
occupy overlapping memory, unlike c and c++. As a result, the
optimizers can do better than c and c++ where this cannot be assumed.
This difference is enough that the standards teams for c, at least,
went back and forth about it.

Jon

FORTRAN is now over 50 years old.

So is COBOL.

Archimedes' Lever · Feb 28, 2009

On Fri, 27 Feb 2009 13:49:15 -0800, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Fri, 27 Feb 2009 07:54:10 -0600, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:20:34 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:25:21 -0700, Jim Thompson
To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

You threw stones at John F, then posted a very soft transition
solution... did you not?

I called him an old hen, which is pretty accurate.

---
That was later on, and it isn't accurate at all.

What you like to do is try to belittle anyone who catches one of your
errors in an attempt to make their position questionable and therefore
trivialize the error.

Typical cheater tactics.
---

What's wrong with
soft turnoff of a relay? The armature stays seated until it doesn't.

---
And if it leaves the contact slowly and it's breaking DC???

Does a relay armature ever leave slowly? The return spring accelerates
the mass of the moving contact assembly when the armature-to-solenoid
contact opens up, going from from metal-metal contact to an air gap.
At that instant, the magnetic reluctance increases and the holding
force drops, positive feedback. Would it acelerate much different if
the current drops off quickly or slowly?

John

Probably not within a certain fairly big window.

They are made to snap off as you stated.

Bringing one up with incremental voltage steps will show that the turn
on 'snap', however, can be slower right as the operation actually starts
working. Nothing that one could use though.

HV relays have even more rules. Best to engage or disengage it with
the supply in standby mode or off as far as HV output goes. Even a
proper HV relay will not last long when operated while voltage is on the
contacts.

StickThatInYourPipeAndSmo · Feb 28, 2009

On Fri, 27 Feb 2009 13:51:36 -0800, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

Why disaster?

Were you not one of those on the arc plasma is bad bandwagon a couple
weeks back?

Think about a slow opening contact that is still passing current. What
happens at that time that could be detrimental to the contact surfaces in
a short period of time?

Jim Thompson · Mar 1, 2009

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 20:47:19 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 12:17:45 -0700, Jim Thompson
To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@My-Web-Site.com> wrote:

| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

The first sign of senility is persistently trying to be an asshole

Actually, endless, content-free repetition is often an earlier sign.

John

Living in Arizona is the first sign...

480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

With all this hope and change, all you need is a dab of mayonaisse
and you'll have a tasty lunch on which you will choke to death.

John Larkin · Mar 1, 2009

On Sun, 01 Mar 2009 04:22:05 -0600, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sun, 01 Mar 2009 03:58:37 -0600, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:29:02 -0600, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:45:16 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

I've got a few serious problems to work through this weekend (some
exploding power resistors, more firmware, cleaning up downstairs and
The Ratmobile for a visitor, some family stuff in Sausalito) but I may
play with it. If not, next week maybe.

It's like the Variac thing. As Wernher von Braun famously said, "One
experiment is worth a thousand expert opinions."

---
Indeed.

news:qtugq49954qasb38h05eggcb0tqp2nlnl8@4ax.com

---
Oops...

Should be:

newsqojq455ntkuoeg3b8o80lpqkb2f337ssh@4ax.co

---
Oops... It's supposed to be .com on the end.

This oughta do it:

newsqojq455ntkuoeg3b8o80lpqkb2f337ssh@4ax.com

JF

Yes, I saw that, and I have no idea what it means.

John

Martin Griffith · Mar 1, 2009

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 16:30:47 -0800, in sci.electronics.design John
Larkin <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
snip

Even better--'tunnel' diodes and more...

http://home.earthlink.net/~lenyr/zincosc.htm
http://home.earthlink.net/~lenyr/ntype-nr.htm

Cheers,
James Arthur

Neat. Solid-state electronics could have got going 100 years ago.

John

What about this guy?
http://www.tuc.nrao.edu/~demerson/bose/bose.html

martin

Jerry Avins · Mar 5, 2009

Flash wrote:

I would like to find info on how to wire large groups of LEDs. Just an art
project, but I am curious.

I wish to assemble a large group of LEDs in a certain pattern and wish to
know how to control them for on/off without using hundreds of miles of wire.

Any pointers would certainly be welcome.

If you have hundreds of LEDs miles apart, you will need hundreds of
miles of wire. Why don't you supply a few more details? Matched LEDs can
be connected in series like strings of Christmas-tree lights, but that
doesn't allow for individual control.

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ

Bev · Mar 5, 2009

Jerry Avins <jya@ieee.org> wrote in
news:brIrl.20737$ur1.8622@newsfe15.iad:

Flash wrote:
I would like to find info on how to wire large groups of LEDs. Just
an art project, but I am curious.

I wish to assemble a large group of LEDs in a certain pattern and
wish to know how to control them for on/off without using hundreds of
miles of wire.

Any pointers would certainly be welcome.

If you have hundreds of LEDs miles apart, you will need hundreds of
miles of wire. Why don't you supply a few more details? Matched LEDs
can be connected in series like strings of Christmas-tree lights, but
that doesn't allow for individual control.

Jrry

Nobody · Mar 7, 2009

[trimmed list of groups to remove s.e.control and s.e.equipment.]

On Thu, 05 Mar 2009 21:34:11 -0500, Flash wrote:

I want a farily large group, maybe 600 or so, and I wish to be able to turn
them on/off, individually, I know it is possible to do this with 2 wires to
each LED, but I guess I would like to do this without much background, like
board or such. Kind of an open-space effect, with LED's in it.But still,
with the ability to turn them on and off at will, to a certain pattern.

The usual way to control large numbers of LEDs is with a row-column
matrix, as suggested by Charles. This allows you to drive MxN LEDs with
M+N wires (and, usually more important, with M+N outputs from the control
circuitry). E.g. you could arrange 600 LEDs on a 24x25 matrix for a total
of 49 control lines.

The main issue here is that each LED is pulsed, so you have to increase
the current in proportion to the number of rows in order to maintain
intensity, and there are limits to how far you can go. E.g. if an LED can
take 20mA continuous current, it can probably take 80mA with a 25% duty
cycle, but don't count on being able to use 500mA with a 4% duty cycle.
Check the LED's data sheet for hard numbers.

Mar 7, 2009

On Mar 7, 1:22 am, Nobody <nob...@nowhere.com> wrote:

On Thu, 05 Mar 2009 21:34:11 -0500, Flash wrote:
I want a farily large group, maybe 600 or so, and I wish to be able to turn
them on/off, individually, I know it is possible to do this with 2 wires to
each LED, but I guess I would like to do this without much background, like
board or such. Kind of an open-space effect, with LED's in it.But still,
with the ability to turn them on and off at will, to a certain pattern.

The usual way to control large numbers of LEDs is with a row-column
matrix, as suggested by Charles. This allows you to drive MxN LEDs with
M+N wires (and, usually more important, with M+N outputs from the control
circuitry). E.g. you could arrange 600 LEDs on a 24x25 matrix for a total
of 49 control lines.

The main issue here is that each LED is pulsed, so you have to increase
the current in proportion to the number of rows in order to maintain
intensity, and there are limits to how far you can go. E.g. if an LED can
take 20mA continuous current, it can probably take 80mA with a 25% duty
cycle, but don't count on being able to use 500mA with a 4% duty cycle.
Check the LED's data sheet for hard numbers.

You will get better suggestiuons if you provide more info on the
spacing and the environment. And any other constraints you have. Do
you plan to use a pc to control them?

Ross Herbert · Mar 15, 2009

On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:53:26 -0700 (PDT), panfilero <panfilero@gmail.com> wrote:

:Hello,
:
:does anyone know if there's any way to design a simple low power dual

ower supply? The result should be able to swing between -2V and 2V

for example, the values are not important just giving an idea of the
:range) and supply around.... 200mA (again just an idea... around here
:somewhere).
:
:The output of the power supply should (ideally) consist of two wires
:that I can swing between +/- 2V. I'm open to any type of control...
:I'm guessing it will end up being a pot, although voltage control or
:current control would be nice... however, that is not really what I'm
:trying to figure out right now.
:
:I'm just wondering if someone can point me in the right direction
:here... I'm having a hard time trying to figure out where to begin
:with this design.
:
:much thanks!

I don't know exactly what you hope to achieve by being able to "swing between
-ve and +ve" using "two wires".

One of the output wires has to be the nominal reference or common wire which
means that the other wire must be able to ramp up to some +ve value when
rotating a potentometer in one direction. Alternatively, this wire will also be
able to ramp down to some -ve value by rotating the pot in the other direction.

Is this what you mean?

Usually, a power supply is used for a specific purpose and if it is required to
be voltage adjustable, then its output range is between the value of 0V to some
+ve maximum, OR from 0V to some -ve maximum on another wire which is referenced
to the 0V wire, ie. the output wire can go no lower than 0V referenced to the 0V
or common wire.

Tom Biasi · Mar 21, 2009

"BadNight" <e4c5f4@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:gq2nq0$vdv$1@news.motzarella.org...

I just bought a digital multimeter and wanted to check my battery and UPS.
When I check the voltage of my battery it gives 12.6. When I check voltage
of UPS ( not connected to the battery) it gives 9.7??? Shouldn't it be
higher than 12.6 for charging to take place or does it get higher when I
connect it to the battery?? When I check the voltage when Battery is
connected to UPS it gives 12.7 . The UPS is working fine otherwise. The
automatic charging red light is on when it should be charging and after
some time the blue light (charging full) turns on so every thing looks ok.
....Cross posting removed...

The charging voltage may not be pure steady DC.
The circuitry senses the battery condition and adjusts its charging
characteristic. Your meter may not be able to accurately record what's
happening.

Tom

startagroup · Mar 23, 2009

I'd love to have a copy of Siemens 7 since I'm about to get a job
where that would be a big advantage.
If I could become more familiar with it there's a chance for a HUGE
pay increase right off the bat and a large promotion in a few months.
Any help would be appreciated.

Joe Brophy · Apr 1, 2009

On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:40:35 -0700 (PDT), rmiles3887@gmail.com wrote:

On Mar 21, 5:50 am, "BadNight" <e4c...@nowhere.com> wrote:
I just bought a digital multimeter and wanted to check my battery and UPS.
When I check the voltage of my battery it gives 12.6. When I check voltage
of UPS ( not connected to the battery) it gives 9.7??? Shouldn't it be
higher than 12.6 for charging to take place or does it get higher when I
connect it to the battery?? When I check the voltage when Battery is
connected to UPS it gives 12.7 . The UPS is working fine otherwise. The
automatic charging red light is on when it should be charging and after some
time the blue light (charging full) turns on so every thing looks ok.

Your UPS (Universal Power Source) is used to regulate your output
voltage so that it remains constant. It's possible that your battery
is just too weak(worn out) to uphold the 12.6 volts required to run
your unit. Batteries are a lot cheaper than the whole UPS so you might
want to weigh the cost factor in replacing the battery.

Mr. Rick

I thought "UPS" (not United Postal Service...) was an abbreviation for
"Uninterruptible Power System". I don't recall who or how it was I came to
believe that, however. regards, Joe.

Yukio YANO · Apr 2, 2009

Google G.E. scarecrow commercial !
I caught this commercial at 3:00AM and thought that this was a bad dream!

On seeing it again later, I realized that this IS a nightmare! To Every
Single person who has ever worked on a Hot electrical circuit .

I could accept this commercial if Scarecrow was drawing arcs, belching
smoke and flame from at least a couple of the conductors he was
gamboling across .

As it is I didn't recall that he was reconstructed from recycled
electronics, as related by several posters.

There were no Warning Signs of High Voltage, just some Stacks of
Insulators and transmission lines

That this commercial was sponsored by General Electric is even more
disturbing . I can bet they never asked their Health and Safety
Committee's opinion !

If ever a commercial should bear a NR rating , this is one!

After almost a lifetime of working on Electrical Circuits, you learn
that like an Loaded gun, a HOT circuit look just like the Unloaded gun!

"If only I had a brain"

Yukio YANO

Paul E. Schoen · Apr 2, 2009

"Yukio YANO" <yano@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:BZVAl.131746$RJ7.96711@newsfe18.iad...

Google G.E. scarecrow commercial !
I caught this commercial at 3:00AM and thought that this was a bad
dream!

On seeing it again later, I realized that this IS a nightmare! To Every
Single person who has ever worked on a Hot electrical circuit .

I could accept this commercial if Scarecrow was drawing arcs, belching
smoke and flame from at least a couple of the conductors he was gamboling
across .

As it is I didn't recall that he was reconstructed from recycled
electronics, as related by several posters.

There were no Warning Signs of High Voltage, just some Stacks of
Insulators and transmission lines

That this commercial was sponsored by General Electric is even more
disturbing . I can bet they never asked their Health and Safety
Committee's opinion !

If ever a commercial should bear a NR rating , this is one!

After almost a lifetime of working on Electrical Circuits, you learn that
like an Loaded gun, a HOT circuit look just like the Unloaded gun!

"If only I had a brain"

Of course, the scarecrow is made of non-conductive straw. The tin man might
have made some arcs and sparks, and he would not have had to worry about
V-fib because he does not have a heart. And there should have been some
"lion" men on duty, but I think it was a switchyard that was decommissioned
or under construction, and none of the conductors was energized anyway.

But anyone with a brain always throws a chain across the buswork before
crawling into a cubicle to tighten the bolts. At least that's what I was
taught.

Paul

Tom Biasi · Apr 4, 2009

"Joe Brophy" <pcfixr@upwardaccess.com> wrote in message
news:dre5t4hbv6g18r1hmub1bg8gn1sbu5qnee@4ax.com...

On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:40:35 -0700 (PDT), rmiles3887@gmail.com wrote:

On Mar 21, 5:50 am, "BadNight" <e4c...@nowhere.com> wrote:
I just bought a digital multimeter and wanted to check my battery and
UPS.
When I check the voltage of my battery it gives 12.6. When I check
voltage
of UPS ( not connected to the battery) it gives 9.7??? Shouldn't it be
higher than 12.6 for charging to take place or does it get higher when I
connect it to the battery?? When I check the voltage when Battery is
connected to UPS it gives 12.7 . The UPS is working fine otherwise. The
automatic charging red light is on when it should be charging and after
some
time the blue light (charging full) turns on so every thing looks ok.

Your UPS (Universal Power Source) is used to regulate your output
voltage so that it remains constant. It's possible that your battery
is just too weak(worn out) to uphold the 12.6 volts required to run
your unit. Batteries are a lot cheaper than the whole UPS so you might
want to weigh the cost factor in replacing the battery.

Mr. Rick

I thought "UPS" (not United Postal Service...) was an abbreviation for
"Uninterruptible Power System". I don't recall who or how it was I came
to
believe that, however. regards, Joe.

Uninterruptible Power Supply

Borked Pseudo Mailed · Apr 10, 2009

1. To sweeten things up private commuter EVs and hybrids won't be
metered for the electricity for the first 20 years -- whole new
meaning to the word "freeway." Only large trucks will pay in the
beginning.

2. Automakers only get federal money to build hybrids and EVs.

Bio fuel ain't gonna happen so why wait?

These guys, BetterPlace . com http://www.betterplace.com/
have a different model to spread the use of EVs, the Cell Phone
model. Charge very little for the cars themselves but charge
for "miles". Owners don't even have to worry about the batteries.
In the BetterPlace model, the company keeps the batteries and
swaps them out, as needed. If new battery technology comes along,
BetterPlace buys them and you get one popped in at your next fillup.

Another key part of their model is to install infrastructure
on "islands" or "regions" where people routinely just have to
travel less than ~300 miles, round trip, per fill up. (E.g.,
Israel, Denmark, Australia, Hawaii, San Fran Bay area, ...)

Anonymous · Apr 10, 2009

1. To sweeten things up private commuter EVs and hybrids won't be
metered for the electricity for the first 20 years -- whole new
meaning to the word "freeway." Only large trucks will pay in the
beginning.

2. Automakers only get federal money to build hybrids and EVs.

Bio fuel ain't gonna happen so why wait?

These guys, BetterPlace . com http://www.betterplace.com/
have a different model to spread the use of EVs, the Cell Phone
model. Charge very little for the cars themselves but charge
for "miles". Owners don't even have to worry about the batteries.
In the BetterPlace model, the company keeps the batteries and
swaps them out, as needed. If new battery technology comes along,
BetterPlace buys them and you get one popped in at your next fillup.

Another key part of their model is to install infrastructure
on "islands" or "regions" where people routinely just have to
travel less than ~230 miles, round trip, per fill up. (E.g.,
Israel, Denmark, Australia, Hawaii, San Fran Bay area, ...

Bret Cahill · Apr 11, 2009

1. ďż˝To sweeten things up private commuter EVs and hybrids won't be
metered for the electricity for the first 20 years -- whole new
meaning to the word "freeway." ďż˝ Only large trucks will pay in the
beginning.

2. ďż˝Automakers only get federal money to build hybrids and EVs. ďż˝

Bio fuel ain't gonna happen so why wait?

These guys, BetterPlace . comhttp://www.betterplace.com/
have a different model to spread the use of EVs, the Cell Phone
model. ďż˝Charge very little for the cars themselves but charge
for "miles". ďż˝

A cell phone is useless and its components of little value as long as
the vendor can block usage. Not so for a motor vehicle. Any tinkerer
who got a vehicle at near zero cost would remove the black box that
either disables the vehicle or alerts the vendor and have a free EV.

At a minimum he'ld certainly have access to free electric motors, free
batteries, free tires, etc.

Bret Cahill

Chip with simple program for Toy

Jon Kirwan

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